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Old 14th November 2014, 14:53   #946
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Default Re: Which Diesel car for ~10 Lakh? Vento vs Verna vs Rapid vs Fiesta vs Linea vs Othe

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Originally Posted by quakerme View Post
Hi all,

Sold my 4 year old companion the ford ikon tdci yesterday, now im on a hunt for a new horse, my budget is max 11L I have narrowed down to the below vehicles TD'd all of them.

1. Ford Ecosport (looks and silent cabin)
2. Ford Fiesta (handling,cruise control , auto rain/light sensors, Aston martin grille)
3. Vento (awesome luxury interiors)
4. Rapid (love all except mileage and ASS)
5. City (above my budget - im not getting the point on why someone should spend another 2L extra just for a brand name)
.
Please buy Honda City.
Even Base Model is good and all Hondas are low on maintenance. With Honda you will not regret. Moreover you get good resale value (sales like hot cake)

Since you already had ford I would not suggest even Ecosports. As such I consider Ecosports to be a hatchback (a good one though)
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Old 14th November 2014, 15:13   #947
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Default Re: Which Diesel car for ~10 Lakh? Vento vs Verna vs Rapid vs Fiesta vs Linea vs Othe

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Originally Posted by quakerme View Post
1. Ford Ecosport (looks and silent cabin)
2. Ford Fiesta (handling,cruise control , auto rain/light sensors, Aston martin grille)
3. Vento (awesome luxury interiors)
4. Rapid (love all except mileage and ASS)
5. City (above my budget - im not getting the point on why someone should spend another 2L extra just for a brand name)
For the priorities you mentioned, I would suggest the Fiesta, especially since you mentioned that you predominantly does solo drives. If you need a change of brand, the Vento (preferably with DSG) can be the alternate choice.
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Old 14th November 2014, 20:47   #948
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Default Re: Which Diesel car for ~10 Lakh? Vento vs Verna vs Rapid vs Fiesta vs Linea vs Othe

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Originally Posted by quakerme View Post
Sold my 4 year old companion the ford ikon tdci yesterday, now im on a hunt for a new horse, my budget is max 11L I have narrowed down to the below vehicles TD'd all of them
If you have driven a Ford for that long, i assure you that you will never be happy driving the Honda city. Dynamically, it is miles away from Rapid or Fiesta. What it gives in return is resale and peace of mind but dont expect a grin on your face after you drive it.

I own 3 out of 5 cars in your list and would honestly jot down my view points about them.

Vento/Rapid are excellent cars as well, the TDi engine is a rocket, have good spacious interiors but the maintenance is expensive and service is several notches down compared to Ford. I own a Vento TDi which has done 30,000 kms and the best part about this car is the TDi engine, there is massive amounts of torque available at lower rpm, floor the throttle and you would come out smiling but it is mostly a straight line rocket. The engine is noisy, service support is non existant and the clutch is hard. On the positive, it has plush interiors, excellent rear seat space and you do get the VW badge value.

The ride/handling leaves a lot to be desired, it is sprung softly and does bob over undulations, steering is very light and it understeers strongly during hard cornering, to me its a great family sedan but not meant if you love attacking corners. Rapid is slightly better but its a similar story. Every service bill would be

Ecosport i would suggest if you need that massive 200 mm clearance, our car has done 12000 kms and is doing good. There is fair bit of body roll due to the clearance and Ford have tuned the steering according to indian market, its not a true Ford. Service bill is around 2.5-3.0 k every service, far lower than VW because Ford uses mineral oil. Its the safest car thanks to 6 airbags in top variant but features a little on the lower side compared to Fiesta. There is nothing special about drive quality of Ecosport, ride is hard and it handles well for that much clearance, steering is average. It does have a much better rear space and better respect in market as it is a hit compared to fiesta. The performance is a little dulling as its almost 150 kgs heavier than Fiesta with same engine.

For Fiesta, just got mine a month back and have clocked 2500 kms on it. I would summarize in two words "mind blowing". Engine is far more refined than Ecosport thanks to plastic cover on top and abs sump guard. Claimed mileage is more at 25, it is easily giving 19-20 here in Delhi.

