Go Back   Team-BHP > BHP India > Vintage Cars & Classics in India > Post-War


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 26th July 2016, 10:47   #1516
Distinguished - BHPian
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: MUMBAI
Posts: 3,059
Thanked: 4,384 Times
Default Re: The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by autocrat View Post
Sir, good learning for us, what I am perplexed about is spark plug performance change with compression. Never thought pressure could influence spark. Now, as I know your results, I think the density of air will also be a factor to generate a spark - more dense air means more energy needed to ionize them to enable the spark to jump across! Do you think the insulator in capacitor will degenerate with age and short internally?
Dear Gowtham - the insulator inside the condenser must have ruptured mechanically. At least I cannot think of anything else. I knew about the relationship with pressure, because when the 118NE project was progressing, MICO had given us spark plugs for the NISSAN engine and I used to take the test car after running of every 2000 kms for establishing the performance gradient and the life. This was way back in 1986. What is surprising is that the misfiring happened for not more than 2 to 3 minutes, and it ruined the plugs. The intensity of missing at the tailpipe after replacing the condenser was very less, a normal person would not even know. That's the learning. Anyways, we learnt forever, so good! I shall be checking the ignition coil also.

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar
DHABHAR.BEHRAM is offline   (2) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 26th July 2016, 22:19   #1517
Newbie
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Lucknow
Posts: 13
Thanked: 20 Times
Default Re: The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread

Quote:
Dear Whenasked - hello to you. 7psi cap is difficult to source. You may use 9psi or 11psi but ensure that the integrity of the hose pipes is perfect. Use EPDM hoses. In OE we used Tecil make caps. There is one RD make available, which is also good. Others are all nonsense. With production cooling system, you must use the cap without the top rubber seal. Even if you use the cap with this seal, you will not get any advantage as there is no surge tank.

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar
Dear BD sir,
Regarding the availability of radiator cap in the places where the PP/Fiat parts are difficult to source I have found that the radiator cap for HM Ambassador OEM supply is of good quality and is rated 9psi. I changed the RD one of my S1 last Saturday with the HM one. Other caps are not that good.
Posting some pictures of the replaced radiator cap and the new one.
Attached Thumbnails
The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread-img_20160716_122333.jpg  

The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread-img_20160716_122408.jpg  

The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread-img_20160716_122350.jpg  

The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread-img_20160716_122051.jpg  

The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread-img_20160716_122101.jpg  

The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread-img_20160716_122110.jpg  

jollyA is offline   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 27th July 2016, 10:30   #1518
Distinguished - BHPian
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: MUMBAI
Posts: 3,059
Thanked: 4,384 Times
Default Re: The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread

Dear JollyA - the cap will not work, the rubber has cracked so pressure will not build, so water will boil at 100 degrees C. Please see if you can source an early model Maruti 800 cap, it was 9 psi with same boundary dimensions and suitable for working with the surge tank so it can work with the degassing tank of the S1 also.

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar
DHABHAR.BEHRAM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27th July 2016, 20:50   #1519
BHPian
 
Leoshashi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Ranchi
Posts: 682
Thanked: 2,634 Times
Default Re: The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by jollyA View Post
Dear BD sir,
Regarding the availability of radiator cap in the places where the PP/Fiat parts are difficult to source I have found that the radiator cap for HM Ambassador OEM supply is of good quality and is rated 9psi. I changed the RD one of my S1 last Saturday with the HM one. Other caps are not that good.
Posting some pictures of the replaced radiator cap and the new one.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM View Post
Dear JollyAPlease see if you can source an early model Maruti 800 cap, it was 9 psi with same boundary dimensions and suitable for working with the surge tank so it can work with the degassing tank of the S1 also.
Dear Sir,

Sorry for the off-topic doubt, but what does the 0.9 on the radiator cap mean??

Regards,
Shashi
Leoshashi is online now   (2) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 27th July 2016, 21:03   #1520
Newbie
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Lucknow
Posts: 13
Thanked: 20 Times
Default Re: The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread

Quote:
Dear JollyA - the cap will not work, the rubber has cracked so pressure will not build, so water will boil at 100 degrees C. Please see if you can source an early model Maruti 800 cap, it was 9 psi with same boundary dimensions and suitable for working with the surge tank so it can work with the degassing tank of the S1 also.

