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Old 10th December 2011, 08:51   #1531
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Originally Posted by Vintage Khan

Hi,

Just wondered if this RR still lies that derelict condition begging attention?

cheers!
This is not an RR similar body style but not an RR and very much restored. Resides in Hyderabad.
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Old 10th December 2011, 11:10   #1532
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Originally Posted by Vintage Khan View Post
Hi, Just wondered if this RR still lies that derelict condition begging attention? cheers!
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Originally Posted by kasli View Post
This is not an RR similar body style but not an RR and very much restored. Resides in Hyderabad.
Kasli, what's wrong with you? Is this not the ex-Vohra car with Sanghi, now restored? And what were you saying about RR and not, a bit confusing.

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Old 10th December 2011, 11:23   #1533
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Kasli, what's wrong with you? Is this not the ex-Vohra car with Sanghi, now restored? And what were you saying about RR and not, a bit confusing.

Cheers harit
HARIT, I am sending a snap of a RR separately of vohra and another car in Hyderabad bearing not the same but exact body style. Can you verify. Can't post that cars pic here

Then you will see the dilemma and BOTH are done here at he same place.

Cheers
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Old 10th December 2011, 15:42   #1534
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Originally Posted by kasli View Post
HARIT, I am sending a snap of a RR separately of vohra and another car in Hyderabad bearing not the same but exact body style. Can you verify. Can't post that cars pic here. Then you will see the dilemma and BOTH are done here at he same place. Cheers
Dilema or not, I don't know of another PIII in Hyderabad.

Saw this interesting article and circled the relevant para. Any comments?

Cheers harit
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Old 11th December 2011, 11:31   #1535
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This is not an RR similar body style but not an RR and very much restored. Resides in Hyderabad.
Yes the Baroda RR is alive and well in Hyderabad after going thru a traumatic rescue at the docks while being exported.

I think the picture is of another car because the Baroda car looks much bigger and more imposing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kasli View Post
This is not an RR similar body style but not an RR and very much restored. Resides in Hyderabad.
What car is it Kasli ?

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Old 11th December 2011, 12:20   #1536
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Default re: Classic Rolls Royces in India

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Dilema or not, I don't know of another PIII in Hyderabad.

Saw this interesting article and circled the relevant para. Any comments?

Cheers harit

Hi,

Firstly the writer of the article appears a southener which makes it blasphemous to get the name of the Nizam incorrect, adding insult is the fact that he has got Nizam's number in succession wrong too, (He was the 7th Nizam not the Second) As for stock count, well for the Jungs, Daulas and the Paigahs who claim the Nizam discreetly snatched their magnificent cars after a ride and hoarded their beauties in his garrages, records available speak otherwise. BTW, wouldn't it be nice to collate info on all the RRs the Nizams ordered, their types and pictures etc...if its a pictorial book what a good read it would make. Wouldn't it?
Cheers!
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Old 11th December 2011, 18:30   #1537
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Yes the Baroda RR is alive and well in Hyderabad after going thru a traumatic rescue at the docks while being exported.

I think the picture is of another car because the Baroda car looks much bigger and more imposing.
Wasifbhai, that car from Gajjar to the Mumbai dealer to Hyderabad via customs was never ever seen in a dilapidated condition, it had engine problems, that's all. This dilapidated PIII was a completely different car, bore no resemblance to that Hyderabad car, was even lying in Chennai for a while.

Cheers harit
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Old 11th December 2011, 18:36   #1538
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Wasifbhai, that car from Gajjar to the Mumbai dealer to Hyderabad via customs was never ever seen in a dilapidated condition, it had engine problems, that's all. This dilapidated PIII was a completely different car, bore no resemblance to that Hyderabad car, was even lying in Chennai for a while.

Cheers harit
Thats what I felt too ....the Baroda car is much better looking.