The chassis balance of this car should be experienced, i cant explain in words. We have a Linea at home (old 2009 model) and Fiesta blows it away in terms of ride and handling. It glides over potholes, the ride is extremely good, handles beautifully and the steering is precise and super sharp. Even the front seats offer fabulous support during cornering. This car is just meant for those who love driving hard, not just in straight line but love to corner as well. The stability and handling is several notches higher than vento/rapid.
There is cruise control, sync, folding mirrors, keyless entry, sport seats and it is prices very competitively. Also Ford offers optional 5 years warranty while VW only gives 4 year warranty and that Fiesta is a global car is another point to note.

Where Fiesta loses out is resale, poor rear space, awkward looking rear and average interior quality compared to Vento.

If you love driving, go for the Fiesta, i never knew it was such a good car until i drove one, totally pales the german engineering in comparison. If you need to know anything specific, let me know.

Last edited by coolboy007 : 14th November 2014 at 20:50.
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Old 14th November 2014, 21:10   #949
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Default Re: Which Diesel car for ~10 Lakh? Vento vs Verna vs Rapid vs Fiesta vs Linea vs Othe

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Originally Posted by coolboy007 View Post

Service bill is around 2.5-3.0 k ,every service, far lower than VW because Ford uses mineral oil. .
The Sales Guy at Skoda was explaining me that the new Skoda Rapid 1.5 TDI uses mineral oil and not the synthetic oil that was earlier used in the outgoing 1.6TDI motor.

Further following is the statement in the initial test drive of Rapid thread:

"Skoda & VW claim that they've fixed the reliability issues by switching from synthetic to mineral oil, software updates & some component changes"

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/offici...al-review.html (2014 Skoda Rapid 1.5L DSG : Official Review)

So we can expect the cost of oil replacement to be on the lower side for Vento and Rapid in future.

In between, Tata is also not cheap, for my Manza 1.3 MJD, I normally spend 10K on every service bill and the oil change costs me approx 3.5 K including labour.

Last edited by rki2007 : 14th November 2014 at 21:13.
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Old 14th November 2014, 21:26   #950
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Default Re: Which Diesel car for ~10 Lakh? Vento vs Verna vs Rapid vs Fiesta vs Linea vs Othe

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Originally Posted by rki2007 View Post
The Sales Guy at Skoda was explaining me that the new Skoda Rapid 1.5 TDI uses mineral oil and not the synthetic oil that was earlier used in the outgoing 1.6TDI motor
That is a blatant lie by the Skoda sales guy, either he was misinformed or was trying to act too smart.
VW and Skoda have always used synthetic oils in their engine and for every service, the cost of oil itself is around 4.5 k, they also change fuel filter and air filter at every service so a cost of around 9000 is a given every month.
Ford uses mineral oil and they only change air filter at 20,000, diesel filter is changed at 30,000 kms.

Quote:
"Skoda & VW claim that they've fixed the reliability issues by switching from synthetic to mineral oil, software updates & some component changes
That statement is for the DSG 7 speed gearbox. VW was having issues with this gearbox, hence they shifted to mineral oil. Engine oil is still a synthetic grade.

Have no clue about Tata but service centres do throw in stupid things like anti glare, polish, decarbonisation, alignment (best done outside) etc to hike the bill, its upto you to be informed and say a polite no to things which are not needed.
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Old 14th November 2014, 22:15   #951
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Default Re: Which Diesel car for ~10 Lakh? Vento vs Verna vs Rapid vs Fiesta vs Linea vs Othe

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Originally Posted by lamborghini View Post
But yes, a tuning box is more advantageous, as you can disconnect it before sending it in for service, thus not losing warranty. My biggest grouse is all the damned black smoke!
He he he.. From(68PS @4000rpm) to a (89 bhp @ 3750) is a huge leap as if someone is upgrading to a hero honda splendor from Kinetic Luna..so tuning box is out of question for a long time

