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Old 30th December 2013, 20:07   #1
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Default Comfortable Entry Level Sedan - Etios / Verito / Sail / Manza / Sunny?

I want to get a feedback for these models. Could NOT find a comparo for the entry level (diesel) sedans and a winner from that.

Contestants:

Toyota Etios
Mahindra Verito
Nissan Sunny
Chevy Sail
Honda Amaze
Tata Manza

Criteria:

Absolutely NO problems with the badge value
Sedan + Good boot space
Spacious & Comfortable rear seat.
Silent cabin
(Comparative) Driver oriented nature.
Cost of ownership.
NO pre-owned cars!

My dad may go for a comfortable rear seat sedan soon and hence trying to shortlist one out of these. We have 3 hatchbacks now - a Wagon R, Swift & i20. Of these, Wagon R gives the best seating for them, i20 spacious of the lot & Swift, the best driver oriented nature (NOT great for parents though).

The plan is to upgrade to a entry level sedan from the Wagon R. While none of these shortlisted cars will give the high seating, we want to have a very comfortable seating for the rear seat.

Dzire has been struck out as it's NOT the spacious of the lot. Plus, the service costs of the Swift has been high and we would NOT want a 2.5 car (limited boot space) with high service bills. We need a proper sedan with good boot space.

Out of these, I have been in the rear seat of a Manza & Sunny. Probably since the hump in the Manza is pretty high and I am 6'2" and there were 3 people at the back, my ride was nothing short of a nightmare. So that gets a low priority.

The drives are usually thru bouncy state highways or broken rural roads. While my parents will be at the back, usually NO music will be played and I get irritated with the diesel thrum (even Swift's) - so the most silent of the lot is preferred. Another point is I would like to take the better drivers car of this lot as I "love to drive". The reliability of the car is extremely important as we NEVER had a downtime with respect to the car (mechanically) in the last 14 years.

From whatever reviews / experience,

Amaze - NOISY diesel
Manza - Not so great rear
Sunny - Most expensive of the lot
Sail - Notorious GM + recall issues.
Dzire - 2.5 car with limited rear + boot space & high service costs
Fiesta Classic - Very old car + not so spacious rear.
Linea - Not a spacious car

Please put down the positives & negatives of these models, so that anyone who is looking for a entry level sedan can make an informed decision from this thread.

Last edited by swiftnfurious : 30th December 2013 at 20:24.
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Old 30th December 2013, 20:28   #2
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Default re: Comfortable Entry Level Sedan - Etios / Verito / Sail / Manza / Sunny?

My pick will be Etios. As a package, it ticks most of requirements minus a spirited drive(if I may say). Plus Toyota maintenance is a big boon. amaljee's thread is a very informative. please go through it.
Even though Manza is VFM product, but I will stay away from Tata just for peace of mind.
Sunny is the costliest among the lot and should be the second preference in case the Etios interiors make your parents feel bad.
I haven't experienced Sail. So no comments for this contender.

Last edited by GTO : 1st January 2014 at 17:16. Reason: No SMS language please
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Old 30th December 2013, 20:34   #3
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Default re: Comfortable Entry Level Sedan - Etios / Verito / Sail / Manza / Sunny?

From the list i personally feel nothing ticks all your requirement to the fullest. ETIOS will be the best pick of the lot, as it offers all your requirement though not to the fullest.

Sunny comes with space and suits best for elders who were Chauffeur driven, but it sans driver oriented nature (my opinion).

Rest of them lacks/omits some of your requirement to the core.
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Old 30th December 2013, 20:39   #4
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The verito/ vibe are one of the most underrated cars in our country. As you are not much concerned about brand value I would suggest do have a look at the Verito/vibe.
Why verito?
1. It is very spacious. 2 of my relatives have the Logan. It could comfortably seat 3 above average built people.
2. The fuel efficiency is superb. Both my relatives get 20+ kmpl on the highway. In the city thy get about 17-18kmpl. All these figures with 80% ad on.
3. It is a no nonsense car. Sturdy built And a real workhorse.
4. Boot space is good. Logan, manza and etios were the only cars which could swallow our luggage during our vacations when we visited india.
I really can not comment on the driving part as I haven't driven the Logan. Both the cars in the family are chauffeured.
Just few days back we were returning from a family get together. When my grandparents initially sat In one of the d'zire's we have in the family. After sometime they were shifted to the Logan. As soon as they reached home the first thing my grandfather told me was that after Our Wagonr he just found the Logan to be comfortable. He did not like the dzire at all.

