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Old 10th April 2010, 09:28   #196
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OMG, Prabal, you wont stop, neither will i.

Some updates on my car as on Date

During the last 8 months and thanks to my Mumbai visit 4 months ago where i found lots of stuff from Mr Ratilal, my Beetle has been undergoing some minor upgrades.

1) Original fuel pump installed
2) Got the original dynamo overhauled with new components
3) Got the original dashboard switches and installation done
4) Got the original sunvisors and installed
5) Got the original dashboard grab handles and installed
6) Got the engine tin that was missing(From Bangalore)
7) Got the original reversing lights , not yet installed

Search is on for some more orignal parts, will be on my TO DO LIST for the next 6 months, while the Bug is still running fine, have made up my mind to get it to the last bit of originality.

1) Original tail light assembly
2) Original door handles
3) White wall tyres
4) Dashboard mounted fuel indicator and speaker mesh
5) Roofliner as per stock
6) Upholstery as per stock
7) Original front headlight assembly

While search is on for all the above parts, some leads appreciated.
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Old 10th April 2010, 12:16   #197
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Originally Posted by Prabal View Post
Now ,we are getting somewhere, Pavan! And I'm not the adamant one here though, I think you are, since you will not admit easily.

Do we need to bring out discussions on the headlights of the Fiat, the recent discussion on the '57 'artistic' and the 'not much originality left' '57 Beetle cabriolet in Bombay, many a discussion on the 1500 Beetles in the past, MG-which is a Wolseley, Messerschmitt, etc., etc. here? You do not admit easily. And that too, when you do not have the facts in your grasp.

Although, I do appreciate your passion, and untiring efforts in bringing many a car back from the brink, but you have to understand the importance of a statement, especially in the context of those who are really not clued-in. Those who are, will just laugh it off but others will fall for it, and that's not good, intentionally or otherwise. You have done a great job on your yellow bug, and even more commendable is the fact that you've made her a reliable daily runner. But you can't go around commenting about the originality of other folks' cars when you admit your VW itself isn't cent per cent there, what with Scorpio handles, et all. That's all I object to. And also the fact, that 1500 Beetles aren't such a big deal as you attempt to make them out to be, just because you've got one (and also one that you were instrumental in selling once to someone in Hyderabad, which is now back in Bengaluru again through you!). If you ara a true aficionado then learn from people who've been there before you, and probably still are in better touch with ground realities.
Prabhalji,
Great to see you here in this forum.
I am relatively new to this forum, but have been a reader of autoindia since the 90's.
You are the most apt person to speak about beeteles and I dont how many people here are aware that you had written a 10 page article in AUTOINDIA on the 50th anniversay of the VW beetel in 1998.
After reading all the stuff wrtitten by my neighbouring mallu
classico ,pavan kadam, etc, I assume that there is no point in arguing with pavan kadams claims regarding his beetel.
It really sounds hilarious when he says as a kid itself he was searching only for a 1500cc beetel only why not a super beetle, why not a 1300?
as you and classico has correctly said there is nothing special or unique about 1500cc beetel or 1967 beetel .

Pavan Kadam, please dont come after me also like you have done to several others in the forum . but let me tell you these in your interest.

1)since your car is not a single owner car you cant be that sure about whether it had an engine swap or not.

2)you have said your cars chassis number starts with 117, then it must be manufactured in the period from august 1966 to july 1967 .

3)If that is correct then your car is having the correct oval headlights ,5 lug rims ,etc

4)If it is registered in september 67 in INDIA, then it must have been manufactured at least 6 months ago in the factory.(even if it is a direct import)

5)all these things will go wrrong if some previous owner for any valid reason has interchanged books of another volkswagon for this.As per your statments this car has come from Mahrashtra, and what happened there till the car reached bengaluru no one can say .

good luck in your future restorations
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Old 10th April 2010, 12:58   #198
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Originally Posted by kishorelal View Post
Prabhalji,
Great to see you here in this forum.
I am relatively new to this forum, but have been a reader of autoindia since the 90's.
You are the most apt person to speak about beeteles and I dont how many people here are aware that you had written a 10 page article in AUTOINDIA on the 50th anniversay of the VW beetel in 1998.
After reading all the stuff wrtitten by my neighbouring mallu
classico ,pavan kadam, etc, I assume that there is no point in arguing with pavan kadams claims regarding his beetel.
It really sounds hilarious when he says as a kid itself he was searching only for a 1500cc beetel only why not a super beetle, why not a 1300?
as you and classico has correctly said there is nothing special or unique about 1500cc beetel or 1967 beetel .

Pavan Kadam, please dont come after me also like you have done to several others in the forum . but let me tell you these in your interest.

1)since your car is not a single owner car you cant be that sure about whether it had an engine swap or not.

