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View Poll Results: If I had to buy one of these two sedans today I will put my money on,
Swift DZire 76 23.46%
Tata Manza 248 76.54%
Voters: 324. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 24th January 2010, 21:31   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vinaydas View Post
dzire any day.
the 6 month + waiting period it self answers the question.

Waiting peroid of 6 months + is passe, the display board in showroom says 2-2.5 months. When I booked in Nov, the waiting period written on my application was 3-3.5 months.
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Old 25th January 2010, 00:07   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aaggoswami View Post
Dzire is a better overall car than Manza.

1) Performance : I think Manza is a bigger car with not so good power. Dzire is lively as compared to Manza.

2) FE : Dzire holds and edge.

3) A.S.S : Dzire wins hands down. One of the best network.

4) Not sure about this, but Vista was to be modified to achieve 3 or 4 star rating in Euro NCAP. Swift has 4 stars. Dzire has and edge here also.

5) Handling : Based on Swift, Dzire is better to drive than manza.

6) Petrol engine. Though the new K12M is not in league of the G13 ( which is legendary IMHO ), this motor is still better than the motor tata offers ( petrol ).

Where Manza scores is space, and lots of it. No other significant advantage over Dzire.
1)You think? Please post based on facts. Manza has the 86 BHP VGT engine while dzire has the same old 75 BHP. Manza has the better engine here, and weight is not too different either

2)Agree on the FE part though the diff is approx 1 km/l only

3)Definitely true, Maruti's *** is the best

4) Swift has a 4 star rating because it is offered with six airbags there. Safety wise id say both are fairly similar( ie if we consider both with two airbags and ABS)

5)Dzire has a softer rear suspension and handling is worse than the swift. Havent driven the manza so cant say but dzire probably has a slight edge

6)Tata offers the 90 BHP 1.4 petrol. Apart from FE, why is this inferior to the K12M?

Yes the manza has substantially more space than the dzire. Dzire has the same rear space as the swift
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Old 25th January 2010, 01:54   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vigsom View Post
History says Tata cars fetch little cash when sold;and are anyway not too easy to maintain especially after two years.

Yes,I have loved the Indigo and now love the Manza for sheer comfort but I would vote for teh DZire as the better overall car.The rear seat in the DZire is not at all bad - have done many journeys and in fact rate it way better than the ANHC also
History also has Tata cars built on desi engines and only diesel vehicles in the market. Considering both companies use FIAT engines, I don;t see much difference in resale values.

Quote:
Originally Posted by aargee View Post
IMHO, Manza (or any Tata product) comes only with attractive pricing & looks, the quality will never be equivalent to its competitors. So Dzire wins my vote
If the competitor was Honda City, I would completely agree with you but you are comparing Manza to DZire for god sake. It ain't no benchmark of quality either. And how can we judge Manza on the basis of old Indigo.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vinaydas View Post
dzire any day.
the 6 month + waiting period it self answers the question.
A Marketing gimmick. Waiting period is a result of controlled production to ensure high demand or may be due to lack of parts supplied by FIAT. Either way, with full throttle production, DZire would never have such booking period. In fact our neighbourhood dealer has SZire in stock at present just in case anyone here is interested.

Quote:
Originally Posted by aaggoswami View Post
Dzire is a better overall car than Manza.

1) Performance : I think Manza is a bigger car with not so good power. Dzire is lively as compared to Manza.

Manza has 90bhp power compared to 75bhp on DZire. If Manza power is not good, Dzire's power would be worse not better.

2) FE : Dzire holds and edge.

Minor difference but yes I agree you have a point here.

3) A.S.S : Dzire wins hands down. One of the best network.

Hmm... I think this depends from dealer to dealer, but Maruti could claim upper hand here.

4) Not sure about this, but Vista was to be modified to achieve 3 or 4 star rating in Euro NCAP. Swift has 4 stars. Dzire has and edge here also.

Hatchback NCAP ratings can never be used as mark for sedan counterparts. But using your rule, Nano has 4 star NCAP rating. If tested, Manza would atleast match its little sister.

5) Handling : Based on Swift, Dzire is better to drive than manza.

Manza handles lot better than swift having much better integrated boot. It is known fact that Dzire boot overhang makes its handling rather poor.

6) Petrol engine. Though the new K12M is not in league of the G13 ( which is legendary IMHO ), this motor is still better than the motor tata offers ( petrol ).

At present, Tata offers FIAT FIRE engine in Manza which also does duty in Palio, Punto, and Linea which is tried and tested. Further, you seem to be ill-informed here since Dzire does not use K12M Engine.

Where Manza scores is space, and lots of it. No other significant advantage over Dzire.

What about the feature list ? Comfort ? Design ?


