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Old 2nd December 2012, 00:42   #31
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Default Re: Calling Lawyers & CAs on this forum to provide free consultations

Hi BHPians,

I have some queries about the marriage registration process in Mumbai.

I am currently in UK and will be in Mumbai from 21st December to 12th January. My fiancee is in Mumbai and we intend to register our marriage in the court to obtain the marriage certificate in a short time. This is needed for her to get a dependent visa for UK to apply for jobs. We are not yet married traditionally, we intend to do that in May 2013.

I know that there is a gap of 30 days required between the application of marriage and when we can actually solemnize our marriage according to the special marriage act. My questions are

1. Is it necessary for both of us to be present and sign the application for a registered marriage when we submit this to the marriage registrar ?

If this is not the case then I can send the form signed from UK now and she can submit it with all the required documents (Hoping that my passport not being one of the must required documents)

If this is the case, I am in a fix since I am not in India for 30 days and will have to delay my return or go back again.

2. Are these laws different for different states ? I could read on the Karnataka government site that the form can be sent by registered post or has to be submitted in person along with the fee. I cannot find any relevant information on the web about Maharashtra/Mumbai.

Thanks in advance for any help!

Last edited by dgupta : 2nd December 2012 at 00:58. Reason: Spelling error
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Old 3rd December 2012, 14:05   #32
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Going by what you have stated that the property is only in his name. If that is the case then he is well within his rights to dispose off the property.

Being mere co-applicant in mortgage with bank would give her no right to object for sale (not considering the situation of a matrimonial dispute).

All he needs to do is pay back the loan, get his documents from the bank and he is free to sell off the property.

Is their marriage estranged?
Thanks for your reply buddy. He has not spoken of any problems with his marriage but we definitely noticed some distance\tension between them at their house.
I don't think either of them are planning on filing for divorce in the near future, but by the looks of it it will happen for sure sometime later though. He wanted to know if there were any negative implications if he did want to sell the house they live in. He has found a buyer who is ready to pay off the mortgage first, the owner will collect the original papers from the bank & complete the sale transaction.
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Old 4th December 2012, 11:37   #33
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1. Is it necessary for both of us to be present and sign the application for a registered marriage when we submit this to the marriage registrar ?
Unfortunately, yes. In some states, you are required to be present in person to submit the various documents and to sign the application form.

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Originally Posted by dgupta View Post
2. Are these laws different for different states ? I could read on the Karnataka government site that the form can be sent by registered post or has to be submitted in person along with the fee. I cannot find any relevant information on the web about Maharashtra/Mumbai.
Yes, laws are different for different states. For eg. Delhi and Mumbai require you to be present in person to apply for a registration of marriage under the Special Marriage Act. Karnataka and West Bengal do not require that.

If you or your fiancee do have a proof of address for Karnataka, I would urge you take that option. Basically you will need to show that one of you are subject to the jurisdiction where you are applying for the registration.

Hope this helps. And all the best!
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Old 4th December 2012, 12:57   #34
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Hope this helps. And all the best!
Thanks arjyamaj for the information! I am trying to find a way around it, speaking to a few lawyers in Mumbai to find what's the best way out.
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Old 4th December 2012, 13:18   #35
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Thanks for your reply buddy. He has not spoken of any problems with his marriage but we definitely noticed some distance\tension between them at their house.
I don't think either of them are planning on filing for divorce in the near future, but by the looks of it it will happen for sure sometime later though. He wanted to know if there were any negative implications if he did want to sell the house they live in. He has found a buyer who is ready to pay off the mortgage first, the owner will collect the original papers from the bank & complete the sale transaction.
He can sell off the property as he is the sole owner, mere co-application for loan creates no right. However to add, considering the fact that there is tension in their matrimonial relationship, I would recommend him to make adequate provisions to maintain his wife and kids.

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Thanks arjyamaj for the information! I am trying to find a way around it, speaking to a few lawyers in Mumbai to find what's the best way out.
This link gives some idea about the procedure in Mumbai, local lawyers will help you in this regard for mandatory appearance on application and final registration or both.

http://mumbaicity.gov.in/htmldocs/marr.htm

Last edited by setuniket : 4th December 2012 at 13:25. Reason: No PM or Email
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Old 4th December 2012, 13:33   #36
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I have a question for auditors...

