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Old 5th July 2011, 18:37   #406
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Default Re: Choosing a Spacious Diesel Sedan upto 12L

Quote:
Originally Posted by AutoIndian View Post
I have taken a long TD of the Verna SX CRDi (25kms approx) & have also driven a friend's Vento TDi Highline (but within the office premises, not going beyond 3rd gear), so can't really compare the two. As said earlier, the Vento produces the peak torque (of 250Nm) in the rpm band of 1500-2500, whereas the Verna produces the peak torque (of 265Nm) in the rpm band of 1900-2750. However 90% of the peak toruqe (whis comes to 238Nm) is produced @ 1500 rpm which is decent enough to pull the car effortlessly in low revs. On my TD of Verna I had 5 adults & 1 kid & AC ON @ Blower speed 3 & the car pulled without any fuss, the second gear was very impressive. The point I want to make here is that I could not feel any kind of turbo lag & the accelerator was responsive, giving you enough thrust to pull ahead when required. So I would definitely recommend you to TD the Verna before making a final decision.
It's really surprising how wildly the TD impressions vary from person to person. I guess it depends on the person's driving background and what they are used to. Taking my own example, I drive an 800cc Alto. So no matter which 1.6L diesel car I try, I'd find it to be quite responsive. Fortunately, the first 1.6L diesel car I tried was a Vento so I got a good baseline and now know what to expect.

It also depends on the person's expectations while going in for TD. I find Optra Magnum to have turbo lag in lower gears whereas various other folks don't. The turbo lag is there but I find it to be excessive due to my expectations from Optra being quite high.

I am not sure what is the origin of your impressions about Verna. That's why I trust folks who have considerable experience with various cars and can really do an honest comparison, like GTO, Rehaan and other official TBHP reviewers.
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Old 5th July 2011, 18:52   #407
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Default Re: Choosing a Spacious Diesel Sedan upto 12L

@ Bansal - If you would prefer to have a car released recently, you can definitely choose between the Verna and the Vento. Between the Verna and the Vento I would opt for Vento. Yes, the Verna comes with a lot of features, but these would be ancillary to what we need everyday. The Vento should last you for a long time, with good stability at high speeds and a very nice spread of Torque. The Verna on the other hand, as also mentioned in the review, tends to be a little less stabile at higher speeds. Also, Vento would age better as a car. Though Hyundai has improved tremendously from its previous image of rattles etc.. Most review give a single opinion on the ride quality and handling of Vento. In this aspect, opinions have been varied for the Verna.

I hope this helps.

Last edited by visweshkalambur : 5th July 2011 at 18:55.
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Old 5th July 2011, 19:32   #408
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Default Re: Choosing a Spacious Diesel Sedan upto 12L

Quote:
Originally Posted by bansal98 View Post
It's really surprising how wildly the TD impressions vary from person to person. I guess it depends on the person's driving background and what they are used to.
TD impressions do vary a lot from person to person & these are built upon in comparison to what a person is used to. I am currently driving a Naturally Aspirated (Non-Turbo) Indica, one of the most sluggish cars in the market. However when I went for the TD of Verna I had already made up my mind on what to expect (Thanks to numerous ownership reports of the previous generation Verna available here on TBHP). The engine & transmission exceeded my expectations, the major disappointment being the rear seat & the claustrophobic feeling especially in the rear.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bansal98 View Post
I am not sure what is the origin of your impressions about Verna. That's why I trust folks who have considerable experience with various cars and can really do an honest comparison, like GTO, Rehaan and other official TBHP reviewers.
The names you have listed (& not listed) are indeed very knowledgeable & trustworthy. However if you make your decision purely based on these reviews (without you actually taking a test drive, getting a feel of the car), then you may run the risk of repenting later. This is not to discourage you, but just to make you aware of the fact that requirements vary from person to person. What is very good & useful for one, could not be the same for the other. Hence first list down your exact requirements, set your expectations & then see to it which of the cars meet the most of them. Go for that car, as simple as that.
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Old 5th July 2011, 20:34   #409
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Default Re: Choosing a Spacious Diesel Sedan upto 12L

