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Old 7th April 2011, 17:22   #2836
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Default Re: Bodybuilding - Exercises and Supplements

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Originally Posted by avisidhu View Post
Hi Guys,

Have been working out for around two months now. My gym timings are 7:30 PM onwards, for an hour or so. Usually have dinner 15 minutes after I'm done with the work out. Reason being, everything is done inside the office campus, typical bachelors life Weigh close to 90Kgs with a height of 183 cms, so am overweight by around 5KGs. Try to combine weight training with 10 to 15 minutes of cardio.

The problem I'm facing is that if I restrict dinner, I start feeling hungry after around two hours. I usually go to sleep around 12:30 am. What kind of a diet schedule would you recommend for me?

Many thanks in advance.
Hi Avisidhu, firstly take pics of yourself, maintain logs of how much you lift how many times how often and also of what you eat. Also check your bodyfat levels to start keeping track as you progress.

Try eating clean ideally (not fried oily etc.) and get quality protein and stress on complex carbs etc and up the daily fibre and water intake.

Night is a great time to workout since it boosts recovery and aids muscle growth since you are sleeping/resting postworkout and not going through an entire day's proceedings.

Do your cardio postworkout only, for minimum of 20 minutes, and then give a cool down or stretch.

You must ingest quality protein within 30-45 minutes or max an hour of your weight training. Here I will strongly advise whey protein and whey protein only, but this postworkout meal can also be egg whites, chicken, fish, soyabean, milk etc sources of protein.

If you stayin up late nights then do keep a snack option ready for bedtime, could be a tuna+egg white sandwich in wheat bread, or anything which works well for you.

Morning cardio is best done on empty stomach if you planning on losing some stubborn fat, and also avoid any simple carbs post 5-6pm, that's when your metabolism starts slowing down.

In case you are investing in hi-intensity cardio postworkout then a serving of simple carbs (dextrose preferably) is also advisable postworkout, alongwith the protein stuff. It helps restore glycogen levels and also gives a much needed insulin spike to get nutrients to muscles sooner.

The only thing to avoid postworkout is fats.

Do not restrict dinner, this is also your postworkout meal and has to be quality and not necessarily big. You start feeling hungry as the body needs food in the next 2-3 hours again post training and even post your postworkout meal. The bedtime snack will help this and also see you through the night.

Breakfast needs to be big for both people training at night, for this reason, as it is for those training mornings!

I will advise a supplement stack if you looking to build muscle, or else regular food is best for pure fitness purposes.

Have fun!

Last edited by mandheers : 7th April 2011 at 17:23.
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Old 15th April 2011, 12:18   #2837
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Default Re: Bodybuilding - Exercises and Supplements

Here's some motivation for those looking for a reason.

The man's been lifting and been in great shape for countless years now.

He still hits the gym every day, time of day notwithstanding, and cycles around Mumbai to studios and even to his farmhouse near Khandala.

These were taken by a freind's friend after Sallu's workout.
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Old 28th April 2011, 21:37   #2838
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Default Re: Bodybuilding - Exercises and Supplements

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I currently weigh 73 kgs and have a not-so-fantastic looking tummy; so basically my goal was to neutralize that fat tummy by building up my upper body, at the same time reduce the fat.
After working out quite good 3-4 months i feel that my upper body is growing, as i was taking pictures and keeping a track of it.

However I feel that my question was unanswered, as i can see my tummy still bulging out, and no amount of fat is getting reduced. So what is the effective way on consistently reducing the belly fat. I know that it is not going to improve overnight, but unfortunately heavy training hasn't helped much either.

Any tips for dinner menu and exercises for belly fat reduction ?

Also I stopped/reduced doing crunches as they say, that muscles will expand and the tummy would look more bulged out because of the excessive fat on top of the muscles.
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Old 28th April 2011, 22:21   #2839
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Default Re: Bodybuilding - Exercises and Supplements

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Originally Posted by Fraz33r View Post
After working out quite good 3-4 months i feel that my upper body is growing, as i was taking pictures and keeping a track of it.

However I feel that my question was unanswered, as i can see my tummy still bulging out, and no amount of fat is getting reduced. So what is the effective way on consistently reducing the belly fat. I know that it is not going to improve overnight, but unfortunately heavy training hasn't helped much either.

Any tips for dinner menu and exercises for belly fat reduction ?