Asit
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Old 30th December 2013, 20:46   #5
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Default re: Comfortable Entry Level Sedan - Etios / Verito / Sail / Manza / Sunny?

My pick would be the Sunny out of the lot specially when you want rear seat comfort. Its not marketed as caaaarr for no reason. Although it does cost maximum in amongst the contenders in your list but then in true sense it competes with cars a segment above and cannot be badged as an entry level sedan per se.

Pros:
1. Exceptional interior space. You have to experience the rear seat to believe it. Also the boot space is quite huge too.
2. Exceptional city driving ability with great low end torque. The car can pull itself from speeds of as low as 10kmph and go all the way to 3 digit speeds in the 3rd gear itself.
3. The base diesel variant XLD is very well kitted and comes with ABS, Dual Airbags, Rear AC vents, Automatic climate control, Steering controls for ICE etc.
4. Nissan generally makes trouble free cars.

Cons:
1. Can only think of one and that is the 6 monthly service interval taking the overall servicing cost close to 8-9k per annum as each service costs 4-4.5k with labour charges.

I heard it currently is being offered with discounts of close to 70k which makes it an even more desirable.

Last edited by drmohitg : 30th December 2013 at 20:48.
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Old 30th December 2013, 20:51   #6
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Default re: Comfortable Entry Level Sedan - Etios / Verito / Sail / Manza / Sunny?

Quote:
Originally Posted by swiftnfurious View Post
Amaze - NOISY diesel
Manza - Not so great rear
Sunny - Most expensive of the lot
Sail - Notorious GM + recall issues.
Dzire - 2.5 car with limited rear + boot space & high service costs
Fiesta Classic - Very old car + not so spacious rear.
Linea - Not a spacious car

The Manza's boot can easily take half the house inside it. That is actually its biggest plus point.

I have a Sail UVA Petrol.
5,000km in 118 days and am very happy with the car.

My previous car was a Wagon R.
My family in unanimous in saying that the Sail is more comfortable.
The front seats are on top of the fuel tank.
Makes for very comfortable ingress and egress.

Parry's has a Sail D. His ownership review is worth reading.
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Old 30th December 2013, 21:13   #7
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Default re: Comfortable Entry Level Sedan - Etios / Verito / Sail / Manza / Sunny?

Quote:
Originally Posted by headbanger View Post
My pick will be Etios. As a package, it ticks most of requirements minus a spirited drive(if I may say)...
With parents at the back, spirited drive will be the last thing in my mind. When they are NOT around, I would hop onto my Swift D for that extra fun.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DRIVE_ADDICT View Post
From the list i personally feel nothing ticks all your requirement to the fullest...
True. There is ONLY "better of the lot" among the contestants.

Quote:
Originally Posted by asit.kulkarni93 View Post
The verito/ vibe are one of the most underrated cars in our country...
No Vibe for sure as it's again a 2.5 car. We need proper boot. Heard very good stuff about Verito. Would really love to see a comparo between Verito & Etios on the below fronts

1. Noise levels in the cabin
2. Ride quality
3. Driver focus
4. Service costs (Is it significantly higher than an Etios?)

Quote:
Originally Posted by drmohitg View Post
...Although it does cost maximum in amongst the contenders in your list but then in true sense it competes with cars a segment above and cannot be badged as an entry level sedan per se....
Completely agree. The ONLY reason I added this to the list is because of the space + comfort offered.

