Go Back   Team-BHP > BHP India > Vintage Cars & Classics in India > Pre-War


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 13th June 2014, 22:38   #2011
BHPian
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Lahore
Posts: 80
Thanked: 322 Times
Default re: Classic Rolls Royces in India

Quote:
Originally Posted by F Abbasi View Post
Two more twenties Rolls Royce cars from the Bahawalpur Motor Khana. The first is a photograph of a Barker Silver Ghost taken in Bahawalpur in 1924. The Viceroy, the Earl of Reading, and the Nawab of Bahawalpur are in the rear of the car. Could this be GAK 39?......
The RR Twenty GAK39 , Engine G 859 is a Barker tourer body with original owner shown as the raja of Sarangarh in John M Fasal's Book " The RR Twenty). As per my records Bahawalpur had only one RR Twenty Chassis 81K2 Barker tourer 1923. I do not think GAK was in BWP inventory . Having said that, everytime I think I have compiled a complete inventory for my book I find new cars and events in HH's life. I have been told of a photgraph in HH's London estate with the Nawab Sahib standing with his Bugattis and Alfa Romeos. Lets see.

The Silver car is almost for sure RR Silver Ghost 86CW.

As per my research for the book, it was the first Rolls Royce and the first car that the Nawab Sahib Sadiq Abbasi V bought on coming of age. In September 1922 he was 18 years old, a tall lean strapping young man, Knighted KCVO Knight Commander of the Royal Victorian Order & Prince of Wales visit Medal in the year 1922. He was to order three RR silver ghosts and a Twenty in 1923 : RRSG 41LK tourer, RR SG 42LM Cockshoot Barker Limousine, RR SG 82RM tourer, RR 20 81K2 Barker tourer which were delivered end 1923 to start 1924.

It must be understood by the readership that in those days, it was not easy to sell such expensive cars ( Approx Rs 30,000 each)and conversely when such a customer did arrive, there was a good chance of sale if there was a finished car available.

The yet unconfirmed account is the young nawab was visiting Delhi with courtiers and advisors and the families of British advisers and engineers of his state and needed a car fit for a future Nawab (HH was invested with ruling powers in March 1924 ) to travel around and 86CW was waiting for him to buy in the Delhi dealership, originally ordered for Malir Kotla but not picked up for unknown reasons. ( Similar fate happened to 76WJ, ordered by Maharaja Kasmir and not taken, languished in Bombay dealership till picked up by the Khan of Kalat). The time since off test, adding couple months for body erection by Barker, passage to India etc., the car would have languished in the showroom for a year and a half before being bought.

Secondly, it was not uncommon for the owners name on chassis cards to be changed to new one especially when cars were sent to RR UK for overhaul etc. like most of Bahawalpur cars were.
Third, the rulers of the state were normally referred by the state name only so the clerk at the dealership, would probably unsure if Bahawalpur was a Nawab or a Maharaja and took the easy guess of Maharaja.

Finally this car was taken to Arabia by charter ship "Rizwani" in 1935 with the entourage of the Nawab Sahib for Haj pilgrimage, along with 12 truck/lorries from the Nawab's Army and more significantly the Crossly hunting wagon by Barker for the Nawab to sleep in enroute, i.e in between camps if needed. This rare Crossley recently briefly in my charge for a restoration, and now with a new owner, became known as the Haj wagon.
Before the return of HH the Nawab, RR Silver Ghost 86CW was presented to the Kind of Saudi Arabia through the good offices of the Sharif of Makkah ( previously called Mecca) as gift from the Nawab who also purchased land and and built housing for pilgrims from India in Makkah.
I suppose the remains of 86CW could be preserved interred in the dry sands of Saudi Arabia even today
I am writing a book on the fascinating life and times of HH the Nawab and any info and pictures are welcome.
shyml is offline   (2) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 14th June 2014, 08:01   #2012
Team-BHP Support
 
karlosdeville's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Pune
Posts: 9,382
Thanked: 6,244 Times
Default re: Classic Rolls Royces in India

Quote:
Originally Posted by shyml View Post
The RR Twenty GAK39 , Engine G 859 is a Barker tourer body with original owner shown as the raja of Sarangarh in John M Fasal's Book " The RR Twenty). As per my records Bahawalpur had only one RR Twenty Chassis 81K2 Barker tourer 1923. I do not think GAK was in BWP inventory.
The Sarangarh car GAK39 survives in a Mumbai collection, albeit interestingly rebodied.
karlosdeville is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14th June 2014, 13:46   #2013
BHPian
 
Boybentley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Leiden, Netherlands
Posts: 90
Thanked: 245 Times
Default re: Classic Rolls Royces in India