Quote:
Originally Posted by AutoIndian View Post
As said earlier, the Vento produces the peak torque (of 250Nm) in the rpm band of 1500-2500, whereas the Verna produces the peak torque (of 265Nm) in the rpm band of 1900-2750. However 90% of the peak toruqe (whis comes to 238Nm) is produced @ 1500 rpm which is decent enough to pull the car effortlessly in low revs.
I dont trust these figures produced by OEM. Trust me be it a Vento, be it a Verna you will get considerably less torque in case you mount the engine on Dyno. What I trust is 0-100 and in gear acceleration.
0-100 gives you an idea about its top end.
Where as the in gear acceleration gives you an idea about lag and gearing. Mainly Midrange.

And most of all it is the TD that has to make the final call.
Figo diesel produces less power and torque than PoloD. But the difference in real life feel is huge.
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Old 6th July 2011, 01:29   #410
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Thumbs up Re: Choosing a Spacious Diesel Sedan upto 12L

Quote:
Originally Posted by Torquedo View Post
2) Honda the so called segment leader with it's global product is selling less in numbers to not so hot selling Optra.
And how many of them are petrol Optras?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Torquedo View Post
3) The tech specs (slightly higher BHP on the Civic but in terms or torque, the Optra beats the Civic blue and black) are comparable but the price difference is huge.
Blue and black?? What are we talking about?
Civic = 17.5 Kg-m = 171.616 Nm @4300RPM
Optra (petrol) = 148 Nm
Unless you are comparing torque of Diesel Optra with Petrol Civic, which again is grossely unfair.

Moreover I feel Optra petrol should be compared with Honda City which is its natural competitor.
  • Engine: City 1.5 ----- Optra 1.6
  • Wheelbase: City 2550 ----- Optra 2600
  • Max Power: City 118 PS ----- Optra 104 PS
  • Max Torque: City 146/4800 ----- Optra 148/at what RPM??
  • Fuel Efficiency: City 16.7KMPL----- Optra 12.9KMPL
Internal Space
  • Boot Space: City 506 ltr----- Optra 405 ltr
  • Max Rear Legroom: City 93 cms----- Optra 91 cms
  • Min Rear Legroom: City 63 cms----- Optra 69 cms
  • Rear Headroom: City 95 cms----- Optra 91 cms
  • Rear Seat Width: City 135 cms----- Optra 135.5 cms
Quote:
Originally Posted by Torquedo View Post
1)Optra is not a dud, it sells more than the ICONIC GLOBAL HONDA CIVIC, the only thing is there is hoopla created around it. (reasons galore, if we start discussing it might run into pages).
No one is claiming Optra is dud. All I am saying it is unfair to compare Optra with Civic. It should be compared with Honda City.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Torquedo View Post
On the posting the same message on multiple forums part, I guess he might have done it for the sake of others, there are many a people around who might not go through this thread (no offences here Poitive ) but might look at the other threads.
That way we should just have a single thread, so that no one misses out on anything. Or each message should be published on every single thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by visweshkalambur View Post
@ Rock 'n' rollz - Just because the two cars are at the different price point, it does nt mean that they are not in the same platform for comparioson. As Torquedo has mentioned, look at the size of the car, interior space, engine block, power and you would see that both fit into the same bucket. I do not see any lack of logic to have compared the Optra and the Civic.
Sorry but I still don't understand the logic.

As I mentioned earlier, Optra Petrol fits more into Honda City's bucket than that of Civic's. And in a month, Honda City sells 10 times total no. of Optras sold (Diesels included).

