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Old 22nd May 2015, 20:34   #1501
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Aroy, any ideas as to where one can get lamb in S.Dilli, would National in mkt#3 have it? What's your recommendation for a good mutton shop and ditto for fish in the general area.

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By the way, as far as I know, most of the Kashmiri "mutton" dishes use Lamb instead of goat.
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Old 22nd May 2015, 22:14   #1502
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Aroy, any ideas as to where one can get lamb in S.Dilli, ...
Hey, Khoj, I don't think it is worth going to any trouble for lamb!
In fact, most of us prefer goat. Less overpowering (slightly offensive) odour.
This is a regional thing. People eat what is available locally; never mind that it might be inferior to things brought in from far away places and thus costing a lot more too.
We're lucky to get goat meat. The original Sheppard's Pie used goat meat but the poor Brits cannot buy that in UK now (illegal?) except in a few select communities.
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Old 23rd May 2015, 19:23   #1503
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Aroy, any ideas as to where one can get lamb in S.Dilli, would National in mkt#3 have it? What's your recommendation for a good mutton shop and ditto for fish in the general area.
Find mutton shops that supply to Kashmiris. They get lamb for them. The mutton shop in Savitri Cinema complex used to get Lamb, but I have not visited it in the last couple of years.

For fish it is either INA market for exotic and Sea Fish. Market #1 in Chittaranjan Park for river fish liked by Bengalis.
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Old 23rd May 2015, 22:25   #1504
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I agree Anup ji. It is just that I ate some very well prepared lamb in a couple of places and was wondering how it would turn out when cooked at home. Guess will leave that till travel to the UK

BTW any pointers for a good mutton shop. My favourite used to be a place in Kailash colony market but they closed down ages ago. Did not miss them much as I myself was away but now that I am back I cannot find a shop with consistently decent quality of mutton.

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Hey, Khoj, I don't think it is worth going to any trouble for lamb!

I did go to the chap in Savitri but the way they were handling the meat turned me off big time. National is now on and now off, the big positive about this guy is that he has a wash basin in his shop with running water and a cake of soap and both father and son use these whenever they step back in to the shop(you guys will think I am crazy).

For fish I rely on the Gujarat Fisheries Coop in Yusuf Sarai, was just hoping for a closer spot.

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Find mutton shops that supply to Kashmiris. They get lamb for them. The mutton shop in Savitri Cinema complex used to get Lamb, but I have not visited it in the last couple of years.

For fish it is either INA market for exotic and Sea Fish. Market #1 in Chittaranjan Park for river fish liked by Bengalis.
Will visit the local market in Pamposh enclave and see if the meat walla there has any lamb.

Last edited by khoj : 23rd May 2015 at 22:27.
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Old 24th May 2015, 10:20   #1505
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I agree Anup ji. It is just that I ate some very well prepared lamb in a couple of places and was wondering how it would turn out when cooked at home. Guess will leave that till travel to the UK

BTW any pointers for a good mutton shop. My favourite used to be a place in Kailash colony market but they closed down ages ago. Did not miss them much as I myself was away but now that I am back I cannot find a shop with consistently decent quality of mutton.




I did go to the chap in Savitri but the way they were handling the meat turned me off big time. National is now on and now off, the big positive about this guy is that he has a wash basin in his shop with running water and a cake of soap and both father and son use these whenever they step back in to the shop(you guys will think I am crazy).

For fish I rely on the Gujarat Fisheries Coop in Yusuf Sarai, was just hoping for a closer spot.



Will visit the local market in Pamposh enclave and see if the meat walla there has any lamb.
Where are you staying? On that will depend where the nearest shop is. As I live in C R Park, I find that of the four or five mutton shops, the ones on Market #3 and his second shop in Market #1 have the best quality. If you want good mutton, then you must be able to judge the quality of raw one. Every shop I have visited in Delhi (including INA) have a few excellent goats and a lot of old indifferent ones (from the point of view of cooking). If you have no idea, then the seller will invariable fob off the least lucrative pieces.

Though I have visited the Gujarat Fisheries out let a number of times, INA has much better stock, and it is replenished daily. You get a lot of variety of sea fish - various sized prawns, lobsters, squid, pomfret, mackerel, sea bass, red snapper, and these are really fresh on week ends.

For day to day consumption of river fish, nothing beats C R Park (as we are a 100m from the market!). Again if you do not know your fish, then you are better off buying the frozen stuff sold in super markets. There are excellent frozen prawns and other sea fish available at reasonable rates - considering that the tails are some 40% of the whole prawn weight, and prawns are going between 400 and 800, frozen ones at 800/kg are quite a bargain.
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Old 24th May 2015, 14:15   #1506
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Hi Folks,

My two cents regarding "Rogan Josh". [Pleaes skip it if you don't like it]

Rogan Josh is a Signature Kashmiri dish which has its origin from Persia.

