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Old 16th December 2007, 02:15   #31
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Great job guys....the thread starter must be so relieved now that we have jointly helped him in making a decision.

But if your still confused yousivakutti then just go ahead and buy any of the other Forum favs...baleno/palio/swift/ohc etc.


Cheers.
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Old 16th December 2007, 02:38   #32
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i guess i could give a clearer & unbiased picture on the war between the sx4 zxi and the nhc gxi.i own both of them(nhc vtec instead of the gxi) and have driven both.yes,the sx4 zxi has airbags,abs blah blah blah,but when you are stuck in a traffic jam,what matters more is steering lightness and responsiveness of the engine.this is where the nhc scores.fit and finish is light years ahead of the sx4.it feels icky when you see the similar buttons and switches on the swift.the sx4 just doesnt cocoon you from the outside noise while the nhc has pretty good damping for isolating noise,why i mentioned this is because it does make your drive stressful if all you can hear is the honking and the tire noise.visibility on both the cars would be comparable.the nhc can accomodate 3 people easily on the backseat while the sx4's backseat feels cramped,best for 2 people.
a lot of members are stressing on nhc's 77bhp vs sx4's 102bhp,mind you dont compare the figures raher compare the rpm's at which max torque and power are produced.you will be surprised to know that the nhc produces max torque at a rpm well below that of the sx4.so in gear accelerations are pretty good.and for those mumbling about power,please go through the ACI,and you'll find that the nhc's 0-100 time is 13.5 sec compared to the sx4's 12.4sec.hardly a difference.the sx4 zxi is currently giving me 10kmpl in the city while the nhc vtec gives me 14-15 easily.add another 1-2kmpl forthe gxi.

NHC:
1.better nvh
2.more space
3.better sound insulation
4.lighter steering which helps in the city
5.better fit and finish
6.Honda's impeccable reliability.
7.lesser features compared to the sx4
8.more expensive than the sx4.
9.poor dealership network compared to the maruti.
10.lower ground clearance compared to the sx4.
11. i found it easier to drive than the sx4.
12.higher fuel efficiency.
13.better build quality than the sx4.

you can select which points matter to you more and then decide accordingly.since this is going to be your family car and will keep it for the next 6-7years,i would suggest the honda.if you want vfm and dont want to spend more,get the sx4.
both cars are brilliant,its just that you have to decide which one suits you best.

Last edited by hellspawn : 16th December 2007 at 02:41.
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Old 16th December 2007, 03:00   #33
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Originally Posted by BUSA View Post



Here is a deal, lets have a straight line 1km race, with me in a Swift Diesel(the smallest diesel engine car sold in India) against you in a NHC and both of us will shift at 2000RPM, then we will know how the hell does NHC have diesel like torque. All diesel cars sold in the country have much much more torque then the NHC.




He



All the students on board, there is a new subject to learn about "NHC"



No wonder it is being phased out in the next City.

Please stop being obssessed about the NHC, there is more to life and team-bhp then a car with a puny engine and obesity.

And people who think Honda quality is fantastic take a look at new Citys and Accords, Honda quality is not what it used to be.
when somebody says"the petrol car has diesel-like torque",it means that the petrol engine produces max torque low down in the rpm band rather than high up.the nhc produces max torque at 2700rpm while the sx4 does it at 4200rpm.so you tell me which car will have better drivability.

oh and the sx4 is built like a tank...my day old sx4 zxi has rattles emanating from somewhere,while the nhc which has done 44k kms doesnt even have a single rattle as yet.
go behind your car and look at the rear..thats what actual obesity is. and look under the hood and you will find a Fiat engine.
and have you even driven both the cars(not a TD but a proper long drive) as you seem to be advising with a lot of confidence.
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Old 16th December 2007, 03:58   #34
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Well, the posh interior look comes with the City more than the SX4..Even the exterior, City i feel is alittle more graceful especially. Sx4, with those funky side window panels, reminds me of those helicopters used to shower medicine on crops! hehehe....just my opinion no offensive intend. But considering features and safety its SX4 all the way. Also since this Honda city will get phased out soon, Its wise to go for Indias largest service network provider's SX4.
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Old 16th December 2007, 07:07   #35
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Its a tough call.

