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Old 31st July 2011, 17:39   #631
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Poitive,
I am not too keen on ICE setup. Am just interested in a single system that caters to music, Bluetooth, GPS and reverse sensor. With so much traffic in Bangalore I end up spending 2 hrs a day on road. Bluetooth helps me in productivity. Reason a single system is music auto cut off when call comes through.
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Old 31st July 2011, 18:01   #632
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Default Re: Choosing a Spacious Diesel Sedan upto 12L

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Originally Posted by prabhuferrari View Post
Poitive,
I am not too keen on ICE setup.
Prabhu,

Mate, when I said ICE, I meant In Car Entertainment, which could just be a very simple audio system.

Single DIN : The olden small size Head Unit size, one has been using for eons, right from our Maruti 800's onwards.
Double DIN : Double that size (height wise).

What I really am telling you is that the Optra seems to have a standard double din slot. Just confirm this and you have a world to choose from and not just Caska etc.

All major manufacturers make double-din systems, with varying capabilities.

As I said, just go through the ICE part of the forum. Put up a querry and you may get very good results. Do share your experience on this thread too, for the benefit of other's considering this car though.
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Old 31st July 2011, 18:21   #633
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Sure. I got your point. I have already started the research for various options including CASKA. Once I get an answer, will post it here. Coming back to diesel sedans, when I learnt driving the car my instructor told me
0 to 10 gear 1, upto 20 in gear 2, upto 30 in gear 3, upto 50 in gear 4 and more than that on gear 5. Now reading all these gear ratios talk make me wonder if my learning is wrong? What's the advantage of going in 80 in 3rd gear instead of 5th?
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Old 31st July 2011, 18:36   #634
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Default Re: Choosing a Spacious Diesel Sedan upto 12L

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Originally Posted by prabhuferrari View Post
Coming back to diesel sedans, when I learnt driving the car my instructor told me
0 to 10 gear 1, upto 20 in gear 2, upto 30 in gear 3, upto 50 in gear 4 and more than that on gear 5.
Mate, the instructor would have told you what was right for the car you were using then. It changes as per the car. (power delivery, gear ratios, turbo-lag, sporty vs FE based driving). This was discussed when we were discussing @bansal98's preferences wrt going over a hump etc. You could check on the link the the quote below:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Poitive View Post
Diesels often have taller gears. Also cars with a higher top end speed have taller gears (higher top end divided into 5 gears vs lower top end divided into 5 gears). Optra qualifies for both (especially when compared to the 800cc Alto).

Recommendation for anyone trying out a diesel for the first time in a car like the Optra:
Normally used gear - Gear to use in Optra Diesel
1 - 1
2 - 1
3 - 2
4 - 3
5 - 4
And use the 5th for the extra top end it has.
The above is not a precise formula or anything, but a rough guideline. This should take care of the going over humps too.

And we need not take the first as some very special gear. About the jerks one faces in it, it would take a bit of getting used to when to do it. I also often press the A pedal a bit when changing to a lower gear so that the engine and speeds match better (as per the gear) when the clutch is released.

Hope this helps

Edit: @Bansal, in case you haven't, you should TD the 'Fludic' Verna too. You may love how it drives.
Overall, once you get a 'feel' of the car, it will tell you when to change. I rarely, if ever look at the speedo to change gears.
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Old 31st July 2011, 18:49   #635
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Default Re: Choosing a Spacious Diesel Sedan upto 12L

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Mate, did the 2008 car have ABS and Airbags? That may be more important than ACC.
Oh yes, 2008 model has ABS and Airbags. I checked up another car just now, this one is White color, 63k on Odo, well maintained barring couple of parking-lot-pillar scratches which are quite common in apartments. Asking price is 6L.

One more car to check out and I will have to take a decision - first step being accepting the fact that in 2008 models there was no ACC. One of the reasons I rejected ANHC out right was it did not have ACC. When I am paying in excess of 11 lakhs I would like to have that feature.

The last car belongs to a friend's cousin - I will have the comfort of knowing the seller. Will get to check it out by tomorrow.

