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View Poll Results: Which car should I choose
Ford EcoSport Petrol AT Titanium 38 18.01%
Honda City SV AT 60 28.44%
Vento DSG Petrol 86 40.76%
Increase Budget or Consider Deisel 27 12.80%
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Old 9th June 2014, 09:41   #76
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Default Re: Automatic Quandary - Budget of 10 Lakhs

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Originally Posted by aseem View Post
Linea is also plagued with poor resale which is a big factor for me to begin with.
Petrol based driver's cars in my opinion are bound to suffer from poor re-sale given our love for diesels and FE. Hence I would suggest you will need to balance priorities. Else I think it would continue to remain an open ended problem.

I do understand your requirements and can understand the frustrations. But I think re-aligning your priorities is the only way out.

Last edited by ampere : 9th June 2014 at 09:46.
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Old 9th June 2014, 10:45   #77
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Default Re: Automatic Quandary - Budget of 10 Lakhs

Toyota must be really happy if a car enthusiast looking for a FTD car ends up buying their Corolla!

I'll go against the tide here and say that its a good choice given your requirements. The Petrol Corolla is no slouch and the engine is very driveable in the city with good torque spread and being an N.A engine it does not suffer from turbo lag. We moved from a Corolla to a Laura TSI. Yes the Skoda is more fun to drive on open roads, but really the Corolla wasn't too far behind. The steering in the first gen Corolla that we had, was a pure hydraulic unit and offered good feedback and though the ride wasn't perfect, I loved the cars agility and predictable handling. It was light on its feet and was very chuckable. Don't know how the new car behaves though. And the engine was very peppy in traffic and fairly efficient too.

What I am trying to say is that after moving from a Corolla to a Laura TSI, I did not feel that the Corolla was too far behind in the FTD department at low to medium speeds. In fact when compared to the stock Laura suspension, I felt the Corolla was more chuckable into corners. Of course the Laura's high speed stability is in a class of its own.
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Old 9th June 2014, 23:31   #78
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Default Re: Automatic Quandary - Budget of 10 Lakhs

Just a quick update back from test drives & an observation update:

Toyota Corolla: I had finalised this after reading online reviews, going by Toyota maintenance, my memory of 1.8 Toyota of 2007 timeframe and given Toyota's reliability and resale. Upon first look the car did impress. The drive was smooth. But there was no oomph. Zero, zilch, nada. Ok it was not as anaemic as Honda City, there was throttle response. But the response was quite weak. Upon closer inspection the "G" model has dated alloys, misses out on so many goodies, fabric seats, and has an ARAI mileage of 13 kmpl
The automatic claims 15, which was quite surprising given its a CVT. Once my love for the vehicle subsided it was clear that it was a point A to a point B in comfort car and neither engine/nor handling was geared towards driving. There were some parts in the console (namely AC vents and digital clock) that felt cheap. This was a good/better Honda City, but does that warrant 4-5 lakh rupees more? It looks like Toyota is heavily banking on its badge, after sales support and the good looks of the car.

Even more confused then before I approached the Skoda showroom.

Skoda Octavia 2.0 Diesel Top Model: Well first things first, the first impression sitting inside this car is that of premium luxury like Audi A4. I mean the leather, the lights, you name it. You can sit inside this cabin and feel happy. Plus the middle variant only misses out on sunroof, cruise control, projector lamps/drl, automatic seat. But on most part it feels a premium cabin. I drove the DSG 6 speed Octavia Diesel. The first impression was the car is wide, and engine is slightly rough (unrefined). The throttle responses were uncontrolled. I mean the car simply unleashes. Unlike the Polo TSI with 7 speed, the 6 speed ratios, the diesel turbo/lag, and more power means that the car simply launches in not so good way when you floor it. The brake pedal too was hyper sensitive. I couldn't check handling as it was straight roads, but I could just see that this car will need lot of maintenance. I mean the sales guy himself looked like he himself was not sure about hight maintenance cost telling me lights would set you back by 40k rupees as its a CKD etc.
My feeling towards this car change, each and every device, like sunroof, complicated aux port, etc were looking to me as costly to repair. I was unsure and not confident. The drive didn't excite me much either. This was no Corolla but this was not refined either. Maybe it was the TD vehicle.

Now the pridacement is as follows, Corolla ruled out. Now I have the following 3 choices:

Polo TSI with net EMI of 11k per month. Keep for 3 years and sell, no snob value, wife doesn't approve.

Laura 1.4 TSI with net EMI of 23,000. Wife will be ok, but its a manual, and should I go for diesel. My friend says petrols demand less maintenance. Budget wise this is ok. Does this have any resale? This has ARAI mileage of 17 kmpl.