Quote:
Originally Posted by drmohitg View Post
...
Cons:
1. Can only think of one and that is the 6 monthly service interval taking the overall servicing cost close to 8-9k per annum as each service costs 4-4.5k with labour charges...
I think the costs are a bit high. But then it's more premium and desirable than the rest too. Would you be able to compare the comfort this offers against Etios or Verito? I mean if we take a comfort-to-price ratio (similar to power-to-weight ratio), how would these fare against each other? Which one will be more bang to buck just from purely a comfort perspective?

Quote:
Originally Posted by bblost View Post
The Manza's boot can easily take half the house inside it. That is actually its biggest plus point.
As I said, I was NOT very happy with the back seat. Guess hard compound seats + high transmission tunnel made it difficult for 3 at the back.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bblost View Post
...Parry's has a Sail D. His ownership review is worth reading.
Had read it once. Will dig it up once again.

Last edited by swiftnfurious : 30th December 2013 at 21:17.
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Old 30th December 2013, 21:21   #8
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Default re: Comfortable Entry Level Sedan - Etios / Verito / Sail / Manza / Sunny?

Quote:
Originally Posted by swiftnfurious View Post
Contestants:

Toyota Etios
Mahindra Verito
Nissan Sunny
Chevy Sail
Honda Amaze
Tata Manza
@Swiftnfurious: My honest opinion to you as you need this car more keeping your parents in mind, I suggest you Toyota Etios. Toyota reliability and a good to drive car with decent space and best ASC that I have seen and heard off here in Hyderabad.

------------------

Opinions about the list!:
  1. Toyota Etios - Reliable with a super backup ASC, tractable diesel engine.

  2. Mahindra Verito - Has a Taxi image but a overall decent family sedan with average space at the rear if the front seats are set for a tall driver.

  3. Nissan Sunny - The best rear seat space in the segment and puts some higher segments cars to shame. The ASC is a not familiar territory but has above average reliability.

  4. Chevy Sail - Neat looking sedan with the National engine (Bullet proof reliability), only issue could be the ASC, seating space is also decent enough for rear passengers.

  5. Honda Amaze - The diesel engine for me after the 1.3 MJD in the Indian small cars/entry level sedans, with the reliability and ASC are not to be doubted off. The car is small when compared to the rest here so will be the space as it may be uncomfortable and drives well too.

  6. Tata Manza - The only car I get in my mind without doubts when rear speace + comfort is searched for and it is not a drivers car. ASC is nothing much to talk about.

Quote:
Originally Posted by swiftnfurious View Post
Had read it once. Will dig it up once again.
The digging is easier now.

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/test-d...0-000-kms.html (Sailing on tarmac : The Chevrolet Sail ownership report @ 20,000 kms)

Anurag.

Last edited by a4anurag : 30th December 2013 at 21:26.
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Old 30th December 2013, 22:42   #9
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Default re: Comfortable Entry Level Sedan - Etios / Verito / Sail / Manza / Sunny?

Quote:
Originally Posted by swiftnfurious View Post

I think the costs are a bit high. But then it's more premium and desirable than the rest too. Would you be able to compare the comfort this offers against Etios or Verito? I mean if we take a comfort-to-price ratio (similar to power-to-weight ratio), how would these fare against each other? Which one will be more bang to buck just from purely a comfort perspective?
Sorry I never checked out the Verito. Are you really willing to buy the Verito? The car looks seriously dated and ugly now and I cannot really see any good reason to opt for it over the others. How many private buyers really opt for it?
The Etios again has always felt like a "made to cost" car and lacks any sort of appeal to me as a buyer.

If you have the budget then go for the Sunny. You will not regret. Refer to GTO's ownership review thread of his Sunny diesel.

Last edited by drmohitg : 30th December 2013 at 22:44.
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Old 30th December 2013, 23:11   #10
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Default re: Comfortable Entry Level Sedan - Etios / Verito / Sail / Manza / Sunny?

Quote:
Originally Posted by swiftnfurious View Post
My dad may go for a comfortable rear seat sedan soon and hence trying to shortlist one out of these.
Quote:
Originally Posted by swiftnfurious View Post
While none of these shortlisted cars will give the high seating, we want to have a very comfortable seating for the rear seat.
Having driven most of the listed cars in their petrol avatars, I might be the least qualified one here to comment on the diesel aspect. But my friend, if rear seat space is THE top priority here, I suggest you go with the Nissan Sunny eyes shut. Hands down, the most comfortable rear seat among the entry-level sedans you can get.