This is about the PAN card issue. I have the PAN received from ITD by 2002, but I haven't received the card till now. I made number of attempts to receive the card through UTI and NSDL. There was no response from neither of these service providers for all my correction applications. At last, for the recent application I have submitted through NSDL, I heard that there is a correction form in pending status wit UTI from 2005 and because of that they couldn't process my applications. Till UTI cancels the form, there is no chance of getting my card.
I emailed and phoned UTI to cancel that pending form to proceed with. When I followed-up with UTI for my email request, they said, they will forward this to their Mumbai office and get back to me with the status. I am not sure, they will cancel the old form or give me some other reason.
Now there are two options for me, upto my knowledge...
1. Surrender this number to ITD and get a new one. In this case, will it create any problem when I submit the returns in future. I am salaried and no other income.

2. Keep following-up with these guys and wait for the card for ever.

Do I have any other choice? Please advise.

Thanks
Dinesh
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Old 5th December 2012, 19:50   #37
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This link gives some idea about the procedure in Mumbai, local lawyers will help you in this regard for mandatory appearance on application and final registration or both.

http://mumbaicity.gov.in/htmldocs/marr.htm
Thanks setuniket, trying to find a way and speaking to the local lawyers.
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Old 3rd January 2013, 10:22   #38
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Question Re: Calling Lawyers & CAs on this forum to provide free consultations

Quick question for CA's, pls do respond.

I have two houses of which one is home loan free and I intend to gift this property to my spouse+son to reduce my tax liability. What are the ifs and buts that I should be taking care of? Also whether the gift deed needs to be registered? If so whats the normal charge for the same.
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Old 13th January 2013, 16:38   #39
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Unhappy How to recover my money from an ex-tenant?

I had a tenant who was staying in the ground floor of our house in Noida. Man Wife 2 kids. Let's call him G. The first floor of the house was also given to some bachelors from my company. Three of them. Now the bachelors being bachelors, shirked away from having to own the responsibility of depositing the electricity bill.


There was just one electricity meter in the house and G and the bachelors, used to divide the bill amongst themselves. The bachelors used to handover cash to the ground floor guy G who used to pay the electricity bill. During the months of June 11 & July 11 the ground floor guy pocketed the cash given to him by the first floor guys and did not pay the electricity bill. He also did some handiwork to show the bill as normal for the month of Aug 11 when he vacated the house.


The next month we got a huge bill which contained the sum of previous bills + penalty + current bill. The sum of previous bills (for Jun & Jul 11) + penalty was equal to 27k. Seeing how the electricity connection of the house was going to be cut I paid the 27k from my pocket and settled the case with the electricity authorities.


When confronted, Mr G admitted that his cheques bounced and he will pay the sum of Rs 27k to me later. He cited financial troubles at that moment so we gave him some time to pay the Rs 27k to us. Now this was in Aug 2011 and till date he has given me is Rs 5k. I have made numerous visits to him and each time he has some excuse or the other.


G's Rent agreement with me had finished on April 2011 or so. He had asked for an extension of 1 month at a time to find a new place and finally vacated the house in Aug 2011. So when he did all this handiwork of pocketing the money from the First floor tenants his rent agreement was officially expired.


Now I stay in Delhi. Each visit to Noida costs me approx Rs 400/- apart from the time wasted. He doesn't pick my phone anymore nor does his wife. Some days he is not even at home when I go to visit him. His wife just keeps saying that she doesn't have any money and I should talk to her husband.


Now me and my father are simple people and we don't even know any policeman/bigwig in Noida. I personally think that it is below my dignity to use force with him. Mr G is a man in his 40s and is a lifelong resident of Noida. He is a kind of Smart Alec/Jugaadbaaz and I suspect he has contacts in police and other people as he often keeps saying - Mere paas to hain nahi paise... le chalo police ke paas mujhey (I don't have money. take me to police if you please).

He has already observed that me and my dad are soft hearted people who have given him extensions on paying rent and repayment of his dues on numerous times and now he is taking undue advantage of this. I am really confused how I should get the money out of him.


All I have against him is a cheque of Rs 5k in my name, dated 10Nov 2012, which bounced due to insufficient funds in G's account.

I would be grateful if you can provide suggestions on what are my options and how to proceed.

