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Old 5th June 2012, 12:25   #121
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Default Re: Returning to India

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Originally Posted by poloman View Post
Did it not cross your mind that, this was nothing but racial profiling and discrimination? Do you feel the above points are serious enough to warrant this behaviour from the lady?
Cross my mind? buddy I have seen worse racial profiling being done. Notably at US embassies and airports among other places. But the worst racial discrimination I have faced is in our own country. Due to such discrimination, I have had to take up a third choice career and give up on my aspirations before beginning college. I am not the only one and I am sure a lot of others who have been through this.

I was not there to argue with her or to get her to change her mind. If she had not respected the booking as was done, we would have walked out and looked for another hotel. As she gave us what we had originally agreed upon, I had no complaints or reason to argue.

To be very blunt about this, I think we Indians are also racist in our own way. She did not discriminate against me and once she reached that level, I didnt care what she thought about Indians. I was on vacation paying my own money, not working as a brand ambassador for Indian behaviour. If she wanted to change her opinion, our behaviour should have been enough. If not, little else that I said would have helped as she had numerous bad experiences before that.

As for the reasons being serious enough, its subjective. What is not serious to me and you may be serious enough for that lady. Maybe some other things happened that she did not share with me.

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Originally Posted by vivekiny2k View Post
I agree, the logical thing would be to correct the behavior or in the worst case, deduct cost of cleaning from their deposit. First mistake she did was to make changes to the room request, and second and worse was to admit it the next day
Yes, maybe she let down her guard because we were conversing in her language. And in her own way.
The reason I narrated this incident is because it relates to the other incidents where cabin crew treat Indian sectors as a punishment posting.
Not everyone in the US/ UK/ Aus/ Canada are very vocal about this, but some of the non English speaking people are.
The only reason they shut up is because of the money that our tourism brings them.

Last edited by selfdrive : 5th June 2012 at 12:32.
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Old 5th June 2012, 15:36   #122
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Default Re: Returning to India

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But what about the government that has been mercilessly taking its citizens for a ride? It's when you look at the likes of Mamata-s, Raja-s, Reddy-s, Yeddy-s and the countless local goondas and their nexus with law enforcement and corrupt babus that you start wondering if you made the right decision to move back
Maybe a little OT.

This video very aptly summarizes what a lot of us think about the way the country is heading:



"Muft me mili hui azaadi ki wajah se desh ko bahut sasta samajh rahe hai aaj ke log" - Truer words were never said!

Cheers,
Vikram
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Old 5th June 2012, 16:49   #123
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Default Re: Returning to India

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Maybe a little OT.

This video very aptly summarizes what a lot of us think about the way the country is heading:

"Muft me mili hui azaadi ki wajah se desh ko bahut sasta samajh rahe hai aaj ke log" - Truer words were never said!

Cheers,
Vikram
Very true. Lagta hai hame bhi ladna hoga ab...
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Old 5th June 2012, 16:51   #124
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Default Re: Returning to India

Hi everybody
Comfortablynumb
It is great of you to provide the above,What is said is more relevant today than it was when the movie was released.
Love the judge's comment that is the duty of the leaders to improve society.Unfortunately they have abdicated that duty.

Selfdrive
You should also have mentioned that any newcomer to the buffet breakfast will wish the others in general.At the same time your privacy would be respected.
The traffic does not give way to an ambulance but the moment a red light atop a car is seen people give way, dutifully helped by the cops.
Regards
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Old 5th June 2012, 17:16   #125
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The situation and the behaviour is pretty bad in India now a days. This is really a very alarming situation. The problem starts the moment you step out of the house. You have confront with idiots on the road. Even if you are driving carefully some idiot coming on the wrong side of the road expects you to give him space to pass through. Else he will shout at you in foul language!
Shopping malls are a big mess all together. Some people let their kids loose with the shopping carts! The kids go on rampage hitting people and commodities.
These are just examples. There is outright negative behaviour every where combined with callous attitude.
Another example is that the other day I saw 3 guys on a two wheeler and pointed it out to a constable at the junction, to which he said "poor fellows Sir, let them go". Almost at the same moment a Fortuner jumped red lights and the same police fellow said "Rich guys with connections, cannot do anything". So for whom is the law for? Only for middle class and upper middle class people?