What happened to the poor P III
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Old 29th December 2011, 18:28   #1539
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I'm a member of the Rolls-Royce Enthusiasts Club (RREC) based in the UK and am currently helping a fellow member who lives in Austria research the history of his 1931 RR 20/25 - GOS58. It's unusual in that it was originally fitted with a body by Fountains Auto-Carriage Works of Horsham, Sussex, England. The company was very small and went out of business in October 1931 just a few months after his RR 20/25 was built. We're trying to find out more about Fountains Auto-Carriage Works and the RRs they bodied.

There is another Fountains car that appears here under this topic and it is described as a 1930 Phantom II belonging to Nawab Wali Dowla. Chassis No. 82XJ. (I've included a photo of the car at the end of this to make it easier for you to understand which car I am talking about.) Does anyone have any more information on this car? The photograph would appear to have been taken around around 1992/1993 in Hans-Gunter Zachs' private Rolls-Royce Museum in Germany. It's not a car that seems to feature in any information on the museum and it wasn't one of the cars up for sale when he had his big auction in 2009. It's a bit of a mystery.

So what's the connection with Nawab Wali Dowla? Does anyone know? It seems that the first owner of 82XJ is listed in both Complete Classics and in Dalton's "Derby Phantoms" as being sold to Sir Hildebrand Aubrey B. Harmsworth Bt, not to Nawab Wali Dowla. Perhaps Nawab Wali Dowla acquired it at a later date and if so how has the car now found its way back to Europe? I have seen another photo of the car and it looks to have been taken in England during the 1960s.

Are there any sleuths out there who might be able to throw some light on all of this?!
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Old 2nd January 2012, 18:09   #1540
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Lets wait for Travancore or Steve to reply to some of your questions here.
What I can ad is that inthe 60's there were cerain british based car dealers who made it a habit of touring the princly states all over Indian and buying up old cars which were then exported to the UK.

At that time these old royal families had most of their old cars parked away and not in use. There were hardy any Indian collectors or any others who wanted to bus these huge old cars so it made it all the more easier for international car dealers to buy and take the cars with them.
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Old 2nd January 2012, 20:20   #1541
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Lets wait for Travancore or Steve to reply to some of your questions here.
What I can ad is that inthe 60's there were cerain british based car dealers who made it a habit of touring the princly states all over Indian and buying up old cars which were then exported to the UK.

At that time these old royal families had most of their old cars parked away and not in use. There were hardy any Indian collectors or any others who wanted to bus these huge old cars so it made it all the more easier for international car dealers to buy and take the cars with them.
Sorry, but I do not anything anything more than what I have seen published. The only reference I have seen to Nawab Wali-ud-Dowla was on the Traumautoarchive website.

We will have to wait for a real expert like Steve or park-ward to chime in!
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Old 3rd January 2012, 01:42   #1542
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Originally Posted by Crusoeman View Post
I'm a member of the Rolls-Royce Enthusiasts Club (RREC) based in the UK and am currently helping a fellow member who lives in Austria research the history of his 1931 RR 20/25 - GOS58. It's unusual in that it was originally fitted with a body by Fountains Auto-Carriage Works of Horsham, Sussex, England. The company was very small and went out of business in October 1931 just a few months after his RR 20/25 was built. We're trying to find out more about Fountains Auto-Carriage Works and the RRs they bodied.

There is another Fountains car that appears here under this topic and it is described as a 1930 Phantom II belonging to Nawab Wali Dowla. Chassis No. 82XJ. (I've included a photo of the car at the end of this to make it easier for you to understand which car I am talking about.) Does anyone have any more information on this car? The photograph would appear to have been taken around around 1992/1993 in Hans-Gunter Zachs' private Rolls-Royce Museum in Germany. It's not a car that seems to feature in any information on the museum and it wasn't one of the cars up for sale when he had his big auction in 2009. It's a bit of a mystery.