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Originally Posted by Wanderers View Post
Please buy Honda City.
Even Base Model is good and all Hondas are low on maintenance. With Honda you will not regret. Moreover you get good resale value (sales like hot cake)
True that! Considering the fact that top end honda city is 2.5L more than fiesta why would someone settle for a low end honda variant just for the sake of resale value , take it this way - the amount I loose at the time of re-selling my car will be same as the amount I gain in opting out Honda from the list.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vb-san View Post
For the priorities you mentioned, I would suggest the Fiesta, especially since you mentioned that you predominantly does solo drives. If you need a change of brand, the Vento (preferably with DSG) can be the alternate choice.
Yes Fiesta looks more practical hmmm ! Vento DSG -Im in no position to own a white elephant as of now but my heart will be always with the plush interiors of Vento/skoda

Quote:
Originally Posted by coolboy007 View Post

If you love driving, go for the Fiesta, i never knew it was such a good car until i drove one, totally pales the german engineering in comparison. If you need to know anything specific, let me know.
Thank-you very much Coolboy for your detailed reply I thoroughly enjoyed your views.
My worry now is will they phase out the global fiesta 2014 next year and concentrate on the new Aston grille figo and the replacement of fiesta classic, heard rumors that they are bringing out a compact sub 4mtr sedan next year and it is also also called fiesta

Last edited by quakerme : 14th November 2014 at 22:18.
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Old 14th November 2014, 22:20   #952
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Default Re: Which Diesel car for ~10 Lakh? Vento vs Verna vs Rapid vs Fiesta vs Linea vs Othe

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Originally Posted by quakerme View Post
My worry now is will they phase out the global fiesta 2014 next year and concentrate on the new Aston grille figo and the replacement of fiesta classic, heard rumors that they are bringing out a compact sub 4mtr sedan next year and it is also also called fiesta
I don't think they will phase this new model out so soon. Take the Classic for example. It's been around since Nov 2005. Even the new Fiesta came in around mid-2011. The latest one is only a slight modification of that new Fiesta. I think they will manufacture this for another 5 years minimum, unless their sales dwindle to single digit numbers.

Why don't you write to Ford India and seek information? I had done so before buying my car in 2007, and they promptly replied saying that the car would be manufactured for a decade from inception, and parts manufactured for another ten. I really liked their prompt response and went ahead with my decision.
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Old 14th November 2014, 22:34   #953
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Default Re: Which Diesel car for ~10 Lakh? Vento vs Verna vs Rapid vs Fiesta vs Linea vs Othe

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Originally Posted by vnabhi View Post
I don't think they will phase this new model out so soon. Take the Classic for example. It's been around since Nov 2005. Even the new Fiesta came in around mid-2011. The latest one is only a slight modification of that new Fiesta. I think they will manufacture this for another 5 years minimum, unless their sales dwindle to single digit numbers.

Why don't you write to Ford India and seek information? I had done so before buying my car in 2007, and they promptly replied saying that the car would be manufactured for a decade from inception, and parts manufactured for another ten. I really liked their prompt response and went ahead with my decision.
You never know, I bought my Ikon tdci in 2010 december had this slight hunch that the vehicle will be phased out soon, I asked the dealer they made some phone calls(pretended) and said "No saar they will not stop ikon any time soon it will be there for a minimum of 3 years" and within 6 or 8 months they phased out Ikon and its pretty sad to drive a new car which is no more in the market.
Any ways as you said let me try writing to the corp office this time before the purchase any idea whom to contact for info?
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Old 14th November 2014, 22:49   #954
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Default Re: Which Diesel car for ~10 Lakh? Vento vs Verna vs Rapid vs Fiesta vs Linea vs Othe

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Originally Posted by coolboy007 View Post
I own a Vento TDi which has done 30,000 kms The engine is noisy, service support is non existant and the clutch is hard.

For Fiesta, just got mine a month back and have clocked 2500 kms on it. I would summarize in two words "mind blowing".
How is the clutch on the Fiesta? Does it have a long clutch travel?
The front look of the car is very attractive. It would be one of the best pre-worshipped driver's car 2yrs down the line!
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Old 15th November 2014, 09:48   #955
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Originally Posted by quakerme View Post
You never know, I bought my Ikon tdci in 2010 december had this slight hunch that the vehicle will be phased out soon, I asked the dealer they made some phone calls(pretended) and said "No saar they will not stop ikon any time soon it will be there for a minimum of 3 years" and within 6 or 8 months they phased out Ikon and its pretty sad to drive a new car which is no more in the market.

