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Old 23rd February 2016, 13:39   #1426
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Default Re: The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread

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Originally Posted by dracul View Post
Sir, why there is a bulge in the hood of your car?. Is it just for visual enhancement or something bigger is there underneath.
This is inside the bulge.
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/post-w...ml#post1208613 (My Left Hand Drive Fiat.)
Mikuni Carburetor + manifold and 118NE air filter box.
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Old 23rd February 2016, 14:08   #1427
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Default Re: The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread

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Originally Posted by dracul View Post
Sir, why there is a bulge in the hood of your car?. Is it just for visual enhancement or something bigger is there underneath.
Dear Dracul - hello to you. That "bulge" on the bonnet is called "hood scoop". I used to rally in my group A prepared car MMY43. As it was group A (modified), it ran with the twin carburettor setup. I am posting three photographs of MMY43 taken in 1989 and 1991, which shows the hood scoop and the twin carburettors. It also had the steering strut, the suspension brace reinforcement and the full roll cage. In those days, petrol was 8 rupees a liter, I was somehow able to afford 6 kmpl . At today's petrol price, twin carburettor setup does not make sense, although I still have the manifold with me at home. However, in order to come as close as possible to MMY43, I made the LHD with the hood scoop, the steering strut and the full roll cage. For getting sensible fuel economy at today's fuel price, it now runs a Mikuni with a 118NE air cleaner, which needs the hood scoop in any case. I am changing the air cleaner to Esteem as I need a little better mass flow of clean air flowing into the engine and as original Purolator make 118NE air cleaner cartridges are difficult to buy now.

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar
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Old 24th February 2016, 09:42   #1428
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Default Re: The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread

I am loving this

Some lights on my cars speedo console light is not lighting up when I turn parking lights on, but when I apply brake the speedo console lights are lit dimly. I am not able to trace the fault. Please let me know what can be done about this. Also, can I fit the president meter console to my car? Are the inputs for the temp gauge and fuel gauge same for 1990 PP meters and president meters? I dont even know if the president meter is working.

Goutham
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Old 25th February 2016, 13:33   #1429
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Default Re: The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread

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Originally Posted by autocrat View Post
1. Some lights on my cars speedo console light is not lighting up when I turn parking lights on, but when I apply brake the speedo console lights are lit dimly. I am not able to trace the fault. Please let me know what can be done about this. 2. Can I fit the president meter console to my car? Are the inputs for the temp gauge and fuel gauge same for 1990 PP meters and president meters? I dont even know if the president meter is working. Goutham
Dear Goutham - my reply is as follows:

1. Console lights fuse is loose, tighten it. Fuse box has always been a very weak link in the Padmini, it is terrible. As a permanent solution, use an original Maruti 800 fuse box with fuses mounted below the glove box cavity. The Padmini fuse box and its cover remain as dummy parts. The electrician who does this job must understand what he is doing, otherwise you will get hassled by more electrical problems. All my cars run with the Maruti 800 fuse boxes.
2. You can fit the President meter in your car. Remove the fuel gage sending unit from the tank and calibrate the gage before you fit it. President came with the thermistor type temperature gage which has no electrical connection. You will need to use the plug with the blind hole and M8*1.0 (not 1.25) size threads in the cylinder head. Tape the thermistor connection so that it does not short anywhere.

I suggest you go for total looks change package, including the thin steering wheel. The car will look and feel much better, like a classic! .

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar
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Old 27th February 2016, 13:22   #1430
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Default Re: The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread

In my S1, there seems to be some oil leakage from the side of the engine.
Can someone please advise on corrective action to be taken?
Also, the floor shift gear lever makes a vibrating noise when cruising,the noise stops when i hold the lever down. What can/could cause this?

PFB the pics
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Old 29th February 2016, 12:21   #1431
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Default Re: The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread

Dear Shom - the crankcase breather pipe is kinked, so the crankcase pressure is increasing. As pressure has to find its way out, it is coming out through the weakest link, which in your case seems to be the side cover, so oil is leaking through the side cover packing. Just unkink the breather pipe. The kink is clearly seen in your photograph. What yaar! . Also see that the 3 nuts holding the side cover are tight. Do not apply excessive torque, the plastic washers below the nuts will split. You can go for around 12Nm. Check the oil level on a warm engine, 10 minutes after shutoff with the car parked on level ground. Oil level should not increase above maximum. If you find it more than maximum, tell me, I'll tell you what went wrong, it's very interesting! .

By the way, your plug wires are not original.