Last edited by lsp : 13th January 2013 at 16:41. Reason: Corrections
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Old 13th January 2013, 23:05   #40
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Issue a detailed notice to him of all amounts due by registered post acknowledgement due. Mention that he has misled you in the past (and give details with approximate dates on which he has misled you), and that the intention is to cheat. Mention also the cheque which has bounced, and this is a notice prior to filing of a case under S.138 of the Negotiable Instruments Act. Mention that you are giving him 30 days after which you will file FIR.

After 30 days, contact a lawyer, and file a cheque bouncing case. Also take that same lawyer, and file an FIR for cheating at the police station. Things should automatically get sorted after that. You will have to pay Rs.4-5k to a lawyer for all this.
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Old 14th January 2013, 14:16   #41
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Originally Posted by ghodlur View Post
Quick question for CA's, pls do respond.

I have two houses of which one is home loan free and I intend to gift this property to my spouse+son to reduce my tax liability. What are the ifs and buts that I should be taking care of? Also whether the gift deed needs to be registered? If so whats the normal charge for the same.
Income earned from gifts made by you to your spouse will be taxable in your hands.
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Old 14th January 2013, 14:58   #42
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Thanks for the reply Manolin. Few Qs from me in regards to your reply

1. Does the Acknowledgement of the registered post containing notice hold value in court? Why I am asking this is that he is seldom at home.

2. Can you share some template format for such a notice?

3. The FIR ans subsequent litigation, how much time will it take?

4. Is there a way to recover my legal costs from him?

5. Since the cheque is only for Rs 5k will the litigation be based on that amount alone or Rs 22k which is due to me?

Any other advice you may wish to share.

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Issue a detailed notice to him of all amounts due by registered post acknowledgement due. Mention that he has misled you in the past (and give details with approximate dates on which he has misled you), and that the intention is to cheat. Mention also the cheque which has bounced, and this is a notice prior to filing of a case under S.138 of the Negotiable Instruments Act. Mention that you are giving him 30 days after which you will file FIR.

After 30 days, contact a lawyer, and file a cheque bouncing case. Also take that same lawyer, and file an FIR for cheating at the police station. Things should automatically get sorted after that. You will have to pay Rs.4-5k to a lawyer for all this.
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Old 14th January 2013, 18:50   #43
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Thanks for the reply Manolin. Few Qs from me in regards to your reply

1. Does the Acknowledgement of the registered post containing notice hold value in court? Why I am asking this is that he is seldom at home.

2. Can you share some template format for such a notice?

3. The FIR ans subsequent litigation, how much time will it take?

4. Is there a way to recover my legal costs from him?

5. Since the cheque is only for Rs 5k will the litigation be based on that amount alone or Rs 22k which is due to me?

Any other advice you may wish to share.
It will hold good in court (the acknowledgement is signed by the receiver when it is delivered).

I will try, but just search online- otherwise just check with any chotta mota lawyer to do all this for you.

Regarding the other things - see for 22k it doesn't typically make sense to go for full on litigation. All this legal notice business is just to intimidate - check bouncing is a criminal offense, but you need to give a notice before you start proceedings. Similarly fraud/cheating can be a criminal offense (also a civil offense). Thats why the minute you give notice for a criminal offense, all these payments start coming through (if not when you file FIR they should). If it still don't, it is not worth your time or money to pursue 22k (not worth the hassle).
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Old 14th January 2013, 19:20   #44
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1. Surrender this number to ITD and get a new one. In this case, will it create any problem when I submit the returns in future. I am salaried and no other income.
This is not an option. Stay with your current PAN. Changing it will cause more problems than you can imagine.


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2. Keep following-up with these guys and wait for the card for ever.
Follow up by emails, letters and phone calls. Be patient and hear what they are actually saying. You will have to detect what the problem is and solve it even if they come up with a new reason.

Key word is be patient when you talk with them. It will get your job done.


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Originally Posted by ani_meher View Post


If one was to accumulate savings every month over next few years for major purchase, what is the safest and least tax attracting avenue? This is after fulfilling all the 1lakh tax free investment.
A debt Mutual Fund is the best option.

Last edited by lapsi : 14th January 2013 at 19:29.
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Old 15th January 2013, 01:49   #45
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A debt Mutual Fund is the best option.
Why Debt - the returns are less than inflation rate - you are actually losing money. Conventional wisdom is that Debt MFs should be bought only to balance portfolio loaded on equity mfs. From a tax perspective, they are taxed at the same rate right?
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