Rogan means "Oil / Ghee / Fat".

Josh means "Heat / Boil". Even today if you watch or hear some Pakistani or Urdu speaking culinary experts, they say "Wait till Josh comes" meaning "wait till boil comes".

So you have a dish which has lot of Rogan(Oil/ghee) and lot of Josh ( read it as cooking time)

Having said that:

1. Sauth (dried ginger powder)
2. Saunf (fennel) powder
3. curd (Dahi, Yogurt)
are three essential ingredients of any yakhni dish. Kashmiri Rogan Josh has its roots in the same Yakhni theme.

Having said that [again], I have seen many so called Kashmiri Rogan Josh recipes ranging from curdless (no curd) to equal amount of curd (equal to mutton in weight).

Having said that [last time] It only boils down to personal taste at the end. So give a skip to academicians, go ahead use curd or no curd, saunf or no saunf, saunth or no saunth; if you like your dish, it is "Original" for sure, at least for YOU.

But do cook. It is the best stress-buster.
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Old 24th May 2015, 23:03   #1507
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Across the road in Kalkaji. Never knew that National had another outlet in #1. The very reason for complaining about the quality is because I know meat. Have bought fish from CR park too but I find buying at Yusuf Sarai easier since there is no language barrier and parking is easier to find, will explore INA next time around.

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Where are you staying?
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Old 25th May 2015, 12:31   #1508
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Originally Posted by drk_411 View Post
Hi Folks,

My two cents regarding "Rogan Josh". [Pleaes skip it if you don't like it]

Rogan Josh is a Signature Kashmiri dish which has its origin from Persia.

Rogan means "Oil / Ghee / Fat".

Josh means "Heat / Boil". Even today if you watch or hear some Pakistani or Urdu speaking culinary experts, they say "Wait till Josh comes" meaning "wait till boil comes".

So you have a dish which has lot of Rogan(Oil/ghee) and lot of Josh ( read it as cooking time)

Having said that:

1. Sauth (dried ginger powder)
2. Saunf (fennel) powder
3. curd (Dahi, Yogurt)
are three essential ingredients of any yakhni dish. Kashmiri Rogan Josh has its roots in the same Yakhni theme.

Having said that [again], I have seen many so called Kashmiri Rogan Josh recipes ranging from curdless (no curd) to equal amount of curd (equal to mutton in weight).

Having said that [last time] It only boils down to personal taste at the end. So give a skip to academicians, go ahead use curd or no curd, saunf or no saunf, saunth or no saunth; if you like your dish, it is "Original" for sure, at least for YOU.

But do cook. It is the best stress-buster.
Curd and Turmeric are great tenderizers. Add salt and you are brining the meat. These three ingredients with any other spices, used as a marinade will not only tenderize the meat, but infuse it with spices. The longer you keep the meat in marinade, the better the effect.

Unlike goat meat (which is tough), lamb meat (which is tender), needs very little time for tenderizer to soften it up. That is why with lamb, the curd is used primarily for taste and curry colour, hence the variety. Some add curd while marinating, some during cooking and some at the very end, depends on what effect and what colour of curry you want.
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Old 25th May 2015, 17:31   #1509
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... My two cents regarding "Rogan Josh". ... Rogan Josh is a Signature Kashmiri dish which has its origin from Persia.
Rogan means "Oil / Ghee / Fat". ...
LOL So says Wiki too.

Unfortunately Wiki relegates / trivializes the centuries-old Kashmiri / Indian colloquial usage by saying "Another interpretation of the name rogan josh is derived from the word rogan meaning "red color" (the same Indo-European root that is the source of the French "rouge" and the Spanish "rojo")". Roghan as in color is the true usage in the context of Roghan Josh, as it is in

* Roghani Naan (which used to given a coat of saffron water before going into the tandoor)
* Rang-roghan, as in saying "rang-roghan karwana" - getting the house painted

The Roghan in Roghan Josh comes from Rattanjoth or Ratan Jyoth, the bark of a tree indigenous to J&K. It also has a mild flavor like cinnamon, which one can make out if the RJ is made well. Unfortunately, no one uses this anymore (other than oldies like me). Rattanjoth was a poor man's substitute for Saffron. There was a flower whose petals were used a long time back as a Rattanjoth substitute, but I forget it's name. Some even recommend beetroot juice, but I have never tried it.

I get the typical Kashmiri masala powder - pounded, not ground - which has Rattanjoth amongst other spices. Extremely aromatic - need to use only a teaspoon of it for a kilo of meat. This comes as discs with a hole in the centre, and is sold by Kashmiri traders who come to Delhi seasonally. Haven't found this in shops anywhere.
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Old 25th May 2015, 19:06   #1510
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LOL So says Wiki too.....

I get the typical Kashmiri masala powder - pounded, not ground - which has Rattanjoth amongst other spices. Extremely aromatic - need to use only a teaspoon of it for a kilo of meat. This comes as discs with a hole in the centre, and is sold by Kashmiri traders who come to Delhi seasonally. Haven't found this in shops anywhere.
We too use Ratan Jyoth at our household (and of course I am oldie).

I have been trying to get my hands on those discs for quite a while now. Could you be helpful ? I would be in Bangalore from 19th June to 24th June.

Last edited by Gannu_1 : 26th May 2015 at 15:08. Reason: Removed contact details. Please do not post your contact number/email on the forums. They can be misused. Thanks!
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Old 25th May 2015, 21:29   #1511
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... Could you be helpful ? ...
Ha ha, and, could you be helpful?
You know excatly what I'm trying to say. Since I'm NOT going to Bengaluru, would you be kind enough please? I do so hope that you will be in NCR on your return!
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Old 25th May 2015, 22:07   #1512
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Ha ha, and, could you be helpful?
You know excatly what I'm trying to say. Since I'm NOT going to Bengaluru, would you be kind enough please? I do so hope that you will be in NCR on your return!
Yes Anup, I would be in Delhi on my way to Bangalore on 18th.

Can you help me ? Ever since I read about those discs on bcmtouring years ago, I have been frantically trying to search for them and you know my passion for spices.

Here I find a knowledgeable person who is equally passionate about food, so I request him to help me out even disclosing my mobile and email on a public and open forum. So you understand the gravity of the request.
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Old 26th May 2015, 01:20   #1513
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Hi Der Alte, could you kindly share the source of this masala powder from where it can be procured.

And if you are able to meet our newbie here, I am sure you will have a lot to discuss given that both of you are die hard foodies who love to cook

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Originally Posted by DerAlte View Post
LOL So says Wiki too.

I get the typical Kashmiri masala powder - pounded, not ground - which has Rattanjoth amongst other spices. Extremely aromatic - need to use only a teaspoon of it for a kilo of meat. This comes as discs with a hole in the centre, and is sold by Kashmiri traders who come to Delhi seasonally. Haven't found this in shops anywhere.

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Originally Posted by anupmathur View Post
Ha ha, and, could you be helpful?
You know excatly what I'm trying to say. Since I'm NOT going to Bengaluru, would you be kind enough please? I do so hope that you will be in NCR on your return!

Hello 'Newbie' or should I say "Doc" welcome to the forum and this thread in particular. In case you are wondering, we have not interacted before but I have closely followed your eastward sojourns on bcmt and hope that you will share your travelogues here as well.

Alright then, if I have buttered you enough let me take inspiration from Anup ji's post and put in a request to you to kindly get a few of these discs for me as well. I will of course be paying for the same unlike Anup ji

I am in Dilli too and hopefully this will be the perfect excuse to meet with you provided Anup ji does not banish me to the galleys.


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Yes Anup, I would be in Delhi on my way to Bangalore on 18th.

Can you help me ? Ever since I read about those discs on bcmtouring years ago, I have been frantically trying to search for them and you know my passion for spices.

Here I find a knowledgeable person who is equally passionate about food, so I request him to help me out even disclosing my mobile and email on a public and open forum. So you understand the gravity of the request.
NOTE : Once your post with the contact details has served it's purpose, you can use the report button beneath the same and ask the admin/mods to remove the information from the post.
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Old 26th May 2015, 15:02   #1514
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... I have been trying to get my hands on those discs for quite a while now. Could you be helpful ...
Quote:
Originally Posted by anupmathur View Post
... Since I'm NOT going to Bengaluru, would you be kind enough please? ...
Quote:
Originally Posted by khoj View Post
... could you kindly share the source of this masala powder from where it can be procured. ...
Alas, no one has heard about such things in Bangalore, forget about stocking it. Have pinged my sister, who got me the discs in Delhi a couple of years back. They last quite a while in the freezer in a sealed box. Will update you when I get info.

If one has to search in Delhi, the likely places would be Sadar Bazar, Chawri Bazar and Bhogal - places which bring forth in mind questions like "Kaise jayein? Kidhar se jayein? Can't take the car there ..." Like Metiabruz in Kolkata, even taxi and auto drivers refuse to go there.

Last edited by DerAlte : 26th May 2015 at 15:04.
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Old 26th May 2015, 16:21   #1515
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...
....
.... I will of course be paying for the same unlike Anup ji
.....
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Originally Posted by DerAlte View Post
....
If one has to search in Delhi, the likely places would be Sadar Bazar, Chawri Bazar and Bhogal - ....
Hmm, but that would mean I'll have to pay for it!

It doesn't make sense that old men from Delhi are asking an old man in Bengaluru to procure an item that the said old man had said in the very first instance is available only in Delhi!
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