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Old 5th November 2007, 12:56   #1
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Default Smoking Laws in India: Bad expereince at a restaurant

We had settled in and were having our drinks at Haka, 3rd floor of Galleria Mall in Vashi (Can anyone confirm if they are part of the Mainland China group?). Starters were on their way and dinner menu was being discussed.

Haka has seating outside as well as in the air-conditioned inside. Someone sitting inside starts to smoke and though the restaurant is pretty big, we could manage to smell the cigaratte smoke. We call the waiter and ask him how they can allow cigaratte smoking inside an airconditioned area. The guy seems lost. So we ask him if he can request the smoker to put out his cigaratte as it's irritating us. The guy says he will get his senior over. A few minutes later the senior comes over and asks us what the problem is. We repeat the issue to him and he promptly says this is a smoking area. Then we ask him if he can request the guy to stop smoking as it's inconviancing us non-smokers. The guy smiles and says he can't do that as this is a smoking area and we can shift to their seating arrangement outside. I tell him I want to sit in the airconditioned inside and there is no way I am going to go out. The guy says he can't ask the smoker to sit out as the outside is a public place and the governent law says you can't smoke in public. I ask him what does he think the inside is? Isn't your inside a public place too? The guy says there is a logical reason why he can't ask the smoker to stop as this is a smoking area. Please note that the guy refused to request the guy to stop smoking. I tell him that if he can't request the guy to stop smoking then he is going to lose 2 and more permanant customers so the ball is now in his court. He starts the same crap about giving me his logical explanation so I decide to walk out telling him that I wasn't going to pay for inhaling poisonous cigaratte smoke. We had half finished drinks which we left and walked out without paying.

On the way out, we are stopped by another senior guy who tells us not to go and that they can solve the issue. I tell him the only way he can solve this is by requesting the guy to stop smoking. He repeats saying that the inside comprises of a bar and as per government laws it's a smoking area and hence they can't ask the guy to stop smoking. I tell him that since Haka supports smoking and smokers and doesn't mind inconviniancing non-smokers I see no point in sitting there or ever visiting them again.

Questions are:

1. What do the smoking laws of our country say? I googled on this and there is very sketchy information avaliable. No official website of our Ministry of health makes it even more difficult to know the facts.

2. From what I know the government has banned smoking in public places. Does a bar not qualify as a public place? I know that abroad, even if you are in a bar, you have to go out of the building to smoke. The guys kept insisting that the bar is a smoking zone. Is that true as per our laws? I read online that any restaurant (didn't say anything about a bar) with a seating arrangement of 30 or more has to clearly identify smoking and non-smoking zones. Does the law say that?

3. Even if by law, it was a smoking zone, could the management not request the guy to stop smoking? A similar thing happened at Kobe's, Vashi a few months back where the guys said their place was a smoking area but if we are getting inconvinianced he will request people to stop smoking which he actually did.

What I learnt is that even educated people don't know about laws simply because there is barely any communication/information avaliable for the same. Lawyers on the forum, please educate us .

From the way the employees were reacting, it was obvious that it was the first (and in all probablity the last) time they were facing a situation like this and they probably were wondering what the fuss was about with the two of us as all the other diners were quiet and didn't raise this issue.
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Old 5th November 2007, 13:18   #2
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Well there is no law yet which bans smoking in restaurants and pubs. Unlike some European countries. At a place which serves alcohol, people are bound to smoke. Unless there is a law, both smokers and non smokers have equal rights. It's upto the restaurant management to decide whether they want the premises to be non-smoking or not.

Most smoking and non-smoking sections are a joke. Unless they are insulated completely from one another, you will still smell cigarette smoke.
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Old 5th November 2007, 13:21   #3
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The least the management could have done was - asked the guy if would stop smoking as it was bothering other patrons.
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Old 5th November 2007, 13:27   #4
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Actually, it does not make sense for non-smokers to visit a restaurant that allows smoking, especially one which is attached with a bar. A drinking gent will be a lot more difficult to part with his ciggie.
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Old 5th November 2007, 13:33   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by esteem_lover View Post
Actually, it does not make sense for non-smokers to visit a restaurant that allows smoking, especially one which is attached with a bar. A drinking gent will be a lot more difficult to part with his ciggie.
Totally..there might be people visiting that place for the reason it allows smoking too.People who drink most likely would smoke too.
This is gonna be a debate as people who drink and smoke are gonna be on one side people who dont smoke are gonna be on one side.
For me when i have a drink i smoke with it too.Its part of the package.
Non smokers should visit a place which does not allow smoking.
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Old 5th November 2007, 13:52   #6
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Its more person dependent if some one wants to adhere to a request for No Smoking. If guys are out there to have fun they may not bother to the request and may even walk out just the way you guys walk out of the restaurant. In most of the situation the Hotel Management is in a fix as either way they loose customers.
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Old 5th November 2007, 14:00   #7
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It happened to me and my wife in Bangalore. Took her out to Sahib Sindh Sultan, a decent restaurant located @ Forum.

After waiting for a few minutes, were seated inside. The guy sitting at the adjacent table is smoking, worse, since its a big company grp, the business that they will generate now and in future will be bigger than mine.

We ask the waiter to request him to stop smoking as it is A/C and it is incovinencing us.

THe manager comes over- sir, actually this is smoking area.
Me- in A/C???
He- Yes sir, drinks etc are also served
Me- but what abt us non-smokers
He- There is a non-smoking area, but already there are a lot of people waiting for tables in that area. We thought that perhaps you were not that particular and you wouldnt mind sitting here.

To cut the long story short, it was wifes birthday, didnt want to create a scene- the chaps at the adjacent table were finishing and had asked for bill, so we stayed put.

Did take my revenge on the tip tho- left a smallish tip that what i would have usually left
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Old 5th November 2007, 14:16   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by humyum View Post
Non smokers should visit a place which does not allow smoking
Doesnt make sense. What if the restaurant serves good speciality food? Like Kobes, whose sizzlers i enjoy a lot. why should i be forced to inhale second hand smoke while i eat?
Applying your logic from the non smoker's point, smokers should drink at home and poison their loved ones instead of poisoning a larger populace.

The only way out is for smokers to realise that they should not punish innocent people for their own weaknesses, and not smoke in restaurants. Some laws need to be followed more to the spirit than to the word.
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Old 5th November 2007, 14:39   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by esteem_lover View Post
Actually, it does not make sense for non-smokers to visit a restaurant that allows smoking, especially one which is attached with a bar. A drinking gent will be a lot more difficult to part with his ciggie.

Agree with you 100%

I have the occasional drink and the smokes along with it. I would frankly be pissed off if they asked me to put out the smoke while having a drink. most of the bars/hotels have more than 1 bar (3 or more upto 5 or 6) (like roof top, the local bar, the family bar, the non smoking bar etc.. ) so that setup usually solves the problem here.
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Old 5th November 2007, 14:46   #10
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Originally Posted by amitoj View Post
The only way out is for smokers to realise that they should not punish innocent people for their own weaknesses, and not smoke in restaurants. Some laws need to be followed more to the spirit than to the word.
Yes I agree, Specially when you see kids & families around.

Another problem I am very pissed of is the smoke coming out of autoricksaw's (specially in Bangalore). I sometimes go so mad that I feel like putting the exhaust in autowallahs mouth and give full trottle.
why don't these traffic police do someting about it.

Last edited by greatDrive : 5th November 2007 at 14:53.
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Old 5th November 2007, 14:53   #11
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From what I know all restaurants are expected to reserve 1/3rd of their seating space for non-smokers or vice versa this included even the small dhaba type restaurants in city & many of them did a make shoft arrangemnet by clssifying 2 out of 6-8 tables a smoking\smoking.

So I think even inside ac they should have a smoking & non smoking area.

I dont think though that there is any solution to problem that Amit faced
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Old 5th November 2007, 15:20   #12
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Default Smoking sections in restaurants

In my opinion having a smoking section in a restaurant with a common hall (seating arrangement) is like have a pissing section in the swimming pool. It does absolutely no good to non-smokers.
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Old 5th November 2007, 15:20   #13
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Quote:
The least the management could have done was - asked the guy if would stop smoking as it was bothering other patrons.
Thats exactly what pissed me off. If you guys read my thread, we asked three members of the staff to request the person to stop smoking and all of them flatly declined to do that. My gf told them that she has minor asthma and the guys still kept saying that this is a smoking area blah blah. Who would be responsible if someone whose asthmatic has an attack because of 1 person smoking?

Quote:
For me when i have a drink i smoke with it too.Its part of the package.
Quote:
I have the occasional drink and the smokes along with it. I would frankly be pissed off if they asked me to put out the smoke while having a drink.
Just because it's a bar or a place where alcohol is served doesn't mean you can smoke there too. Abroad, you have to go out of the bar if you want to smoke.

Besides, what would you guys do if a restaurant employee came to you and requested to stop smoking as it was bothering 1 person in the restaurant/bar?

Quote:
THe manager comes over- sir, actually this is smoking area.
This is interesting. Three different places - Kobe's, Haka and your place, all said that "this is a smoking area" but with the law silent, can the restaurants assume that smoking is allowed if the law doesn't disallow smoking?

Last edited by amit : 5th November 2007 at 15:28.
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Old 5th November 2007, 15:30   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amitoj View Post
Doesnt make sense. What if the restaurant serves good speciality food? Like Kobes, whose sizzlers i enjoy a lot. why should i be forced to inhale second hand smoke while i eat?
Applying your logic from the non smoker's point, smokers should drink at home and poison their loved ones instead of poisoning a larger populace.

The only way out is for smokers to realise that they should not punish innocent people for their own weaknesses, and not smoke in restaurants. Some laws need to be followed more to the spirit than to the word.
Oh in that case why dont u take a parcel home and leave the smokers alone??common dude..its a smoking zone so people who smoke will smoke..!!
And in that case stop driving your car..people who walk on the road inhale the carbon monxide bla bla which u pollute for no fault of theirs.
Do they ask you to sit at home and not drive while they have a clean enviornment?
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Old 5th November 2007, 15:36   #15
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Originally Posted by amit View Post
Thats exactly what pissed me off. If you guys read my thread, we asked three members of the staff to request the person to stop smoking and all of them flatly declined to do that. My gf told them that she has minor asthma and the guys still kept saying that this is a smoking area blah blah. Who would be responsible if someone whose asthmatic has an attack because of 1 person smoking?





Just because it's a bar or a place where alcohol is served doesn't mean you can smoke there too. Abroad, you have to go out of the bar if you want to smoke.

Besides, what would you guys do if a restaurant employee came to you and requested to stop smoking as it was bothering 1 person in the restaurant/bar?



This is interesting. Three different places - Kobe's, Haka and your place, all said that "this is a smoking area" but with the law silent, can the restaurants assume that smoking is allowed if the law doesn't disallow smoking?
Request is okay.Anyone would understand if u request them with such a problem.Atleast i would understand. But if u want none of them to smoke because u dont smoke and that too in a smoking zone you are not being fair.

Last edited by humyum : 5th November 2007 at 15:43.
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