Laura 1.8 TSI DSG with net EMI of 29,000. Should I go all the way? I love DSG, but 30k EMI is a little too much for me. This has ARAI mileage of 12.5.

Or should I go for Laura Diesel (ARAI 17.5) and the test drive vehicle that was abused made the car look unrefined?.. The diesel will give good mileage and get a decent resale I imagine.

Friends please advise. I am more confused, my car is sold. I need to put a check on something, that too fast!

Last edited by aseem : 9th June 2014 at 23:39.
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Old 9th June 2014, 23:53   #79
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polo gt tsi... I myself recently sold my honda city zx and now waiting to book the new face lifted polo gt tsi once it's officially announced.

A hatch back is in many ways so much more practical over a sedan as long as you don't need to seat 5 people + use the boot on a regular basis.

we need to all reach a point in our lives where we should take decisions based on what's right for us rather than what's right in front of other's eyes as long as we aren't hurting anyone.

Easier said than done but my friend one day you will see that all that you worried about never really mattered in the first place.
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Old 10th June 2014, 06:11   #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aseem View Post
.

Friends please advise. I am more confused, my car is sold. I need to put a check on something, that too fast!

My first overarching feedback would be, don't buy into an EMI that you feel uncomfortable with, more so with a depreciating asset. Err on the side of caution. We all get loans far too easily and if you feel a particular EMI is too munch then assume it is so and walk away.

With that out of the way ...

If you could wait, I'd still urge you to wait for the Vento DSG diesel. It seems to combine the best of all worlds for you. I say this also recognising that you've bought into buying a VAG group co car considering you've got the octy and polo on your list.

Next option would be City AT. It ideally combines a lot of factors. It's not exactly boring to drive in my opinion, it's got the comfort of a reasonably big car with the compactness and ease of driving of a small car, it's got image, massive boot. Big downside of course is that you've already owned one. Having said that, if you change frequently, you're repeating a model for only a few years. On the flip side if for any reason you don't change the car as soon as you expect, owning the bigger car will allow it to serve your possibly changing needs for that longer period (I don't know about personal front but child etc).
Bear in mind this will get you the best resale value too. The difference between second hand city and corolla of similar age is significantly less than the diff in their new MRP.

Final option could be polo TSi. Fun to drive in a compact package.

Outside contender that compromises on fun to drive but gives you a nice looking package with diesel and AT as well as decent resale is Verna D AT.

If you still must stretch, I think corolla AT will add visibly on back seat comfort over the City AT. if you're purely self driven though, I feel the extra money for the corolla won't seem like adding value.
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Old 10th June 2014, 07:49   #81
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Default Re: Automatic Quandary - Budget of 10 Lakhs

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My first overarching feedback would be, don't buy into an EMI that you feel uncomfortable with
+1. If you are uncomfortable with the EMI, the same would go for maintenance too (well...in most cases). If you are looking at Petrol, then nothing comes close to Honda City At.
Good resale and good reliability.

Last edited by ampere : 10th June 2014 at 07:50.
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Old 10th June 2014, 10:46   #82
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Default Re: Automatic Quandary - Budget of 10 Lakhs

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Originally Posted by aseem View Post
Just a quick update back from test drives & an observation update:

[Now the pridacement is as follows, Corolla ruled out. Now I have the following 3 choices:

Polo TSI with net EMI of 11k per month. Keep for 3 years and sell, no snob value, wife doesn't approve.

Laura 1.4 TSI with net EMI of 23,000. Wife will be ok, but its a manual, and should I go for diesel. My friend says petrols demand less maintenance. Budget wise this is ok. Does this have any resale? This has ARAI mileage of 17 kmpl.

Laura 1.8 TSI DSG with net EMI of 29,000. Should I go all the way? I love DSG, but 30k EMI is a little too much for me. This has ARAI mileage of 12.5.

Or should I go for Laura Diesel (ARAI 17.5) and the test drive vehicle that was abused made the car look unrefined?.. The diesel will give good mileage and get a decent resale I imagine.

Friends please advise. I am more confused, my car is sold. I need to put a check on something, that too fast!
Any reason why you dropped the Vento TSI from your list? Based on your needs seems to be a good match. Reasonable EMI, Better Snob value since it is a sedan, as good to drive as the Polo TSI in real world.

On a side note, the Polo (and the Vento TSI) have 6-8 months waiting periods in Bangalore, So I do not think you will be able to get your hands on one immediately.
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Old 10th June 2014, 11:47   #83
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Default Re: Automatic Quandary - Budget of 10 Lakhs

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Friends please advise. I am more confused, my car is sold. I need to put a check on something, that too fast!
As others have pointed out, no matter how much you are hard-pressed to buy a car do not committ to an EMI that you think will be unsustainable. You may buy a brilliant car but start to worry about the service costs etc. soon after which will take the fun out of owning that car.

