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Old 12th October 2008, 13:34   #1
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Default Engines of the Devil

"Want to buy a diesel car to keep your oil bill low? Think again. You may end up trading your
life for cheap and toxic diesel.
As companies go for a hard sell of diesel cars, dieselmania grips you too. What was
supposed to be cheap fuel for the poor farmers is now driving the cars of the rich.
Do not choose to ignore the fact that diesel fumes trigger cancer and pose serious threat
to public health. Delhi is already reeling under high concentration of diesel-related
pollutants small particulate matter, oxides of nitrogen and ozone. Studies also show
that neither improving diesel quality nor upgrading engine technology can help to
avert the threat posed by toxic particulate emissions. The cleaner the diesel,
the tinier the particulate matter, and higher the cancer-causing potential.
More private diesel cars on road simply negate the spirit of the Supreme Court
orders steering a large part of public transport fleet away from use of diesel
to a cleaner fuel like CNG to control air pollution in Delhi. The only option
therefore is to ban private diesel cars."

you can read the remaining part of the paper published on the "evil" diesel engine by Center for Science and Environment, India. It is available at http://www.cseindia.org/campaign/apc/pdf/dieselmo.pdf

Pretty interesting read, and particularly interesting is page # 16 which has petrol prices (in 1997) of the metro cities. Oh how I wish we had the same prices today... cheers:
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Old 12th October 2008, 19:58   #2
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great find ak916 and very interesting article. all good and based on facts the article has proved beyond reasonable doubt that diesel is more polluting than petrol. however the solution is certainly NOT banning private diesel cars.

quoting bangalore as an example since i stay there, i would say that just ban 2 stroke autos. but since most bangalore autos are owned by local goondas, police constables and local politicians, i wish that the rto have a certain part of the male anatomy to ban all polluting autos, ban any polluting buses and lorries rather. these steps will hugely increase the quality of the air in bangalore. i simply do not see the need to ban private diesel cars.
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Old 12th October 2008, 20:06   #3
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There is no way deisel cars can be stopped. Many people have been addicted to diesel than petrol.

( I am an exception)

I think that if they bring the price of the petrol down and increase the price of the deisel for the private vehicles , it may have an effect on the sale of deisel cars ( if not completely stop them)

P.S.

In Dubai , Petrol is around 18-20 Rs a litre(According to INR)
and deisel 48 Rs.

This difference causes everyone ( or if not atleast 99% of the people ) to choose petrol cars over deisel .
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Old 12th October 2008, 20:10   #4
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Great find. Its autos and heavy vehicles who do more harm.

This gives an indication of where bangalore is headed to. Diesel makes economical sense, but we also want our children to grow up in a healthy environment.
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Old 12th October 2008, 20:41   #5
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May be it is the Goverments way of reducing the population in a safe manner?
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Old 12th October 2008, 20:42   #6
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Small correction - I meant page 16 has the diesel prices in 1997 and not petrol pricesas mentioned in my post.

I am sure everyone knows this but am still going to say it :-) Diesel is cheaper in India because they wanted farmers and govt agencies like state transport corporations to get the price benefit. The difference (also according to this paper) is used to offset the price of kerosene ( again poor man's fuel, but also used to adulterate petrol... he he, the vicious cycle!!!).

Nowadays though its a different story. We have expensive cars with diesel engines. That said, I heard the govt is mulling have different pricing for diesel - One price for personal vehicles and the other for govt/farmers.
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Old 12th October 2008, 23:10   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ak916 View Post
I heard the govt is mulling have different pricing for diesel - One price for personal vehicles and the other for govt/farmers.
hah! that will straight away mean more money making opportunity for the local politicians and fuel mafia. black-marketing will become rampant. those numb skull politicians must realize that dual pricing WILL NOT work but will rather create a huge diesel black-market.

but may be thats what they want.
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Old 13th October 2008, 13:00   #8
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The dual pricing is a joke. Like Holly said it will benefit the politicains directly because they run and own half of the fuel bunks.

Ban on Private diesel cars is also a joke. Why not ban all forms of cars then. Why subsidise everything for farmers and village folks? Why subsidise in the first place? How many poor villagers benefit from the subsidies anyway? all that is available is black sold by the local politicians and his cronies.

Pollution is pollution, if diesel pollutes petrol pollutes too maybe in smaller number but it pollutes doesnt it? We do have PUC for diesels too and they are much more fuel efficient then petrol engines. Efficiency is more in a diesel then a petrol owning to the higher calorific value.

If you have to reduce pollution, make better public transport. PERIOD. Anything else is frivolous.

Look at how the Metro in Delhi and the Volvo buses in Bangalore have changed so many mindsets about public transport.

Dual pricing, scientists finding out diesel is some percentage more polluting then petrol, ban diesel cars are short term uninformed decisions. Please try and push for valid solutions.

Have a look at a diesel engine these days, you will be surprised and while you are at it send a copy to Centre for Science and Environment, India too.

PS: Oh you must be kidding me - this stupid report is 10 years old. Mr ak916 atleast try and find a recent report.

10 years back the diesel engines in India were from the stoneage. WOW i wasted my time on this.

Last edited by Spitfire : 13th October 2008 at 13:05.
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Old 13th October 2008, 17:48   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spitfire View Post
Have a look at a diesel engine these days, you will be surprised and while you are at it send a copy to Centre for Science and Environment, India too.

PS: Oh you must be kidding me - this stupid report is 10 years old. Mr ak916 atleast try and find a recent report.

10 years back the diesel engines in India were from the stoneage. WOW i wasted my time on this.
Spitfire - True to your name huh? But before you spit fire, I would like you to read the posts/links carefully or atleast casually.

I never said diesel should be banned. I never said we need to have dual pricing. All I said was it makes an interesting read. I understand "interesting" has a broad meaning, but none of it means what you think I meant. In short - I never supported the paper.

Again, 10 years or 20 years old - it is a paper which i meant for people to read cos I found it ... again, interesting.

Peace.cheers:
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Old 14th October 2008, 10:52   #10
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duh? I didnt get it? You found something interesting that is 10 years old and totally irrelevant today?

Remember the ban on diesel vehicles which are 15 years and above? which came into force sometime back, that makes the irrelevancy of the above report rise a few more notches.

But yeah you can paste any link you find intersting but then look at the reactions and following mails all are assuming the report is latest. Intersting you tell me?

PS: Spitfire - is not spit and fire its Spitfire one word - after a WWII RAF aircraft. No need to get personal dude.
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Old 14th October 2008, 11:04   #11
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@ Spitfire: You are right and I am wrong.
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Old 14th October 2008, 12:17   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ak916 View Post
@ Spitfire: You are right and I am wrong.
Ok. God bless you.
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