I have stayed in a foriegn country for quiet sometime and the stay has always been good. I need not worry as long as I am following the laws of that country. I need not worry that some nincompoop driving on the wrong side may hit me. I need not worry or carefully examine a product stocked on the shelf for damage. I need not worry about getting cheated after paying for a service or a product. The punishment is so strict that people think twice before breaking the laws. Also having "connections" does not help an offender.

As I see it today, things are going to be far worse in the future. Days are not far when we should have a gun to protect ourselves!

And yes, I love my India and my culture! Thats why I am here.
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Old 5th June 2012, 17:22   #126
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Arrogance/show-off/trickery = cool/confident is the new mantra. Have you seen those ads where a young girl makes fun of an elderly business man for not having a smartphone? That totally gives a wrong message to the children. Such small things also play an important role in upbringing of children.

I don't know what can we do to stop the traffic madness that is spreading like wildfire. I feel that everyone is trying to win those small battles on the road which give them a false sense of achievement. No one is ready to let go someone else in front because of the big ego.

To quote an incident, there was bumper to bumper traffic one day. I was on my bike. I see few meters ahead that a swift guy is trying to get onto main road, but no one is allowing him to get in. When I reach near him, I just stopped there and let him go. The cabbie behind me started honking madly as if I committed some crime. The swift guy was so grateful to me, he said Thank You sir 3 times and gave a thumbs up to me. For me it was just one car in front of me in the traffic, but for that person it made a whole lot of difference.

About punctuality, it's not as bad in my company as it is while dealing with local service providers. Our water bottle supplier always makes me angry because he would promise to deliver the bottle in half n hour but won't turn up for 3 hours even after multiple calls. I've tried to explain him multiple times that it is OK to say that he will deliver the bottle after 3 hours, but its not OK to promise something that he can't keep.

Somehow people have got into a habit of over-promising and under-delivering.

Last edited by Gandhi : 5th June 2012 at 17:24.
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Old 5th June 2012, 17:24   #127
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Default Re: Returning to India

Hi everybody
Located Jug Suraiyas article regarding the smiling nature of Sri Lankans and the difference he noticed.
Enjoy
Regards

Article Window
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Old 5th June 2012, 17:38   #128
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Originally Posted by selfdrive
If this degradation continues at the same rate, I will soon have to reconsider my move to return here. Its just a matter of time I guess before one's patience runs out.

The problem as I see it is that we keep waiting for someone to clean up the mess. Like waiting for the maid to come and clean our own house. Not the best analogy, but thats how I look at it.
The trouble is that we as a people refuse to do precisely what is needed to solve our own problems. Of Indians don't clean up India, who will? Then there is the omnipresent crab like tendency to pull each other down, the insane habit of ridiculing and trying to find ulterior motives in anyone who does try to do anything to fix the wrongs of the country.

This has even penetrated the media. For example, the media can only focus on some imaginary differences in a group of people trying to root out corruption in the country. This is a movement that will help every single individual in the country, yet all they can do is to discuss what exactly those individuals are going to gain, and how they must have a plan to grab power, somehow.

This is what is pathetic about our people - not the bad habits, not the boorishness nor being too loud. We either run away, as is being discussed on this thread, or try and prevent others from doing any good themselves.
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Old 5th June 2012, 17:47   #129
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Am wondering is the problem of assimilation is more that of the one in the new place or of the place itself. Can you really expect an entire country or city or neighbourhood for that matter to transform overnight just because you have moved there? Isn't it far easier to make the choices that suit you best and accept them for what they are?

Been 3 years since I moved back. I know for sure what I have gained AND lost in the transition. No regrets at all.

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Arrogance/show-off/trickery = cool/confident is the new mantra. Have you seen those ads where a young girl makes fun of an elderly business man for not having a smartphone? That totally gives a wrong message to the children. Such small things also play an important role in upbringing of children.
Yup- have seen that advert- it's not an "elderly" gent by any stretch of the imagination, just an arrogant guy in an expensive car who is put firmly in place by the smartphone carrying young woman whom he asks for directions, not very politely. If our children learn to stand up for themselves and not be overawed by money/influence, I would say they are learning all the right lessons
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Old 5th June 2012, 17:58   #130
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Originally Posted by noopster
Yup- have seen that advert- it's not an "elderly" gent by any stretch of the imagination, just an arrogant guy in an expensive car who is put firmly in place by the smartphone carrying young woman whom he asks for directions, not very politely. If our children learn to stand up for themselves and not be overawed by money/influence, I would say they are learning all the right lessons
Not that one. I am talking about the new ad, where the same young girl makes fun of a businessman, who is trying to find out about stock prices.
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Old 5th June 2012, 18:03   #131
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Default Re: Returning to India

I went through similar discussions for 5 years (2002-2007) in a forum dedicated to returning to India. So I am not going to re-hash same old stuff. I only read this thread.

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Yup- have seen that advert- it's not an "elderly" gent by any stretch of the imagination, just an arrogant guy in an expensive car who is put firmly in place by the smartphone carrying young woman whom he asks for directions, not very politely.
She calls him UNCLE, so case closed.
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Old 5th June 2012, 18:12   #132
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Originally Posted by noopster View Post
Am wondering is the problem of assimilation is more that of the one in the new place or of the place itself. Can you really expect an entire country or city or neighbourhood for that matter to transform overnight just because you have moved there? Isn't it far easier to make the choices that suit you best and accept them for what they are?

Been 3 years since I moved back. I know for sure what I have gained AND lost in the transition. No regrets at all.
Perhaps you are correct. At the end of the day the problem lies with me being unable or unwilling to accept that the India of the early noughties has moved on and things will never be the same again. Unfortunately I think its for the worse. Again maybe this is because I am inherently pessimistic or tend to see the worst case scenario during any of my run ins with n number of morons.
As is the case, I chose to be here. Whether that decision is correct or not is for me to judge by my own standards. Another limitation that I have is that I cannot live with chalta hai attitude, so if I cannot ensure that things ship up, I will shape out.

As someone else said a few posts earlier, we need to do something about it. Yes of course we do. We are responsible for improving the country, I am responsible for doing it. How far each of us is willing to sacrifice our personal happiness and well being for that of the country is the key to it. How many of us have the courage to walk down that path? As of now, I dont think I do. Who knows how that may change in the future.

Someone has correctly said, its not the 100th blow that gets a person to retaliate. Its the 99 that went before that. So let me try to keep an account of all the blows and then lets see what happens. It may be for my selfish benefit or it could be for a selfless effort at changing things. Time will tell.

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Not that one. I am talking about the new ad, where the same young girl makes fun of a businessman, who is trying to
find out about stock prices.
Its the one where a group of youth (one girl actually) mocks a middle aged guy for using two different phones (or is it a mobile and a laptop) for checking stock prices.
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Old 5th June 2012, 18:25   #133
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Its the one where a group of youth (one girl actually) mocks a middle aged guy for using two different phones (or is it a mobile and a laptop) for checking stock prices.
Yup.. this one
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Old 5th June 2012, 18:27   #134
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As I see it today, things are going to be far worse in the future. Days are not far when we should have a gun to protect ourselves!

And yes, I love my India and my culture! Thats why I am here.
@MCR and others

I want to add a few more things here. I see my very educated colleagues throw garbage on the roads. My neighbor spits with full force out of his balcony. The temple across the street sees it perfectly normal to blare devotional songs right from 6AM.

What pisses me off is not how these people behave, but their incredible indignant foul mouthed choice of words when I confront them with such behavior. You see, in other countries, education = awareness = cultural sentitivity = social responsibility. But here, the well educated and the rich are no better off than those with no awareness or education. How do we remedy this? The kids who run around with shopping carts, they're the kids of US return types or IT types. Definitely not poor, definitely not uneducated. Then where's the problem? Why so much of behavioral apathy?
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Old 5th June 2012, 20:10   #135
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She calls him UNCLE, so case closed.
Yup. Reminds me of many in my place in India who claim that American kids don't respect their elders because they call them by their name and not "aunty" /"uncle".

I have a feeling they totally believe that these kids don't call them buddhha /budhiya (old man, old women) on their back while calling them uncle and aunty on face. This in spite of the fact that they themselves do it to their elders everyday.
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