I had a budget of 10 lacs and to me the only option was the Polo GT TSI. Nothing came close to it! Yes, there are questions about why I am spending 9 lacs OTR on a 'choti gaadi'! But I ignore such questions because I know that they are coming from people who know little or nothing about cars and the technology that goes behind making them! Thankfully, wifey is on the same side as me. We have a 3-year old but we dont feel the need for a 'dicky wali gaadi' in a crowded city like Mumbai where parking space is at a premium.

More than anybody you have to convince your better-half about the Polo GT TSI (which I suppose is your first choice). The merits of having a hatch-back. Let her drive the car once during a test drive, pretty sure she'll appreciate the ease of use and the power on tap!

Good luck, mate!
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Old 10th June 2014, 20:02   #84
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Default Re: Automatic Quandary - Budget of 10 Lakhs

I can afford EMI unto 20k easily. I am buying through car lease so 20k means 30k before taxes. So that means around 13-14 lakh loan is sweet spot. I can also put 3 lakh rupee as downpayment.
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Old 10th June 2014, 22:32   #85
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Default Re: Automatic Quandary - Budget of 10 Lakhs

@aseem,
You can avail a bank loan of 9.5L at an EMI of 20K for a tenure of 60 months @ 10.25% ROI. If you add 3L downpayment then you have a total of 12.5L.
As other team-bhpians suggested, you may go for Honda City VX (Manual) post budget season as market is expecting some more reduction in taxes. You can buy it for under 12L OTR in Bangalore and it will take care of most of your needs. This city is much advanced than the earlier city you owned.

Also remember that you will be paying an interest of 2.7L on a loan of 9.5L for 5 years. This will be offset by tax benefit you are availing.

My funda is never stretch your budget for a depreciating asset. Always stretch your budget for an appreciating asset. End of the day the stretch will be worth. I usually avoid availing more loan on a car as i try to make more down payment in region of 50 to 60%. See here you are loosing on depreciation + you are paying interest= not a good combo. Atleast you should buy a car which pulls string else the whole investment will look like a huge loss.

Edit: Fix a budget and not EMI. Take TD of all car's within your budget and then decide. Don't think too much on Resale etc. Kal kisne dekha hai

Last edited by djay99 : 10th June 2014 at 22:40.
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Old 11th June 2014, 01:04   #86
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Default Re: Automatic Quandary - Budget of 10 Lakhs

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@aseem,
You can avail a bank loan of 9.5L at an EMI of 20K for a tenure of 60 months @ 10.25% ROI. If you add 3L downpayment then you have a total of 12.5L.
As other team-bhpians suggested, you may go for Honda City VX (Manual) post budget season as market is expecting some more reduction in taxes. You can buy it for under 12L OTR in Bangalore and it will take care of most of your needs. This city is much advanced than the earlier city you owned.

Also remember that you will be paying an interest of 2.7L on a loan of 9.5L for 5 years. This will be offset by tax benefit you are availing.

My funda is never stretch your budget for a depreciating asset. Always stretch your budget for an appreciating asset. End of the day the stretch will be worth. I usually avoid availing more loan on a car as i try to make more down payment in region of 50 to 60%. See here you are loosing on depreciation + you are paying interest= not a good combo. Atleast you should buy a car which pulls string else the whole investment will look like a huge loss.

Edit: Fix a budget and not EMI. Take TD of all car's within your budget and then decide. Don't think too much on Resale etc. Kal kisne dekha hai
I am talking about Company car lease. So in company car lease if my EMI is as follows:

Car Value Ex-Showroom: 1417500

Registration & Insurance: 3,00,000 (downpayment from my pocket)

Car Loan Value: 1417500 - 141750 (10% paid in last instalment) = 12,75,000

Total EMI @ 12% Interest for 4 years: 33,575

if you are @ 30% slab, plus you get petrol reimbursement tax free upto a certain limit. Therefore the effective outflow:

Total EMI tax adjusted: 20600

Thats the whole idea behind car lease. It greatly reduces your EMI. I am refraining from City, though I agree from resale standpoint its a practical choice.

I need a good balance between living & enjoying today and saving for tomorrow. I can "easily" I reiterate this part, I can easily without stretching afford 20k. I can afford 30k as well, but its a mental block that anything close to 40-50k can easily let me afford another house EMI, so spening 30k on a car kind of pushes my self proclaimed limit on car EMI. I am ok with 22k, 23k etc.