Last edited by Rock 'n' rollz : 6th July 2011 at 01:39.
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Old 6th July 2011, 02:00   #411
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Default Re: Choosing a Spacious Diesel Sedan upto 12L

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rock 'n' rollz View Post
I am sorry but I failed to understand the logic behind comparing sales figures of Optra to that of Civic? Both cars belong to different segments. Civic would cost 4-5 lacs more than an Optra.
Rock, Optra and Civic

Though this has been discussed a bit before, would like to add a point or two. When we talk about segments, we talk about comparable cars. To divide cars into segments we draw lines across grey areas. Price is often used as a criteria for this, as a lot of car purchases (atleast in India), start with a price band in mind. So to that extent, Rock's concern is understandable.

However, if we go to other aspects (engine power, capacity, wheel base etc), they surely are comparable. On the price front, a good perspective on this comes from this post (Sedans Under Rs. 12 Lacs - A Quantitative Ranking) , which talks about how when the Civic was introduced at about 12L, when the other cars in the 10-12L (OTR Bangalore) were Optra, Corolla, Octavia, Elantra, Cedia and how it went from there.

This is what makes the Optra such wonderful VFM.

Another reason which was probably missed out - One of the reasons this thread started was to check on if the Optra is going to get discontinued (the title was changed at about pg15-16). Comparing to the Civic came up before too, to get a good perspective on the continuity of Optra.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bansal98 View Post
It's really surprising how wildly the TD impressions vary from person to person.
...........................................

I am not sure what is the origin of your impressions about Verna. That's why I trust folks who have considerable experience with various cars and can really do an honest comparison, like GTO, Rehaan and other official TBHP reviewers.
Test Drives et all

Not sure if you are following the Driven! thread. Some discussion between rock22 and me should be a worthwhile read. It also mentions your experience. They start here and are upto #57

It ends with this:
Quote:
My humble suggestion to you and others would be to NOT rule or decide cars based on others' TD (or even other experiences). People experience cars differently. A lot of people complain of turbolag, but it rarely bothers me. On the Spacious Diesel Sedans thread, a member (bansal) was so unhappy with the turbolag of the Optra that he has decided against it, whereas SLK who recently bought it was totally at ease with it. The Verna too is supposed to have it, when I hardly felt it. I think it is to do with when we change gears. Like many, I never look at the meters to change them. For me it comes from the feel and sound of the car.

There are many happy and proud owners of the Verna too. Check the "bringing home the Fluidic" thread.

Even with regards to the Vento, the reviews say that it has ample headroom, where as I could not even sit straight in the rear seat with my 6'. I even tried out another (IPL edition) Vento after seeing those videos posted my a member, but it was the same for me.

So I'll just repeat - use others' experiences to guide you to an extent. To keep in mind what you would like to check in the few minutes of a TD, but do not base your decision on what others experienced in a TD.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AutoIndian View Post
TD impressions do vary a lot from person to person
The value provided by official reviews and individual test drives is very different. This topic probably deserves a thread in itself, but let me state briefly - Official reviews are done by acknowledged experts and cover far more detail, as they get ample time with the car and they are in a good position to judge things. It is (as it should be) about how the car will be for others - for typical drivers/various types of drivers. TDs by members are usually more about personal experiences over a short period of time.

Reviews have an obvious value. The value of Test drives comes from knowing experiences of various people. About how some issues mentioned in a review may or may not have relevance to various users. (have more thoughts, but talking about all of it will take it a bit too off-topic, so will restrict).

Also bear in mind that TD's are done on cars which may not be well maintained (even the tyre pressure being incorrect could change the experience significantly).

Quote:
Originally Posted by oxyzen View Post
What I trust is 0-100 and in gear acceleration.
0-100 gives you an idea about its top end.
Where as the in gear acceleration gives you an idea about lag and gearing. Mainly Midrange.
In Gear Acceleration

I am not too much of a believer in the in-gear acceleration figures (as stated in, say ACI). These figures would depend a lot on the gear ratios. Some cars' gear ratios may be better suited for a 20-80 in third (as ACI tests) and some may do it better in second or maybe even with a gear change.