Honda City
Pros
Refined Engine
Fuel Efficiency
City Driveability
Build Quality/Honda Reliability

Cons
Safety Features

SX4
Pros
Features. Cant ask more
Price
Driving Posture. I love it.
More powerful
Ground Clearance
Service network of Maruthi

Cons
Build Quality
Fuel Efficiency. Mixed Reports.

Sorry to make you more confused. I would say, TD both and go for the one that suits you. All the Best!!
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Old 16th December 2007, 10:04   #36
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Originally Posted by hrman View Post
I knew the minute this thread started that its gonna be a NHC Vs SX4 fight all the way.. I have stated this in another thread as well, please dont bombard Honda or the NHC just because of its high price. The fact that it has been around for so many years, and is widely loved as a status symbol (Snob value if you wanna be blunt), speaks for itself.
I have great respect for Honda for its racing roots and refinement in contemporary technologies. For instance, Civic (and Civic Si) is a looker none other car in that category can match! It is not about Honda vs. Suzuki or Maruti. It's about a product that is grossly under featured, and yet, a company of Honda's stature managed to get away with it!

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Originally Posted by hrman View Post
And oh yes, I do own an NHC, so will support it, irrespective of what any other manufacturer offers. I love the reactions I get from people when I tell them I own a Honda as against the fact that I own something else.
I understand your sentiment and I am sorry if any of you get offended. I too use a company NHC Gxi temporary and loves it. But to say, having a NHC is a status symbol, is bit odd comparing to what it offers. Status symbol is owning an expensive and rare object,to show one's high social status. Yes right, NHC is a rare pearl that elevates to this club whereas Bentlies are so common cars in India that even my next door neighbour who runs a small cement store owns one. Even if the car does not have ABS/Airbags/Climatronics/Alloys/temperature gauge/state of the art security system etc., hey, bro, how does it matter, as long as you can feel INDUCTED to this exclusive club! If you got the picture, snob value is NOT status symbol. It is just a make belief imagination that hangs around upper middle class families that started up. Purely utopian school of thought and nothing else. And if you feel happy about it, sure, enjoy it. That only shows how irrational and ignorant most people are in India.

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Originally Posted by hrman View Post
And the competitor for the NHC is amongst all, a product from the stable of a Government owned company which continued with its bread and butter model (read 800) for close to 3 decades and still is not willing to phase it out for something new. Look at the esteem (erstwhile 1000) which was largely unchanged for over 1.5 decades? Im sure we can expect the same SX4 with a modified headlight 20 years from now, but the Honda city would have undergone 10 modifications by then. An earlier thread mentions that the NHC is gonna be phased out next year. What do we have? 4 modifications to the City in the past 10 years? Doesnt that say something about the progressive outlook of Honda? .
So, basically you are trying to compare Honda Motors Corporation with Indian Maruti! Don't go rubbish by dragging legendary Honda's reputation and might with the filmsy car maker, Maruti. Comparision should be made on fair level grounds and equating Honda and Maruti, is like, hare and tortoise racing. Having said that, even after 4 revamps on NHC, the looks are still aweful to many and still to these days, the popular Exi/Gxi/CVT/VTEC does not even get safety features that it deserves. So, to sum up, in the past 4 revamps, the changes are only cosmetics (just as in maruti 800, Zen). And still, they couldn't get the car in shape and enticing enough! So, instead of a progression, it is regression! To add to this, even the design of new Accord is a way step backward and possibly a copycat of Hyundai. Only if you see Civic, would one appreciate its design. For that matter, GM, Ford and Suzuki can design car better than Honda. Newbie launches just as Fiesta, SX4, looks fabulous. Don't you agree? You'll say, NO, but who cares, most majority do and that is what it matters!