Last edited by aseem : 11th June 2014 at 01:07.
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Old 11th June 2014, 01:53   #87
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Default Re: Automatic Quandary - Budget of 10 Lakhs

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Originally Posted by aseem View Post
I am talking about Company car lease. So in company car lease if my EMI is as follows:

Car Value Ex-Showroom: 1417500
I got your point.

Did you check Chevy Cruze? LT variant retails at around 17L OTR Bangalore and there are some good discounts on this car. Since its a diesel, you can expect reasonable resale value though no where comparable to Japanese or Koreans.

You may have to think again on your requirements as i don't see any car ticking all of your requirements.

Edit: I guess upon completion of lease period, car will be transferred to your name and then you can sell it. I guess this will further reduce resale value of car.

Last edited by djay99 : 11th June 2014 at 01:57.
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Old 11th June 2014, 04:42   #88
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Originally Posted by aseem View Post
I am talking about Company car lease. So in company car lease if my EMI is as follows:

Total EMI tax adjusted: 20600

@ Aseem.

I think it would be bordering on off topic to make this into a detailed discourse of EMI vs lease vs ownership vs 101 of tax and depreciation provisions.

Why don't you keep it simple by just re-confirming an on road price range that's in your consideration (basis all your internal calculations, internal decisions on mode of purchase, mode of funding etc). People can then accordingly focus on suggesting the cars that meet your requirements (to the extent it's not out there already).
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Old 13th June 2014, 17:10   #89
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Default Re: Automatic Quandary - Budget of 10 Lakhs

Please look at this calculation. Also note that I am currently paying close to 20k EMI per month for my cars and its not a stretch at all to pay 20k per month. I can easily do 25k per month for EMI but just a little apprehensive as I don't know how long it will take for my wife to find a job in Bangalore once she quits her job in Delhi. Than too, 25-30k EMI is manageable, but we would be saving less then we are used too. Please pay special focus on the resale value tab. I have used car wale to guestimate it. Please let me know if the calculation for the resale is on the higher side. Resale value taken after car is 4 years old. Cost per year is total cost of the vehicle less the resale value divided by 4 years.

Thanks in advance. I am in closing stages. Cars in green that I am leaning towards. Note, EMI before tax is just for reference. I would be paying the EMI after tax that is the lower EMI as going via company lease.

Cost of insurance, extended warranty, not included in the calculations.
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Old 13th June 2014, 20:58   #90
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Please find updated calculation. Mom has a mental block buying 22 lakh rupee car, even though dad liked the Octi & gave go ahead for Octavia Diesel DSG or Petrol 1.4 TSi middle model. He wasn't that impressed with Corolla/Vento, and it has no waiting period. So dad thought the model is going to flop and perhaps less resale???

In anycase, taking both their suggestions into account, it basically boils down to the following:

Corolla G Variant (20,600Rs 4 Year EMI):
Pros:
17.21 Lakh OTR Sweet Spot
Cheapest cost per year over a 4 year period
Low maintenance and hassle free ownership
Upgrade over Honda City/Fiesta (++ snob value for whatever it is worth)

Cons:
Dull driving experience
Fabric Seats
Cheap 15" allows with low width tyres
Average FE of ARAI 13 kmpl on petrol

Corolla G Variant Auto (23,320Rs 4 Year EMI):
Pros:
18.85 Lakh OTR
FE of 15.5 kmpl on petrol more than that of manual
Paddle shifts
Low maintenance and hassle free ownership
Upgrade over Honda City/Fiesta (++ snob value for whatever it is worth)

Cons:
Dull driving experience
Fabric Seats
Cheap 15" allows with low width tyres

Skoda Octavia 1.4 TSI Manual Ambition (23,159Rs 4 Year EMI ):
Pros:
18.75 Lakh OTR
ARAI mileage of 17 kmpl on petrol
Leather seats
Dual zone climate control
Overall better cabin then Toyota
More ++ snob value over Corolla
Driving pleasure is higher
3 month waiting period unlike Corolla which is readily available (has it flopped?)

Cons:
Lower resale value
Turbo lag in City traffic
Poor looking lights without bi-xenons
Costly repairs though I will take extended warranty
Costly insurance

So this is what it boils down too. Would have considered Vento, but dad didn't like it at all. I would love to have DSG, but diesel DSG is taking cost to 22 lakh OTR. If my assumption that Octavia Petrol Manual will fetch me 7.25 Lakh after 4 years of driving 30k KM and maintaining the car is true, than I can make an informed decision. If you feel my assumption is optimistic and I will loose a lot more, please let me know. Please find updated chart. Please review and advise.
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Last edited by aseem : 13th June 2014 at 21:04.
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