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Old 9th March 2015, 15:54   #796
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Unhappy Re: The Delhi Bus Rape Case. UPDATE: Ram Singh Suicide, 4 others sentenced to death

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^^ We will not walk alone and flash our wallets in mugging prone areas in America, will we?
No offence, but this is the same mentality shown by people in the documentary.
If you roam at night, you are not safe. If you travel with your friend, you are not safe.
The question should be WHY. There should be no conditions in an ideal society.
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Old 9th March 2015, 15:59   #797
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Default Re: The Delhi Bus Rape Case. UPDATE: Ram Singh Suicide, 4 others sentenced to death

^^ It is not my mindset! But it is a fact. That certain places at certain times are unsafe. It can not be wished away, just like that. And it doesn't hurt to be mindful of the fact. In an ideal world, that is not necessary. But till the ideal condition prevails?
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Old 9th March 2015, 16:04   #798
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Unhappy Re: The Delhi Bus Rape Case. UPDATE: Ram Singh Suicide, 4 others sentenced to death

And I was horrified at the end of the documentary.

The accused said, and I quote, " IF YOU GIVE DEATH SENTENCE, IN FUTURE, RAPISTS WILL NOT LET THEIR VICTIMS GO FREE. THEY WILL MURDER THEM."

And I felt there was some truth in the statement.
Rapists will now think twice before letting their victims go free.

How that will turn out is best left to the wildest of horrific imaginations.

Deeply sad the situation in our country.

And my main question is still unanswered. WHAT ARE WE, AS EMPOWERED INDIANS, GOING TO DO ABOUT THIS SITUATION?
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Old 9th March 2015, 16:23   #799
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Default Re: The Delhi Bus Rape Case. UPDATE: Ram Singh Suicide, 4 others sentenced to death

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^^ India alone is not unsafe for women. But it is made out as if it is the only place. That is wrong.
Maybe, but you know what? It gives me a little solace that we will feature better than Pakistan, Afghanistan, Iraq and Syria here.

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That is all I am saying. We will not walk alone and flash our wallets in mugging prone areas in America, will we?
And I sincerely hope that you will give up driving your car on the road since there is quite a chance of an accident which may result in loss of life. After all, you will not want to do something that results in possible threat!

Please don't be offended, but all we need to do is to precisely change that mentality of 'flashing wallets in mugging prone area' OR as that lawyer said 'if you will keep sweets in open, dogs will feast on it.'
Have a good day sir.
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Old 9th March 2015, 16:28   #800
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Default Re: The Delhi Bus Rape Case. UPDATE: Ram Singh Suicide, 4 others sentenced to death

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Originally Posted by DevilzzzzOwn View Post
And I felt there was some truth in the statement.
Rapists will now think twice before letting their victims go free.
No, it is a stupid statement from a stupid man.

Lots of law abiding citizens are capable of violence. But you don't see them all going around beating/killing others. Do you know what separates them from lawbreakers? A combination of good conscious and fear of consequences. In case of a rapist, there is no good conscious, so forget that. What about fear of consequence? Even that is pretty low, compared to normal people. But it does exist in every criminal, unless they are suicidal. It is obvious that rape+murder is much more heinous than just rape, and carries more stringent punishment. If this rapist-murderer is given death, it does become a deterrent to others. That is because no rapist wants to die for few minute of sadistic sex, they all hope to never get caught. It is not easy to dodge a murder charge, it raises the profile of the case much higher.
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Old 9th March 2015, 16:29   #801
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Default Re: The Delhi Bus Rape Case. UPDATE: Ram Singh Suicide, 4 others sentenced to death

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Originally Posted by Gansan View Post
^^ It is not my mindset! But it is a fact. That certain places at certain times are unsafe. It can not be wished away, just like that. And it doesn't hurt to be mindful of the fact. In an ideal world, that is not necessary. But till the ideal condition prevails?
Allow me to place a couple of facts here. The brave girl, along with her friend, got into a bus which was supposed to be plying commuters and she boarded the bus from one of the busiest place in central Delhi - Munirka, Saket

So, I didn't know till this incident that it is unsafe to board a bus that is supposed to be a public transport vehicle at busy places

Last edited by 1lokesh : 9th March 2015 at 16:35. Reason: replaced the word "poor" with "brave" for the victim. and corrected munirka reference from select city walk. My apologies
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Old 9th March 2015, 16:37   #802
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Default Re: The Delhi Bus Rape Case. UPDATE: Ram Singh Suicide, 4 others sentenced to death

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Have the "holier than thou" foreign critics rooted it out in their land? If not, why come here and paint the picture as if this is the only place on earth where it happens?