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar
Dear BD sir,
With all due respect I would request you to look at the pictures posted by me again. The first 3 pictures are of the RD make radiator cap that I removed from my S1. The last 3 pictures are of the new one with fresh rubber in it that I installed on my car.

It's from a new stock of OEM Ambassador radiator caps and it is rated 9psi. I think it is working fine.

Thank you
Arun
jollyA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27th July 2016, 23:23   #1521
Senior - BHPian
 
samsag12's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: City of Nawaabs
Posts: 1,598
Thanked: 183 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jollyA View Post
.

It's from a new stock of OEM Ambassador radiator caps and it is rated 9psi. I think it is working fine.

Thank you
Arun
I think you mean to say 0.9 psi right !
samsag12 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27th July 2016, 23:50   #1522
Newbie
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Lucknow
Posts: 13
Thanked: 20 Times
Default Re: The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread

Quote:
I think you mean to say 0.9 psi right !
Sagar Bhai, I am saying that the pressure rating on both the radiator caps is same.
Posting the pics again for comparison.

Thank you
Arun
Attached Thumbnails
The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread-img_20160716_122333.jpg  

The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread-img_20160716_122051.jpg  

jollyA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28th July 2016, 13:26   #1523
Senior - BHPian
 
samsag12's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: City of Nawaabs
Posts: 1,598
Thanked: 183 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jollyA View Post
Sagar Bhai, I am saying that the pressure rating on both the radiator caps is same.
Posting the pics again for comparison.

Thank you
Arun
I am aware of what you're meaning to say Arun bhai, it's just that you omitted a decimal before writing down the pressure cap rating, it's 0.9 psi (0.062 bar) and not 9psi (0.62 bar) as mentioned in your post no 1517.

Anyway, eagerly waiting for some pics of the 1100D. 😃

Last edited by samsag12 : 28th July 2016 at 13:27.
samsag12 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28th July 2016, 14:52   #1524
BHPian
 
ariesonu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Bombay
Posts: 973
Thanked: 1,002 Times
Default Re: The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM View Post
Please see if you can source an early model Maruti 800 cap, it was 9 psi with same boundary dimensions and suitable for working with the surge tank so it can work with the degassing tank of the S1 also. Best regards - Behram Dhabhar
Is it only applicable to radiator with degassing tanks or also to straight radiators. If not then which is the best cap for straight radiators.

RED has S1 engine but no degassing tank.

Regards-Sonu
ariesonu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th July 2016, 21:40   #1525
Newbie
 
Carrera555's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Ahmedabad
Posts: 20
Thanked: 9 Times
Default Re: The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by KkVaidya View Post
I believe you are looking to restore the paint or is it the whole car? Getting good technicians to work on classics is getting difficult by the day. If it is mechanical restoration, I would recommend Manan Motors @ Navrangpura. For bodywork, I am yet to find a bodyshop in Ahmedabad that gives the finish I want.
Hi, I am looking forward to restore the entire vehicle. The vehicle needs attention in every aspect. I considering to give my car to Prakash who has a little garage in Ranip near BRTS stand. He has always worked on Padminis and he also owns Padminis and 118s. Do you know him?

Last edited by aah78 : 29th July 2016 at 22:06. Reason: Spell-check.
Carrera555 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th July 2016, 11:01   #1526
Distinguished - BHPian
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: MUMBAI
Posts: 3,059
Thanked: 4,384 Times
Default Re: The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread

Dear Arun and all - when you say "working fine", you must meet these criteria:

So OK, let me give you some information on radiator caps. The regular Padmini has a cooling system without a surge tank / degassing tank. The S1 has a cooling system with a degassing tank. In both the applications, the pressure cap does two things. When the engine is running, it regulates the cooling system pressure so as to control the boiling point of the coolant and protect the cooling system aggregates from overload. When the engine is switched off, it regulates the cooling system vacuum so as to revert to atmospheric pressure (in case of the open cooling system) replenish the coolant (in case of the surge tank) and maintain coolant level (in case of the degassing tank), also prevent collapse of the weakest link in the cooling system, which is the hoses.