Also I stopped/reduced doing crunches as they say, that muscles will expand and the tummy would look more bulged out because of the excessive fat on top of the muscles.
1. Stop carbs after 6pm. Eat ONLY proteins. Eat lots of it. Proteins not used by the body for muscle building will be converted to energy.

2. Lots of cardio based activity like running, swimming. Do interval training.

3. Eat 6-8 meals a day. Break it up. Eat just enough to keep your body running. Take 2-3 hour gaps in between meals.

This should do it.

I went on an ALL protein diet for 3-4 months (no rice, chapatis, nothing - I got all my carbs from fruits and brown bread sandwiches) and managed to get a 4 pack by doing what I described above. But its very tough and takes a toll on your mind and body.
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Old 29th April 2011, 15:45   #2840
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fraz33r View Post
After working out quite good 3-4 months i feel that my upper body is growing, as i was taking pictures and keeping a track of it.

However I feel that my question was unanswered, as i can see my tummy still bulging out, and no amount of fat is getting reduced. So what is the effective way on consistently reducing the belly fat. I know that it is not going to improve overnight, but unfortunately heavy training hasn't helped much either.

Any tips for dinner menu and exercises for belly fat reduction ?

Also I stopped/reduced doing crunches as they say, that muscles will expand and the tummy would look more bulged out because of the excessive fat on top of the muscles.
And it won't help much if you do the way most ppl traditionally do it.
(*You = usual/general personal, not necessarily Fraz33r)

1. You need to realize what is heavy. Heavy = picking up a weight with a set target or reps.
If these no of reps is 3 or so - unless you are blessed with high metabolism - you will only pile up on lard. Or else you keep doing these 3 reps for the entire day - to get some metabolic effect.

Remember any exercise that raises your heart rate - and keeps it elevated for a long time - is going to cut down you lard more.

2. You drop the weights down (negative/eccentric) and use the rebound energy of the stretching muscles to lift up the weight as fast as you can (positive/concentric).
This is a sheer no-no. Unless you plan to impress your friends with bench-press/squat figures.

You need to resist the weight going down. At each point of the eccentric - you should be in a position to reverse the movement.
You need to pause at the max stretch position for some time. This will not allow you to utilize the stretch-rebound energy of your muscles and tendons.
You need to push/pull the weight again slowly - fighting with it.

Some ppl believe that the positive/concentric should be done as fast as possible. Well I don't dispute it - but human body has a tendency of doing things in rhythm - and when you do your positives fast - you will start dropping the weight, as well utilizing the stretch energy. Thus essentially in your next rep, your muscles are not being utilized 100%.

Therefore I am of the view that your positive motion should also be slow and controlled. No acceleration.

1 rep should take at least 5 seconds to complete. Use a stopwatch to time yourself - at least initially!
You will be surprised how fast everyone completes movement - and how much killing is the slow movt.

3. You take 5 minutes of rest between the sets. Not required.
If you are aiming to improve your 1RM figures, then long rest are good because it enables you to replenish your creatine stores.
Helping you with max effort lifts.

That is not your aim.
Your rest interval between the sets should be as less as possible.
Just enough to bring the heart rate and breathing to manageable levels.
Which is usually less than a minute.

This will not allow you to complete the no of reps you did in last set.
Good. Indulge in rest/pause technique. Say your target reps are 6.
You did first set of 6 reps.
Took a 1 min break and came back.

This time you can do only 4. Keep the weight down for 10 seconds and then try to complete the remaining 2 (or more if possible!) reps.

Rest for 1 minute.
Repeat.


What we are trying to do is to make your metabolic system tax more than your nervous system.
This will make you lose fat.

At the same time your muscles will not loose their mass (incidentally you may look bigger - because of increased sarcoplasmic hypertrophy - pumped up look).
You may not see great improvements in strength though.

Last edited by alpha1 : 29th April 2011 at 15:56.
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Old 29th April 2011, 18:43   #2841
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Default Re: Bodybuilding - Exercises and Supplements

Hey guys,
Been on this thread after a real long time. Read the last few pages and have got really interested in Strong lifts 5x5. Keen to give it a go, infact starting this today.

I've been working out for a while now and usually follow the 3 days split with cardio on the 4th day with no great results to show.