There are no two opinions about the crime that has taken place. But I get irritated when a false opinion is created as if that is the only thing happening day in and day out here, and nothing else.
Agree pretty much to your sentiments. Agree that it shouldn't have been banned.

I disliked the propaganda around it - global event etc etc. Though its otherwise well made.

If you want to solve the root cause - you organize screenings in places in India (whether villages / slums / schools / colleges etc) and help change mindsets.
If you want to "shame" India and put a global spotlight on us - you organize global "events". Not sure the Mukesh or Ram singhs of the world would care much about the London/NY events.

Let's not even get into the title. In my limited experience, North India has far less respect/general safety for women than for example places like South India, specifically places like Chennai (in my 1.5 years here). But hey, guess the BBC is no less in their chase than the desi media for shock worthy headlines than for nuances.
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Old 9th March 2015, 16:39   #803
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Default Re: The Delhi Bus Rape Case. UPDATE: Ram Singh Suicide, 4 others sentenced to death

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Originally Posted by 1lokesh View Post
Maybe, but you know what? It gives me a little solace that we will feature better than Pakistan, Afghanistan, Iraq and Syria here.


And I sincerely hope that you will give up driving your car on the road since there is quite a chance of an accident which may result in loss of life. After all, you will not want to do something that results in possible threat!

Please don't be offended, but all we need to do is to precisely change that mentality of 'flashing wallets in mugging prone area' OR as that lawyer said 'if you will keep sweets in open, dogs will feast on it.'
Have a good day sir.
Actually we fare better than Sweden, UK and the USA.

As for the second point, the sweets analogy of that lawyer was very crude. I was just making a point about being circumspect at some places. If you want to let the juice go and hold on to the pulp, I am not offended.

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Originally Posted by 1lokesh View Post
Allow me to place a couple of facts here. The poor girl, along with her friend, got into a bus which was supposed to be plying commuters and she boarded the bus from one of the busiest place in central Delhi - Munirka, Saket

So, I didn't know till this incident that Select City Walk is an unsafe place to board a bus that is supposed to be a public transport vehicle.
If I remember right from what I read in the papers, it was not a DTC bus but one that belonged to some company that was returning after dropping employees off, which this couple flagged down at a late hour.

I am not justifying anything. I am just saying people's mindset needs changing and till that happens, use your discretion.

Last edited by Gansan : 9th March 2015 at 16:41.
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Old 9th March 2015, 16:53   #804
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Default Re: The Delhi Bus Rape Case. UPDATE: Ram Singh Suicide, 4 others sentenced to death

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Originally Posted by Gansan View Post
If I remember right from what I read in the papers, it was not a DTC bus but one that belonged to some company that was returning after dropping employees off, which this couple flagged down at a late hour.

I am not justifying anything. I am just saying people's mindset needs changing and till that happens, use your discretion.
You seem to be unaware of public transport plying on Delhi roads. Here we have DTC, cluster buses, contract carriages (it is similar to the bus that is in news), shared autos, autos, radio cabs and a couple more options.

The contract carriages ply from point to point (sometimes to nearby towns) and carry people. This particular bus stopped at a bus stop and the couple boarded it. There was a rape case a couple of months back in a Uber cab, if you remember.

On 'mindset', read my last post and you will realise that it is indeed changing, but for worse.The 'discretion' is just because of reduction in safety, freedom and changing mindsets. However, we can still be happy that we fare better than US, UK, Sweeden and we should not worry till we surpass them as well as Nigeria.
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Old 9th March 2015, 17:01   #805
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Default Re: The Delhi Bus Rape Case. UPDATE: Ram Singh Suicide, 4 others sentenced to death

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Originally Posted by Gansan View Post
Actually we fare better than Sweden, UK and the USA.
While US has the highest rate of reporting rape, We fare very poor. However, the numbers here are insufficient to deduce this fact.

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Originally Posted by Gansan View Post
As for the second point, the sweets analogy of that lawyer was very crude. I was just making a point about being circumspect at some places. If you want to let the juice go and hold on to the pulp, I am not offended.



If I remember right from what I read in the papers, it was not a DTC bus but one that belonged to some company that was returning after dropping employees off, which this couple flagged down at a late hour.

