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Old 24th September 2013, 18:21   #1876
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Default Re: Fiat Linea T-Jet : Test Drive & Review

Did another small test drive of the T-Jet. For such a good car, why are there so many frustrations

1. Small footwell. Not comfortable for large feet. Or maybe just a matter getting used to it I suppose.
2. Driving ergonomics - I was somewhat OK but couldn't find a comfortable driving position. For my wife though its close to a deal breaker, just not designed for her I think. I think there are only two adjustment positions for the steering wheel tilt - up or down. With down it hits her knees, up is too high. She would have loved to sit a little back so that her knees don't hit but no telescopic adjustment.
3. Cramped rear window seating area. I banged my head twice getting in, and once I sit headroom is pretty less. For such a large car, where is the interior space?
4. Just about fits in my parking slot (which can't be enlarged or changed in any way), parking is going to be tough until we get used to it and even then its not a one-shot reverse into the slot like I can do with my Palio.

Somehow my Palio feels more spacious inside, front seats definitely are larger. Rear bench width(length?) is also more so under-thigh support is better in the Palio I felt.

Still undecided :-(
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Old 24th September 2013, 20:16   #1877
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Default Re: Fiat Linea T-Jet : Test Drive & Review

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Originally Posted by Kartik Kumar View Post
Did another small test drive of the T-Jet. For such a good car, why are there so many frustrations

1. Small footwell. Not comfortable for large feet. Or maybe just a matter getting used to it I suppose.
2. Driving ergonomics - I was somewhat OK but couldn't find a comfortable driving position. For my wife though its close to a deal breaker, just not designed for her I think. I think there are only two adjustment positions for the steering wheel tilt - up or down. With down it hits her knees, up is too high. She would have loved to sit a little back so that her knees don't hit but no telescopic adjustment.
3. Cramped rear window seating area. I banged my head twice getting in, and once I sit headroom is pretty less. For such a large car, where is the interior space?
4. Just about fits in my parking slot (which can't be enlarged or changed in any way), parking is going to be tough until we get used to it and even then its not a one-shot reverse into the slot like I can do with my Palio.
Replies according to your points.

1. I think it takes a bit getting used to. The dead pedal is not exactly the most useful, but after a while it doesnt matter that much.
2. Here you are facing some issue, which is an oddity of the car. When you push the lever down to unlock the steering wheel, dont push it all the way. If you push it all the way down, it becomes very difficult to adjust the wheel to any intermediate point, leaving you with fully lowered or fully raised positions. If you push the unlocking lever down partially, you can adjust the angle of the steering wheel infinitely between the two limits. You should be able to find a comfortable angle.
3. The coupe like roof line eats into the rear headroom. You lose a bit of headroom, to gain a lot in the looks department. Its sort of the price you pay.
4.Like you said earlier, its not exactly a small car and has a slightly big turning radius.
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Old 24th September 2013, 22:47   #1878
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Default Re: Fiat Linea T-Jet : Test Drive & Review

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Replies according to your points.

1. I think it takes a bit getting used to. The dead pedal is not exactly the most useful, but after a while it doesnt matter that much.
2. Here you are facing some issue, which is an oddity of the car. When you push the lever down to unlock the steering wheel, dont push it all the way. If you push it all the way down, it becomes very difficult to adjust the wheel to any intermediate point, leaving you with fully lowered or fully raised positions. If you push the unlocking lever down partially, you can adjust the angle of the steering wheel infinitely between the two limits. You should be able to find a comfortable angle.
3. The coupe like roof line eats into the rear headroom. You lose a bit of headroom, to gain a lot in the looks department. Its sort of the price you pay.
4.Like you said earlier, its not exactly a small car and has a slightly big turning radius.
Cool. I didn't know about the steering tilt with semi-pushed lever, will try that out sometime.
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Old 24th September 2013, 23:53   #1879
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Default Re: Fiat Linea T-Jet : Test Drive & Review

The footwell you will get used to. Ergonomics personally for me is fine , it did not take that long to find a comfy spot between adjusting the steering , seat height etc.

The interior space has been a weak point always for the car and not much can be done about it.