So what's the connection with Nawab Wali Dowla? Does anyone know? It seems that the first owner of 82XJ is listed in both Complete Classics and in Dalton's "Derby Phantoms" as being sold to Sir Hildebrand Aubrey B. Harmsworth Bt, not to Nawab Wali Dowla. Perhaps Nawab Wali Dowla acquired it at a later date and if so how has the car now found its way back to Europe? I have seen another photo of the car and it looks to have been taken in England during the 1960s.

Are there any sleuths out there who might be able to throw some light on all of this?!
I have a book on cabriolets which features the Wali ud daula P-II mentioned here. The book is in my Lahore residence and next I go there I shall remember to scan the text and pics from it. It has very nice HQ pics but coffee table type info .
Amer
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Old 3rd January 2012, 14:56   #1543
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Originally Posted by Crusoeman View Post
I'm a member of the Rolls-Royce Enthusiasts Club (RREC) based in the UK and am currently helping a fellow member who lives in Austria research the history of his 1931 RR 20/25 - GOS58. It's unusual in that it was originally fitted with a body by Fountains Auto-Carriage Works of Horsham, Sussex, England. The company was very small and went out of business in October 1931 just a few months after his RR 20/25 was built. We're trying to find out more about Fountains Auto-Carriage Works and the RRs they bodied.

There is another Fountains car that appears here under this topic and it is described as a 1930 Phantom II belonging to Nawab Wali Dowla. Chassis No. 82XJ. (I've included a photo of the car at the end of this to make it easier for you to understand which car I am talking about.) Does anyone have any more information on this car? The photograph would appear to have been taken around around 1992/1993 in Hans-Gunter Zachs' private Rolls-Royce Museum in Germany. It's not a car that seems to feature in any information on the museum and it wasn't one of the cars up for sale when he had his big auction in 2009. It's a bit of a mystery.

So what's the connection with Nawab Wali Dowla? Does anyone know? It seems that the first owner of 82XJ is listed in both Complete Classics and in Dalton's "Derby Phantoms" as being sold to Sir Hildebrand Aubrey B. Harmsworth Bt, not to Nawab Wali Dowla. Perhaps Nawab Wali Dowla acquired it at a later date and if so how has the car now found its way back to Europe? I have seen another photo of the car and it looks to have been taken in England during the 1960s.

Are there any sleuths out there who might be able to throw some light on all of this?!
Crusoeman, since you are a member of RREC, can you check and tell me what were the numbers of the Silver Seraph produced? I researched and it shows 1400, but 1570 at other club sites. I own one, and am in the process of finding out what they termed as 'last of the series'
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Old 3rd January 2012, 18:51   #1544
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Re RR Seraph production numbers I can't find any figures on the RREC website. However a Google search brought up the Wikipedia entry that says 1570. Why don't you email RR directly and ask them? They should know and after all you do own a Seraph!

Going back to my original question about the 1930 RR Phantom II, I am now on the trail for information on another RR over in your part of the world. This one is a 1927 RR Ghost with the chassis number GHJ76 and registration number CY 2086. It's in Sri Lanka and was at one time owned by Sir Leo Fernando who owned a bus company. It now belongs to the government having taken over the bus company complete with Rolls-Royce! I believe it is now looked after by the Ceylon-German Technical Training Institute in Moratuwa. Does anyone know any more about this one? What I really want to find out is who owned it before Sir Leo Fernando bought it in 1954? All I know is that he was a tea planter. Can anyone help?

By the way don't forget that I still on the trail of 82XJ, the 1930 RR Phantom too!
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Old 5th January 2012, 07:10   #1545
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I am now on the trail for information on another RR over in your part of the world. This one is a 1927 RR Ghost with the chassis number GHJ76 and registration number CY 2086.
GHJ76 is a R-R 20 H.P. (1927 Park Ward landaulette). The original owner (per Fasal's RR Twenty) is Mrs. F. Cunard.

"park-ward" on this forum may have much more info on its subsequent history!

Roger Thiedeman is considered an authority on R-R 's in Ceylon - see an attached artcle by him (on a different car). He is another potential source.

The Sunday Times Plus Section
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