I am not justifying anything. I am just saying people's mindset needs changing and till that happens, use your discretion.
It was an off charter bus and the 'minor' rapist had called for passengers, in this case depicting that it was one of those "blue line" bus service widely operating in Delhi as public transport medium
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012_De..._rape#Incident
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Old 9th March 2015, 18:54   #806
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Default Re: The Delhi Bus Rape Case. UPDATE: Ram Singh Suicide, 4 others sentenced to death

The stats are also limited (I won't necessarily call it flawed) in the sense they account for 'reported' numbers. India's crime-reporting and documenting rate (even lodging preliminary FIRs) is abysmally low.

If even half the crimes committed were reported and accounted for, we'd be at the top (or bottom) of the list, based on how you ranked it.

I really don't care how bad some news organisation (with or without a parallel agenda) is making us look. The truth is out there for all of us to see/feel and I don't need BBC or 'perceived' international humiliation to make me ashamed; I already am, as we all should be. What the convicts said on video, was repeated by his lawyers when interviewed, and is repeated at every nook & corner of this country and in every home inhabited by a lady, varying by degrees but invariably present. We are a sick society and we need to change, never mind where we stand on a comparative scale, it's not a competition.

Last edited by Chetan_Rao : 9th March 2015 at 19:12.
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Old 9th March 2015, 19:21   #807
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Default Re: The Delhi Bus Rape Case. UPDATE: Ram Singh Suicide, 4 others sentenced to death

In my opinion, lack of deterrent makes our cities unsafe for women or rather anybody. Our police is totally understaffed to track all crimes reported to closure. Most of the times, even FIR is not registered in time.

However, I hold judiciary even more responsible in delaying justice even in straight forward cases.
In Nirbhaya case, Supreme Court is holding the criminals back from hanging.
For what reason? Defense lawyers did not file their petition on time!

In my opinion, Supreme Court is more interested in making political statements rather than acting on even straight forward cases. It is Supreme Court's duty in my opinion to set the example, act rapidly and also guide lower courts in cleaning up their backlog!

Two main pillars of legal systems - Judiciary and Police - are not able to function efficiently and effectively, partly due to British Raj times procedures being followed and partly due to our lack of political will to reform them.

I believe, our collective mindset will improve dramatically, if punishment for sexual crimes is delivered swiftly.

Also at personal level, I believe glorification of AIB roast types of events in name of freedom of speech fuels the negative mindset about sexuality.

My two cents...

Regards,
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Old 9th March 2015, 19:45   #808
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Default Re: The Delhi Bus Rape Case. UPDATE: Ram Singh Suicide, 4 others sentenced to death

IMO its a combination of way too many things that lead to this.
Hanging these people is NOT a solution but maybe it will be a deterrent in a few cases.
Education again will help people evolve. But as one of the guys said in the video, "we used to roam outside when school was going on or something similar" how do you force people to learn?
The accused thought they were teaching the girl a lesson. For doing what? Hanging out with a guy friend at 8ish PM? *Even though this was said in the documentary, the accused also said that the plan was to drink and go to an illegal red light district. So contradiction*
I think until everyone is taught to respect men and women equally, and taught that they both have the same rights and position in society this problem will exist. Men need to stop objectifying women.
Now I understand that this, just like educating everyone in the country, is a distant dream, so till then I am all in for disaster management (life prison or hanging).

OT: With all due respect to our culture, it was disheartening when the wife of one of the accused said that she would smother her kid and kill herself if her goddamn 'pati parmeshwar' was hanged.

Last edited by akshaymahajan : 9th March 2015 at 19:47.
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Old 9th March 2015, 20:59   #809
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Default Re: The Delhi Bus Rape Case. UPDATE: Ram Singh Suicide, 4 others sentenced to death

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OT: With all due respect to our culture, it was disheartening when the wife of one of the accused said that she would smother her kid and kill herself if her goddamn 'pati parmeshwar' was hanged.
That just goes on to show their illiterate mindset! I think the wife of this accused ******* should also be arrested for such a statement! They don't deserve to be humans! Utterly Disgusting!
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Old 9th March 2015, 21:05   #810
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Default Re: The Delhi Bus Rape Case. UPDATE: Ram Singh Suicide, 4 others sentenced to death

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The accused thought they were teaching the girl a lesson.
This bugged me a lot. Who were they to teach any lesson? U cannot play GOD just because you had some alcohol in you or the receiving end is a woman.

Education is not the only answer to this. Proof: The lawyer who told that he will burn his own daughter or sister in view of his entire family, if they ever went out before marriage.
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