Any ways as you said let me try writing to the corp office this time before the purchase any idea whom to contact for info?

Well, the Ikon was there for more than ten years. You bought a new avatar of it in its fag end, hence that is not surprising.

I suggest you write to their chief at write2md@fordindia.com. Best of luck!
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Old 15th November 2014, 12:53   #956
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Originally Posted by PPS View Post
How is the clutch on the Fiesta? Does it have a long clutch travel?
The front look of the car is very attractive. It would be one of the best pre-worshipped driver's car 2yrs down the line!
The clutch on Fiesta is neither too hard, nor too soft. I would put it in between Vento and Verna.
Clutch travel is really short and is free of vibrations compared to Vento.
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Old 16th November 2014, 11:31   #957
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Default Re: Which Diesel car for ~10 Lakh? Vento vs Verna vs Rapid vs Fiesta vs Linea vs Othe

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Originally Posted by quakerme View Post
Please help me choose the right one, my priorities are
1. Safety need driver and pillion side airbags and ABS
All these cars provide D+P airbags on most variants.
Quote:
2. Need good mileage as I travel at-least 120kms a day (so pref it should be a diesel engine)
Diesel engine is the way to go for so much running.
Quote:
3. Good ASS, low maintenance
Japanese cars are best in this aspect. But if you're happy with Ford ASS in your area, take the plunge. VW and Skoda have got very bad reputation for ASS.
Quote:
5. Need a vehicle with good driving dynamics
City and Verna fly out of the list here.

Can I suggest the Renault Duster?
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Old 16th November 2014, 19:17   #958
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Default Re: Which Diesel car for ~10 Lakh? Vento vs Verna vs Rapid vs Fiesta vs Linea vs Othe

Thanks D4D, DrSinghji & IshanIan


Dr. Singhj, somehow I'm unable to bring myself to purchase a used car. Corolla is out of contention. Petrol for such high mileage would be unaffordable. The Corolla D4D is grossly underpowered too. And I'm not sure how dynamically accomplished it is.

Just tested a Renault Duster AWD a while ago, though its not sedan, I too the suggestions of some members. I've posted my feedback on the official Duster AWD test drive & review.

Suffice it to say, its now in the list too.

Thanks again :-)
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Old 16th November 2014, 22:53   #959
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Default Re: Which Diesel car for ~10 Lakh? Vento vs Verna vs Rapid vs Fiesta vs Linea vs Othe

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Originally Posted by D4D View Post

City and Verna fly out of the list here.

Can I suggest the Renault Duster?
Duster is out of the list -110 is out of my budget and the 85 is kind of under-powered and the interior looks minimal and old all the way, think I will stick on to a sedan.

I had one more in the list the fiat Avventura and it disappointed a lot, about three months back i had a good offer on my old ikon but as there were news about avventura I thought will wait for it and decide, when hyson motors (cochin) displayed avventura I was one among the first few who went and saw the vehicle, they had a low end variant on display outside the showroom and after one week they got the TD vehicle, went there the first day itself- out of all the TD which I have done this is the one vehicle after TD had to express my disappointment verbally as well as in the feedback form.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vnabhi View Post
Well, the Ikon was there for more than ten years. You bought a new avatar of it in its fag end, hence that is not surprising.

I suggest you write to their chief at write2md@fordindia.com. Best of luck!
I tried contacting ford in custmail@ford.com from their website as you said they responded within a few hours and asked for my contact number ( I dint want them to contact me as I wanted the information in writing) anyways I have now mailed them my contact number and complete address this happened on friday and till now no response, now I have forwarded the message to their cheif write2md@fordindia.com waiting...

Last edited by quakerme : 16th November 2014 at 23:10.
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Old 22nd November 2014, 21:38   #960
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Default Replacement for Palio Multijet in 2015

So I am starting this thread really early, but I guess I would like people's opinions.

