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Old 18th April 2012, 13:48   #2101
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Default Re: Mahindra Thar : Test Drive & Review

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Originally Posted by poddy View Post
Hi just wanted to know what gearbox does the thar use and if it is same as the 4x4 scorpio?
Dear Poddy - Thar CRDe uses NGT530R manual transmission coupled to a Borg Warner transfer case (chain drive). This arrangement is essentially same as Scorpio 4WD but Scorpio transfer case uses electrical actuation by a switch whereas Thar transfer case uses manual actuation by a lever. Thar DI 2WD uses NGT520 manual transmission. Thar DI 4WD uses NGT520 manual transmission coupled to a T18 transfer case (gear drive). This transfer case is also mechanically actuated by a lever.

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar
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Old 18th April 2012, 14:04   #2102
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Default Re: Mahindra Thar : Test Drive & Review

[quote=WindRide;2747442] Mr.Behram Dhabhar - did it come down to choosing between your "dream" versus the safety of hundreds of thousands of ill-informed customers? When you signed off this vehicle and unleashed it onto our chaotic roads, didn't your concience prick you regarding its safety aspects? The end result should be more of a POC / "proof of what could be done" rather than a final production sample. quote]

Dear Windride - thank you for your correctly mentioned comments above, which I appreciate and I am trying to answer in the best way I can.

It did not come down to choosing anything. I started by saying that "we have a CMVR certificate" means that essentially this thing meets the law of the land, all systems included. One can always argue that if people say that this thing is not felt as safe, how does it meet the law of the land? Well, this debate can go on till the cows come home and there will be no conclusion. That said, finally it is a conscious call. And as far as "conscience" is concerned, it should be "corporate conscience" and not "individual conscience". The individual can at best agree to disagree and continue to dissent (as I always did on brakes in all forums and as I am doing now) so that something good happens to the product but finally it is a taken decision. How many decision makers in the company actually drive company products "as they ought to be driven", and then ensure by asking relevant questions in the meetings and getting relevant answers, to satisfy to themselves that improved things have actually happened to the products? Don't even ask me to answer this one as team leader, you can well imagine. Reason? DENIAL MODE! "there is no issue" syndrome, because CMVR certificate is there. They see an excel file in which they see this issue as green in color. "Customer Passion Driven Products" cannot be validated by excel file reviews. Also as I have mentioned before, there is something much more than CMVR but it becomes "convenient" for people not to listen to other people naa!

On your comment - "Proof of what could be done?" - "Technology Demonstrators" have their place in the scheme of things, but for Thar, I was not interested in it becoming one such project. This would have been the worst thing to happen to Thar, it would have been doomed, forever! I want this thing in production, manufactured in good numbers every working day, all of them getting sold, running out there on the road, delighting customers and doing business! Period! TECHNOLOGY DEMONSTRATOR PROJECTS are a different breed altogether, Thar does not fall in that category. I apologise for not agreeing to your point of view but that's the way it is. See what Carrot Eater has written, he would still be looking at South African photographs! Good one Mr.Ranjit Singh Sir, I appreciate your comments.

Well, I hope I have clarified. That was a tiring post to pen down, so whew!

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar
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Old 18th April 2012, 17:10   #2103
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Cool Re: Mahindra Thar : Test Drive & Review - DC Thar - Magic!!!

Folks,

Here's an interesting piece of work. They call it DC Thar!

Courtesy: Zigwheels

DC Thar:
Name:  DC_Thar.jpg
Views: 3775
Size:  70.5 KB

From utilitarian off-roader to urban hipster; when DC Design worked its magic on the Mahindra Thar, that's exactly the effect that was achieved!

Original Thar:
Mahindra Thar : Test Drive & Review-mahthar03.jpg

What the stylists at DC Design have done is make a complete body replacement, which in simple terms looks at chucking the classic 'Jeep' body of the Thar and replacing it with a custom-made fiberglass body shell. The aim was to create an "urban convertible off-roader" that looks as much at home on city streets as it does slugging it out on the rough stuff. It really does look like nothing else on the road at the moment. In fact, it almost looks like a concept sketch of a Thar from the future come to life in the present day.