To illustrate this point ACI figures of 20-80kmph in third:
Manza: 13.73
Cruze : 13.83

(Wonder if this could be a typo from ACI. Cruze would just need to be in second gear for a 20-80kmph)

Statistics reveal only a part of the story. Read this somewhere - A man once drowned crossing a stream which had an average depth of 6"

Quote:
And most of all it is the TD that has to make the final call.
+1

Last edited by Poitive : 6th July 2011 at 02:14.
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Old 6th July 2011, 10:10   #412
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Default Re: Choosing a Spacious Diesel Sedan upto 12L

Quote:
Originally Posted by Poitive View Post
The value provided by official reviews and individual test drives is very different. This topic probably deserves a thread in itself, but let me state briefly - Official reviews are done by acknowledged experts and cover far more detail, as they get ample time with the car and they are in a good position to judge things. It is (as it should be) about how the car will be for others - for typical drivers/various types of drivers. TDs by members are usually more about personal experiences over a short period of time.

Reviews have an obvious value. The value of Test drives comes from knowing experiences of various people. About how some issues mentioned in a review may or may not have relevance to various users. (have more thoughts, but talking about all of it will take it a bit too off-topic, so will restrict).
The reason I made the point about trusting experienced reviewers is because of my experience with cameras. Photography is a serious hobby of mine and I used to own a digicam which was my only camera. And as we know, digicams have several limitations in terms of noise, shutter lag, lens choice etc. So I decided to upgrade to a DSLR and ended up buying a D80. I absolutely loved that camera. Coming from a digicam background, the DSLR was a revelation. It could do things which my digicam could only dream of.

Then a funny thing happened. As my skills improved, I wanted to push the camera further but it could only go so far. It had hit its limit. So I ended up selling it and bought a D7000. I have never felt constrained in any way since then.

Coming back to cars, I know I'd love Verna, Vento, Fiesta, and City etc because these are all worlds ahead of my Alto. But what happens when I become experienced and want to push the car to perform at a higher level. That's what matters to me 'cause it's a decision which cannot be easily reversed. I want my car to grow with me. And these are the things which a TD cannot tell you. A TD might impress you for now but it's not a guarantee of future satisfaction. This is where experienced reviewers come in. If they say there is turbo lag, even though we may not feel it now, I can guarantee you that we'll start feeling it too after sometime. What happens after the honeymoon phase is over is more important than those initial wow moments.

Looking at all the things so far, I find Vento to be the best bet for me.
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Old 6th July 2011, 11:05   #413
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Default Re: Choosing a Spacious Diesel Sedan upto 12L

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rock 'n' rollz
And how many of them are petrol Optras?



Civic = 17.5 Kg-m = 171.616 Nm @4300RPM
Optra (petrol) = 148 Nm
Unless you are comparing torque of Diesel Optra with Petrol Civic, which again is grossely unfair.

Moreover I feel Optra petrol should be compared with Honda City which is its natural competitor.
  • Engine: City 1.5 ----- Optra 1.6
  • Wheelbase: City 2550 ----- Optra 2600
  • Max Power: City 118 PS ----- Optra 104 PS
  • Max Torque: City 146/4800 ----- Optra 148/at what RPM??
  • Fuel Efficiency: City 16.7KMPL----- Optra 12.9KMPL
Internal Space
  • Boot Space: City 506 ltr----- Optra 405 ltr
  • Max Rear Legroom: City 93 cms----- Optra 91 cms
  • Min Rear Legroom: City 63 cms----- Optra 69 cms
  • Rear Headroom: City 95 cms----- Optra 91 cms
  • Rear Seat Width: City 135 cms----- Optra 135.5 cms
That way we should just have a single thread, so that no one misses out on anything. Or each message should be published on every single thread.