The Palio Multijet was a purely "by-the-heart" purchase and for a car purchased for Rs 5,00,000/- OTR, it has served me well. It has had issues with certain parts creating trouble, but, it has been mechanically reliable and trustworthy and done a whole lot of long trips, including a crazy 23-hour 1,250 km Indore-Delhi run. (http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/long-t...28-000-km.html)

I have crossed the 1,40,000 km mark and will cross 1,50,000 km before the 7th year is up in April 2015. If things go as per plan (when you are self-employed, they never do!), I will be looking for a replacement in the second half of 2015.

Here are the priorities:

1. Economical: Palio has given me 17 kmpl average all combined. New car should exceed that in 75% bumper to bumper conditions.

2. Power: I don't want to drive another car with the 75 HP multijet again for another couple of lakh kilometers and wait for the turbo to spool till eternity. At most, I will settle for the 90 HP multijet. I don't think I want anything lesser.

3. Highway performance and off-road ability: I haven't been to Ladakh (and perhaps don't intend to) but the places in Himachal and Uttarakhand and the general bad roads of Ghaziabad itself need a car which is suited to highways as well as the bad rural roads (at one point of time, I was doing Delhi-Lansdowne-Delhi in a single day for work once a month on the Palio, so you know what will be demanded of this vehicle)

4. Ride and handling: Coming from the Palio, I definitely don't want anything worse.

5. Space: I don't need a big , hulking vehicle with the interior space of the Innova, but I would like better rear seats and high seating as parents and in-laws are old with knee and back problems. Easy ingress / egress are important.

6. Safety: ABS + 2 Airbags is a minimum requirement. Would prefer 6 / 8 airbags but only XUV500 and Ecosport provide them

7. General robustness: Unfortunately, buying a vehicle with full safety kit will end me up with a version that will be loaded with gizmos so the basic freedom from electronic vagaries might be difficult. I don't think there is a workaround for that.

8. Budget: Under Rs 10 lakhs on road.

I have nothing decided so far, but I have some contenders, unfortunately most of them beyond budget:

1. Duster AWD RXZ: way beyond budget, but has everything I need, including the much-loved independent rear suspension. Just the right size, too. But Rs 14 lakh OTR is way, way beyond. RXL AWD doesnt have passenger airbag. Can consider the 2WD versions but only with dual airbags. But probably won't work out within my budget.

2. Ecosport: The compromise to the Duster. Although it is the right size for me, but at around Rs 11 lakhs OTR for the Titanium (O), it gives me efficiency, compactness, less turbo lag, good GC and full safety kit (with some creature comforts thrown in). The downside is Ford's somewhat iffy ASS (I am a happy Fiat customer, but Ford is unknown territory).

3. Ciaz: Too low. Too long. Both for my driving conditions and for my Mother / Mother-in-law. I don't want the Swift because I don't want another half a decade with the 75 HP multijet.

4. Polo: The new Polo TDI ticks everything except the rear seat space. It's worse than my Palio. Vento is beyond budget.

5. Punto 90 HP / Avventura / Linea: I am okay with Fiat service. I have spent 7 years dealing with them and I can handle them. (I even appear on the sales brochure of the new Linea TJet!). Of course, situations may change over the years but I can handle them. If nothing else works, I will pick up one of these cars and I am partial towards the Linea. Even the dynamic version will do (the only thing it lacks from my perspective is the 16 inch wheels. I was never a big fan of Blue and Me and cruise control). I don't see the point in the Avventura for me since even regular Punto has decent GC.

6. i20: This is the other choice which I find to be a bit of a compromise. But I am willing to explore it.

7. Scorpio / XUV 500: Too big and too thirsty for me. For the Scorpio, only the S8 version works for me (except price) and at that price point the XUV500 W4 is Rs 40,000 cheaper! The 4WD are either without safety kit or beyond budget. I don't like either of them aesthetically.

I am not looking at the compact sedans, I don't like them aesthetically and most have the same 75 HP MJD except the Zest and Amaze. I will stick to the hatches or small SUVs. Except the Linea, most sedans are too low or too close to Rs 12 lakhs for top-end versions with safety kit. The Etios is the exception, but it is a boring car with boring engines and a caricature-ish interior (no offence meant for those who like it. I don't).

Now, Ladies and Gentlemen, all yours.

Last edited by architect : 22nd November 2014 at 21:43.
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