On the parking spot , well that one i would not agree with , criticizing the car for a small available slot is not fair

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kartik Kumar View Post
Did another small test drive of the T-Jet. For such a good car, why are there so many frustrations

1. Small footwell. Not comfortable for large feet. Or maybe just a matter getting used to it I suppose.
2. Driving ergonomics - I was somewhat OK but couldn't find a comfortable driving position. For my wife though its close to a deal breaker, just not designed for her I think. I think there are only two adjustment positions for the steering wheel tilt - up or down. With down it hits her knees, up is too high. She would have loved to sit a little back so that her knees don't hit but no telescopic adjustment.
3. Cramped rear window seating area. I banged my head intwice getting in, and once I sit headroom is pretty less. For such a large car, where is the interior space?
4. Just about fits in my parking slot (which can't be enlarged or changed in any way), parking is going to be tough until we get used to it and even then its not a one-shot reverse into the slot like I can do with my Palio.

Somehow my Palio feels more spacious inside, front seats definitely are larger. Rear bench width(length?) is also more so under-thigh support is better in the Palio I felt.

Still undecided :-(
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Old 25th September 2013, 06:52   #1880
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Originally Posted by puchoo View Post
The footwell you will get used to. Ergonomics personally for me is fine , it did not take that long to find a comfy spot between adjusting the steering , seat height etc.

The interior space has been a weak point always for the car and not much can be done about it.

On the parking spot , well that one i would not agree with , criticizing the car for a small available slot is not fair
Well to be fair, the parking slot size and the car just barely fitting in is not a criticism of the car as such. Just relief that it fits and is not an outright deal breaker.
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Old 25th September 2013, 09:02   #1881
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Default Re: Fiat Linea T-Jet : Test Drive & Review

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kartik Kumar View Post
Did another small test drive of the T-Jet. For such a good car, why are there so many frustrations
Quote:
1. Small footwell. Not comfortable for large feet. Or maybe just a matter getting used to it I suppose.
It is just a matter of getting used to. Like many other owners here, I too took some time to get used to it, but all is well now.

Quote:
2. Driving ergonomics - I was somewhat OK but couldn't find a comfortable driving position. For my wife though its close to a deal breaker, just not designed for her I think. I think there are only two adjustment positions for the steering wheel tilt - up or down. With down it hits her knees, up is too high. She would have loved to sit a little back so that her knees don't hit but no telescopic adjustment.
The ergonomics are a little awkward I do agree. It does take some time to find a comfortable position. I've been using the T-Jet for my highway drives since 2 years, and I am mighty impressed with the fact that I've sometimes done 800+ km in a single day and still been fresh as a daisy after getting out. The seat support is just fantastic for highway driving.

About the TD, Did you try the seat height adjustment option for your wife? If the steering wheel doesn't move back and forth or up and down much, the other way is to move the driver's position itself!

Quote:
3. Cramped rear window seating area. I banged my head twice getting in, and once I sit headroom is pretty less. For such a large car, where is the interior space?
Only Fiat cars have this problem - large outer dimensions, cramped interiors. This is the price we pay for those gorgeous looking exterior shapes and coupe-like sloping roof. The Honda City has much better interior space management in this segment.

Quote:
4. Just about fits in my parking slot (which can't be enlarged or changed in any way), parking is going to be tough until we get used to it and even then its not a one-shot reverse into the slot like I can do with my Palio.
I think it is unfair to compare a 3.8m hatchback with a 4.6m full-blown sedan and mention about parking/turning radius woes. This is a compromise you will have to live with, right?? You could always install parking aids such as reverse parking sensors or reverse cameras to make the job easier (and safer).

Quote:
Somehow my Palio feels more spacious inside, front seats definitely are larger. Rear bench width(length?) is also more so under-thigh support is better in the Palio I felt.
One of my close friends owns a Palio, and while it is a spacious hatchback, I don't believe the space is so much better there. The seats in the Linea are larger, provide much better support and there are other things inside the cabin (presence of armrests, low roofline, thicker seats and thicker door panels) occupying space and giving that illusion of being smaller than a hatchback's cabin. It is not as big as it should be, agreed, but it is not lousily cramped. Just my opinion.

Last edited by KarthikK : 25th September 2013 at 09:04.
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Old 25th September 2013, 09:44   #1882
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Default Re: Fiat Linea T-Jet : Test Drive & Review

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Originally Posted by KarthikK View Post
One of my close friends owns a Palio, and while it is a spacious hatchback, I don't believe the space is so much better there. The seats in the Linea are larger, provide much better support and there are other things inside the cabin (presence of armrests, low roofline, thicker seats and thicker door panels) occupying space and giving that illusion of being smaller than a hatchback's cabin. It is not as big as it should be, agreed, but it is not lousily cramped. Just my opinion.
I own both Palio (2002 model) and a Linea. The front seat space in Palio is much better compared to Linea (I am 6'2'' ), same thing with the under thigh support.
The rear space in Linea is better compared to Palio. There is more leg space and better support overall.
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Old 25th September 2013, 09:50   #1883
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Default Re: Fiat Linea T-Jet : Test Drive & Review

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Originally Posted by Kartik Kumar View Post
Did another small test drive of the T-Jet. For such a good car, why are there so many frustrations
I can relate to some of the issues though they are no reason to rule out the car.