I must admit, you are pretty good with your "Quant"

I reiterate my statements on the Optra VS Civic comparison, the fact is on the parameters mentioned below, the Optra wins hands down & when Viswesh stated this (Optra and Civic comparison) is was in terms of Volume sold -

1) Pricing
2) Performance

On the one thread suggestion, seems pretty good, and the single post on the all the threads even better, please recommend the same to the MODS, you might have a business proposition over there, HATS OFF.
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Old 6th July 2011, 12:50   #414
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Default Re: Choosing a Spacious Diesel Sedan upto 12L

Quote:
Originally Posted by Poitive View Post
In Gear Acceleration

I am not too much of a believer in the in-gear acceleration figures (as stated in, say ACI). These figures would depend a lot on the gear ratios. Some cars' gear ratios may be better suited for a 20-80 in third (as ACI tests) and some may do it better in second or maybe even with a gear change.

To illustrate this point ACI figures of 20-80kmph in third:
Manza: 13.73
Cruze : 13.83

(Wonder if this could be a typo from ACI. Cruze would just need to be in second gear for a 20-80kmph)

Statistics reveal only a part of the story. Read this somewhere - A man once drowned crossing a stream which had an average depth of 6"

+1
Im not sure what you're trying to say here Poitive. In gear acceleration figures are a key indicator of how the car would be in city driving conditions. In the city it happens quite often that you are in third gear and need to slow down and then accelerate again, or you are in second gear and need to accelerate after a turn/speedbreaker, etc. So 20-80 in third is a reasonably representative statistic. And especially for diesel sedans it gives you a really good idea of how the turbo lag is.

Of course all cars would do better doing a 20-80 in second gear. But you cant drive in second gear all day can you? You have to drive in higher gears for fuel economy and you cant keep shifting up and down every few seconds. The manufacturer should choose the right gear ratios and tune the engine appropriately so that gear changes are minimized and fuel economy is improved.

The figures you have posted, ie Manza: 13.73 and Cruze : 13.83 show just how much of turbo lag the Cruze has. With 150 ps on tap it performs slightly worse than the comparatively puny 90 ps of the Manza. For that matter even the Manza has a fair bit of turbo lag. A good example of a car that does not have much lag is the Vento, it has a time of ~10.5 seconds. The Fiesta diesel should be somewhat similar
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Old 6th July 2011, 20:46   #415
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Default Re: Choosing a Spacious Diesel Sedan upto 12L

Quote:
Originally Posted by Torquedo View Post
I must admit, you are pretty good with your "Quant"
Thanks for your words of encouragement.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Torquedo View Post
I reiterate my statements on the Optra VS Civic comparison, the fact is on the parameters mentioned below, the Optra wins hands down & when Viswesh stated this (Optra and Civic comparison) is was in terms of Volume sold -

1) Pricing
2) Performance
Pricing??
City E MT 785530 (incl ABS, EBD, Airbags)
Optra 1.6 LS 769637 (No ABS, No EBD, No Airbags)

Performance??
Again City beats Petrol Optra.

0-60 KMPH
Honda City - 4.58 seconds
Optra 1.6L - 5.23 seconds

0-100 KMPH
Honda City - 10.28
Optra 1.6L - 12.49

Top Speed KPMH
Honda City - 190
Optra 1.6L - 175

Quarter Mile Rankings (Seconds)
Honda City - 18.03
Optra 1.6L - 18.9

In fact refer this post (Sedans Under Rs. 12 Lacs - A Quantitative Ranking) and see Honda City matching Optra Diesel's performance on every single parameter barring one or two.

Regarding volumes, how many petrol Optras were sold as against Civic?

Last edited by Rock 'n' rollz : 6th July 2011 at 20:51.
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Old 6th July 2011, 22:10   #416
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Default Re: Choosing a Spacious Diesel Sedan upto 12L

Optra belongs neither in the City category nor in the Civic category.
It has a category of its own. It includes Cedia, Elantra etc.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Poitive View Post
To illustrate this point ACI figures of 20-80kmph in third:
Manza: 13.73
Cruze : 13.83
It is not a Typo.
The stonking midrange of Cruze is overshadowed by the terrible lag and the tall gearing.

The numbers 20-80 and 40-100 is chosen is based on practicality.
Suppose you are cruising at 20 in 3rd gear, which you should. And then you want to accelerate without downshifting (which you normally do unless you are in sports mode), you will find the practicality of the timings.
As for the gear ratio, there is nothing better than max speed in each gear.

But seriously it is better to TD than compile all these numbers in excel and trying to figure out.
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Old 7th July 2011, 01:23   #417
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Default Keeping this thread relevant and maintaining quality

A Request

A lot of us are passionate about cars.
This passion can, at times make us a bit emotional about cars. Cars we own, we like, we hope to have, cars we aspire to have. This may lead us to say things in a manner which may hurt others a bit.

Let us be more tolerant of each other's expressions.
(As the old man says: Maturity is in knowing when not to talk.)

Let us keep the thread relevant to what it is about. About Choosing a Diesel Sedan upto 12L
(even if it is about less spacious sedans, it is not a big deal).

As many of us would know, the thread was initially about helping me choose a Spacious Diesel Sedan upto about 7-9L (see OP, if needed) and if the Optra was likely to be discontinued. Later (around page 15-16) was about anyone choosing a Diesel Sedan upto 12L.

Let the posts be about issues which help people in making such decisions. The odd thing may get a bit off topic, but let us try to keep that to a minimum and not spend more time, efforts and posts in getting more off topic. We do want the quality of this thread to be maintained and that it is one with constructive useful discussions.

It is GREAT to have different views -
We are on a forum with people from various backgrounds, needs, thoughts etc. This may give us different views and opinions. And it is GREAT that it is like that. (I shudder to imagine a world where only one view about everything existed. One view followed by a few billions "I Agree" statements!) It is OK to have different views. When we debate on issues, let us keep in mind if it helps the discussion constructively or not. Let us consider if the issue being debated has relevance to the central idea of the thread.

Now, I am not saying that ALL talk will be TOTALLY on topic. It is not our school principal's office. We do need some freedom, however, let us try and maintain focus, cordiality and mutual respect.

The tone of our messages goes a long way in us being cordial. Please choose words appropriately. And in case another person's post is not so, let us be mature and tolerant towards it, unless it gets beyond limits, in which case we could choose to report the post to the moderators.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

PS: I realize that I am no moderator on this forum. I had started this thread and hence try to keep it on course, to the extent I can. This was an overt effort to that effect. Hope you guys will support this.

PPS: This post may seem off topic, but I hope this eventually will keep the following posts more relevant, so that makes it on topic to quite an extent.

PPPS: I took pretty long between opening the reply page and actually posting my previous post (#411) and in the meantime there was a post by Rock 'n' Rollz, which I noticed much later.

(@Mods, am putting the other stuff I have to say in a different post, so that this post gets the attention it deserves and for ease of linking, if needed. In case you think it is not a good idea, please merge them.)

Last edited by Poitive : 7th July 2011 at 01:29. Reason: Added bit about reporting. Minor formatting. Added PPPS
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Old 7th July 2011, 12:52   #418
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Default Re: Choosing a Spacious Diesel Sedan upto 12L

@ Rock n rollz - I greatly appreciate your patience to gather data.

1. The context in which I had posted the data is from the history of this thread. There were concerns about the Optra not doing well. The moment I saw it to be doing better than the Civic, which is largely a car used to benchmark, i had posted this here. I had mentioned that I was pleasantly surprised.

2. This thread has been on Optra Diesel. There are hardly any Optra petrol selling now in the market and most of us are aware of it.

3. It is because I was talking about the diesel, i had compared it with the Civic and also mentioned in my post that the engine cubic capacity are comparable.

4. I had/ have no disregard or disrespect to the Civic.

5. I appreciate your passion for the Civic. No one here discredited the vehicle by any means.

6. I write this to establish the context and hopefully communicate that it was with no intention to malign Civic.

7. As Poitive had mentioned, I opine the same that in a lot of cases, it is unfair to bucket/ segment the cars based on price. Just because a Company prices their car expensive, it does nt put them into the next segment and vice versa.