I have checked the chassiscard for #GAK39 and it says the chassis was delivered in March 1924. The complete car was delivered in May 1924 to Rolls-Royce Ltd. in Bombay finished in Oxford Blue with Blue crocodile leather. Sold and delivered to HH Raja Jawahir Singh Bahadur, ruling chief of Sarangarh State in February 1927 (!).
Boybentley is offline   (2) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 14th June 2014, 17:18   #2014
Distinguished - BHPian
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Ann Arbor
Posts: 1,752
Thanked: 3,296 Times
Default re: Classic Rolls Royces in India

Quote:
Originally Posted by shyml View Post

Finally this car was taken to Arabia by charter ship "Rizwani" in 1935 with the entourage of the Nawab Sahib for Haj pilgrimage, along with 12 truck/lorries from the Nawab's Army and more significantly the Crossly hunting wagon by Barker for the Nawab to sleep in enroute, i.e in between camps if needed. This rare Crossley recently briefly in my charge for a restoration, and now with a new owner, became known as the Haj wagon.
Thanks Shyml for your "personal" history of the Bahawalpur cars. It is much appreciated!

Here is a picture from possibly that Haj Pilgrimage. The Crossley is on the far left - identifiable by its "Cyclops" headlamp. Some of the other trucks are probably Morris Commercial 6-Wheelers. Too bad, 86CW is missing from the picture!

picture courtesy "Lords of Bahawalpur"

Name:  Bahawalpur Crossley and Trucks Haj.jpg
Views: 7169
Size:  188.9 KB

Last edited by travancore : 14th June 2014 at 17:20.
travancore is offline   (3) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 14th June 2014, 18:02   #2015
Distinguished - BHPian
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Ann Arbor
Posts: 1,752
Thanked: 3,296 Times
Default re: Classic Rolls Royces in India

Quote:
Originally Posted by karlosdeville View Post
The Sarangarh car GAK39 survives in a Mumbai collection, albeit interestingly rebodied.
Sorry about the back-to-back posts.

Here is GAK39 in its new Avatar, the picture was posted many moons ago.
Wonder if the esteemed owner has any "as found" or original body pictures to share ?

Classic Rolls Royces in India-sarangarh-gak39-1924-barker-tourer-raja-sarangarh.jpg
travancore is offline   (2) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 15th June 2014, 15:41   #2016
Newbie
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Bahawalpur
Posts: 18
Thanked: 148 Times
Default re: Classic Rolls Royces in India

I wouldn't be surprised if a Rolls was moved to Saudi Arabia along with the other vehicles, as on arrival the Nawab of Bahawalpur had a Saudi General, Hamdi Bey, attached to the his staff and he met with H.M. King Abdul Aziz Ibn-i-Saud, the Heir Apparent Prince Saud and Prince Faisal, who was then Viceroy of Hedjaz.
I have an image and some information about the Bahawalpur Crossley, BWP 105, for your web-site.
Attached Thumbnails
Classic Rolls Royces in India-image0406.jpg  

Classic Rolls Royces in India-image0407.jpg  

Classic Rolls Royces in India-image0408.jpg  

Attached Images
 
F Abbasi is offline   (9) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 15th June 2014, 23:15   #2017
BHPian
 
TractionAvant's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: pune
Posts: 183
Thanked: 89 Times
Default re: Classic Rolls Royces in India

Quote:
Originally Posted by travancore View Post
Sorry about the back-to-back posts.

Here is GAK39 in its new Avatar, the picture was posted many moons ago.
Wonder if the esteemed owner has any "as found" or original body pictures to share ?

Attachment 1250028
make it go away please, it's making me weep
TractionAvant is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16th June 2014, 01:31   #2018
Distinguished - BHPian
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Ann Arbor
Posts: 1,752
Thanked: 3,296 Times
Default re: Classic Rolls Royces in India

Quote:
Originally Posted by F Abbasi View Post
I wouldn't be surprised if a Rolls was moved to Saudi Arabia along with the other vehicles, as on arrival the Nawab of Bahawalpur had a Saudi General, Hamdi Bey, attached to the his staff and he met with H.M. King Abdul Aziz Ibn-i-Saud, the Heir Apparent Prince Saud and Prince Faisal, who was then Viceroy of Hedjaz.
I have an image and some information about the Bahawalpur Crossley, BWP 105, for your web-site.
Thank you so much. It is amazing that these pieces of automotive history (vehicle & documentation) have withstood the ravages of time.

The Crossley was very well covered and described in many period car magazines.

Below is a period photo. Note the "tracks" stored at the center of the spare - to be laid out to traverse muddy terrain.