As of now I weigh in at 87 kgs, height 5.11" and approximate body fat of 23%.
Short term goal is to get the body fat to 15%

Cheers
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Old 29th April 2011, 20:40   #2842
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Default Re: Bodybuilding - Exercises and Supplements

Some comments from my side

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fraz33r View Post
After working out quite good 3-4 months i feel that my upper body is growing, as i was taking pictures and keeping a track of it.

What about your lower body ? Or are you interested only in 50% of your body ?

However I feel that my question was unanswered, as i can see my tummy still bulging out, and no amount of fat is getting reduced. So what is the effective way on consistently reducing the belly fat. I know that it is not going to improve overnight, but unfortunately heavy training hasn't helped much either.

When on a surplus of diet where you are trying to build tissue to body, however hard you try, you might be left with a paunch unless you are a professional. If you can invest the whole of your day into body building, you can take care of the bulge, but otherwise, eating well might leave you a bulge in belly. So, if you cant invest more time taking care of this, the best way is to work a little harder, put a li'l more weight and then cut down calories keeping protein intake the same. Body will lose some muscle, but it will lose fat too. Clean eating is not an easy thing as pointed out earlier.
If you are driven by the glossy fitness magazine models or bodybuilding professionals, they are assisted by a lot of things like drugs, diuritics, photoshop etc.
If a working man's flat belly is what you want, you ve got to do what a working man does. Do physical work all day and eat clean, unfortunately this is not practical. Even AM and PM workout even is not possible for most.


Any tips for dinner menu and exercises for belly fat reduction ?

I have heard this no carb post 6PM before, but I never had a good experience with that. I would say low carb, stay away from white rice and whatever you are having, have in very low quantity.

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Old 29th April 2011, 23:30   #2843
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Default Re: Bodybuilding - Exercises and Supplements

Started with SL 5x5 today and it felt nice, different.
How do you guys measure how much you lifted?

Today for squats I did, 2x45 lbs plate + 1x10 lbs plate on each side, so thats 200 lbs plus the weight of the Olympic bar - 45 lbs. Thats a total of 245 lbs. Is this correct?

Some queries regarding SL, is it complete? I mean when do the the traps get worked? What about the calf muscle and when do the hamstrings get worked? Biceps and triceps will be worked during barbell rows and bench press.

Thanks in advance.
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Old 30th April 2011, 20:29   #2844
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Originally Posted by hiren.mistry View Post
Started with SL 5x5 today and it felt nice, different.
How do you guys measure how much you lifted?

Today for squats I did, 2x45 lbs plate + 1x10 lbs plate on each side, so thats 200 lbs plus the weight of the Olympic bar - 45 lbs. Thats a total of 245 lbs. Is this correct?

Oh My !
As far as stronglifts goes, that is not correct.
Mehdi asks you to start with an empty Olympic bar, which of course weighs 45 lbs. And you add 2.5 pounds each side every workout.
You have taken a giant leap, and most probably you would hit a plateau in a week.
This is over 100kgs which I presume is more than your bodyweight. It is almost 1.5Xbodyweight for me, which sure is not the way to start with stronglifts.

Stronglifts make you squat thrice a week. You have got to start very low so that the body adapts to this. And when you can squat 5X5 for 3 days a week, for 12 weeks, you have to stop stronglifts and switch over to something else. Pls read the ebook carefully. There is a facebook fan page with good responses.

Some queries regarding SL, is it complete? I mean when do the the traps get worked? What about the calf muscle and when do the hamstrings get worked? Biceps and triceps will be worked during barbell rows and bench press.

From my understanding, it is correct. Traps, sure they get worked during deadlifts, dips, OHP, and bench press, although as assistors. With the volume involved, this is more than enough. Calf gets worked really well with heavy squats although you would need a different program if you want bodybuilder calves. Isometric (.... I forgot the term) works the calves.
Hamstrings do get worked really well with deadlifts (if you are doing in right, you will know it very well) and squats.
And squats -- No I do not agree that squats is a quad exercise, then everybody would have been able to squat as much as you leg press. Squats, done with top of thighs parallel to floor or lower than that requires good hamstrings if you lift heavy and do it the right way.