Quote:
Originally Posted by swiftnfurious View Post
We need a proper sedan with good boot space.
Quote:
Originally Posted by swiftnfurious View Post
The reliability of the car is extremely important as we NEVER had a downtime with respect to the car (mechanically) in the last 14 years.
If you want the best of both worlds - interior space AND fuss-free maintenance - then the Etios makes a strong case for itself as well. But remember, the Etios has been built to a cost. Although it is a Toyota and can be dependable, there have been stories about the Etios and it's atrocious cost-cutting finish. Also, the Etios in it's petrol avatar is a hoot to drive. Can't comment on the diesel.

Re-reading your opening post, I have a feeling your folks will be most comfortable in the Sunny. You say you have been in one yourself, so you would have an idea already. Take them for a test drive in the Sunny and let them decide. I have a feeling the Sunny, although the costliest of the lot, will fit your requirements to a T. The engine is a proven unit, and the car itself comes with plenty of humongous space and comfort. Long-term maintenance shouldn't be a problem either, since it's a Nissan.

All the best!

Last edited by RavenAvi : 30th December 2013 at 23:14.
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Old 30th December 2013, 23:13   #11
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Default re: Comfortable Entry Level Sedan - Etios / Verito / Sail / Manza / Sunny?

My pick would be the Fiesta Classic but I wouldn't recommend it for obvious reasons.

A friend of mine owns the Verito, and apart from the fact that according to me Mahindra has ruined its focused styling that lent it a certain character, the car is very good. That wide body is a huge plus, the ride quality, drive-ability of the motor. Never hated the rides to and fro from my house to the airport, in the Verito/Logan taxis.

Another brilliant car, something that I always hated and still can never bring myself to own, the Sunny. I am being honest here; I believe Nissan, like Toyota did with the Etios, deliberately styled the car to be fugly inside-out to remind you that while these are brilliantly packaged cars, you do loose out on things when you dont buy their more expensive offerings. That being said, I honestly believe that the proven motor, sheer ease of driving and limo-like rear bench, make a strong case for this car and it is usually what I recommend for most people's requirements.
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Old 30th December 2013, 23:18   #12
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Default re: Comfortable Entry Level Sedan - Etios / Verito / Sail / Manza / Sunny?

Sail - Very functional with loads of places to tuck luggage and stuffs.
Amaze - Good looks and New kid on the block.
Linea - Awesome build and ride. Spacious (wide), Door handles dont intrude into seating space. Short on leg room for tall boys.
Sunny - Best leg room. Wide enough to be strictly a 4 seater.
Manza - Tata is doing their best to improve customer satisfaction in service department.
Dzire - Dated looks and not proportionate to look. High service costs
Fiesta Classic - Very old car + not so spacious rear.

Last edited by HillMan : 30th December 2013 at 23:23.
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Old 30th December 2013, 23:29   #13
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Default re: Comfortable Entry Level Sedan - Etios / Verito / Sail / Manza / Sunny?

I would recommend an Etios as my first choice. On the rear you will miss the centre arm rest which is a must. I would never suggest a Mahindra Verito, it's an outdated sedan and does not look pretty either.

I feel that Nissan Sunny would be priced close to Maruti SX4. Since, the Sx4 car is all set to be phased out, you can still be assured of the availability of spares and service.

Buy a car which gives you value for money, don't end up buying something where after sale remains a headache for you.

Do let us know your final decision.

Best wishes
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Old 31st December 2013, 00:45   #14
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Default re: Comfortable Entry Level Sedan - Etios / Verito / Sail / Manza / Sunny?

Well let me try my best to put my inputs on the above cars. I can give the best input on the Etios (petrol) as i personally own one for the last 2.5 years.