Classic Rolls Royces in India-bahawalpur-crossley-6-wheeler.jpg

Last edited by travancore : 16th June 2014 at 01:48.
travancore is offline   (3) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 17th June 2014, 18:58   #2019
BHPian
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Lahore
Posts: 80
Thanked: 322 Times
Default re: Classic Rolls Royces in India

Quote:
Originally Posted by F Abbasi View Post
I wouldn't be surprised if a Rolls was moved to Saudi Arabia along with the other vehicles, as on arrival the Nawab of Bahawalpur ...I have an image and some information about the Bahawalpur Crossley, BWP 105, for your web-site.
Thanks for the great period documentation, very useful to my research. Abbasi Sahib is requested to please post information and documents regarding the Bahawalpur Packard 740 1929-30 and the V-16 Cadillac if possible.
shyml is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18th June 2014, 17:26   #2020
BHPian
 
Boybentley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Leiden, Netherlands
Posts: 90
Thanked: 245 Times
Default re: Classic Rolls Royces in India

This 1926 Indian delivered Rolls-Royce Twenty (#GYK85) Barker 3/4 Cabriolet de Ville is currently offered for sale in the UK.
Attached Images
 
Boybentley is offline   (2) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 20th June 2014, 13:03   #2021
Team-BHP Support
 
karlosdeville's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Pune
Posts: 9,382
Thanked: 6,244 Times
Default re: Classic Rolls Royces in India

Amongst other high end cars we see this Silver Ghost used for Lady Irwin's visit - can we identify which one?

Name:  irwin01.JPG
Views: 1253
Size:  33.2 KB

karlosdeville is offline   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 20th June 2014, 17:32   #2022
Distinguished - BHPian
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Ann Arbor
Posts: 1,752
Thanked: 3,296 Times
Default re: Classic Rolls Royces in India

Quote:
Originally Posted by karlosdeville View Post
Amongst other high end cars we see this Silver Ghost used for Lady Irwin's visit - can we identify which one?

Attachment 1251974


It is the Mysore SG 21PP. Barker Cabriolet.
travancore is offline   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 26th June 2014, 16:02   #2023
Newbie
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Bahawalpur
Posts: 18
Thanked: 148 Times
Default re: Classic Rolls Royces in India

ROLLS ROYCES AT WORK
1. Bahawalpur 97 in the use of the Viceroy, Lord Linlithgow, Bahawalpur, 1939.
2. Bahawalpur 73, 31, 28, and 97 at a Durbar in Bahawalpur.193?.
3. Bahawalpur 31and other Rolls Royce cars lined up for the rulers of Kapurthala, Pataudi, Bahawalpur, Faridkot and the Heir Apparent of Bahawalpur, departing after attending a garden party at Sadiq Garh Palace, Bahawalpur, 1945.
4. On the August 14 1947 Quaid-i-Azam Mohammad Ali Jinnah, and the Viceroy, Lord Mountbatten, rode from the Constituent Assembly in Karachi in Bahawalpur 31, a second Rolls, Bahawalpur 28, was used by Mohtarma Fatima Jinnah, the Quaid's sister, and Lady Mountbatten.
5. Bahawalpur 73 was one of the cars used by King Faisal II of Iraq on a visit to Bahawalpur in 1954, here seen with the Nawab of Bahawalpur taking the salute presented by the Amir's Janisari Bodyguard at Sadiq Garh Palace, Bahawalpur.
Attached Thumbnails
Classic Rolls Royces in India-1.jpg  

Classic Rolls Royces in India-2.jpg  

Classic Rolls Royces in India-3.jpg  

Classic Rolls Royces in India-5.jpg  

Attached Images
 
F Abbasi is offline   (10) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 12th July 2014, 04:37   #2024
Distinguished - BHPian
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Ann Arbor
Posts: 1,752
Thanked: 3,296 Times
Default re: Classic Rolls Royces in India

Quote:
Originally Posted by Boybentley View Post
The fabulous Bhopal PIII (3BU86) is soon up for grabs. Any takers ?

I wished I could! What a magnificent car!

Many unusual views of this splendid car here:

http://www.bonhams.com/auctions/2191...w_lot/4700951/


Name:  Bhopal RR PIII 3BU86 Bonhams 2014 Top.jpg
Views: 1133
Size:  77.4 KB
travancore is offline   (4) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 13th July 2014, 08:11   #2025
Distinguished - BHPian
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Ann Arbor
Posts: 1,752
Thanked: 3,296 Times
Default re: Classic Rolls Royces in India

A 2004 interpretation of the Nizam's Silver Ghost

Name:  Brunei RR.jpg
Views: 1021
Size:  104.4 KB
travancore is offline   (2) Thanks Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Pics : Rolls Royces & Bentleys in India jesal Super-Cars & Imports in India 195 20th August 2012 13:25
Why do Rolls Royces "lean back"? D33-PAC Technical Stuff 4 15th April 2012 22:55
Pics : Economic Times Rolls Royce Centenary Rally. Includes 2004 Rolls Royce Phantom v12 Vintage Cars & Classics in India 28 15th February 2009 17:15
Classic ICE: Rolls Royce Silver Spur gunbir In-Car Entertainment 48 21st August 2007 10:07
The new S Class, Rolls Royces and more! gemballa Super-Cars & Imports in India 30 25th February 2006 02:22


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 03:07.

Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks