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Old 24th June 2016, 13:33   #2581
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Default Re: A YetiGuide® : How To Post In Proper English

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Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom View Post
but all too many of them seem to mostly talk empty rubbish in made-up silly words.
True, as Noopster said such words have their origin in the classroom, by way of either books or professors and before we realise it we're all talking the same way using the same abbreviations and catch-phrases. One has to be very conscious of it to not go down the same path.

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I didn't say TLA was an acronym. TLA stands for three-letter acronym.
Never heard of TLA until today. The revert part is accurate, I've received countless mails asking me to revert back at the earliest. I never paid attention to it until now.. effectively they're asking me to make it as if they never sent the mail at all going by the meaning, not to mention that revert back is redundant usage.

Glad I never used it, all I write is a simple "please confirm at the earliest". This language is indeed peer driven for a very large part.

Last edited by dark.knight : 24th June 2016 at 13:34. Reason: Typo :p
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Old 24th June 2016, 19:24   #2582
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Default Re: A YetiGuide® : How To Post In Proper English

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I didn't say TLA was an acronym. TLA stands for three-letter acronym.
No it doesn't! It stands for Three-Letter Abbreviation, because it is an abbreviation, and it is not an acronym. And I'm so old I can remember the the origin of this. It's a joke: "The last thing we need is more TLAs,"
Quote:
Like ASS for after-sales service
Only an acronym if you say it wrong!

There is nothing wrong with abbreviations or acronyms. They are both great, although India does seem a bit obsessed (ABO) sometimes, like even making up an abbreviation (MUAO) for something that is actually never going to be used in the rest of the newspaper article

[
Quote:
Stewardess: Sir, you can't take that dog on the plane.
Phantom: Don't worry, Devil's not a dog. he's a wolf!

Love it!

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Originally Posted by dark.knight View Post
True, as Noopster said such words have their origin in the classroom, by way of either books or professors and before we realise it we're all talking the same way using the same abbreviations and catch-phrases. One has to be very conscious of it to not go down the same path.

Never heard of TLA until today. The revert part is accurate, I've received countless mails asking me to revert back at the earliest. I never paid attention to it until now.. effectively they're asking me to make it as if they never sent the mail at all going by the meaning, not to mention that revert back is redundant usage.

Glad I never used it, all I write is a simple "please confirm at the earliest". This language is indeed peer driven for a very large part.
Please confirm your date of birth. OK, tell me, and I'll confirm it! But there is no point in explaining this because it is in the script, and the poor person on the phone would not be allowed to change it,

This revert thing. It used to be that people would say "I'll revert to you," but they weren't me in the first place, so that would have been impossible.

There was an recent article on one of the tech news sites about some start-up expo (yes, I have got in the habit of saying expo instead of exhibition) in which the writer told how very few of the exhibitors were able to say, in simple straightforward language, what their company/product actually did.

This situation dates back some time. I used to get glossy brochures from IBM about something that would change my company and solve all per personal problems. By the time I reached the end, the thing I still had no clue about was what they were trying to sell me!

Last edited by Thad E Ginathom : 24th June 2016 at 19:27.
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Old 26th June 2016, 13:03   #2583
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Default Re: A YetiGuide® : How To Post In Proper English

Now British English will have only 3 vowels *a i o* ....
as it has left *e u* ..... ��

I guess Wren and Martin will have to be rewritten.
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Old 6th July 2016, 14:20   #2584
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Default Re: A YetiGuide® : How To Post In Proper English

Somebody mentioned autonomous driving, and it stopped me in my tracks! Autonomous means being in charge, which would imply full manual control, whereas what is meant here is the exact opposite.

After a few minutes I thought, ok: it is the car which autonomous, not the driver!
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Old 21st August 2016, 02:49   #2585
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Default Re: A YetiGuide® : How To Post In Proper English

The BBC: Beyond dumbed down!
Quote:
Nicola Adams became the first British boxer to retain an Olympic title for 92 years by winning gold in the women's flyweight final at Rio 2016...
Goodness, 92 years? How old was she when she first won it?

BBC News item
.
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Old 21st August 2016, 08:45   #2586
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Default Re: A YetiGuide® : How To Post In Proper English

The question is not how old WAS she; it should be "how old IS she now?"

I would say approximately 116 years old. But this also means that the last Olympics was held in 1924.
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Old 21st August 2016, 09:30   #2587
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Default Re: A YetiGuide® : How To Post In Proper English

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... I used to get glossy brochures from IBM about something that would change my company and solve all per personal problems. By the time I reached the end, the thing I still had no clue about was what they were trying to sell me!
The premise is that if it did, you wouldn't buy it.

Which is one of the secrets to selling in IT - use new acronyms and terms that have a "fashionable" ring to it and you are halfway through a sale with most customers who, for the most part, don't know what you're talking about.

The terms SaaS, Cloud, Digital Transformation etc - aren't anything new, all of these stand for services that existed with minor variations ever since computers were invented.

Yet, utter the phrase "Digital Transformation" to a customer and he'll want it like the latest fashion accessory.

And as is the case with the latest accessories, it's bought not because you need it but to show others that you have it.

Sad state of affairs no doubt, but does help to keep the cash registers ringing.
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Old 21st August 2016, 09:44   #2588
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Default Re: A YetiGuide® : How To Post In Proper English

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Yet, utter the phrase "Digital Transformation" to a customer and he'll want it like the latest fashion accessory. Sad state of affairs no doubt, but does help to keep the cash registers ringing.
Valid point, language is misused in marketing, or should I say used in a way that a realistically ordinary service or product is made to seem like a positive life-altering experience in a metaphysical sense. Yet people fall for it. Many words are over-used these days, specially in the Sunday newspaper, some examples :

- Treat yourself to "xyz" - Might apply to coffee, a vacation or a cinema, we might not think of all these as a treat, but the mere usage of the word attracts people.

- Feel good "sale" - Online shipping/shopping sites use this word every second of the day, the notorious "sale" with its feel good factor. Again a truckload of propaganda.. they make you feel what want to make you feel, getting a 10% discount wont change ones life for the better and in all probability that customer will waste that 10% away in calls made to direct the listless delivery boy to the address.

- Latest - Latest is synonymous with greatest, unfortunately if history has taught us anything, its antonymous.
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Old 21st August 2016, 12:01   #2589
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Default Re: A YetiGuide® : How To Post In Proper English

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*SNIP*
There was an recent article on one of the tech news sites about some start-up expo (yes, I have got in the habit of saying expo instead of exhibition) in which the writer told how very few of the exhibitors were able to say, in simple straightforward language, what their company/product actually did.
Er... Thad, did you mean to say "mentioned"? "Told" needs to be followed by a word to indicate a person or an entity.

I told you/him/her/them/the group/ that...

or

"Said" is followed by an actual quote. He said "So few exhibitors are able to..."

He said to me "So few exhibitors..."

He mentioned that very few exhibitors...

Cheers
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Old 21st August 2016, 12:16   #2590
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Default Re: A YetiGuide® : How To Post In Proper English

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The question is not how old WAS she; it should be "how old IS she now?"

I would say approximately 116 years old. But this also means that the last Olympics was held in 1924.
I get that you're being facetious but the explanation is further down in the BBC piece.
Quote:
Adams... is the first Briton to retain her Olympic crown since middleweight Harry Mallin in 1924.
Bad miss by the Beeb though. It's still uncorrected on the website!
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Old 21st August 2016, 14:34   #2591
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Default Re: A YetiGuide® : How To Post In Proper English

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I get that you're being facetious but the explanation is further down in the BBC piece.


Bad miss by the Beeb though. It's still uncorrected on the website!
Now that makes sense.

My bad though
I should have read the article first.
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Old 21st August 2016, 14:58   #2592
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Default Re: A YetiGuide® : How To Post In Proper English

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The question is not how old WAS she; it should be "how old IS she now?"

I would say approximately 116 years old. But this also means that the last Olympics was held in 1924.


Quote:
Originally Posted by VeyronSuperSprt View Post
Which is one of the secrets to selling in IT - use new acronyms and terms that have a "fashionable" ring to it and you are halfway through a sale with most customers who, for the most part, don't know what you're talking about.
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Originally Posted by dark.knight View Post
- Latest - Latest is synonymous with greatest, unfortunately if history has taught us anything, its antonymous.
In a corporate world where bullshitters get promoted, they buy from bullshitters. cf Dilbert's pointy-hair boss.

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Er... Thad, did you mean to say "mentioned"? "Told" needs to be followed by a word to indicate a person or an entity.
I don't think so, tilt. I'm still going with told how. What you say can still be technically correct. Sometimes it is ok to leave something as assumed: he told [us] how...
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Originally Posted by noopster View Post
I get that you're being facetious but the explanation is further down in the BBC piece.
The real meaning is obvious with some thought. It is one the good things about English, that we can often work out what someone meant, even if they say something else. However, saying something else is not good, especially if you are one of the world's prime English-language news sources.

The BBC has dumbed down, with a policy of excluding hyphens (and other punctuation?) from its headlines. It thinks this makes it easier for everybody to read. It is wrong, and has lost touch with the early principle enshrined by Lord Reith, that correct English is actually the easiest to read.

I despair of them: they no longer write English as if it was their first language! I am not being facetious, I am being very critical. Thing is, this time, their mistake was delightfully funny.

Last edited by Thad E Ginathom : 21st August 2016 at 15:08.
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Old 21st August 2016, 19:59   #2593
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Default Re: A YetiGuide® : How To Post In Proper English

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Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom View Post
The BBC: Beyond dumbed down!


Goodness, 92 years? How old was she when she first won it?

BBC News item
.
Now how do you frame the sentence without any one of them reading like the old 'eating breakfast along with uncle' joke? I tried...and failed
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Old 21st August 2016, 20:44   #2594
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....
I don't think so, tilt. I'm still going with told how. What you say can still be technically correct. Sometimes it is ok to leave something as assumed: he told [us] how...
....
I agree with this one. I think tilt needs to be a little more open to actual usage of the language. A language is not entirely and only technical. There are instances where it may sound incorrect to a non-native speaker of the language but that does not make it incorrect.
This particular case is not even one where poetic licence is being claimed. It sounds... um... simply right.
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Old 21st August 2016, 21:43   #2595
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I agree with this one. I think tilt needs to be a little more open to actual usage of the language.
l. There are I used the word "assumed." I think that the technical word for when something is supposed to be in a sentence, but is not, but it makes sense, is understood. But it is a very dim brain cell that I got that from! It is still technically correct, but a part of it is invisible

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Originally Posted by mallumowgli View Post
Now how do you frame the sentence without any one of them reading like the old 'eating breakfast along with uncle' joke? I tried...and failed
I'll try

BBC:
Nicola Adams became the first British boxer to retain an Olympic title for 92 years by winning gold in the women's flyweight final at Rio 2016...

Thad:
Nicola Adams became the first British boxer in 92 years to retain an Olympic title by winning gold in the women's flyweight final at Rio 2016...
What I believe/hope that I have done is associated the 92 years with history rather than the individual title holder. A couple of commas might help too.

I guess there is a good reason that they call it syntax in programming. It is all parsing and association, and if wrong, it doesn't work. I don't have the skills to debug a sentence; some people do. I might run this one past a pro linguist on another forum!

Last edited by Thad E Ginathom : 21st August 2016 at 21:56.
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