Quote:
Originally Posted by hrman View Post
And another thing, two different opinions can exist in this world. If this thread turns into a debate, then the initiator of this will not be able to get conclusive answers/ suggestions. Only many NHC -Haters/ SX4 supporters pouncing on a few NHC owners.
And a smiley after the post does not necessarily subdue the seriousness of the accusations/ sarcastic statements made in the post...
Well, everyone, ain't this thread open for all members including NHC owners? And considering how much NHC are sold every month, there should be staggering number of users in teamBHP too. They are all too welcome to comment and present facts. If this thread find few takers for NHC (that is to be understood as most only own it for the "STATUS SYMBOL", and do not realize what bogie they are getting into) why blame NHC haters and SX4 supporters! Facts are sometime bitter to digest and if you perceive them as being sarcastic, then, it probably is because of your lack in the the level of knowledge and awareness about cars around your world. No one is making accusation here, no post or views are subdued. Instead of twirling facts, if you have better insights, then please draw conclusively, so that if I am missing something, I can get to know it! That is what this forum serves for, isn't?

Last edited by iTNerd : 16th December 2007 at 10:12.
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Old 16th December 2007, 10:20   #37
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NHC does this figures at 2700RPM, while SX4 does it at 4200RPM. Most drivers drive between 2000~3000RPM & this is where NHC scores.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CrAzY dRiVeR View Post
Power- NHC 77bhp, SX4 102 bhp
Torque- NHC- 12.8 kgm, SX4 14.5 kgm.
0-100 figures- NHC 13.11s, SX4 12.10s
SX4 is ahead, be it torque or power. NHC will be better in FE though!
Nope. Its you who have been denied favors from Honda. And so now you are NHC basher.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BUSA View Post
I have asked you this question many times before also and asking again, Do you work for Honda or Do they give you commission for every NHC sold or Have you bought shares of Honda? I hope you have the courage to answer my queries.
I again tell everybody. NHC is a car for comfort, ease of driving, reliability, less noise in car. Its a passenger car. It is not a car for racing. In case if you race, it lose by just 1 second. (But, if you are performance oriented, go for NHC VTEC & beat by a good 2~3 seconds).
Quote:
Here is a deal, lets have a straight line 1km race, with me in a Swift Diesel(the smallest diesel engine car sold in India) against you in a NHC and both of us will shift at 2000RPM, then we will know how the hell does NHC have diesel like torque. All diesel cars sold in the country have much much more torque then the NHC.
OHC too was phased out some time in history - 5 years back to be precise. Are any OHC owners cribbing about non-available of parts from Honda?
Quote:
@ Thread Started - Buy the SX4 ZXi, no point in buying a car which is going to be phased out in the next 7 months.
iTNerd, you have worked out that SX4 has better FE than NHC. So working like you, I have proved that NHC has ABS too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by iTNerd View Post
Technically, City never won at the first place. With a kerb weight of 1055 kgs, 14 inch narrow tyre, 77 bhp, no climatronic, the mileage should be significantly more compared to SX4 ZXi which is 1200 kgs, 16 inch wide tyres, 102 bhp, with climatronics. But a SX4 Zxi gives around 12-13 kmpl in city condition with 90% AC, whereas, NHC Gxi, under the condition, leads by a mere 1-2 kms. In fact, SX4 Zxi technically, gives a better FE w.r.t the fuel guzzling factors of the car as mentioned.
Quote:
Originally Posted by iTNerd View Post
You wish. How lame is your logic?
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Old 16th December 2007, 10:26   #38
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I fail to understand - what is the 'Status Symbol' in owning a 8 lakh car? Even SX4 costs 8 lakhs .
People go for NHC for the comfort it offers. They are willing to pay for the comfort.
Quote:
Originally Posted by iTNerd View Post
Well, everyone, ain't this thread open for all members including NHC owners? And considering how much NHC are sold every month, there should be staggering number of users in teamBHP too. They are all too welcome to comment and present facts. If this thread find few takers for NHC (that is to be understood as most only own it for the "STATUS SYMBOL", and do not realize what bogie they are getting into) why blame NHC haters and SX4 supporters! Facts are sometime bitter to digest and if you perceive them as being sarcastic, then, it probably is because of your lack in the the level of knowledge and awareness about cars around your world. No one is making accusation here, no post or views are subdued. Instead of twirling facts, if you have better insights, then please draw conclusively, so that if I am missing something, I can get to know it! That is what this forum serves for, isn't?
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Old 16th December 2007, 10:55   #39
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Originally Posted by diabloo View Post
technically, you can simulate ABS action manually in NHC and so this advantage if SX4 is nullified.
Hey, this is cool.
Is it possible to simulate airbags as well somehow? Because my Verna doesn't have any and I'd like some.
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Old 16th December 2007, 11:11   #40
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Technically, if it can be proved that SX4 offers better FE, why not technically prove that ABS exists in NHC ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by iTNerd View Post
Technically, City never won at the first place. With a kerb weight of 1055 kgs, 14 inch narrow tyre, 77 bhp, no climatronic, the mileage should be significantly more compared to SX4 ZXi which is 1200 kgs, 16 inch wide tyres, 102 bhp, with climatronics. But a SX4 Zxi gives around 12-13 kmpl in city condition with 90% AC, whereas, NHC Gxi, under the condition, leads by a mere 1-2 kms. In fact, SX4 Zxi technically, gives a better FE w.r.t the fuel guzzling factors of the car as mentioned.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Kapasi View Post
Hey, this is cool.
Is it possible to simulate airbags as well somehow? Because my Verna doesn't have any and I'd like some.
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Old 16th December 2007, 11:13   #41
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Originally Posted by diabloo View Post
NHC does this figures at 2700RPM, while SX4 does it at 4200RPM. Most drivers drive between 2000~3000RPM & this is where NHC scores.