Toyota Etios- I own a petrol but i have driven the 1.4 D4D engine. The diesel is good to drive in the city with minimum turbo lag. In the highways above 120/130 the car looses its steam. The steering is light, brakes are supper effective but i found the clutch to be on the harder side compared to my petrol Etios. With the new stiffened suspension the cars handling improved significantly. So for self driving its a decent car. Now coming to the rear seat comfort. I can say its a comfortable car. The Ac is decent. The NVH level of the new Etios improved a lot compared to the older ones. The way it glides over the pot holes or the rough patch is quiet impressive. But the Verito is more comfortable on the rear seat. The interiors of the Etios is very bare basic. You wont find the premium feel of the club class sedan (Manza). In one word Etios can be best described as a practical car. The interiors are basic but very functional. Space is no bar too. One can comfortable seat on the rear seat with crossed legs. Now coming to the point Etios is build to cost. Yes its very true. The car thoroughly lacks the premium feel. But its a no nonsense car. The service costs are the cheapest of the lot. Maintaing my Etios is less expensive than maintaing my Alto K10. The service Toyota provides is really good and they leave no room for complaints. So if you are looking for a hassle free comfortable and spacious sedan with good service back you can close your eyes and opt for the Etios. I have a niggle free ownership with my Etios for about 2.5 years with nearly 28,000kms.

Mahindra Verito- I never drove a Verito but had been a rear sear passenger on this car many time for the airport runs. In one word i can say its a very comfortable car. The AC is good too. What i observed is the cars has minimum turbo lag and once i got a very enthusiastic driver. On a open stretch i saw the car cleanly pulled till 130. After that the driver had to slow down due to traffic. I know one driver in Bangalore who used to drive a Verito for Meru and later he switched to an Etios for mega cabs. I always take him and have is phone number too. Once i asked him to compare Etios and Verito. His comparison was like-
1) Verito felt more powerful. (In specs both the cars are similarly powerful so i gues the drivabilty of the Verito is better than the Etios.)
2) Etios has much better brakes.
3) Maintenance cost of Etios is less than Verito.
4) Mileage of Etios is more than Verito.
5)Comfort wise he told Etios is more comfortable. ( May be thats for the driver but i would say rear seat comfort of Verito is slightly better than the Etios. Its has got a more poised feel over the rough patches.).

Nissan Sunny- I never drove one nor did i seat in one. So no comments.

Chevy Sail- I never drove one nor did i seat in one. So no comments.

Honda Amaze- This is a car which i love a lot. 100ps power with 25km/ltr sounds really awesome. I once took a TD of this car. The power delivery is linear. Its a nice car to drive. Being a sub 4 meter car its more easy to drive and park compared to the other cars mentioned over here. On the flip side what i noticed is the NVH level was a bit on the higher side. The rear seat space is less compared to Etios/ Verito/ Manza. The car is a bit more bumpy than the others over here. Its a pure drivers car. So if your prime decisive factor is the rear seat then its better to rule the Amaze out.

Tata Manza- I have been in the rear seat and drivers seat both on this car. Its one of the most fun to drive when the turbo Kicks in. Unlike the Amaze it gives a sudden rush of the adrenaline. Where as the Amaze feels more of a tamed car. The Amaze is way more easier to dive than the bigger Manza. The Manza is really a big car to drive in congested cities. The interiors of the Manza is no doubt the best. In the rear seat it felt as if i was seating on a sofa. But still on rough roads the vertical movement was there. Which is better controlled in a Etios/Verito. As a chauffeur driven car i liked the Manza. But my friend who owns the car has referred to few niggling problems. For example with in 15,000kms he had to change the clutch plate. Left side suspension needed overhauling at 21,000kms, there was a minor issue with the steering too. But all were rectified by Tata to his satisfaction. I must say Tata has improved a lot with the Manza.

So at the end i would say all are great car. Best thing will be you take test drives of all the cars with your parents on the rear seat. So they can judge the comfort level and the feel good factor. If i were you i would pick the Etios due to its over package. (I tried to be unbiased but still suggesting you the Etios. )
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Old 31st December 2013, 00:50   #15
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Default re: Comfortable Entry Level Sedan - Etios / Verito / Sail / Manza / Sunny?