2)you have said your cars chassis number starts with 117, then it must be manufactured in the period from august 1966 to july 1967 .

3)If that is correct then your car is having the correct oval headlights ,5 lug rims ,etc

4)If it is registered in september 67 in INDIA, then it must have been manufactured at least 6 months ago in the factory.(even if it is a direct import)

5)all these things will go wrrong if some previous owner for any valid reason has interchanged books of another volkswagon for this.As per your statments this car has come from Mahrashtra, and what happened there till the car reached bengaluru no one can say .

good luck in your future restorations
One more to the group

With due respects to everyone, Why is it that everyone other than me is right in their stand.

I respect others views, and i have all the right to stand by my own.

Writing an article in the book does not make one qualify for being having the best knowledge on the Beetles, neither do i after restoring half a dozen VW's so far. Everyone of us are still in the learning stage , and have a loooong time to get there.

I have maintained, my Bug is only 50% original, never am i contesting saying mine is the best Bug around.

I can vouch in saying i own the BEST RUNNING BUG.

And where am i talking about my car, i am stating about the importance of 1967 1500's here.

There is a reason behind me running behind the 1500 and a 1967, i am particular about it and i know after owning it, every VW historian can tell.

I know i am right in my stand and abide by it, my views mine and to each his own.

Last edited by PAVAN KADAM : 10th April 2010 at 13:16.
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Old 10th April 2010, 13:49   #199
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PAVAN KADAM View Post
One more to the group

With due respects to everyone, Why is it that everyone other than me is right in their stand.

I respect others views, and i have all the right to stand by my own.

Writing an article in the book does not make one qualify for being having the best knowledge on the Beetles, neither do i after restoring half a dozen VW's so far. Everyone of us are still in the learning stage , and have a loooong time to get there.

I have maintained, my Bug is only 50% original, never am i contesting saying mine is the best Bug around.

I can vouch in saying i own the BEST RUNNING BUG.

And where am i talking about my car, i am stating about the importance of 1967 1500's here.

There is a reason behind me running behind the 1500 and a 1967, i am particular about it and i know after owning it, every VW historian can tell.

I know i am right in my stand and abide by it, my views mine and to each his own.
Here it goes again,
If you say something which is substantiated by strong evidence/data/documents then no one else will even dare to contradict you.so please provide valid data(not wickipedia,which is not authenticated in many technical matters) and shut up your critics.
with due respects to your views, it is your position like the above stand BEST RUNNING BUG which makes others unneccessarily come after you.
How can anyone say that his is the BEST running bug?? have you tested running all the beetels in bengalurulu leave alone whole of our desi beetels.
if you had said a more diplomatic "one of the better runninng"' most of us would only appreciate.
regarding Prabhal,many of us who have grown up in the days of Indian Auto journal know about his credentials and his deep knowledge of automobiles especially beetels. maybe the guys who have just come into the feild have not heard about him
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Old 10th April 2010, 14:04   #200
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one more nice thing that pavan can do is explain why he is so adamant on establishing that 1967 1500 beetel which as per others in the forum had a production figure of around twenty thousand plus cars is considered rare and special and limited
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Old 10th April 2010, 14:16   #201
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Originally Posted by kishorelal View Post
one more nice thing that pavan can do is explain why he is so adamant on establishing that 1967 1500 beetel which as per others in the forum had a production figure of around twenty thousand plus cars is considered rare and special and limited
sir,The reason is quite obvious
It is the model owned by him
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Old 10th April 2010, 14:22   #202
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Originally Posted by PAVAN KADAM View Post
This is how my VW looked the day i brought it, after it was lying at a workshop for 15 yrs rusting slowly.

This is a September 1967 VW Beetle
Engine: 1500 cc
Power: 58 BHP
Type: Right Hand Drive
Engine: Air/Oil cooled-Flat 4


I never had any floor in the car, With only 1 rim

Engine seperate and idle for 15 yrs, Body paint bits inside but nothing on the outside.

A broken bonnet. no bumpers no lights and ABSOLUTELY NOTHING.

This was loaded onto a tempo till the workshop.




My restoration started and took 18 months, initial plan was 12 months right on schedule for my wifes birthday.




My only aim was to restore the whole car inside out.

To take it to its original glory.

My process started with sourcing spares from our good old gujri.

But later got so fed up with them, i got my spares from US and few from Germany.

To my luck i had a great mech and a great painter who did their best to get my baby to shape.

Finally this is how the Bug turned out.


Back

This is how the car came out after labourious 18 months schedule.

My daily trips to the workshop for a minimum of 5 hrs(2 hrs in morning 4 hrs in Evening) used to irritate my parents and my wife.

But once they got to know what's going on they were thrilled.

Literally they did not know a thing that this beauty was being done up by me.

Finally my dream car was ready to go on roads.