Nope. Its you who have been denied favors from Honda. And so now you are NHC basher.
The explanation to that is the inherent difference between SOHC and DOHC engine technology. SOHC has better low-end power, DOHC has better high-end power and overall maximum power. NHC uses a SOHC engine whereas SX4 does with a DOHC.

Maximum torque
12.8 (kg-m/rpm) at 2700 RPM
14.5 (Kg-m/rpm) at 4500 RPM

My friend, at 2700-3000 RPM, SX4 will be producing 12-13 kg-m/rpm (as output is not linear to RPM) and that is a good reading for a DOHC.

Quote:
Originally Posted by diabloo View Post
I again tell everybody. NHC is a car for comfort, ease of driving, reliability, less noise in car. Its a passenger car.
So is SX4.

Quote:
Originally Posted by diabloo View Post
It is not a car for racing. In case if you race, it lose by just 1 second. (But, if you are performance oriented, go for NHC VTEC & beat by a good 2~3 seconds).
yes, agree, NHC (non Vtec) is not for racing and simply is a means of transport from point A to B. Even if you race, how can you imagine you will lose by just a second? Are you nuts? Where does the horses and the high end torque come to play in a straight line drag race? By the time you crossed the finishing line, SX4 would have already be breaking a champagne bottle . Yes, with OHC VTEC, its a marvelous invention and would break the bottle instead, though the margin is very close. And everyone will agree.

Quote:
Originally Posted by diabloo View Post
OHC too was phased out some time in history - 5 years back to be precise. Are any OHC owners cribbing about non-available of parts from Honda?
Let the owners of OHC be the judge of that. If not cribbing, they are certainly rubbing their head with the unusual high cost they had to bear for spare parts!

Quote:
Originally Posted by diabloo View Post
iTNerd, you have worked out that SX4 has better FE than NHC. So working like you, I have proved that NHC has ABS too.
Get your fact straight! If you read closely, I never said SX4 gives better FE than NHC. If you could not understand as simple as that, it shows how knowledgeable you are.