Shouldn't this thread be in What Car section???
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Old 25th January 2010, 07:14   #19
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The Manza anyday,
SCH sit inside both cars and see the quality for youself. I don't see any major significant improvement over the Manza's quality in a D'zire. To be fair the Swift/Dzire has its fair share of complaints regarding being a rattle box especially in the high mileage cars.
The Manza is definitely more VFM, better interiors, less uglier any day, far more spacious, rides better especially on bad roads.
The only slight advantage I can see in a Dzire is its handling but you would severely sacrifice on ride quality vis a vis the Manza.
Also you can drive the better car ready of the showroom rather than wait for months.
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Old 25th January 2010, 08:46   #20
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Default Real Tough call, but its Dzire for me.

My Dzire Advantage
After sales is the best by Maruti.(this counts very much to me)
Dzire Interior plastics and upholstery much better than Manza.
I like the rear of Dzire more than manza
fuel efficiency of 1.2 k engine

My Manza Advantage
Huge space, very relaxing back seat comfort.
Tech goodies like bluetooth(2nd version)and all, in lower versions also.
Good looking exterior especially in noir grey color, the car looks royal.
effortless saffire engine.
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Old 25th January 2010, 08:50   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by akhilesh51 View Post
History also has Tata cars built on desi engines and only diesel vehicles in the market. Considering both companies use FIAT engines, I don;t see much difference in resale values.

Resale value depends on more than just the common engine ! There is no way a Manza can even dream about having similar resale to that of the Dzire. Expect a 50k difference atleast.

If the competitor was Honda City, I would completely agree with you but you are comparing Manza to DZire for god sake. It ain't no benchmark of quality either. And how can we judge Manza on the basis of old Indigo.

All the mags, websites clearly put Dzire as the benchmark for quality and in general in the "VFM sedan" segment.

A Marketing gimmick. Waiting period is a result of controlled production to ensure high demand or may be due to lack of parts supplied by FIAT. Either way, with full throttle production, Dzire would never have such booking period. In fact our neighbourhood dealer has Dzire in stock at present just in case anyone here is interested.

To the best of my knowledge, Maruti manufacturing plants run at full possible capacity. A controlled production will only mean huge losses to a company. Btw, no means do they manufacture less ! Its just that the demand is too high. Just pick any Autocar mag and see the number of Dzire's sold in any month compared to other.


Shouldn't this thread be in What Car section???
I am biased since I own a Dzire But I own it for the reasons i mentioned !
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Old 25th January 2010, 10:15   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vinaydas View Post
dzire any day.
the 6 month + waiting period it self answers the question.
There is a demand but 6 months waiting period is just a marketing gimmick to hide their manufacturing inefficiency.

Only product I can relate more waiting period vs huge customer demand is the Toyota Fortuner. Toyota never expected this kind of customer demand for the product of Fortuner class. But it shows their inefficiency in market research/forecasting prcocedures.

For me it is Manza for its sheer VFM factor, space and looks (subjective)

Swift is good but Dezire - big no!! :-)

Last edited by Latheesh : 25th January 2010 at 10:18.
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Old 25th January 2010, 10:43   #23
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The thread starter has asked a question which needs to be qualified. I mean he needed to be more specific as to what quality is "better" FE, handling, interiors etc. Which clould then be debated.

IMO a general querry like this would be answered by the car buying people and sales figures will answer this question. a few more months will tell.
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Old 25th January 2010, 10:47   #24
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This thread needs to be in the what car section?

From the test drives here are my observations.

Dzire

+
Maruti Brand with Wide network of ***
Efficient engines
Handles ok for a sedan

-
Ride quality not so good
Interiors not to my liking
Boot looks out of place
Skinny tyres on the Lxi, Vxi, Ldi and Vdi models
Long waiting periods
Suspect of competency of ***

Manza

+
Loads and loads of space
Features
Boot Space
Comfort both at the front and the rear seats
Nice ride quality


-
Average handling due to softer suspension
plastics quality and a few niggles here and there
Not so good *** (again depends on the personal relationship with the SA)

Based on these observations, I would recommend Manza, its a much better car compared to Dzire. Its superb VFM in the segment, competition are no where near to the Manza on VFM
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Old 25th January 2010, 11:09   #25
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Swift looks good, but Dezire? IMHO, Dezire is one of the ugliest cars currently in production.

