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Old 21st January 2017, 11:50   #2236
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Default Re: Government scraps Rs 500 and Rs 1000 notes!

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Originally Posted by Sawyer View Post
It is very visible that here, as in the rest of the country, for all that it has or has not done, demonetisation has definitely provided the smoke and confusion to obscure the real issue that faces the country, the elephant in the room: What is being done to create the approximately 250 million new and genuinely value adding jobs that will be needed by about 2025-30? On the success of that effort will hinge the social unrest potential from the corresponding number of young people if they don't have something useful and constructive to do, that also brings them the commensurate rewards and benefits of growth.
I agree, and running a country has to be more about the macro-picture, and should be done by people with a lot of conscience, development isn't about generating or recovering pieces of paper, inordinately. Those pieces of paper are only means for getting to a better tomorrow in multiple ways.

This move reminds me of the Running Man movie, the host exposes the hoarders and the public cheers loudly proclaiming that "the devils shall run whence they came". I've no doubt that disparities in income has always been a major issue, but this move isn't going to solve that because it has affected every class of people equally. My theory is that the rich (who may have a considerable asset base which is in some portion, undeclared), are the key drivers of the luxury market. The luxury market hires and pays normal people to do their job so that they can take home their blue-collar earnings and support a family. Cash has to be readily liquid, readily accessible and has to have a certain "discretion" when spent in smaller quantities, that is when it is effective in churning the economy. Money was, is and will ALWAYS remain an imperfect concept. The government misuses money and generates black, the banks misuse money, the people also misuse money - FACT.

You've pointed out at creating jobs and ensuring a stable working environment for the generation of tomorrow so that crimes, and anti-social activities do not grow any faster that they already are. You are right and that is a level of thinking beyond the obviously promoted "corruption is bad" movement, which is also valid but is a base thinking.

I go yet another level above to say that the governing bodies must act NOW, before its too late, in matters of honest, good infrastructure, i.e good roads that do not peel off in one monsoon, renewable sources of energy in the power department, water conservation and ensuring reach of water, cleaning up lakes, ensuring organized plantation drives, forest conservation, ensuring tighter and more honest, transparent laws which consider more than just the factor of "wealth" of the defendant, and a flexible, single taxation system which doesn't put so much stress on the limited tax-payers of the nation (which may start with GST). They should incentivize tax-payers and also start a national insurance scheme just for the honest tax-payers than flog them and spit on them.

My opinion, I don't expect anyone to agree nor I expect them to become reality. Let's get back to the cheering now.

Last edited by dark.knight : 21st January 2017 at 11:51.
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Old 22nd January 2017, 07:03   #2237
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Default Re: Government scraps Rs 500 and Rs 1000 notes!

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I go yet another level above to say that the governing bodies must act NOW, before its too late, in matters of honest, good infrastructure, i.e good roads that do not peel off in one monsoon, renewable sources of energy in the power department, water conservation and ensuring reach of water, cleaning up lakes, ensuring organized plantation drives, forest conservation, ensuring tighter and more honest, transparent laws which consider more than just the factor of "wealth" of the defendant, and a flexible, single taxation system which doesn't put so much stress on the limited tax-payers of the nation (which may start with GST). They should incentivize tax-payers and also start a national insurance scheme just for the honest tax-payers than flog them and spit on them.

My opinion, I don't expect anyone to agree nor I expect them to become reality. Let's get back to the cheering now.
To summarise on these recommendations that can be debated for their prioritisation: Much more of enabling governance and much less of glib sloganeering and overbearing government.

One missed recommendation is the development of human infrastructure via health and education. Everything else needs that as a foundation for things to be sustainable and cannot progress faster than the speed at which the foundation gets built.
Whether they become reality or not, I can't see a way forward in their absence, and I am not seeing any real forward progress on any of them.

Meanwhile, the distraction of this farce.

Last edited by Sawyer : 22nd January 2017 at 07:05.
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Old 22nd January 2017, 10:11   #2238
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Default Re: Government scraps Rs 500 and Rs 1000 notes!

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What is being done to create the approximately 250 million new and genuinely value adding jobs that will be needed by about 2025-30?
This is, as I understand it, the stated objective of the Make in India initiative.
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Old 22nd January 2017, 10:18   #2239
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As I have already mentioned in here, only time will tell. Yes, it is too early to judge now. That is my opinion.
This was a political decision. Taken by politicians by excluding the experts. To achieve political ends. We will know the effectiveness of this political decision after the election results. . Utopian analysis of this issue will die down soon as everything adjusts to the new rules and regulations .

Guys don't be disappointed. Just be aware and vigilant about more scrutiny. And hire good accountants and lawyers. Or consider these professions as career options if you are about to enter the work force.

Personally I'd like people to spend more on better doctors and better healthcare. But I'm biased.
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Old 22nd January 2017, 10:38   #2240
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Default Re: Government scraps Rs 500 and Rs 1000 notes!

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Much more of enabling governance and much less of glib sloganeering and overbearing government.
Yeah, pretty much.

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One missed recommendation is the development of human infrastructure via health and education. Everything else needs that as a foundation for things to be sustainable and cannot progress faster than the speed at which the foundation gets built.
My main fear, when is comes to education is something that everyone knows about knowledge, its a double sided missile and when it backfires, no logic, truth, or even laws of physics or biology can stop it. Bureaucracy aka paper pushing aka personification of pure evil grows 100x in strength with a great education. Yes much of the good on this earth is also due to education, but it depends on the inherent quality of an individual and his/her background and process that made them who they are. A person of modest background can easily use education to get ahead by nefarious means, yet sticking to the safe side of the law, at the same time another person of similar background can understand core realities and try to change the system such that others need not face what they have.