"In fact, SX4 Zxi technically, gives a better FE w.r.t the fuel guzzling factors (1200 kgs, 16 inch wide tyres, 102 bhp, with climatronics) of the car as mentioned."



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Last edited by DCEite : 16th December 2007 at 11:45.
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Old 16th December 2007, 11:13   #42
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Originally Posted by CrAzY dRiVeR View Post
Congrats on the NHC!
I guess that would be directed at me, as i couldn't find anyone else posting like that.
Can i ask you sir, what was the sarcastic statement i made? If any statement i have made is wrong, point it out. I'll be happy to correct myself.

Honda- As a manufacturer has got a big place here in team-bhp. The most famous cars here includes the OHC Vtec, Civic, Accord and the likes.
However, in the case of City, opinions differ, and that is with good reason. So, its not Honda that is questioned, Its NHC. As for me, I still believe its an overpriced product without features of its class. And i still dont see any valid comments here proving otherwise.

Power- NHC 77bhp, SX4 102 bhp
Torque- NHC- 12.8 kgm, SX4 14.5 kgm.
0-100 figures- NHC 13.11s, SX4 12.10s


SX4 is ahead, be it torque or power. NHC will be better in FE though!

Sir, It was not directed at you. I have the highest respect for your views and opinions .. Sorry if you misunderstood.
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Old 16th December 2007, 11:15   #43
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Originally Posted by hellspawn View Post
when somebody says"the petrol car has diesel-like torque",it means that the petrol engine produces max torque low down in the rpm band rather than high up.the nhc produces max torque at 2700rpm while the sx4 does it at 4200rpm.so you tell me which car will have better drivability.
I dind't expect this from a senior-BHPian. Boss the City VTEC deliver max torque at 4800 RPM. So does it mean the VTEC is not fun to drive when compared to the i-DSI. You gotta be kidding. Please read the max torque values as well. The max torque of SX4/VTEC are on the higher side than the i-DSI. FYI the SX4 has a flat torqur curve so I bet the SX4 deliver more torque at 2700 RPMs than the i-DSI.

I am sorry I have to get involved in this quarrel but I had to correct the facts. I am sorry to the thread starter that no one has really helped you and the purpose of this thread seem wasted. I am outta this thread.
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Old 16th December 2007, 11:18   #44
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I fail to understand - what is the 'Status Symbol' in owning a 8 lakh car?
Ask that to hrman and you will get a better answer because, birds of a feather flock together.
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Old 16th December 2007, 11:21   #45
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I am a very happy sx4 owner,in the beginning i too was confused which car to buy but believe me i am really happy i made the right choice.Sx4 is a car built on an suv platform so it can be taken for offroading only thing its not 4wd .Everyone complained of it being too tall ,i agree that the comfort has reduced because of that but then being tall has its own advantages,you get a better road visibility,when it comes to highways sx4 rules.The best part is the pickup of sx4,the engine is a bit noisy but for people like me will like that noise its almost like a sports car noise.Sx4 may look difficult to drive but believe me after getting used to it its fun to drive.The next best thing of sx4 is its maruti,to be honest before buying sx4 i was a toyota lover and always considered maruti as a bad company,but after joining the maruti family started liking it not because of the my car syndrome but because of its services after all its got 7yrs continuous customer satisfaction awards.Toyota is always there in my heart,anyway back to topic the next major factor why people do not like sx4 is the interiors,well come on people every car company in the world will want profit,why don't we remember that sx4 top model with features more than city gxi and a few more than vtec costs the same as the city exi,how can you expect a car company to give everything perfect unless they go in loss it has given many features and so has reduced interior quality. I being an sx4 owner don't think its interiors are that bad ,agree it doesn't give the 8lac feeling,but honda city exi which is the same price also does not give that feeling.Everyone has different opinions on cars i just shared my opinion,it is upto the person buying to choose which car suits his lifestyle.
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