Thanks in advance.
Hiren, you should also note that stronglifts is not an average bodybuilding routine. It aims at making you strong and works on the groups that make you strong. It gives you an overall good physique which would give enough confidence to walk around in briefs. But I really do not starting to squat 3X a week, with more than your bodyweight and 5X5 is asking for trouble.
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Old 30th April 2011, 20:43   #2845
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Originally Posted by ashokrajagopal View Post
Hiren, you should also note that stronglifts is not an average bodybuilding routine. It aims at making you strong and works on the groups that make you strong. It gives you an overall good physique which would give enough confidence to walk around in briefs. But I really do not starting to squat 3X a week, with more than your bodyweight and 5X5 is asking for trouble.
Oh! Thanks for the response Ashok. I do have the ebook but have not read it completely. I just read the link on his website and got going.
But if you say that I should start with a empty bar and go about adding 4 pounds, I would tire of it very soon.

Perhaps I should really read that ebook and see how it goes. Alternatively, I can halve the weight I am doing and give it a go for 3 months.

Cheers
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Old 1st May 2011, 18:29   #2846
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Hiren, I wouldnt endorse that even.
See, the point is that a program is created for a given objective and it has to be followed correctly to get the right result. When you start with something else other than empty bar, it actually is not Stronglifts 5X5, it is something else.
In the e-book, Mehdi advises to start with 10 kg plates on both sides if you are an experienced squatter -- ~2 years of lifting and very well equipped with form and flexibility. Most people are not of this kind IMO.

And in case you are not hitting a plateau in 3 weeks starting with your bodyweight 5X5 and 3 times a week, you are blessed with very good powerlifting genetics. Stop whatever job you do, and get on to be a professional in powerlifting !

I never did stronglifts, cos of a variety of reasons. I made my own 5X5 program and it worked for me. While I could give the credit to Mehdi, I sure cannot blame him for the plateaus I hit or any other issues I face -- I dint follow his program, its actually my program.

BTW, I cant do stronglifts cos of the reasons below.
1. No 1.25 kg plates in any gym around my place. Adding more than 2.5kg per workout on 5X5 on Bench press and OHP stalls pretty easily. My experience.
2. Cant squat and bench press on the same day. The day I have to bench press, I have to reach 15 mins early and wait so I can get a bench.
Everyday is National Chest Day in almost all gyms.
3. No place to deadlift in any gyms I've gone to. My deadlift days start with cleaning the area around by removing all the thrown away dumbells, and weights and arranging a sort of platform for deadlift. Cant have so much of time doing such stuff if I have already done a 5X5 squat, for a 1X5 deadlift which Stronglifts recommends.

Last edited by ashokrajagopal : 1st May 2011 at 18:33.
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Old 2nd May 2011, 11:24   #2847
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FOA,
Thanks (in words ) for the detailed post!
Explains everything you say, clearly enough!

SOA,
please help me with some more things here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by alpha1 View Post

2. You drop the weights down (negative/eccentric) and use the rebound energy of the stretching muscles to lift up the weight as fast as you can (positive/concentric).
This is a sheer no-no. Unless you plan to impress your friends with bench-press/squat figures.

You need to resist the weight going down. At each point of the eccentric - you should be in a position to reverse the movement.
You need to pause at the max stretch position for some time. This will not allow you to utilize the stretch-rebound energy of your muscles and tendons.
You need to push/pull the weight again slowly - fighting with it.
...

Therefore I am of the view that your positive motion should also be slow and controlled. No acceleration.

...

You will be surprised how fast everyone completes movement - and how much killing is the slow movt.

explained beautifully!

3. You take 5 minutes of rest between the sets. Not required.
If you are aiming to improve your 1RM figures, then long rest are good because it enables you to replenish your creatine stores.
Helping you with max effort lifts.
(Can you elaborate the part - It helps improve 1RM figures, and what you say about creatine here?)

That is not your aim.
Your rest interval between the sets should be as less as possible.
Just enough to bring the heart rate and breathing to manageable levels.
Which is usually less than a minute.

One query here:
My muscles get hard/tough easily sometimes, with first set of reps itself. (e.g. forearms).
Is it right for me to wait, till the muscle loosens up just a little, or totally loosen it up, or just keep pumping with a hard-muscle?
The Hard muscle is difficult to work with, and reps fall to like 1/3rd! and then, what you have mentioned below (the very short gap, with weight in hand), also does not work then..

This will not allow you to complete the no of reps you did in last set.
Good. Indulge in rest/pause technique. Say your target reps are 6.
You did first set of 6 reps.
Took a 1 min break and came back.

This time you can do only 4. Keep the weight down for 10 seconds and then try to complete the remaining 2 (or more if possible!) reps.
..