Quote:
Originally Posted by swiftnfurious View Post
...Criteria:

Absolutely NO problems with the badge value
Sedan + Good boot space
Spacious & Comfortable rear seat.
Silent cabin
(Comparative) Driver oriented nature.
Cost of ownership.
NO pre-owned cars!...

The drives are usually thru bouncy state highways or broken rural roads. While my parents will be at the back, usually NO music will be played and I get irritated with the diesel thrum (even Swift's) - so the most silent of the lot is preferred. Another point is I would like to take the better drivers car of this lot as I "love to drive". The reliability of the car is extremely important as we NEVER had a downtime with respect to the car (mechanically) in the last 14 years.

From whatever reviews / experience,

Amaze - NOISY diesel
Manza - Not so great rear
Sunny - Most expensive of the lot
Sail - Notorious GM + recall issues.
Dzire - 2.5 car with limited rear + boot space & high service costs
Fiesta Classic - Very old car + not so spacious rear.
Linea - Not a spacious car...
IMO since downtime is a serious concern, and IMO the most critical criteria, I'd suggest the Toyota Etios. Even if it falls short in other aspects.

Tata Manza :
  • If you were OK with the trans-canal in the Manza, I'd have suggested that because it has the Best in Class rear seating angle. Also, AFAIK the top model came with Italian leather (its Black & Plum IIRC) thats rather soft. If you're going for the Mid-Variant, you can get soft seats covers done from outside for ~10k, and since the leg-space is A-M-P-L-E, it wouldn't be an issue.
  • Also, AFAIK Manza is the widest sedan wrt interior space in this segment, anyway as you mentioned mostly your 2 parents would be at the rear, it wouldn't get cramped.
  • Wrt ownership costs & service requirements of Manza, I'd have suggested you read amit1234sangla's thread.
  • An infotainment system with Sygic MMI GPS Navigation with lifetime free updates. (Sygic became free, but now there are updates available with paid features). Suggesting because I'm sure while being chauffeured they'd generally find it quite comforting to know where they are while travelling through state highways.
Fiat Linea :
  • I have a Fiat Linea and I feel the overall ownership costs & effort are both pretty high.
  • Its an excellent driver oriented car, and has a massive 500 Liter bootspace while Manza has 460L. Etios IIRC has a mind-boggling 590L. Also, Linea has no proper bottle-holders inside.
  • At the Max, its meant for 2.5 at the rear, and the rear headroom isn't suitable for heights like 6' 2".
  • Its built like a tank & really safe, thats something that makes me a TOTAL fan of the Linea. Whatever Manza's or other cars safety ratings were, I never felt as safe in them as in the Linea.
  • IMO Fiat A.S.S. is good, but only at SOME places, that aspect lends to its unreliability. Otherwise I've seen people with almost NO issues. DRIV3R knows best in this aspect.
Nissan Sunny / Renault Scala :
  • I once went in a Verito Taxi and the driver went ~110 in the NICE Road - It was horrible, just DO NOT want to experience that again. Ever. The car felt anything but planted, asif its the last ride I was going to have. I've been told Nissan Sunny's handling is similar.
  • Also interior seems EXTREMELY old school, that too while paying the highest.
  • Rest said, no matter what people say about the 1.3mjd being "newer & more advanced thus being technologically superior to the crude 1.5K9K", if its reliable then I'd not mind the engine.
Chevy Sail sedan :
  • Chevy Sail is very proportionate wrt rear looks and has probably executed it best under 4m, it front looks like the Cruze at a distance in the RVM. Interior could've been better.
  • Doesn't Chevy offer 3 years maintenance for 20k, thats a valuable +ve IMO.
  • Its limited to 75bhp with a FGT, but AFAIK the additional 15bhp would only come to use at high speeds, which is not likely if your parents are going to be along.
  • Boot space is limited to 360L but.
Just my 2 cents.

Last edited by GrammarNazi : 31st December 2013 at 01:18.
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