8. In my humble opinion, Honda has historically in India, priced their products high, hoping to cache in on the brand value they have had here. It is a real test of waters for them now with increased competition and aggressiveness in the market now.

9. I have a question, i read in the newspapers that Honda was able to cut the price of City now, due to improved effeciency of their supply chain over the years. Do they mean to say that this would not be applicable to the Civic then? Is it applicable to only the City then? I do not understand.
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Old 7th July 2011, 23:19   #419
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Default Re: Choosing a Spacious Diesel Sedan upto 12L

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rock 'n' rollz View Post

As I mentioned earlier, Optra Petrol fits more into Honda City's bucket than that of Civic's. And in a month, Honda City sells 10 times total no. of Optras sold (Diesels included).
My inputs in context to the discussion here:

Optra and Civic are same segment but different generation. The decade old civic was more comparable to the slightly smaller Optra. Cruze replaces Optra in the west, and Cruze is clearly in Civic segment (at least it made the civic not sell).

Even the current generation City is a full size smaller than Optra, only the 1.6L engine being offered is not a criteria to judge it. Optra has seen its 1.8L days. The ride, the weight, the space all make it in a segment higher than the City.

Just for the record, I do own a City, though a ZX but it is very comparable to the current generation City except for bhp. The difference between Optra and City is considerable.
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Old 8th July 2011, 00:59   #420
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Default Re: Choosing a Spacious Diesel Sedan upto 12L

Let me take this opportunity to clarify a few things.

1. I do not own any of the Honda cars discussed here nor do I aspire to have one in near future.
2. My current ride is Fiat GP MJD E+ and I am weighing my options in diesel Sedan/MUV categories. Chevrolet Optra/Cruz and Innova are favorites at the moment. It also explains me frequenting this and other ownership threads by distinguished Optra/Cruz owners.
3. In my first post on this special thread I had said that Optra is a VFM car. So no quesiton of bashing a superb "diesel" car.

Now the post that started it all.
Quote:
Originally Posted by visweshkalambur View Post
Was reading through the June sales analysis... Optra lovers.. you would like to see the numbers.. Optra has been selling more than the Civic for the past four months.

Numbers given below in the order of March, April, May & June

Optra - 270 368 240 241 (Total 1119)
Civic - 379 253 190 175 (Total 971)

This surprised me, pleasantly though.
I am not a moderator but would like to bring to your notice the following rule.

12. Posts created in a "dotty" style cause inconvenience to other members. Please do not type using excessive dots / full stops (e.g. The...........new car launch.......is expected......in June........).

Anyway, looking at the numbers, if I may say so, Optra sold more than Civic for last three months. In March, Civic sold more than Optra. Also I might be wrong but recent increases in Petrol price might have put, many people's plans to buy Honda Civic, on hold. or may be people are expecting a price cut for Civic too.

I had read this post on a couple of threads including author's Optra ownership thread. I decided to ignore it as I thought Optra Vs Civic comparison was like Apples Vs Oranges (in their current avatars). When I read it here again, I thought it was high time I repond to it. For all the parameters that were considered while comparing Optra and Civic, it can be seen from my previous posts that Honda City matches Optra on each and every parameter. And I believe the claim was substantiated with enough numbers.

Comparing sales of Optra (predominently diesel) with Civic is as unfair as comparing Fiat Punto sales with Honda Jazz.

Anyway enough of comparisons.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Poitive View Post
Let us keep the thread relevant to what it is about. About Choosing a Diesel Sedan upto 12L (even if it is about less spacious sedans, it is not a big deal).
I am absolutely with you on this. We need to focus on comparing diesel cars and lets avoid comparing them with petrol cars.

So let me reiterate this. I have nothing against Optra or for that matter any other car. If I have hurt the thread starter, mods, optra owners, would be optra owners and fellow BHPians with my immature posts, I tender my whole-hearted apology. Hopefully now I know when not to talk and the time is NOW.

Last edited by Rock 'n' rollz : 8th July 2011 at 01:10.
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