At the same time your muscles will not loose their mass (incidentally you may look bigger - because of increased sarcoplasmic hypertrophy - pumped up look).
You may not see great improvements in strength though.
The way you have explained, I think is good enough to be a books content!

Thanks,

Ace.
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Old 2nd May 2011, 18:28   #2848
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3. You take 5 minutes of rest between the sets. Not required.
If you are aiming to improve your 1RM figures, then long rest are good because it enables you to replenish your creatine stores.
Helping you with max effort lifts.
Quote:
(Can you elaborate the part - It helps improve 1RM figures, and what you say about creatine here?)
What I meant is this:
Your muscle utilize three levels of energy system -
1. adenosine triphosphate-phosphocreatine system - this is for short bursts of extreme high power - for activities lasting less than 30 seconds (rough approximation).
2. anaerobic glycolysis - this is for prolonged higher force - for activities lasting to 2 minutes or so.
3. aerobic metabolism - this is the usual aerobic method

At a given moment - all thee are used. However the fuel runs out in following way:
Your body has enough phosphocreatine stores for about 20 seconds. If the acticity has to last more than that - the muscles cannot sustain the force.
Hence, the anearobic glycosis comes into picture (which causes the lactic acid burn). If the activity is further longer - the anearobic way becomes increasingly inefficient and the aerobic becomes the preferred way.
Thus you need to use lower weight if you wish to continue with more reps.

Now when you utilize the creatine in your muscles, it needs to get replenished before being summoned again.
This replnishement is roughtly 50% in 30 seconds, 75% in 1 minute, and so on.

If your aim is to better your 1RM figures, you will utilize all the creatine in yoru muscle you can have. Otherwise - it will result in utilizing the anearobic glycosis route, and you not being able to get higher force.
Second aspect is the increaasing the 1RM figure is more about neuro adaptations. So in order to truly increase your 1RM, you need to handle 1RM loads.
Otherwise your CNS and local motor units simply don't adapt and become increasingly efficient. (kind of like your muscle become efficient and strong only when you load them)

Now if your creatine is running low in your muscles, you won't be able to lift heaviest. And that means not being able to train the nervous system.
Thus if you plan to increase your 1RM-3RM - which utilizes the creatine mode of energy almost exclusively, you need to rest long enough to replenish the stores before attacking he weight again.

3 minutes minimum.

So how will ingesting creatine supplement help? Of course it will help you in replenishing your stores. While working out as well as after workout.
However, taking these long rests does little to keep your metabolism high (this is useful if you wish to reduce the fat on your body, without losing any muscles).
Therefore my advise of keeping 'em short.

Quote:
One query here:
My muscles get hard/tough easily sometimes, with first set of reps itself. (e.g. forearms).
Is it right for me to wait, till the muscle loosens up just a little, or totally loosen it up, or just keep pumping with a hard-muscle?
The Hard muscle is difficult to work with, and reps fall to like 1/3rd! and then, what you have mentioned below (the very short gap, with weight in hand), also does not work then..
This happens only with forearms?

I understand that if you are pumped up like a balloon, in all possibility, your muscles are fatigued to their extent, and lifting further is not possible.
That means you have to take longer rest, before attempting another set, in order to reduce the temporary fatigue.

Last edited by alpha1 : 2nd May 2011 at 18:30.
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Old 2nd May 2011, 18:42   #2849
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Hiren, you should also note that stronglifts is not an average bodybuilding routine. It aims at making you strong and works on the groups that make you strong. It gives you an overall good physique which would give enough confidence to walk around in briefs. But I really do not starting to squat 3X a week, with more than your bodyweight and 5X5 is asking for trouble.
Hi Ashok, can you post the Mehdi ebook here if it's not a large file?

I found some strength training ones but the sizes are huge. Will post links tomorrow.

How's your training going so far? Diet? Gripwork?
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Old 2nd May 2011, 19:48   #2850
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Mandheers, the current version is large I guess. I might have an older version stored somewhere, let me fetch that.
It is available for free from stronglifts.com.

About my training -- not all that great. Had to take off 2 weeks last month cos of some personal engagements. Will lose two more weeks this month too, so I am running in maintenance mode.
About my grip, its not all that improving. Had to switch to a new gym cos my old one closed down -- Its a pain to deadlift here cos of lack of 20 kg plates platform etc.
Hanging in there and deadlifting once a week. Doing some grip work too, like plate hold etc. Working mostly in singles for deadlifts.
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