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Old 4th May 2016, 14:21   #2506
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Default Re: A YetiGuideŽ : How To Post In Proper English

Therein lies my dilemma; should I tell my son to start reading newspapers and risk losing his sense of grammar, or not read newspapers and be unaware of current events.
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Old 4th May 2016, 14:30   #2507
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Default Re: A YetiGuideŽ : How To Post In Proper English

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Originally Posted by anupmathur View Post
The print media is taking its toll on me; I am beginning to doubt things I learnt at school!
Does one resign a post/job or does one resign from a post/job?
I was taught to say "...resigned from the post of secretary general (or whatever)".
In my opinion, you either resign from your job or quit your job. However, my language skills have gone considerably South in the last decade thanks to dealing constantly with US English, Indian English and UK English. So I am no longer sure about anything!
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Old 4th May 2016, 14:36   #2508
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Default Re: A YetiGuideŽ : How To Post In Proper English

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Does one resign a post/job or does one resign from a post/job?
I was taught to say "...resigned from the post of secretary general (or whatever)".
"Resigned" is used in several ways. Another one- to add to your list- is "My boss was too much handle, so I resigned".
Am not very sure which of the two ways you have used it is correct. "I resigned my position as head of marketing" sounds correct to me, if a little American.

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Therein lies my dilemma; should I tell my son to start reading newspapers and risk losing his sense of grammar, or not read newspapers and be unaware of current events.
I'd encourage you to let him read whatever he can lay his hands on. As long as its mostly good stuff, he will soon learn to process what is good and bad writing on his own. As a child I remember reading some very good books way beyond my recommended reading age and all it did was to make me realise that Chacha Chaudhri type of stuff was toxic (purely from an English language perspective). Parents worry that their children will be subject to evil influences but reading a book is probably the least harmful way to get 'corrupted"! Video games, spending time online and watching violent/sexual movies are far worse.

Of course for very small children you need to worry about age-appropriateness but 10 and above I'd say let them read whatever they want!
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Old 4th May 2016, 14:45   #2509
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Default Re: A YetiGuideŽ : How To Post In Proper English

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Originally Posted by noopster View Post
.... "My boss was too much handle, so I resigned".
I presume you mean, "My boss was too much to handle, so I resigned".

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Originally Posted by noopster View Post
Am not very sure which of the two ways you have used it is correct. "I resigned my position as head of marketing" sounds correct to me, if a little American.
And I would say, "I resigned from my position as head of marketing".

... waiting for the Englishman to come in.

Last edited by anupmathur : 4th May 2016 at 14:46.
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Old 4th May 2016, 23:03   #2510
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Default Re: A YetiGuideŽ : How To Post In Proper English

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Therein lies my dilemma; should I tell my son to start reading newspapers and risk losing his sense of grammar, or not read newspapers and be unaware of current events.
My father was a journalist, retired 1967. You do what he did: tell your child that the English used in newspapers is journalistic English, and that he should not talk or write that way. Or, at least, not until he gets a job with a newspaper!

You could also give him a red maker pen and get him to play spot the mistakes. Newspaper English is one thing. nonsense is another. Send his work to the editor every day!

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... However, my language skills have gone considerably South in the last decade thanks to dealing constantly with US English, Indian English and UK English. So I am no longer sure about anything!
Oh, I know how you feel! I have not answered the "resigned" question, because I am just not sure if "resigned his post" is just the usage that I hear here, or if it is standard English.

The Americans seem to be a bottomless well of nonsense jargon. Apart from that, other than a handful of words that have quite different meanings in British English, and a few different spellings, I think that the British/American difference is exaggerated. Reading good American literature is not that different to reading good British literature. 20th and 19th century British English literature might even be more different.

Guys, join me in a prayer for the word abbreviation. There is no benefit at all in calling them all acronyms, it is simply throwing out the right word. it is not obscure or difficult.

Spread the word! The word abbreviation: by using it correctly!
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Old 4th May 2016, 23:58   #2511
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anupmathur View Post
I presume you mean, "My boss was too much to handle, so I resigned".


And I would say, "I resigned from my position as head of marketing".

... waiting for the Englishman to come in.
Both sentences

Not an Englishman but a once-upon-a-time disciple of "Wren and Martin"
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Old 5th May 2016, 10:48   #2512
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You could just say, "OK", if someone asks you to not feel sorry.
Right, will do. Hopefully, I won't have to get into that situation too often.

On another note, what do you all make of this headline I read today on livemint.com ?

"Monsoon arrival forecast on 15 May:Harsh Vardhan"

I didn't understand whether
1. The forecast for the arrival of the monsoon will be given on May 15th or
2. The monsoon itself is forecast to arrive on May 15th (quite unlikely, but you never know in today's climatic change era)

I had to open the article and read the first couple of paragraphs to understand that it is just the forecast that will be given out on May 15th.

Is this correct usage on part of the newspaper? Shouldn't it have been :"Forecast for monsoon arrival on 15 May" ? Or something else that is simpler & quicker to understand?

Headline writing is tricky I acknowledge, but shouldn't the emphasis be on clarity than brevity?

Or am I simply reading it wrong?
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Old 5th May 2016, 12:25   #2513
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Default Re: A YetiGuideŽ : How To Post In Proper English

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Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom View Post

Guys, join me in a prayer for the word abbreviation. There is no benefit at all in calling them all acronyms, it is simply throwing out the right word. it is not obscure or difficult.