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar
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Old 29th February 2016, 23:30   #1432
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Default Re: The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread

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Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM View Post
Dear Shom -

By the way, your plug wires are not original.

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar
Sirji, this is one doubt I wanted you to clarify. How do we make out if the wires are original? The plug wires available in the market are of inferior quality. What's the best way out?
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Old 1st March 2016, 00:06   #1433
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Default Re: The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread

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Check the oil level on a warm engine, 10 minutes after shutoff with the car parked on level ground. Oil level should not increase above maximum. If you find it more than maximum, tell me, I'll tell you what went wrong, it's very interesting!
Behram Sir, even if it is not, educate us, please.
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Old 1st March 2016, 12:50   #1434
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Default Re: The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread

Hi Behram ji ,

What are the key differences with the S1 head /rockers/valves/cam and the standard ones .is there any benefit of interchanging them .

Also i understand that the final drive in the S1 is different is that true .i currently run my car with the 13 inch wheels and a twin butterfly Hitachi carb .the car would be happy with much taller gearing and hence the question

Thanks in advance


Prashanth
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Old 2nd March 2016, 11:59   #1435
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Default Re: The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread

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Originally Posted by Voyager View Post
Hi Behramji, 1. What are the key differences with the S1 head / rockers / valves / cam and the standard ones? Is there any benefit of interchanging them. 2. I understand that the final drive in the S1 is different, is that true? 3. I currently run my car with the 13 inch wheels and a twin butterfly Hitachi carburettor. The car would be happy with much taller gearing and hence the question. Thanks in advance, Prashanth
Dear Prashanth - my reply is as follows:
1. Rocker shaft diameter is increased from 18mm to 22 mm, rocker rigidity is improved by changing the shape and therefore the forging die, pushrod velocity (omega) is reduced to improve mechanical efficiency and minimize driveline clatter, pushrod length is reduced to match the changed valve-train geometry, camshaft lobes are made bigger to improve life, valve timing of both valves is smoothened to enhance scavenging, camshaft support diameter is increased in the cylinder block, valve stem diameter is reduced by 1mm, valve seat angles are optimized to enable better manufacturing control and also provide minimum friction, pistons are optimized for skirt dimensions and coating, piston rings cross section is optimized, optimized intake manifold heating is introduced to reduce HC, 44.45 mm (1.75 inch) diameter 3-2-1 exhaust manifold, front pipe and tail pipe are introduced to enhance scavenging, muffler construction is changed to optimize the back pressure, water pump impeller capacity is reduced to optimize fluid friction but operating speed is increased to enable optimized heat transfer and reduce inertia by using a smaller diameter water pump pulley, cooling system is optimized by using a thermoswitch operated motor driven fan with a cross flow radiator, degassing tank is introduced to reduce cavitation effect on the cylinder head, coolant system pressure is increased to optimize mass emissions. With all this done, will interchange ability ever become possible? Obviously no!
2. Yes, S1 is 3.9:1, non-S1 is 4.3:1.
3. With 13" wheels, the dynamic rolling radius is less by 10 mm (refer ITTAC manual). So you are running a little taller than 3.9:1 in any case.

Dear Karthik - original wires for non-S1 application were metal core with screw-on plastic caps for the ignition coil and the distributor. The original wires have double layer insulation, the outer layer is black and the inner layer is pink, you can physically see both the layers. The spark plug terminals are made of stainless steel. The rubber caps are of thick construction, having 3 concentric diameters. Original wires were made by a vendor in Chembur Mumbai and supplied only to the assembly line at Kurla. Use these wires with the corresponding distributor cap and the PA12 ignition coil for the S1 also, production S1 cars had carbon core wires to meet some electrical related CMVR, but they never worked properly.

Dear Rajeev k - why engine oil level actually increases? Think and post your comments, it will be a healthy thing to discuss! .