Out of the 2 cars I saw today one had Michelin Primacy 195/60/R15, in good condition. The other one had brand new rear tyres - Apollo Accelere 195/60/R15 and stock front tyres - Good Year 195/60/R15. Does this matter?
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Old 31st July 2011, 20:18   #636
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Default Re: Choosing a Spacious Diesel Sedan upto 12L

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Originally Posted by NoRules View Post
One of the reasons I rejected ANHC out right was it did not have ACC.
---------
Out of the 2 cars I saw today one had Michelin Primacy 195/60/R15, in good condition. The other one had brand new rear tyres - Apollo Accelere 195/60/R15 and stock front tyres - Good Year 195/60/R15. Does this matter?
Any particular reason to place so much emphasis on ACC, @NR?

From what I have read, Michelin Primacy are supposed to be good, but that should not be much of a deciding factor.

What would matter is the consistency of "facts" on mileage when checking out a used car:
- Milage
- Tyre wear
- Wear on pedals, gear shift, steering etc.

Dealers also get the service history, if it has been serviced from A$$.'

Edit: Presume you would be aware of this thread on used car prices: http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian...ml#post2450554

Last edited by Poitive : 31st July 2011 at 20:21.
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Old 31st July 2011, 20:43   #637
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Default Re: Choosing a Spacious Diesel Sedan upto 12L

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Originally Posted by Poitive View Post
Any particular reason to place so much emphasis on ACC, @NR?
Call it silly, call it fixation. For me, car is meant to be driven with 100% AC on and in my earlier cars - Zen and M800 - I had issues esp during winters when the car gets chilled even on 1 and then you need to adjust the heater to bring up the temp. On one particular trip with friends and family in a Qualis during winter I remember we had difficulty with manual AC.

After using the ACC in my Baleno I somehow am kind of fixated on this feature.

WRT ANHC or for that matter any new car, if I am paying money for top end model then I expect top end features too. And a new Optra ticks most of the boxes including ACC but then me trying for a pre-owned car instead of going for a new one is a different story altogether.
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Old 31st July 2011, 20:56   #638
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Default Re: Choosing a Spacious Diesel Sedan upto 12L

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Originally Posted by keyur View Post
First of all, that was not a comparison - it was a narration of events, and the comments were specific to the particular car owned by my friend - the post includes his independent reactions as well as mine.
Well it did look like a comparison of sorts to me. Whatever it was it appeared biased.

Quote:
Do I really need to convince my self - for what I need, the Optra suits me perfectly? If you feel that I am trying to convince myself and it makes you feel better, I will agree for your sake! Thanks for your valuable feedback!
Mate with all due respect first of all dont get pissed off because thats not going to take us anywhere. What you are writing here as TBHP member and owner of a car has a lot of impact on people who are following the thread. I for one seriously consider what the members have written. And to be exact I am considering the Vento very seriously. And all of a sudden reading your views creates a doubt if the car is that bad. Your post does appear exaggerated to me specially when you say the Vento struggled to reach 120 and generally you found a fault/were disappointed by its gear shift, break pedal, steering and everything else ! Now thats a little overboard.

Quote:
That's for us to take action upon. Doesn't mean that I would go about comparing the Beat to the Vento!
Ofcourse but in India you compare cars on the basis pf price brackets. Like it or hate it but its how it works. And if Optra is priced in that segment it will be compared with these cars. And its not selling. So here is a car which is amazing to drive, bigger engine then its segment, spacious, hydraulic power steering, great pick up and drive ability and priced below the other cars in the segment. Yet it fails to show the same in the monthly sales number. There has to be a reason here and thats what I am trying to find here. some say the looks are old but honestly If Dzire car still have a waiting for 6 months years into its launch then why cant Optra?


Quote:
I also do not believe in berating a product because some sales rep or showroom or dealer did not satisfy my ego or treated me badly or did not give me time - there is no point being egotical here - I am more concerned about the end product that I have to stay with - afterall, I have a lot many years to spend with my car, not with the sales rep!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Poitive View Post

My first (or possibly second - cant recollect) experience with a Chevy showroom was rather bad (probably the same showroom as mohit). Optra should cost way way lesser to maintain than most competitors. Toyota on the other hand, may not have those sorts of guys, may have cheap A$$ but will charge a lot more upfront - 15L on a 1.3 diesel (based on mohit's thread).
See I agree that you are not marrying the SA but come on buying a car is not like buying a sofa set that you buy and forget about it. There is a reason why Toyota manages to sell so many cars which are priced way above the competition.

@positive: Thats why mate I am considering the other cars because paying 15l for that car just doesn't feel right.
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Old 1st August 2011, 00:32   #639
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Default Re: Choosing a Spacious Diesel Sedan upto 12L

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Originally Posted by drmohitg View Post
And to be exact I am considering the Vento very seriously. And all of a sudden reading your views creates a doubt if the car is that bad.
I have never said that the car is bad. It is an excellent car by itself and tonnes of people are happy with it. I have never said that the Vento is bad. I have certain requirements in a car and mine were fulfilled by the Optra. If you feel that the Vento is good for you, please go ahead - I am sure you will love it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by drmohitg View Post
Your post does appear exaggerated to me specially when you say the Vento struggled to reach 120 and generally you found a fault/were disappointed by its gear shift, break pedal, steering and everything else ! Now thats a little overboard.
These are the exact things that I faced with my friend's car and I wrote an honest narration of the incident - verbatim!
To be VERY clear :
1. Gear Shift : I am not disappointed. I just said it was hard, requires a bit of force. I did not have issues there - just made an observation.
2. Brake pedal - I did not say anything about the pedal, but about the braking. If you tap on the Optra's brakes (very light pressure) - you feel it braking - in the Vento, when i sped up initially, I had expected immediate braking, (thinking that like the Optra, all 4 disks will result in immediate braking), but that did not happen and I nearly hit a scooter! I had to press much farther and much harder. That does not mean that Vento's braking is bad - the people used to the Vento will find it good enough, whereas they will find the Optra's braking to be too tight.
3. Steering - Again this was a personal feeling - I like the heavy steering of my Optra and was uncomfortable with the light steering of the Vento! Heck, you can read my Swift post where I could not adjust to the Swift after the Optra. Many others will find all that very good and will swear by the light feeling - this was my narration - my opinion. If you like the EPS, why should your opinion change because I like HPS?
Again, about the zero feedback - let me explain - when you are turning the EPS wheel, you do not realize that the wheels are actually turning beneath you or not - its extremely smooth. With the Optra's HPS and my dad's previous Corsa's HPS, when you turned the steering, you could actually 'feel' the tyres turning beneath. Even at speeds, on undulating roads, the feedback is very helpful. With my swift, even if the front tyres are in the air or if they are on the ground, the steering feel is approximately same - not so in the Optra - I find the difference very helpful as I drive more on reflexes than on technique!

4. Everything else : The only other thing 'compared' was the ICE. I had never considered the ICE as a deterrent or a decider while purchasing the car. In the last 3 months, I have not even put 1 CD in the system - I am OK with FM. The 'comparison' was requested by my friend as he found the issue in his Vento and wanted to see the effect in my Optra.
If you are thinking that this was a negative for the Vento, well it's your lookout - I wouldn't have cared either way.



Quote:
Originally Posted by drmohitg View Post
Ofcourse but in India you compare cars on the basis pf price brackets. Like it or hate it but its how it works. And if Optra is priced in that segment it will be compared with these cars. And its not selling. So here is a car which is amazing to drive, bigger engine then its segment, spacious, hydraulic power steering, great pick up and drive ability and priced below the other cars in the segment. Yet it fails to show the same in the monthly sales number. There has to be a reason here and thats what I am trying to find here. some say the looks are old but honestly If Dzire car still have a waiting for 6 months years into its launch then why cant Optra?
This is the very concept I cannot understand. Just because a car falls in the same price bracket does not mean that it has to be compared with others in that category. When I chose my car, I looked at the internals first - that holds priority for me. I do not go by the mob mentality (read my signature). Just because 10 people call a gem a rock, does not mean that I will do the same. If the Optra did not sell before, or is not selling well now, that's GMs issue and their loss (or not). I liked the car, did my calculations, weighed the pros and cons and bought my car - many people had told me not to, but in the end, I am the one to drive it, so why should I change what I like for their views?



Quote:
Originally Posted by drmohitg View Post
See I agree that you are not marrying the SA but come on buying a car is not like buying a sofa set that you buy and forget about it.
I am fully aware (though you do get the rear sofa with the Magnum ). And that is precisely my point - the issue being discussed here was the behaviour of the sales guy, not the after sales and maintenance! The Sales rep has nothing to do AFTER the car has been sold - the after sales service, availability of spares, cost of spares, maintenance matters more. I calculated all these things which MATTER - I did not and will not bother about the ego issues caused by an indifferent sales rep - because the relationship with the sales rep ends just there!


Whenever I had my doubts, I have gone ahead and done the tests, comparisons, studies and then posted my opinions here. If you do have a doubt, you are welcome (actually it would be rather good), if you go ahead and drive a Vento and an Optra back to back. If after that you are happy with the Vento, well that would be the best thing for you - not only will it reinforce your belief, but you will be truly satisfied with your purchase -and your observations will make for an interesting discussion as well!

All the best with your purchase
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Old 1st August 2011, 09:35   #640
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Default Re: Choosing a Spacious Diesel Sedan upto 12L

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Originally Posted by prabhuferrari View Post
Sure. I got your point. I have already started the research for various options including CASKA. Once I get an answer, will post it here.
When I visited Chevy showroom last month I checked the ICEs being sold by the showroom guys and they had one Sony model and another Pioneer model, both double DIN with touch screen and fulfilling most of your requirements, in the price range of 25-35k.

From what i have read on this forum, CASKA does seem to be a good option too. Please share your research with us. I will be finalizing my car this week and would like to upgrade the stock ICE immediately, my requirement being similar to yours - a good Bluetooth system with auto volume cut off feature. That has been one of the grouse with my Baleno stock music system, there is no mute button. I have the Sony Ericsson bluetooth system installed but have to manually cut off the volume every time I make / receive calls.
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Old 1st August 2011, 12:55   #641
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Default Re: Choosing a Spacious Diesel Sedan upto 12L

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Originally Posted by NoRules View Post
From what i have read on this forum, CASKA does seem to be a good option too. Please share your research with us. I will be finalizing my car this week and would like to upgrade the stock ICE immediately, my requirement being similar to yours - a good Bluetooth system with auto volume cut off feature. That has been one of the grouse with my Baleno stock music system, there is no mute button. I have the Sony Ericsson bluetooth system installed but have to manually cut off the volume every time I make / receive calls.
The recommendation I received so far are Pioneer 3350BT, JVC AVX846. I just need to cross check if Pioneer has the GPS stuff. Since it has bluetooth, USB and also reverse cam compatibility might choose it. Its around 27K it seems.
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Old 1st August 2011, 17:07   #642
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Default Re: Choosing a Spacious Diesel Sedan upto 12L

Quote:
Originally Posted by markiv View Post
I would pick Hyudnai Verna Fluidic 1.6 Diesel with my eyes closed..........and make that WHITE
Quote:
Originally Posted by markiv View Post
If you are ONLY looking for spaciousness, its not the one I think. But look at the specs! 1.6 L / 128 bhp , and that too in a Diesel !!
Hey mate, Did you TD the cars? What were your opinions? What were your requirements from the car?

Quote:
Originally Posted by keyur View Post
Whenever I had my doubts, I have gone ahead and done the tests, comparisons, studies and then posted my opinions here.
@Markiv, I second Keyurs view here. Do let us know of what you think after the TDs.

Nissan Sunny

Though the diesel avatar is to come in later, it is about to be launched. Post by GTO on the Nissan Sunny thread:

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO View Post
Yup, confirmed. The car will be unveiled on 3rd August 2011, that is day after tomorrow.

Last edited by Poitive : 1st August 2011 at 17:33. Reason: typo
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Old 1st August 2011, 17:25   #643
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Default Re: Choosing a Spacious Diesel Sedan upto 12L

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Originally Posted by prabhuferrari View Post
Ha ha. I have tried many ranges till 107.5. It's not as good as direct USB connectivity and drains battery of mobile as well. Its ok for occasional use in my opinion. Tried for 1 year in my esteem and then changed HU. Now if I go for the optra magnum need to see. I have mailed CASKA to see if they have a HU for Optra. Let's see.
I had checked with CASKA India team, (they are dealing through Auto Trendz India) and have got a confirmation that they do have an unit for Optra. I was supposed to visit them last week and when on the way checked, they were out of Bangalore for a business visit hence could not make it. I am scheduling the meeting for this week Thursday/ Friday and I should be able to make it this time. I am visiting along with a friend of mine who wanted to change his stock ICE of Honda City. While I am just looking at it from a looks perspective & the usefulness of the features like tire monitoring system, reverse parking system etc. (I love very soft music that too at low volumes), my friend is a thorough audiophile who will be looking at it from that perspective. So hopefully I can report it by next Monday.
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Old 1st August 2011, 18:44   #644
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Default Re: Choosing a Spacious Diesel Sedan upto 12L

A New Space to Discuss Mods to Optra Magnum
(for Optra owners and for potential owners)

Guys, The Magnum seems to lack on features. So we need to discuss these things. Also possibly other upgrades/changes like:
  • Bluetooth
  • Head Unit/ ICE /Audio system
  • Reverse sensors
  • Horn
  • Headlamp
  • Tuning Boxes (petes, RD)
  • Coatings like 3M, Teflon, Under-body Anti-rust etc
  • Misc things like seat covers, perfumes, mats etc
  • Etc Etc Etc!
Now this is kind of relevant to choosing this car, but also seems to take the focus from, really, choosing a sedan.

Thought we should have a separate space to discuss this. Hence have started a new thread for this.

Link to the thread to discuss Modifications and upgrades to Optra Magnum

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/modifi...ml#post2452005 (Optra Magnum - Place to discuss all your mods - ICE, Tyre, Gizmos etc.)

Now, since there are few people there as of now, one may not get a suitable response right away. So, if needed one can put one's query there and if needed, put a link to it on this thread. The link to the specific post can be found by right clicking the post number on the top-right of the post.

Hope this helps all and keeps things organized

Quote:
Originally Posted by Highflyer View Post
@prabhuferrari any response from Caska?
I remember reading somewhere that any MP3 player with Aux out would do the job in Optra. We all know that a decent quality MP3 player with Aux out is available for Rs 1000-1500.
Can anyone throw some light on this ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by optimist View Post
Did you check with Sundaram about the upgrade to a touch screen? They told they will fit it and is approved/will not void warranty. Also checked with their helpline and have confirmed the same IF it is done at the ASC.
Quote:
Originally Posted by prabhuferrari View Post
Not sure how good this is when compared to Caska..
----------
Is a tyre upgrade necessary for majority city and occasional highway drive? I am not too comfortable changing the OEM stuff except for headlights. Please advice.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Poitive View Post
Prabhu,
Single DIN : The olden small size Head Unit size, one has been using for eons, right from our Maruti 800's onwards.
Double DIN : Double that size (height wise).
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoRules View Post
Out of the 2 cars I saw today one had Michelin Primacy 195/60/R15, in good condition. The other one had brand new rear tyres - Apollo Accelere 195/60/R15 and stock front tyres - Good Year 195/60/R15. Does this matter?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jakku View Post
I had checked with CASKA India team, (they are dealing through Auto Trendz India)...

Last edited by Poitive : 1st August 2011 at 18:48.
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Old 1st August 2011, 19:14   #645
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Default Re: Choosing a Spacious Diesel Sedan upto 12L

Thanks for the new thread Poitive. I have posted my update on CASKA there. Cheers!
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