Spread the word! The word abbreviation: by using it correctly!
Pardon me for trying to differentiate between the two. I think "Abbreviation" is an all encompassing word that includes "shortened versions of long words" as well in addition to the more common "First letter of every word in the phrase". For instance, "Eng" for "English" or "Dev" for "Developer/Development".

On the other hand, something like "DARYL" (Data Analyzing Robot- Youth Life-form" is an acronym.

That's how I differentiate between "Abbreviation" and "Acronym".
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Old 5th May 2016, 12:40   #2514
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Default Re: A YetiGuideŽ : How To Post In Proper English

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Originally Posted by venuvedam View Post

That's how I differentiate between "Abbreviation" and "Acronym".
Yes. But there are people who use the same word for both. Thad feels that everyone uses acronym in place of abbreviation. I find that most people (at least in this part of the country) use abbreviation instead of acronym - simply because acronym is a newer word that rose in popularity in the last 10-20 years whereas abbreviation was already in use
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Old 5th May 2016, 14:14   #2515
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Default Re: A YetiGuideŽ : How To Post In Proper English

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Originally Posted by Sangre View Post
Headline writing is tricky I acknowledge, but shouldn't the emphasis be on clarity than brevity?
There is journalistic English and then there is... Headline English. Headlines are often nonsense. I regularly click on BBC-news "headline" links just to find out what on earth the story is about!

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Originally Posted by venuvedam View Post
Pardon me for trying to differentiate between the two. I think "Abbreviation" is an all encompassing word that includes "shortened versions of long words" as well in addition to the more common "First letter of every word in the phrase". For instance, "Eng" for "English" or "Dev" for "Developer/Development".
Yes, I suppose so, although this does confuse matters a bit, as those abreviations are pronounceable

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On the other hand, something like "DARYL" (Data Analyzing Robot- Youth Life-form" is an acronym
The Key is that we can say "daryl."

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Yes. But there are people who use the same word for both.
They do. They shouldn't. They are wrong. Feel free to correct them, and beat them if they don't listen! .

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Thad feels that everyone uses acronym in place of abbreviation. I find that most people (at least in this part of the country) use abbreviation instead of acronym - simply because acronym is a newer word that rose in popularity in the last 10-20 years whereas abbreviation was already in use
It seems to me to be the opposite. A recent forum posting talks about ANHC as an "acronym" and I seldom hear the word "abbreviation" any longer.

The word acronym is not new. I learnt it in my early childhood from a list of acronyms in a diary, which taught me the origins of the words laser and radar, both acronyms, and still acronyms even though they have become accepted as words.

Acronyms are a subset of abbreviations: the subset that can be pronounced as a word. Acronyms are abbreviations, but all abbreviations (probably most) are not acronyms.

Last edited by Thad E Ginathom : 5th May 2016 at 14:15.
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Old 5th May 2016, 14:25   #2516
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Default Re: A YetiGuideŽ : How To Post In Proper English

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Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom View Post



It seems to me to be the opposite. A recent forum posting talks about ANHC as an "acronym" and I seldom hear the word "abbreviation" any longer.
.
ANHC would be an initialism. SO, to fish out the venn diagrams again , 'Acronyms within initialisms, and that within abbreviations.'
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Old 5th May 2016, 14:31   #2517
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Default Re: A YetiGuideŽ : How To Post In Proper English

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Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom View Post
and beat them if they don't listen!
If I have to beat them - 'abbreviation' would be taking a low priority. There are many other severely irritating usages. Top of the list would be 'can't able to', childrens, 'are you?' in place of 'do you?' (eg. instead of 'do you like movies, they ask 'are you like movies'!!)and such like

Quote:
It seems to me to be the opposite. A recent forum posting talks about ANHC as an "acronym" and I seldom hear the word "abbreviation" any longer.
Many people over here wouldn't even know the word acronym
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Old 5th May 2016, 14:52   #2518
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Default Re: A YetiGuideŽ : How To Post In Proper English

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ANHC would be an initialism ...
That's a new word to me! It seems to exist, although I am not sure it should!

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Originally Posted by mallumowgli View Post
If I have to beat them - 'abbreviation' would be taking a low priority.
LOL --- which, come to think of it, is an acronym!


Quote:
Many people over here wouldn't even know the word acronym
What, on your side of TN?

Check out The Hindu: they don't know the word abbreviation! But then, these days, they don't know much English.
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Old 7th May 2016, 12:45   #2519
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Default Re: A YetiGuideŽ : How To Post In Proper English

Another lost cause.

noun: Gift.
verb: give.
past tense: gave, given... not gifted.

There is never an exception to this, except as an affectation, which it isn't any longer because everybody does it. And because everybody does it, the correct forms are now almost lost. RIP.
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Old 7th May 2016, 13:11   #2520
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Default Re: A YetiGuideŽ : How To Post In Proper English

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Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom View Post
Another lost cause.

noun: Gift.
verb: give.
past tense: gave, given... not gifted.

There is never an exception to this, except as an affectation, which it isn't any longer because everybody does it. And because everybody does it, the correct forms are now almost lost. RIP.
Now you have me confused! Suppose I gave my book to my friend for reading, would that be a gift? I do want him to return it.

On the contrary, if i'd gifted it to him, I would not have had such an expectation.
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