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar
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Old 2nd March 2016, 14:01   #1436
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Default Re: The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread

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Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM View Post
Dear Prashanth - my reply is as follows:
1. Rocker shaft diameter is increased from 18mm to 22 mm, rocker rigidity is improved by changing the shape and therefore the forging die, pushrod velocity (omega) is reduced to improve mechanical efficiency and minimize driveline clatter, pushrod length is reduced to match the changed valve-train geometry, camshaft lobes are made bigger to improve life, valve timing of both valves is smoothened to enhance scavenging, camshaft support diameter is increased in the cylinder block, valve stem diameter is reduced by 1mm, valve seat angles are optimized to enable better manufacturing control and also provide minimum friction, pistons are optimized for skirt dimensions and coating, piston rings cross section is optimized, optimized intake manifold heating is introduced to reduce HC, 44.45 mm (1.75 inch) diameter 3-2-1 exhaust manifold, front pipe and tail pipe are introduced to enhance scavenging, muffler construction is changed to optimize the back pressure, water pump impeller capacity is reduced to optimize fluid friction but operating speed is increased to enable optimized heat transfer and reduce inertia by using a smaller diameter water pump pulley, cooling system is optimized by using a thermoswitch operated motor driven fan with a cross flow radiator, degassing tank is introduced to reduce cavitation effect on the cylinder head, coolant system pressure is increased to optimize mass emissions. With all this done, will interchange ability ever become possible? Obviously no!
That was indeed quite a lot of redesign Sir, Thank you very much for explaining them in detail. And very obvious that all these redesigned S1 parts cannot go into a normal PP crankcase. But why PAL did not think of this activity or a new engine family or a complete defined powertrain (for example Ambassador has seen BMC petrol / Diesel; Isuzu 1.8 petrol / 1.5 D / 2.0D / 2.0D with Turbo /etc.)

Quote:
2. Yes, S1 is 3.9:1, non-S1 is 4.3:1.
Sir, so the speedometer worm & pinion ratio is changed to accommodate or else the speed correction was integrated into the speedometer itself?

Quote:
why engine oil level actually increases?
The pressurized crank case pushes the oil upwards through the dipstick pipe.
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Old 3rd March 2016, 09:39   #1437
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Default Re: The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread

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Originally Posted by ilangop View Post
1. That was indeed quite a lot of redesign Sir, Thank you very much for explaining them in detail. And very obvious that all these redesigned S1 parts cannot go into a normal PP crankcase. But why PAL did not think of this activity or a new engine family or a complete defined powertrain? 2. The speedometer worm & pinion ratio is changed to accommodate or else the speed correction was integrated into the speedometer itself? 3. The pressurized crank case pushes the oil upwards through the dipstick pipe.
Dear Ilangop - my reply is as follows:
1. Yes it was a lot of redesign, but nobody even knew, so we continued to get brickbats, which was sad. Inspite of all the nonsense surrounding us, we were extremely strong in our vehicle engineering principles. "You know" (oh, come on now), that I am using this information even today, everyday. Due to the product exposure and the resultant product engineering clarity that I got then, I find "many things mildly amusing" today! I guess a smiley is called for, hahaha! .
2. The instrument cluster W (W is speedometer constant) value is different. For the non-S1 with the fiat transmission and 4.3:1 axle ratio application, it is 1.0. For the S1 with the Nissan transmission and 3.9:1 axle ratio application, it is 0.65. W =1 means that the odometer will show 1 km when the speedometer cable rotates 1000 times. So for W = 0.65, the odometer will show 1 km when the speedometer cable rotates 650 times. As usual, every single engineering specification is perfectly clear. Not bad for a 1953 design! I guess there were no presentations in 1953!
3. Oh my God, you must be joking! Does the oil defy gravity? When you switch off the engine, the oil must also come down naa? Now second smiley is really called for. . The reason is so simple, once I tell you, you will never forget it!

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar

Last edited by DHABHAR.BEHRAM : 3rd March 2016 at 09:45.
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Old 3rd March 2016, 13:31   #1438
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Default Re: The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread

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Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM View Post
Dear Ilangop - my reply is as follows:

3. Oh my God, you must be joking! Does the oil defy gravity? When you switch off the engine, the oil must also come down naa? Now second smiley is really called for. . The reason is so simple, once I tell you, you will never forget it!

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar
Sir, may be petrol leaked in to the crankcase which may increase the oil level?
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Old 4th March 2016, 11:04   #1439
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Default Re: The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread

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Sir, may be petrol leaked in to the crankcase which may increase the oil level?
Dear Dracul - congratulations, you are correct. Now define the process to confirm this on the car! This is so interesting that you will always remember it! .

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar
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Old 4th March 2016, 11:20   #1440
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Default Re: The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread

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Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM View Post
Dear Dracul - congratulations, you are correct. Now define the process to confirm this on the car! This is so interesting that you will always remember it! .

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar
Sir, Can it leak from the mechanical pump if the diaphragm ruptures? Because I don't see any possibility of fuel finding its way into crankcase, from the carburetor side.
My 118 has got an electric fuel pump and if above can happen, I am saved.
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