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Old 3rd June 2010, 10:22   #211
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Solder has an extremely low melting point for an alloy and though i have never tried, it is safe to assume it has an equally low boiling point as well. so heating solder with an oxy acetyline torch will most probably vaporize it, making soldering impossible. plus i THINK solder doesnt stick to steel as well. it sticks to brass, that i know.

My 800's radiator sprung a big leak once. A tear in the sheet metal body of the tank that forms the bottom part of the radiator. i fixed it by soldering it (after taking it off and emptying it ofcourse) but must say it has held on remarkably well(been almost 2 years since the repair).No leaks ever since. so guys if ever your radiator leaks and its brass and not alluminium then solder is the best , cheapest and the most non intrusive option and you can do it yourself.

Last edited by mycarhasablower : 3rd June 2010 at 10:25.
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Old 3rd June 2010, 10:27   #212
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[quote=Stanher;1918617]Sure, I'm ready to go there even today!

Could you again give me the directions to that place btw? Incidentally, my mech. was told of a Herald put up at a dealer's a little ahead of Mehdipatnam a few days ago. I presume it has to be the same car you saw. But he says he went to that area and couldnt find the car even on asking a few dealers there. I presume Attapur is even further ahead.

This car is completely painted in red oxide, top has a huge dent and rear wheels are removed. I guess this car is not being worked for quite sometime and again with that I presume it might be also for sale (guess work) so we can check this on any weekend Stanguru.
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Old 3rd June 2010, 11:43   #213
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Um, yes it is gas welding. What exactly do you advise me to clarify btw?
And for the body work has it not been the Gas welding that is been used from ages? and every book on the subject also prescribe as one of the predominent method. And from the pictures it looks like he is not using any solder.

Solder is also described as one of the method of working on sheet metal. and its relatively easy to work on. I have a a book on the subject from my collage days, need to dig out for reference of all.

Last edited by manishalive : 3rd June 2010 at 11:51.
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Old 3rd June 2010, 12:48   #214
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Originally Posted by mycarhasablower View Post
Solder has an extremely low melting point for an alloy and though i have never tried, it is safe to assume it has an equally low boiling point as well. so heating solder with an oxy acetyline torch will most probably vaporize it, making soldering impossible. plus i THINK solder doesnt stick to steel as well. it sticks to brass, that i know.
Well then how do you think the welders melt chunks of solder when they are welding 2 panels together? It does not vaporize at all! Solder does stick whenm you are joining 2 pieces of steel but we do not use steel in the car body, it works out to be far more expensive so taking the example of Steel is irrelevant here i feel. We normally use sheet metal and there are different ways of welding it.

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Originally Posted by mycarhasablower View Post
My 800's radiator sprung a big leak once. A tear in the sheet metal body of the tank that forms the bottom part of the radiator. i fixed it by soldering it (after taking it off and emptying it ofcourse) but must say it has held on remarkably well(been almost 2 years since the repair).No leaks ever since. so guys if ever your radiator leaks and its brass and not alluminium then solder is the best , cheapest and the most non intrusive option and you can do it yourself.
I have a question here if you saw solder has a low melting point then using it on a radiator won't make it melt ? The radiator is normally quite hot.

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And for the body work has it not been the Gas welding that is been used from ages? and every book on the subject also prescribe as one of the predominent method. And from the pictures it looks like he is not using any solder.
Yes it is the on e that has been used for a long time now but there are many workshop i have seen where they using transformer welding on cars. In this process we just have to make sure that the battery is not connect to the car.If i may pint out he is in the pictures attached by shyam earlier which i will mark out the portions where it seems he has used solder.

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Solder is also described as one of the method of working on sheet metal. and its relatively easy to work on. I have a a book on the subject from my collage days, need to dig out for reference of all.
Yes you are correct that solder is described as one of the easiest methods of welding but it is not the best and specially for old cars.There are many who use this.
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Old 3rd June 2010, 13:52   #215
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Yes it is the on e that has been used for a long time now but there are many workshop i have seen where they using transformer welding on cars. In this process we just have to make sure that the battery is not connect to the car.If i may pint out he is in the pictures attached by shyam earlier which i will mark out the portions where it seems he has used solder.

Yes you are correct that solder is described as one of the easiest methods of welding but it is not the best and specially for old cars.There are many who use this.
What I have seen and read that solder is used for small areas like filling up of small holes, smoothning small undulations instead of using metal paste. for welding it is not advised. for large areas some times a wires mesh is used and then filled with solder. I will try to put some pictures from the documents that I have.

No were Soldering is a substitute for welding. Oxy-Acetylene welding is used as it produces smooth results, than Electric arc welding (MIG and TIG are a different ball game all togather)

I commented that they might have not used solder as I saw the ones circled in picture. But you might be right. Let Shyam clarify our doubt

Resurrection of (a) Stanher by Stanher!-img_6206.jpg

On the other note could you please let me have details on sand blasting. I intend to that on my car, the way you intend to do on the Mercedes. If you know of any one in Bangalore it will be an added help.
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Old 3rd June 2010, 14:37   #216
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No were Soldering is a substitute for welding. Oxy-Acetylene welding is used as it produces smooth results, than Electric arc welding (MIG and TIG are a different ball game all togather)

I commented that they might have not used solder as I saw the ones circled in picture. But you might be right. Let Shyam clarify our doubt
If you look at the finish of the welding you can make out wheather it is solder or not. Apart from than if you have seen a lot of welding work been done by looking at a pic you can say if it solder or not.



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On the other note could you please let me have details on sand blasting. I intend to that on my car, the way you intend to do on the Mercedes. If you know of any one in Bangalore it will be an added help.
What car do you want to do it for ? Do you have a dedicated thread ? posting the link of the thread would help.

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Old 3rd June 2010, 15:36   #217
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If you look at the finish of the welding you can make out wheather it is solder or not. Apart from than if you have seen a lot of welding work been done by looking at a pic you can say if it solder or not.

What car do you want to do it for ? Do you have a dedicated thread ? posting the link of the thread would help.
Yes looking at the weld, it is definitely not peetal (sorry i am getting english name of the metal).

My Car is 1959 Fiat 1100 (Select).

The thread is

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/post-1...storation.html
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Old 3rd June 2010, 15:40   #218
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Solder is not used for welding. It just cant be used with a gas welder. it is used in electronics and you use a soldering iron to melt it(no flame just a heating element heated metal rod). What the welders use is a wire made of the same material that is being welded which may look like soldering wire but it isnt, maybe some mechnics call it solder and their jargon is what confused you, but then again that happens, i myself had a hard time understanding their jhoolas(swingarms) and chidiyas(rockerarms).Gas welding acheives temperature way north of a 1000 degrees. soldering iron doesnt heat up mre than 300. An 800's radiator doesnt get hotter than 150 on its surface.

Last edited by mycarhasablower : 3rd June 2010 at 15:42.
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Old 3rd June 2010, 15:42   #219
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Originally Posted by manishalive View Post
Yes looking at the weld, it is definitely not peetal (sorry i am getting english name of the metal).

My Car is 1959 Fiat 1100 (Select).

The thread is

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/post-1...storation.html
Peetal is Brass. It is not that. I am quite sure it is solder.



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Originally Posted by mycarhasablower View Post
Solder is not used for welding. It just cant be used with a gas welder. it is used in electronics and you use a soldering iron to melt it(no flame just a heating element heated metal rod). What the welders use is a wire made of the same material that is being welded which may look like soldering wire but it isnt, maybe some mechnics call it solder and their jargon is what confused you, but then again that happens, i myself had a hard time understanding their jhoolas(swingarms) and chidiyas(rockerarms).Gas welding acheives temperature way north of a 1000 degrees. soldering iron doesnt heat up mre than 300. An 800's radiator doesnt get hotter than 150 on its surface.
Sir i think you need to clarify things once again. I nowhere mentioned that the wires are of solder. I know what it is and how it is used. No mechanics call it such. I know it for a fact because i have bought it many times for my workshop. Nothing has confused me at all.Solder that is used for welding doesnt come in wires and is not melted using a soldering iron. The solder that is used for welding comes in solid chunks and not wire which has to be used using a gas welding set.

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Old 3rd June 2010, 15:56   #220
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is it the same solder that is used in electronics?? AFAIK solder is an alloy of tin and lead which melts around 200 degree celsius and gas welding equipment is capable of producing temperatures above 3000 degree celsius(i just checked it wasnt 1000). Now you only tell me why would someone use 3000degree c to melt somthing that melts at 200.


edit: i just checked, there is something known as hard solder(not normal solder) which is used for brazing and is an alloy of copper and zinc. it has a much higher melting point. and thats what i think u were referring to i guess. sorry for the confusion.

Ohh and i did use normal solder to fix my radiator

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Old 3rd June 2010, 16:07   #221
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Originally Posted by mycarhasablower View Post
is it the same solder that is used in electronics?? AFAIK solder is an alloy of tin an lead which melts around 200 degree celsius and gas welding equipment is capable of producing temperatures above 3000 degree celsius(i just checked it wasnt 1000). Now you only tell me why would someone use 3000degree c to melt somthing that melts at 200.

edit: i just checked, there is something known as hard solder(not normal solder) which is used for brazing and is an alloy of copper and zinc. it has a much higher melting point. and thats what i think u were referring to i guess. sorry for the confusion.

Ohh and i did use normal solder to fix my radiator


The solder used in welding is a bit different in composition. It has got copper to increase its melting point. Many welders know how to use only solder that is the way they have been trained.


Wait for overheating problems and then you will see what is what on the radiator.

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Old 3rd June 2010, 16:14   #222
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Wait for overheating problems and then you will see what is what on the radiator.

Lol i have had overheating problems as i mentioned in the thread -The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread. (thanks to a broken wire my fan wasnt rotating at its correct speed) and thankfully it still isnt leaking.

I think even on overheating the surface temp. of the radiator doesnt reach 200 so i guess i have been lucky.
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Old 3rd June 2010, 16:16   #223
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Lol i have had overheating problems as i mentioned in the thread -The FIAT 1100/Premier Padmini Technical Information thread. (thanks to a broken wire my fan wasnt rotating at its correct speed) and thankfully it still isnt leaking.

I think even on overheating the surface temp. of the radiator doesnt reach 200 so i guess i have been lucky.

And how did you melt the solder ?? Using an soldering iron ?
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Old 3rd June 2010, 16:28   #224
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Yup very much. Ill take a picture of the repaired area if you want and put it up later. Maybe its because the 800 , just cuz it doesnt produce much power , also runs cooler than pretty much all other cars. After all how much heat is given out is a function of how much fuel is burnt/how much power is prduced.
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Old 3rd June 2010, 17:08   #225
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Originally Posted by IndrojitSircar View Post
It can be seen that he is doing Oxygen Gas welding and it seems he is melting solder to join the two panels. Could you just clarify this with your welder?
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What the welders use is a wire made of the same material that is being welded which may look like soldering wire but it isnt, maybe some mechnics call it solder and their jargon is what confused you
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Let Shyam clarify our doubt
OK, got it! But as MCB says, they use the wire-like things that are not really soldering wire but they melt down to act as joining forces. Is this what you guys wanted me to clarify? If not, then have to wait until tomorrow, as they werent at the garage today when I went! So couldnt ask them.
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