Its been 4 yrs since i've been using it.

This is the only car that brings miles of smiles on anybodys face(Young or Old)

Its done 3 trips to Tumkur and totally clocked 13 k on the odo.

The max speed i've touched is 130 kmph.

The other amazing thing about this car is you reach home safely with whatever trouble your car is going through.

It never breaks down abruptly(Only if you have been taking care of it Properly)

Just because of this car all we BUG enthusiast in bangalore formed a club named BANGALORE BEETLE CLUB.




We've been a part of many events.

Hats of the Ferdinand Porcshe and Hitler for giving us this car.

By all means this is PEOPLES CAR.

Pavan,It seems the Bhp of your car has come downn from 58bhp to 53 bhp now .?
any modifications recently?
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Old 10th April 2010, 14:58   #203
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kishorelal View Post
one more nice thing that pavan can do is explain why he is so adamant on establishing that 1967 1500 beetel which as per others in the forum had a production figure of around twenty thousand plus cars is considered rare and special and limited
Quote:
Originally Posted by classico View Post
sir,The reason is quite obvious
It is the model owned by him
If guys fail to understand what i am trying to say, i am really sorry for you guys

I am not saying its rare, its the special model produced by VW's since this was the year the Beetle underwent most number of significant changes.

A true 1967 1500cc is termed the best ever Bug produced by VW's. Thats it.

Cant help if you guys have not read about it.

And classico! you are continuing from where our dear friend ajay99 left.
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Old 10th April 2010, 16:00   #204
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PAVAN KADAM View Post
OMG, Prabal, you wont stop, neither will i.

Some updates on my car as on Date

During the last 8 months and thanks to my Mumbai visit 4 months ago where i found lots of stuff from Mr Ratilal, my Beetle has been undergoing some minor upgrades.

1) Original fuel pump installed
2) Got the original dynamo overhauled with new components
3) Got the original dashboard switches and installation done
4) Got the original sunvisors and installed
5) Got the original dashboard grab handles and installed
6) Got the engine tin that was missing(From Bangalore)
7) Got the original reversing lights , not yet installed

Search is on for some more orignal parts, will be on my TO DO LIST for the next 6 months, while the Bug is still running fine, have made up my mind to get it to the last bit of originality.

1) Original tail light assembly
2) Original door handles
3) White wall tyres
4) Dashboard mounted fuel indicator and speaker mesh
5) Roofliner as per stock
6) Upholstery as per stock
7) Original front headlight assembly

While search is on for all the above parts, some leads appreciated.
Pavan,
Am glad to hear your plans. In th emeantime, I'll keep trying to convince you to add the stock rear suspension and stock carb to your list. I can help you tune it so that it runs just as well as your current carb. I'll also volunteer to install the rear suspension for you.

PS: you stopping by today?

Byas
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Old 10th April 2010, 16:15   #205
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Originally Posted by PAVAN KADAM View Post


To correct you, the 1500cc engines came into existence only in late 1966.
A small note from the VW wiki:

1967 Beetle 1500CC

1967 the 1500 Beetle was announced. Offering improved performance, it used a 1493cc engine, with the same dimensions as the Type 2 vehicles, to give 44bhp DIN at 4000rpm (or 53bhp SAE), with improved torque. The 1500 model included the fitment of front disc brakes, the rear suspension revisions improved road behaviour, reducing oversteer. The six-volt electrical system converted to twelve-volt. The "Fifteen", as it is affectionately known, rates as one of the best Beetles ever made and these cars are consequently sought-after by enthusiasts.
The 1500cc VW engine was actually introduced in 1961 on the Typ 3 which was called the VW1500. The long block of this engine (case, cylinders, head) is identical to the 1500 type 1 engine.

The 1500 type was intro'd as Pavan mentions in Model year (MY) 67 and was produced until '73 at least.

Stricly speaking the 1600 single port typ 1 engine is probably "rarer" as it was quickly superceded by the dual port 1600.

There are many the consider the 1500 the "best" engine, while others consider the 1600sp the best, and still others the 1600dp. Of course then there are some that consider all cars after 66 as less desirable. All of these are opinions. If we look at "data" -- as in are prices higher for some of these engines -- in my cursory look at prices of cars listed on the Samba, I've not see the 1500s or the 1600sp justifying a higher price. But, the earlier cars do have higher values if other variables like condition, history, location are the same.

Byas
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Old 10th April 2010, 16:33   #206
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Originally Posted by PAVAN KADAM View Post
I did not know, every car got registered the same month they were manufactured.

As per me, my car in specific was registered in September 1967.