More here: DC Thar: Mahindra off-roader goes chic| Zigwheels.com

Thanks,
C_

Last edited by Coolman : 18th April 2012 at 17:16. Reason: Including a picture of Original Thar for quick reference!
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Old 18th April 2012, 17:32   #2104
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Default Re: Mahindra Thar : Test Drive & Review

OMG!! One of the most hideous designs I've seen of late. I will never drive this even if given for free. The basic design of the vehicle has been totally ruined & turnout is a wierd & wacky stuff. Hope MM doesn't employ the services of the above mentioned design studio for designing its future vehicles.
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Old 18th April 2012, 19:42   #2105
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Default Re: Mahindra Thar : Test Drive & Review - DC Thar - Magic!!!

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Originally Posted by Coolman View Post
Folks,

Here's an interesting piece of work. They call it DC Thar!
WHY BUY THAR for this? Maruti swift would have worked
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Old 18th April 2012, 22:06   #2106
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Default Re: Mahindra Thar : Test Drive & Review

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Originally Posted by Harbir View Post
But seriously, I am willing to overlook every problem the thar had, except 2, one that has been addressed, and one not: no factory fit A/C and offset steering wheel, respectively
The offset steering wheel issue , honestly , is not an issue. I mean you drive for a few mins and you will completely forget about it. It seemed like a big issue to me before buying the Thar but when you drive it - you do not notice it - unless you keep thinking of it - even then you will not notice it after a few mins.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM View Post
See what Carrot Eater has written, he would still be looking at South African photographs! Good one Mr.Ranjit Singh Sir, I appreciate your comments.
Mr. Dhabhar - I guess there will be a version of Thar which will have ABS, Airbags, FFRA (the old one) and everything else, but will be priced at a price I wouldn't probably be able to afford. So I am glad you had the current version out, and the AC kit - now help us to get the brakes boosted and " All izz well".

Quote:
Originally Posted by Coolman View Post
Folks,
Here's an interesting piece of work. They call it DC Thar!
Well if someone is willing to pay so much more money and get this - what can I say !!

BTW he is charging 2 Lacs!! for AC and alloys - wonder what he is putting in there.
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Old 19th April 2012, 08:12   #2107
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Default Re: Mahindra Thar : Test Drive & Review

We can blame the engineering team that put the thar together, but really the responsibility is Mahindra's as a corporation to have the organizational sophistication that leads to standards of quality and performance that are adhered to, and that I suspect is gravely lacking.

I heard that less than an hour before the launch of the thar, a senior executive at Mahindra commented "Thar front and Bolero front is same naa!"

At the very least it shows us that the executives weren't bothered to even know the product that the company was putting out, let alone have it meet quality and engineering standards. At worst it shows us that the company has executives who don't know a damn thing about the product.

In that kind of environment of executive disinterest and incompetence, it seems inevitable that quality and engineering would be blah.

but the XUV shows us that atleast they are trying in some regard.
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Old 19th April 2012, 08:45   #2108
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Default Re: Mahindra Thar : Test Drive & Review

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Originally Posted by Harbir View Post
but the XUV shows us that atleast they are trying in some regard.
Trying to do what? Put make-up on a wart hog?

Anybody try washing an XUV front honeycomb OD'd grille yet?

This post may be deleted for being OT.

Cheers
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Old 19th April 2012, 09:05   #2109
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Default Re: Mahindra Thar : Test Drive & Review

I would not dream of buying the SUV500 because I think its crap, but in all fairness, in the context of the Thar, the Bolero, and the Scorpio, it IS a step forward.
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Old 19th April 2012, 09:58   #2110
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Default Re: Mahindra Thar : Test Drive & Review - DC Thar - Magic!!!

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Originally Posted by Coolman View Post
Folks, Here's an interesting piece of work. They call it DC Thar!
Dear Coolman and all - YIKES! OH NO! .

Dear Harbir - go below a 2WD XUV500 and see. It has an uncanny resemblance to a passenger car. Then drive it. .

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar
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Old 19th April 2012, 10:14   #2111
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Default Re: Mahindra Thar : Test Drive & Review - DC Thar - Magic!!!

[quote=Coolman;2750420]Folks,

Here's an interesting piece of work. They call it DC Thar!

Courtesy: Zigwheels

Excellent!

Reminds me of Jeeps in Comic Books, especially the Bahadur series from Indrajal Comics, which I read as a kid!!
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Old 19th April 2012, 10:43   #2112
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Default Re: Mahindra Thar : Test Drive & Review

Saw the DC Thar photos when it was launched. Complete removed the Jeep look. I expected a more of Wrangler-like makevoer to it.