Manza have proven engines, and oodles of rear leg room, back seat comfort and features - and any day, looks better than DZire.
The quality of parts and Tata A$$ are much better than old days - personally, I will choose Manza over DZire any day.
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Old 25th January 2010, 11:19   #26
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Manza is leagues ahead compared to Dzire - in terms of power, space and the features available. TASS is something people have complained about in the past, but it is not an issue anymore and this comes from my own experience of having owned a Vista.
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Old 25th January 2010, 11:25   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by radiokidb View Post
1)You think? Please post based on facts. Manza has the 86 BHP VGT engine while dzire has the same old 75 BHP. Manza has the better engine here, and weight is not too different either

4) Swift has a 4 star rating because it is offered with six airbags there. Safety wise id say both are fairly similar( ie if we consider both with two airbags and ABS)

6)Tata offers the 90 BHP 1.4 petrol. Apart from FE, why is this inferior to the K12M?

Yes the manza has substantially more space than the dzire. Dzire has the same rear space as the swift
Quote:
Originally Posted by akhilesh51 View Post
1) Manza has 90bhp power compared to 75bhp on DZire. If Manza power is not good, Dzire's power would be worse not better.

1) From what I have read, Manza is slower than Dzire. Manza has additional weight and power, but is tuned for higher FE. So Dzire has an edge here.
1.6 accent tornado had 100+ bhp, Baleno had 96 bhp. Both were not too apart when it came to weight, but still baleno was quicker.
Accent has 95 bhp, Swift with G13 had 87 bhp. Weight difference was around 30 kgs so Accent had higher power to weight ratio, but still Swift was quicker and had higher top speed.
So its not matter of only BHP.

4) Would still give Dzire an edge here. Its based on a hatch that was designed keeping in mind a wider market base and different markets. I would give equal rating to both on this front if Vista had appeared in Euro NCAP rating.
But I agree on another part. These rating wont help much when you crash head on with HCV.

6) Again refer to Ponit 1. K12M is modern, much lighter. The A-star unit weight in at 47 kg dry. So K12M is lighter and is a livelier unit than Tata. K12M is one of the best motor below 1.5 ltr units offered in our country.


Quote:
Originally Posted by akhilesh51 View Post

7) Hatchback NCAP ratings can never be used as mark for sedan counterparts. But using your rule, Nano has 4 star NCAP rating. If tested, Manza would atleast match its little sister.

8) Manza handles lot better than swift having much better integrated boot. It is known fact that Dzire boot overhang makes its handling rather poor.

9) What about the feature list ? Comfort ? Design ?
7) Keep nano aside. Its not a full fledged test and was done after certain modifications were done in the body.
I would give Manza equal safety if Vista undergoes Euro NCAP test.

8) Manza is more tuned towards comfort, and the donor car Vista is not known for handling either. Both have long overhangs. Overall, Swift is more agile and better handler IMO.

9) I was just talking about petrol engine.
If it comes to design, both are shortcuts. Remember cars like Baleno, Lancer, G1HC ? They were good designs.
Feature list, Manza wins, but not by much. I am too dry to think of features BTW.
Comfort, manza wins. But not a very big edge overall.
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Old 25th January 2010, 11:37   #28
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Yes. Being a TATA owner (and a Maruti owner), I can say that the *** is not that bad as people think. Of course, not anywhere near Maruti ***, but it should not be a deterrent. It is 'OK' types. They do take their time out to solve your problems these days.

Resale should not be a problem if you are planning to keep the car for 4 to 5 years. The difference would be negligible.

Plastic quality is not that great in either of the cars. Both have bad quality plastics here and there.

Handling may be better in DZire (Assumption because I haven't driven Manza.)

Looks (subjective). I feel Manza is better.

Overall feature list: Manza is way ahead.

Safety features: Both are equally good.

If I was looking for a comfortable 'proper' sedan, I'd have gone for the Manza. Just personal preference it is!
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Old 25th January 2010, 12:15   #29
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Please don't fall prey to the "false VFM" of the Dzire. It is not a well thought out car in terms of safety and dynamics. Everything about it is "naam ke vaste". If you want resale value , sure . But then I believe you buy a car to own it and not for the resale value.
If it's a petrol, the manza is a brilliant drive (my own 'long TD' experience). The Swift engine is an old one and very very overrated.

Manza is a better engineered car any day. Features and safety wise the
Aura+ is an excellent package. The seating and space will put a smile on your face. The (BHPians) Maruti fans hang on to every negative from GTO's reviews - though it is probably the best review you will come across.

TD both the cars, you are going to drive it.Then make your decision.Tata have had to work hard even to better the market perceptions even with such a fantastic product.There's 25 lakh kms gone into testing the Manza and that makes it a well-finished product. Enough said.all the best for whichever car you go on to buy.
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Old 25th January 2010, 12:25   #30
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I would rate Manza as a more all round and VFM product any day. It is a different matter that MUL is a better brand than Tata for a car though - and this translates into better availability of spares, better service and hence better resale. But as a car, the Manza is better looking, bigger, more powerful and is a better all round package, though Desire may be more fun to drive.
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