I have applied for the Birth certificate for my car, sometime soon, i'll have more info on my very own BUG

Any doubts chettan'
and in your post number 126 you have stated like this::
As per the RC this Vehicle was registered in Mumbai (MRE)on 14-05-1970 and Re registered in Bangalore(CAX) on 04-04-1985 with a new number)
You are contradicting yourself several times in the same thread itself .At least please stick to what you say in the first place.
First you said that VW1967 1500 was rare and limited ,
Now you are saying it is special . what to do
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Old 10th April 2010, 16:34   #207
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Originally Posted by 71Convertible View Post
Pavan,
Am glad to hear your plans. In th emeantime, I'll keep trying to convince you to add the stock rear suspension and stock carb to your list. I can help you tune it so that it runs just as well as your current carb. I'll also volunteer to install the rear suspension for you.

PS: you stopping by today?

Byas
Thank you.

I am supposed to meet you today, sadly i need to cancel my plans as i am not home. Will do it next weekend for sure.

I'll get my Beetle carb (32 PICT), please see what can be done on it.

Something funny happened with one of my 30 PICT carb, you must know. The carb was on my Beetle for some days, but i always had idling and running issues, the 32 PICT carb never saw the day on the bug since i had a bad experience with the VW carbs. Luckily the S1 Solex 32 PBC carb from the Premier Padmini mated damn perfectly with the Bug, and it remained that way till date.

On the other hand the same troublesome 30 PICT carb was put on the 1967 SplitBus, it is running perfectly well.
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Old 10th April 2010, 16:46   #208
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Originally Posted by 71Convertible View Post
The 1500cc VW engine was actually introduced in 1961 on the Typ 3 which was called the VW1500. The long block of this engine (case, cylinders, head) is identical to the 1500 type 1 engine.

The 1500 type was intro'd as Pavan mentions in Model year (MY) 67 and was produced until '73 at least.

Stricly speaking the 1600 single port typ 1 engine is probably "rarer" as it was quickly superceded by the dual port 1600.

There are many the consider the 1500 the "best" engine, while others consider the 1600sp the best, and still others the 1600dp. Of course then there are some that consider all cars after 66 as less desirable. All of these are opinions. If we look at "data" -- as in are prices higher for some of these engines -- in my cursory look at prices of cars listed on the Samba, I've not see the 1500s or the 1600sp justifying a higher price. But, the earlier cars do have higher values if other variables like condition, history, location are the same.

Byas
well said 71conveertible,
your knowledge of beetles is specific and sounds more authentic.
why dont your good friend understand that the 1967 1500 sedan is just like any other bug
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Old 10th April 2010, 18:57   #209
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What I think (this is just my opinion) Pavan means when her refers to the '67 as unique

Aside from the pre '55 cars, the '67 was a strange year for VW. It made many changes/improvements but then had to make several more the following year to comply with changing regulations. This resulted in the '67 have the most (post 55 iirc) one year only features. Some examples -- the exterior door handle is different -- as a result even the door itself is different as the opening for the handle is different. Interior handles are one year only. Mirrors are one year. Decklid is one year only. Seat belt style is one year only. There's several more such items and there is a thread on Samba dedicated to the '67. So in that sense it IS unique. This uniqueness is a plus for some and a minus for others. The minus is because replacement parts are that much harder to come by and many of these one year only features are functionally no different or better -- just different. For others this is a plus. Just depends on how one chooses to view it.

Byas
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Old 10th April 2010, 20:34   #210
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Originally Posted by classico View Post
well said 71conveertible,
your knowledge of beetles is specific and sounds more authentic.
why dont your good friend understand that the 1967 1500 sedan is just like any other bug
We dont miss ajay99 anyways, thanks

Well it doesnt matter, what you say.



Quote:
Originally Posted by 71Convertible View Post
What I think (this is just my opinion) Pavan means when her refers to the '67 as unique

Aside from the pre '55 cars, the '67 was a strange year for VW. It made many changes/improvements but then had to make several more the following year to comply with changing regulations. This resulted in the '67 have the most (post 55 iirc) one year only features. Some examples -- the exterior door handle is different -- as a result even the door itself is different as the opening for the handle is different. Interior handles are one year only. Mirrors are one year. Decklid is one year only. Seat belt style is one year only. There's several more such items and there is a thread on Samba dedicated to the '67. So in that sense it IS unique. This uniqueness is a plus for some and a minus for others. The minus is because replacement parts are that much harder to come by and many of these one year only features are functionally no different or better -- just different. For others this is a plus. Just depends on how one chooses to view it.

Byas

Thank you Byas, This is simply what i wanted to convey.

I would honour something like this coming from someone like Byas. I know his indepth knowledge about the Bugs.

BTW Byas, should i go back to the stock dynamo pulley, i am presently using a smaller diametre pulley.

Also require your help in procuring a pair of 1967 specific tail light lens.

Last edited by PAVAN KADAM : 10th April 2010 at 20:40.
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