What is a genuine concern is your parking. If its not going to fit, please don't buy a Linea. You don't want to end up brushing the car against something or the other. I suggest you get the car over to your place and check how good or bad the parking situation is.

The foot well is indeed cramped. I too don't find the foot rest of much use.

Driving ergonomics is a concern for me. It is difficult to find a good driving position. I don't know how Fiat ignored this or what they felt was right about the existing seat. I find the driving position perfect in a Palio over any of the new generation Fiat's sold in India. I have found the sweet spot driving position but it is still not perfect. I do experience some knee pain over extended periods of driving, something I never had in my previous car, a Ford Ikon. This car had fantastic driving ergonomics.

I do agree that interior space is a big let down. When you look at a Linea from the outside, you get the impression of it being large on the inside which it isn't. It is not roomy at all. This is an area that Honda rules. Their man maximum machine minimum way of designing cars makes a small little run about like the Brio feel roomier. Speaking of cramped window area, I did not feel the same about this.

Personally; I find the rear seats very comfortable. You sit higher, have a nice view of the road up ahead, excellent seat recline angle combined with the adjustable headrest, and excellent under thigh support. Leg room is short but the overall feel is nice.
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Old 25th September 2013, 11:00   #1884
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Default Re: Fiat Linea T-Jet : Test Drive & Review

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You can take a look at either of my ownership threads in case you want to see how these mats will look in the footwell.

I am happily running on PLCs for the past 9 months on the T-Jet, and I can assure you it is dead silent, while at the same time offering a cushioned feel for a comfortable ride. Grip is also superb in both wet and dry conditions from my experience. I would highly recommend this tyre to any prospects sitting on the fence.

The best bet for this would be to head to the same showroom where you picked up the car. You could negotiate for a good price with the accessories department, plus they are more likely to stock the body-colored versions of the sensors you need, than a stray accessory shop elsewhere.
Thanks for the heads on your thread on the mats. Went through it and seems like the 'noodle mats' are the ones to go with, particularly as I am looking for something on the practicality of it.

Also, will consider the PLC's as well and call the stores you recommended for deals. I understand, the wheel-alignment will be required to be done post the swap and guess the overall process can be done in under couple of hours.

With regards to the reverse-sensors and camera, are there body-colored ones available for the 'wine' color, if you would know?


Another contemplation is fitting in display units on head-rests for entertainment for the kids on long-drives. Not a big fan of this, but the thought occurred and wanted to share it here. I believe an alternate to this could be buying a 10" tablet and loading that with movies. Any views on this, anyone?
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Old 25th September 2013, 11:08   #1885
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Default Re: Fiat Linea T-Jet : Test Drive & Review

While driving in the rains last week, the CEL of my T-Jet started to flash intermittently. At the same time the car started to "Shudder" a little bit! However, after about five very long and painful minutes the CEL went off and the Shuddering also stopped.

This has happened once before but for a very brief period - like a couple of seconds. That time as well the CEL had come on after driving in the rains.

Have booked for a service this Saturday will update this thread once the problem is sorted out.
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Old 25th September 2013, 11:19   #1886
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Default Re: Fiat Linea T-Jet : Test Drive & Review

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I own both Palio (2002 model) and a Linea. The front seat space in Palio is much better compared to Linea (I am 6'2'' ), same thing with the under thigh support.
The rear space in Linea is better compared to Palio. There is more leg space and better support overall.
I am 6'1" and have driven Linea, Punto and Palio over long distances and always felt the Linea and Punto had much more room in the front cockpit. In contrast, in the Palio I had pushed back the seat all the way to the maximum extent, and still wished there was more space for the footwell. Even the steering wheel I felt was too close to the body in the Palio. I guess this is more of a subjective opinion, so we can agree to disagree and move on .

Last edited by KarthikK : 25th September 2013 at 11:28.
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Old 25th September 2013, 11:53   #1887
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Also, will consider the PLC's as well and call the stores you recommended for deals. I understand, the wheel-alignment will be required to be done post the swap and guess the overall process can be done in under couple of hours.

Shuddering in rains makes it seem like water ingress triggered the issue and you do not need a whole lot of water for this. Once it was burnt up / vaporized the problem seemingly vanished. Now it is for the service center to find out where the ingress took place.