Is anyone aware of doing a Wrangler like makeover to Thar ??
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Old 19th April 2012, 11:46   #2113
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Default Re: Mahindra Thar : Test Drive & Review

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Originally Posted by carrot_eater View Post
now help us to get the brakes boosted and " All izz well".
Of late, I have been reading about this - Thar brakes are not upto the mark. Any idea why? For me, I can live with the stone age interior but the following things can not be compromised:
1. Steering response - it MUST NOT be vague or over-assisted at high speeds. Any clue what's the root cause of this issue in many non German vehicles? I remember the scary test drives of Safari, Scorpio, new Verna...it's really sad that we need to strictly buy Germans for this basic need. Can't ARAI set some regulations about maximum allowed vagueness (I would set it to ZERO of course) and also a limit on steering assistance in proportion to speed??? It's been more than 100 years since the first car ran on the road and even today some manufacturer boost of sharp steering and handling. Come on, this should be commoditized by now.

2. Brakes - they MUST work well. Simple. No wooden feeling, no drama (what a drama it was in the 2.6 Scorpio we had - I press the brakes and the car would suddenly start rolling as if it slipped into neutral, then I need to continue and press the brakes with such a determination that the brake system finally surrendered to my mental strength and acted...).

I simply don't understand why these two things are kept optional for the manufacturers to implement? I have been looking for answers for some years now.

Note: I am a Thar fan - I love the looks, the very concept of a compact, capable and handsome 4x4. As I mentioned, it's not only Thar, it's an issue with many many other vehicles. They simply don't have the basic capabilities to match the looks. With Thar, the problem is pronounced, becase we all want to buy one (who cares if the new Verna or Sonata steer/handle lousily I do not need these cars anyway, but in case of Thar it hearts).
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Old 19th April 2012, 12:14   #2114
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Default Re: Mahindra Thar : Test Drive & Review

Quote:
Originally Posted by anandpadhye View Post
Note: I am a Thar fan - I love the looks, the very concept of a compact, capable and handsome 4x4. With Thar, the problem is pronounced, becase we all want to buy one (who cares if the new Verna or Sonata steer/handle lousily I do not need these cars anyway, but in case of Thar it hurts ).
Dear Anandpadhye - WOW! LOVELY! FINALLY! .

By your comment above, you have finally endorsed my opinion of Thar, which I used to make in all forums and meetings, which is - "Sir, Thar can compete with main stream passenger cars. People will want to buy it as their daily drive vehicle". Thank you so much for finally realizing my dream today. You are saying it as a "customer", it means value to me.

By the way, I work out of Pune. Can we catch up sometime? Do send me a PM.

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar
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Old 19th April 2012, 12:34   #2115
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Exclamation Re: Mahindra Thar : Test Drive & Review - DC Thar!

Dear Folks,

I have to say, I appreciate DC Design (Dilip Chabria) for the design stuff they do. For those of you who do not know, DC Thar is from the same stable that gave us DC Avanti, unveiled at the recently concluded Auto Expo.

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OMG!! One of the most hideous designs I've seen of late. I will never drive this even if given for free.
AWD, I know you must have told this over enthusiastically, who wouldn't buy it for free!
Quote:
Originally Posted by vnambiar View Post
WHY BUY THAR for this? Maruti swift would have worked
vnambiar, Wrong! Swift would not have. And say we assume it would have worked, then an Alto K10 would have worked too! But that is not the point. The theme here is "design".

Quote:
Originally Posted by carrot_eater View Post
Well if someone is willing to pay so much more money and get this - what can I say !!

BTW he is charging 2 Lacs!! for AC and alloys - wonder what he is putting in there.
carrot_eater, We all know of people paying obscene amounts for vintage cars, custom made cars, modifications and our classic Rolls Royce is a very good example.

Yes, I agree that the charge for just A/C and Alloys is very expensive, unless Zigwheels hasn't published the complete information. To add, the charge for other modifications isn't inexpensive either.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM View Post
Dear Coolman and all - YIKES! OH NO! .
DHABHAR.BEHRAM, Cool down... it's only a concept.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cpbopanna View Post
Excellent!

Reminds me of Jeeps in Comic Books, especially the Bahadur series from Indrajal Comics, which I read as a kid!!
cpbopanna, And to bring something like that to life, is the next big thing!!!

Thanks,
C_
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