The cooling system pressure is regulated by the spring constant acting on the rubber ring interfacing the radiator neck. This pressure is directly proportional to the axial dimension of the cap from the bottom of the rubber ring to the bottom of the cover. So Arun, check this dimension on the new cap that you have. Also conduct one simple test, remove the cap, start the engine and observe the coolant level in the degassing tank. As the filler hose is connected to the suction side of the cooling system, water will be sucked out of the degassing tank and into the cooling system by the water pump. Replenish if required upto the level indicator which I have provided inside the degassing tank (you can see it). Purge the cooling system fully like this, fit the cap and drive the car preferably with full load (GVW) up an incline not less than 10 kms long. Park the car overnight (this is called soak) and next morning without starting the engine in dead cold condition, observe the level in the degassing tank. Acceptance criteria is zero loss. Repeat this test a couple of times to confirm that the pressure valve and the vacuum valve of the cap are working properly. I have found that most of the market caps do not meet this acceptance criteria.

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar
DHABHAR.BEHRAM is offline   (6) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 30th July 2016, 15:01   #1527
Senior - BHPian
 
sandeepmohan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 1,805
Thanked: 1,332 Times
Default Re: The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread

A better picture of my 72' Fiat 1100D.
The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread-img_3623.jpg
The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread-img_3624.jpg
sandeepmohan is offline   (6) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 30th July 2016, 18:48   #1528
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: trivandrum
Posts: 2,337
Thanked: 875 Times
Default Re: The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by sandeepmohan View Post
A better picture of my 72' Fiat 1100D.
Attachment 1535505
Attachment 1535506
try to get the original plain coloured park light lenses.
ajay99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31st July 2016, 17:53   #1529
Senior - BHPian
 
funkykar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Bengaluru
Posts: 2,287
Thanked: 1,211 Times
Default Re: The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread

Dear B.D Sir,

The info regarding the radiator cap was very detailed and now we get to know the importance of the radiator cap!!

Need your help with my S1. As you can see in the below pic, the front suspension is too low. No issue as such, but the silencer/ mufler (Sports type round one) touches every small hump.

My mechanic suggests to put a 9 coil spring instead of the 8 coil spring and also put thicker spring pads. Is this the right solution? What bothers me is, when my S1, to the best of my knowledge, has all original spring, shock-absorber etc, why is it lower than the other PPs?

The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread-p_20160428_205107.jpg
funkykar is offline   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 1st August 2016, 14:02   #1530
BHPian
 
autocrat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 629
Thanked: 447 Times
Default Re: The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by funkykar View Post
Dear B.D Sir,

The info regarding the radiator cap was very detailed and now we get to know the importance of the radiator cap!!

Need your help with my S1. As you can see in the below pic, the front suspension is too low. No issue as such, but the silencer/ mufler (Sports type round one) touches every small hump.

My mechanic suggests to put a 9 coil spring instead of the 8 coil spring and also put thicker spring pads. Is this the right solution? What bothers me is, when my S1, to the best of my knowledge, has all original spring, shock-absorber etc, why is it lower than the other PPs?

Attachment 1536091
Hello Karthik,

Are you using 165/80R14 tyres?

Goutham
autocrat is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Fiat 1100 / Premier Padmini - Parts to Stock for FUTURE! arun1100 Post-War 336 2nd February 2016 17:32
The lovely Premier Padmini S1 (Fiat 1100-D) Ram The Indian Car Scene 391 1st February 2016 07:42
My 1973 (FIAT 1100) Premier President President Post-War 208 17th September 2015 00:13
Fiat 1100 "Family" -1962 -Technical, Photos & Information john a milne Post-War 64 29th May 2012 11:15
Used Maruti800, premier padmini , premier 118ne ? sakharamcool Hatchbacks 8 27th May 2008 11:17


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 22:05.

Copyright 2000 - 2016, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks