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Old 12th March 2013, 00:16   #1
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Default 1925 Rolls Royce Phantom 1 @ Calcutta

I've posted some photos on other threads and felt this restoration deserves it's own thread. It's going to be a remarkable restoration and having had no body, will get a new custom one built.

In the fine tradition of the the Kanorias, I expect it will exceed anything they have undertaken to date. I understand that it was purchased a number of years ago with only the none running chassis and the fenders were in pieces, badly damaged and crumpled up.

Shriv has done quite a bit of research of what were some interesting body types of this period and showed me a photo of a model that caught his eye which should be quite stunning.

He is currently building the body and will complete it first, fitting every thing in place and then remove the body for final painting before starting restoring the chassis and the mechanicals.

The first photos were taken about two months ago and the last few photos were taken last week with a temporary RR rad installed that his dad had custom built quite a few years ago as liqueur cabinet.

The size and scale of this car is awesome, my Fiat WBF1 looks like some kids Toy Car beside it.

Hopefully he will post some of the earlier photos.
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Old 12th March 2013, 11:17   #2
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Default re: 1925 Rolls Royce Phantom 1 @ Calcutta

John, it would be nice if you can check and post the engine and chassis number so the car's history can be linked to the car.

Any idea what its original coachwork was like ?
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Old 12th March 2013, 14:13   #3
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Default Re: 1925 Rolls Royce Phantom 1 @ Calcutta

I don't recall that Shriv had any idea what the original body type was. I'll ask him to post the engine and chassis number.
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Old 12th March 2013, 17:14   #4
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Default Re: 1925 Rolls Royce Phantom 1 @ Calcutta

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I don't recall that Shriv had any idea what the original body type was. I'll ask him to post the engine and chassis number.
Looks like it is going to be a "Hooper" in its new avatar.
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Old 12th March 2013, 18:41   #5
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Default Re: 1925 Rolls Royce Phantom 1 @ Calcutta

Hi,
Excuse my ignorance, what's a "Hooper"?
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Old 12th March 2013, 21:03   #6
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Default Re: 1925 Rolls Royce Phantom 1 @ Calcutta

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Hi,
Excuse my ignorance, what's a "Hooper"?
Sorry John, meant to say a body in the style of Hooper Coachbuilders - that is what those wings look like.
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Old 12th March 2013, 22:46   #7
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Default Re: 1925 Rolls Royce Phantom 1 @ Calcutta

Thanks, I'll google Hooper Coach Builders and see some different body styles.

I understand that there were a number of Calcutta Coach Builders for horse carriages who also built some custom cars bodies. Is there been a thread on these companies?
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Old 18th March 2013, 00:25   #8
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Default Re: 1925 Rolls Royce Phantom 1 @ Calcutta

I remember seeing a similar car being restored at Sanghi Motors (Hyundai Service Centre) Indore before three years. Later heard from the staff there that it was completely restored and sold. Why don't you try and get in touch with them? Hopefully, they can shed some light into this one as well.
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Old 18th March 2013, 11:22   #9
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Default Re: 1925 Rolls Royce Phantom 1 @ Calcutta

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Originally Posted by john a milne View Post
Thanks, I'll google Hooper Coach Builders and see some different body styles.

I understand that there were a number of Calcutta Coach Builders for horse carriages who also built some custom cars bodies. Is there been a thread on these companies?
One of the coach builders was Steuart & Co and another James Hastle Coachmaker in Calcutta, this is what I found on the net, apparently someone searching for ancestors.

"""From: " @yahoo.co.uk
Subject: Re: [INDIA] Steuart and Co, Coachmakers Calcutta
Date: Sat, 9 Oct 2010 09:14:13 +0200
Hi ,

I have been doing a bit more digging.
Isabella Stewart's older sister Ann, of the Parish of Dalserf, married 5 Oct 1781 William Hastie, a cotton spinner (manufacturer), in Kilbarchan.

Hastie died 1808 leaving a widow and a large family of children in reduced circumstances. In 1821 six of these children were living, namely, four sons, Robert, John, James and Archibald, and two daughters Ann & Margaret. Robert,
John & James were carrying on business as coachmakers under style of Stuart & Co (a firm in which two of their Shanks cousins William & James Steuart Shanks were also involved - the middle brother Robert Shanks had also been in the company but had by 1820 joined Robert How, Coachmaker in London, and
married How's niece Ann How). Archibald Hastie (MP for Paisley 1836-1857) was carrying on business as a saddler in London, and acting as agent to Stuart & Co., his brother's firm at Calcutta. The two sisters were residing with their mother, and during this time were supported by the united brothers.................................... Cheers """

And from a second mail,its contents:

""" I have made good inroads into the Steuart and Co families who were Coachmakers in Calcutta from 1784 onwards.
The Steuart family come from Dalserf in Lanarkshire, Scotland and the first two to come to Calcutta were James and Robert Steuart (James Steuart on the Crocodile 1783 and Robert Steuart on a Portuguese ship in 1784). it strongly appears that James Steuart took over the business of William Johnson Coachmaker, who died in Calcutta in 1784. William Steuart - their half brother came out in 1795. He never married but had two natural sons viz General Charles Steuart of 14th
Hussars and Archibald Steuart - a Doctor and three natural daughters.
James Steuart was born in 1759 and died in 1832 - will proves that his sister was Mrs Shanks and neice viz, Margaret Stewart Shanks was Mrs Andrew Muir (both of Edinburgh) and another sister was Mrs Hastie (also married to James Hastie Coachmaker in Calcutta and London). He left Calcutta and went back to Scotland where he married Mary Sword and bought the estate of Carfin.
Robert Steuart was still in Calcutta in 1808 - after his retirement he married Miss Stewart of Grandtully and bought the estate of Alderton in East Lothian, Scotland. He had two sons in his old age.
Robert, William, James Steuart SHANKS are the nephews of these
Steuart and Co Coachmakers and as such were heavily involved in the business along with the Hastie brothers.
I have however to find the marriage of Robert SHANKS and Isabella Steuart (Stewart) around circa 1787-1790 in Calcutta i presume as it is not in Scotland.
Also Robert Shanks parents still remain a mystery but have been narrowed down in Scotland to a Robert Shanks born 1764 to a William Shanks and Margaret Whyte in Glasgow. This however remains to be proved. If born in England there are 3 possibilities. I still have to find a will for Robert Shanks dying somewhere between 1820 and 1845 which is when Isabella died in Edinburgh - i have her will.

I obtained the history of Steuart and Co by Evan Cotton in Bengal
Past and Present and have found it to be a correct history so far.
The early Calcutta newspapers were great to read at Gale database as well. Cheers """

A few years ago a Steuart bodies Rolls was auctioned abroad.

Cheers harit

Last edited by harit : 18th March 2013 at 11:23.
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Old 18th March 2013, 11:23   #10
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Default Re: 1925 Rolls Royce Phantom 1 @ Calcutta

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Looks like it is going to be a "Hooper" in its new avatar.
Looks like its going the "barrel sided" tourer look !
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Old 18th March 2013, 18:41   #11
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Default Re: 1925 Rolls Royce Phantom 1 @ Calcutta

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Originally Posted by harit View Post
One of the coach builders was Steuart & Co and another James Hastle Coachmaker in Calcutta, this is what I found on the net, apparently someone searching for ancestors.

I obtained the history of Steuart and Co by Evan Cotton in Bengal
Past and Present and have found it to be a correct history so far.
The early Calcutta newspapers were great to read at Gale database as well. Cheers """

A few years ago a Steuart bodies Rolls was auctioned abroad.

Cheers harit
Thanks so much for this information.

We tend to forget that Calcutta was the hub of the English Raj and must have drawn some remarkable individuals to this once Grand city.

I'll check out the Gale database and try and encourage some of the Calcutta BHP members to dig into our automotive history here, hopefully find some old photos.
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Old 19th March 2013, 10:44   #12
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Default Re: 1925 Rolls Royce Phantom 1 @ Calcutta

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Thanks so much for this information. We tend to forget that Calcutta was the hub of the English Raj and must have drawn some remarkable individuals to this once Grand city.
I'll check out the Gale database and try and encourage some of the Calcutta BHP members to dig into our automotive history here, hopefully find some old photos.
Please do that.
I think that soon after the advent of the automobile, the Brits shifted from Calcutta to Delhi and Delhi became more impoprtant. Bombay was also an automobile center.
But, automobiles did spread into many areas in India, particularly Rajasthan and Central India, resulting in a dealer network. I have lots of ads, and many were in Hindi.
Its just that someone must take some interest and pull out papers related to automobiles. Its very interesting.
Please do let us know what you find.

Cheers harit
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Old 28th March 2013, 19:22   #13
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Default Re: 1925 Rolls Royce Phantom 1 @ Calcutta

I visited Shiv's works early this week and found lots of progress on his Rolls.

I asked him for more information on the car and it's history. His dad had been buying all sorts of items from the "Mullick Bazar" where all the cars go for scrapping and parting out for the past 35 years. This Rolls was purchased in various pieces some dating back 30 years and he had, as I understand it, had started to assemble the chassis together about 20 years back and so it has just sat. Shriv decided to complete the restoration of the running gear and design and build his own new body having researched various Rolls of that era.

It's indeed a daunting challenge and he hope's to have it finished in 12-18 months taking his time to do it up "right".

He showed me some of the detail work he is currently doing; the half round tubing had rusted out out so he took some metal piping, cut it in half and has welded a flat piece on to match the original section. I mentioned the odd steering wheel that had the top cut out and he said that he had another complete wheel along with the correct instruments for the dash that would be fitted later.

The RR rad shell is temporary as his Dad had made it up with a bar at the back many years ago. He will be putting Teak strips along the bonnet and has marked them out.

I suggested he should create a "Coat of Arms" for his new Calcutta Coach Building Enterprise.
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Old 28th March 2013, 21:44   #14
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Default Re: 1925 Rolls Royce Phantom 1 @ Calcutta

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Originally Posted by john a milne View Post
I visited Shiv's works early this week and found lots of progress on his Rolls.


I mentioned the odd steering wheel that had the top cut out and he said that he had another complete wheel along with the correct instruments for the dash that would be fitted later.

The RR rad shell is temporary as his Dad had made it up with a bar at the back many years ago.
Maybe that cut away steering should be maintained. Looks kind of similar to the one on the 25/30.

Wow, if that radiator shell is handmade in Calcutta, hats off to the artisans!
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Old 28th March 2013, 23:20   #15
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Originally Posted by travancore View Post

Maybe that cut away steering should be maintained. Looks kind of similar to the one on the 25/30.

Wow, if that radiator shell is handmade in Calcutta, hats off to the artisans!
And you think that's made ! It was used as a back to a bar if I read correctly. The cut away steering was a speciality of the east including a v12 p3 we all know also.

No whitewall s ... Please

Cheers

Last edited by kasli : 28th March 2013 at 23:42.
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