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Meanwhile, the distraction of this farce.
Couldn't have said it better myself.

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Guys don't be disappointed. Just be aware and vigilant about more scrutiny. And hire good accountants and lawyers. Or consider these professions as career options if you are about to enter the work force.
This is very, very essential. Following the law to its finest interpretations is the first step, second step is to keep the most talented, twisted yet loyal chartered accountants and lawyers. Otherwise one is going to get eaten up alive in this Orwellian society.
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Old 22nd January 2017, 10:38   #2241
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Default Re: Government scraps Rs 500 and Rs 1000 notes!

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This was a political decision. Taken by politicians by excluding the experts. To achieve political ends. We will know the effectiveness of this political decision after the election results. .
.....
Utopian analysis of this issue will die down soon as everything adjusts to the new rules and regulations
Personally I'd like people to spend more on better doctors and better healthcare. But I'm biased.
As for the decision remember Indira backed off due to election fears.

Spend on better healthcare & doctors. Excellent, but who pays for it. Unless you have more surplus / reserves these things are not possible. remember the days of liberal spend and spend Keynesian economics are long over. Today you need to smell the cash before committing it.
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Old 22nd January 2017, 12:26   #2242
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As for the decision remember Indira backed off due to election fears.

Spend on better healthcare & doctors. Excellent, but who pays for it. Unless you have more surplus / reserves these things are not possible. remember the days of liberal spend and spend Keynesian economics are long over. Today you need to smell the cash before committing it.
I meant I would have preferred the resources they are going to go into accountants and lawyers to instead have gone to improving /maintaining of our citizens' health.
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Old 22nd January 2017, 20:23   #2243
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This is, as I understand it, the stated objective of the Make in India initiative.
Except that I have not come across anything more than the slogan, and some logos for this "initiative", in line with all the other slogans of the last few years, so it seems to just be wishful thinking by those dreaming up these slogans. Not surprising therefore that there is no sign of any meat behind the words in terms of how many jobs, in which sectors, and how many each year connecting that to training, education and infrastructure needs to be addressed to make this more than just casually tossed out words. And of course, no year by year targets for how many jobs will be created, with actuals reported there against to the extent years have passed.

IMO, just one example of the empty sloganeering that proliferates these days.
And we are caught up with GDP growth percentages, with no sense of the extent to which this is adding genuine jobs.

For instance, I remember reading recently that in the last decade or two, banking business transactions/volumes have increased 10-15 times, but jobs in that sector have gone up by less than 10%. That is where the jobless growth concerns come from, because with automation and productivity improvement drives, something similar is happening in manufacturing as well.

So, where do we see 250 million new jobs coming from? I don't have the answer, but the country needs to find these answers and start acting on them, fast. On a war footing, IMO.

My last off topic post on this subject in this thread.
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Old 22nd January 2017, 21:41   #2244
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Default Re: Government scraps Rs 500 and Rs 1000 notes!

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Except that I have not come across anything more than the slogan, and some logos for this "initiative", in line with all the other slogans of the last few years, so it seems to just be wishful thinking by those dreaming up these slogans. Not surprising therefore that there is no sign of any meat behind the words in terms of how many jobs, in which sectors, and how many each year connecting that to training, education and infrastructure needs to be addressed to make this more than just casually tossed out words. And of course, no year by year targets for how many jobs will be created, with actuals reported there against to the extent years have passed.
The Make in India website seems to have the kind of information you are looking for - targets & achievements. Apparently the focus of the initiative is on 25 industry sectors; the website has aggregate and reports specific to each of these sectors. I am reading through some of them right now.

Site: www.makeinindia.com
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Old 24th January 2017, 14:12   #2245
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Not sure to what extent this is true but an interesting read nevertheless:

http://www.globalresearch.ca/demonet...n-cash/5570305
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Old 24th January 2017, 16:19   #2246
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Not sure to what extent this is true but an interesting read nevertheless:

http://www.globalresearch.ca/demonet...n-cash/5570305
That is a known propaganda site.

https://www.quora.com/Journalistic-E...lobal-Research
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Old 25th January 2017, 10:05   #2247
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That is a known propaganda site.
Something to chew on from Horse's Mouth

http://www.firstpost.com/business/ta...y-3215860.html

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All the talk on cashless economy is an unreal thing. This is an agenda of the multinational fintech technology and communication companies. Financial inclusion and cashless economy are contradictory,
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Old 25th January 2017, 11:32   #2248
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Something to chew on from Horse's Mouth
Also mentioned in the blog:

http://norberthaering.de/en/home/27-...-role-in-india
http://norberthaering.de/en/home/32-...65-pot-of-gold
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Old 25th January 2017, 14:53   #2249
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Default Re: Government scraps Rs 500 and Rs 1000 notes!

Something I had hoped not to happen, but feared it might, since the probability was quite high.
My wife just called me saying she found an envelope somewhere from the cupboard, with old 500 notes totaling 4000.

The last news I read on it is that only NRI's/people outside India during Nov/Dec will be allowed to exchange these from RBI branches, that too limited to just 5 locations across India.

Was there any update to this? Can I still get these exchanged even though I was very much in India and I am not an NRI?
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Old 25th January 2017, 15:03   #2250
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@vinit.merchant; I must say I am surprise at the discovery of a packet with old notes. My wife and I searched our stashes and came up with all the cash, adding up to about ₹213,000. We went and deposited all of it in my account in one go around 12th November.

We had done an extensive search and found nothing else. Our son found all of 38k and deposited it around the 5th December. Not surprised since Gurugram is almost totally cashless, even a panwallah accepts plastic. They need the cash to pay their cleaning maid, and car cleaner and not much else.
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