Though, one would like the service center to make their own deductions as to the cause of the problem and solutions thereof.

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While driving in the rains last week, the CEL of my T-Jet started to flash intermittently. At the same time the car started to "Shudder" a little bit! However, after about five very long and painful minutes the CEL went off and the Shuddering also stopped.

This has happened once before but for a very brief period - like a couple of seconds. That time as well the CEL had come on after driving in the rains.

Have booked for a service this Saturday will update this thread once the problem is sorted out.
Alignment is required only if your car is pulling to a side and not running arrow straight either during normal driving or (more importantly) under braking.

If it is running true, there is no reason why it would not continue to do so with new tires. Changing tires does not alter the alignment in any which way.

All you need to do is ensure that balancing is done for all the 4 wheel + tire combos, I would suggest getting it done for the spare tire too. This is enough for a smooth ride.

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Originally Posted by andyonwheels View Post
Also, will consider the PLC's as well and call the stores you recommended for deals. I understand, the wheel-alignment will be required to be done post the swap and guess the overall process can be done in under couple of hours.

A tab is a good idea and these days you can buy cradles that will hold the tab and mount behind the front seat's head rests. There are however a few problems with this arrangement. First is that of the sound. The tab's sound output may not be enough to overcome the ambient noise even with the windows rolled up. Second is the issue of security i.e. either leaving the tab behind in the car or bothering to carry it around every time. Last and maybe a remote is the issue of the grip of the cradle itself. Under heavy / emergency braking there is chance of the tab becoming a missile in the cabin, I know it is remote but could happen.

A better alternate could be to use a roof mounted cd/dvd/media player. This can be hard wired in to the car's sound system and if you get one with a two zone output then the sound can be limited only to the rear speakers thus sparing the driver from binga boom... After use the screen simply folds up and locks in to the player's body safe from prying eyes. You can find N number of such players in the classified pages of any automotive magazine.

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Originally Posted by andyonwheels View Post
Another contemplation is fitting in display units on head-rests for entertainment for the kids on long-drives. Not a big fan of this, but the thought occurred and wanted to share it here. I believe an alternate to this could be buying a 10" tablet and loading that with movies. Any views on this, anyone?

Last edited by GTO : 26th September 2013 at 12:15. Reason: As requested
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Old 25th September 2013, 11:57   #1888
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Default Re: Fiat Linea T-Jet : Test Drive & Review

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Personally; I find the rear seats very comfortable. You sit higher, have a nice view of the road up ahead, excellent seat recline angle combined with the adjustable headrest, and excellent under thigh support. Leg room is short but the overall feel is nice.
Totally agree here!
Personal experience instance of a packed Linea - we were 3 medium built adults and 2 kids sitting on the rear seats. I was in the middle and got superb view of the road, one that I have never experienced before, more like cock-pit view, angling downwards. In terms of space, shoulder room was fine, though sitting in the centre, I felt bit cramped in the legs 'cos of the base support and rear AC vent.

Also, I think the difference in the seats matter as well - i noticed the non-leather seats have their back's scooped out, resulting in more leg room. I think the leather seats have a flatter back and so tighter room.
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Old 25th September 2013, 12:01   #1889
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Shuddering in rains makes it seem like water ingress triggered the issue and you do not need a whole lot of water for this. Once it was burnt up / vaporized the problem seemingly vanished. Now it is for the service center to find out where the ingress took place.
My view exactly, also since the same thing had happened earlier on one of my pune trips in torrential rain and this time as well while I was driving back home from office. I suspect that the oxygen sensor may have been fouled / wet when the warning came up. That also may explain the shuddering caused by the engine!

Still, I had ignored it the last time since it was for a few seconds but this time around it was a looong five minutes, so better get it checked up!
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Old 25th September 2013, 13:49   #1890
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Default Re: Fiat Linea T-Jet : Test Drive & Review

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A better alternate could be to use a roof mounted cd/dvd/media player. This can be hard wired in to the car's sound system and if you get one with a two zone output then the sound can be limited only to the rear speakers thus sparing the driver from binga boom... After use the screen simply folds up and locks in to the player's body safe from prying eyes. You can find N number of such players in the classified pages of any automotive magazine.
That seems like a good alternative as well.
But in terms of the viewing angle, are these screens low enough, so it's comfortable for viewer. And as it's for kids, just hope it does not turn out to be strenuous for them to be looking upwards.

Also, other major concern is the rear view display for the driver getting obscured when the display screen is lowered.

Anyone got a first hand experiences with this?
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