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Old 22nd July 2009, 10:10   #31
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I think its correct to slap a heavy fine, and just send back the security chiefs, and insist from now on that the security chief be a local.

That should prevent recurrence, as well as even save CA the costs of keeping an expat
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Old 22nd July 2009, 10:11   #32
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Continantal signed the agreement they know the protocol and that must be followed as per rules of the land , If they don't agree they should not operate from Indian soil.

I am just waiting to see how spineless the GOI can be now under the rudderless leadership.
After going against official line in G8+ summit and that blunder on inclusion of Balochistan it will be another feather in cap of Government if they do not slap fine on continental.

And those who say a tit for tat will show us as Banana republic, please bear in mind banana republics have no spine for such actions . In the past only examples of tit for tat are from rising powers such as China and Brazil and they command more respect in eyes of world for then a spineless democracy.

There is something really slavish on our Airports when it comes to US

Another funny point on Indian Airports , Duty free shops deal in only US $ for some stupid customs related rule . I found this when I asked the Duty Free guy at near to exit gate of Bangalore Airport on why they only return back in US $.
This is really sad that our own currency is not being respected for whatever reason , How hard it is to find the Interbank $ - rupee exchange rate and pay back in currency of choice to customer ?


Also I remember 1.5 year back one Samosa on Delhi Airport for 50 Rs or 1 US $ and US$ was just 38 rupee that time.

Last edited by amitk26 : 22nd July 2009 at 10:17.
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Old 22nd July 2009, 10:26   #33
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Everyone is the same, no reason anyone should be given red-carpet treatment in security-sensitive areas. Remember that over 50% of Parliamentarians have criminal records and of the rest, almost all of them are rogues, goondas and cheats, who should be subjected to maximum inspection. Let us not forget Taslimuddins and Salaluddins who have openly supported the ISI and made similar anti-national statements.
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Old 22nd July 2009, 10:30   #34
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Originally Posted by hvkumar View Post
Everyone is the same, Remember that over 50% of Parliamentarians have criminal records and of the rest, almost all of them are rogues, goondas and cheats, who should be subjected to maximum inspection. Let us not forget Taslimuddins and Salaluddins who have openly supported the ISI and made similar anti-national statements.
Do our ex president Dr. Kalam should be considered as same in the list?

what about protocol?

what about law of nation?

what about foreign airliner imposing laws of their land on pride of India our ex president and that too in India?

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Old 22nd July 2009, 10:39   #35
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Why does no one spare a thought for the security guys working their butts off all day and night across the length and breadth of the country? Make their life simple instead of adding one more complication to their lives? Instead of searching through long lists of who is exempt and who is not? And keeping this list updated all the time as people get added and deleted? Frisk everybody, except God, is what I would say. And he or she would not fly commercial anyway!
And when things go wrong, everyone comes down heavily on them. No one sings their praises on each of the other 364 days. Like our teachers, these are the real heroes in the country today, notwithstanding a few bad apples here and there.
PS: and why is our ex president not flying Air India????

Last edited by Sawyer : 22nd July 2009 at 10:40. Reason: PS
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Old 22nd July 2009, 10:40   #36
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Do our ex president Dr. Kalam should be considered as same in the list?

what about protocol?

what about law of nation?

what about foreign airliner imposing laws of their land on pride of India our ex president and that too in India?
Everyone is the same, rules cannot be changed for one person. This is like asking, are we also criminals that we should be searched? I can think of so many other persons of repute who may be equally or more worthy - but they are also subject to the normal rules. Diplomatic immunity is also misused most of the time! Why this sudden furore over CA - they have been following the same rules all these years. For example, I do not see any reason why every political goonda gets away without paying tolls in the highways - it is our hard-earned money that has gone to building and maintaining these roads n- why should they be exempted at all? (sorry, that is another topic).

And let us not forget, all this is for your safety in the air, not to satiate any security or airline guys egos.

Last edited by hvkumar : 22nd July 2009 at 10:41.
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Old 22nd July 2009, 10:40   #37
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Firstly as usual, the media has hyped it up.if Mr. kalam didnt make a big deal out of it which however shows the true nature of the man, i dont understand why the media has to.

secondly in matter of security i think every one needs to be treated equally.if a VIP is travelling in his own jet or a chartered jet its fine but if he is travelling as a passenger in an airline i dont see why he must be exempted from any kind of security check.

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then by this logic, us secretary of states should have given similar treatment while she was in India and claim that checked like civilian, fine, no issue.

she was flying in her own plane and wasnt a passenger on a commercial airliner.


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Do continental airlines frisk ex US President if he is returning from India to US?

ex us presidents dont fly continental airline.


rev
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Old 22nd July 2009, 10:45   #38
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Firstly as usual, the media has hyped it up.if Mr. kalam didnt make a big deal out of it which however shows the true nature of the man, i dont understand why the media has to.
Because the protocol established for ex-presidents is an Indian rule and airlines flying in to India and getting business agreed to it before hand.

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secondly in matter of security i think every one needs to be treated equally.if a VIP is travelling in his own jet or a chartered jet its fine but if he is travelling as a passenger in an airline i dont see why he must be exempted from any kind of security check.
There is something known as protocol if you understand what that word means and it carries a big value in world of diplomacy.

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she was flying in her own plane and wasnt a passenger on a commercial airliner.
Security procedures of the land apply to any kind of aircraft flying in world of diplomacy it is known as black carpet treatment.
It can be given on any airliner chartered , commercial or a foreign government.

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ex us presidents dont fly continental airline.


rev
They fly some or other commercial airliner , US does not provide them chartered plane.
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Old 22nd July 2009, 10:47   #39
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Everyone is the same, no reason anyone should be given red-carpet treatment in security-sensitive areas. Remember that over 50% of Parliamentarians have criminal records and of the rest, almost all of them are rogues, goondas and cheats, who should be subjected to maximum inspection. Let us not forget Taslimuddins and Salaluddins who have openly supported the ISI and made similar anti-national statements.
hvkumar, with due respect you do not seem to have an inkling about protocols and the established law around those protocols. These are expected and offered in most instances without exception. The only cases where these protocols are flouted by entities are when they treat citizens of enemy/rogue nations and that does not raise any hue or cry in the host nation as well as the nation of the offending entity and by any media in general.

this is not the first time the a US-based airline has behaved as if rules do not apply to it. To treat a civilian head of state of a democratic nation and that too the largest one smacks of a racist legacy being continued till today. They wouldn't dare do it with any two-bit euro or Chinese head-of-state.
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Old 22nd July 2009, 10:50   #40
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she was flying in her own plane and wasnt a passenger on a commercial airliner.
ex us presidents dont fly continental airline.
I know it.

She entered in India flying in her own plane.

Then all passengers and plane should be thoroughly checked by Indian security guards.

Ex us presidents don't fly conti because they know the bad reputation of conti. Isn't it?
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Old 22nd July 2009, 10:53   #41
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hvkumar, with due respect you do not seem to have an inkling about protocols and the established law around those protocols. These are expected and offered in most instances without exception. The only cases where these protocols are flouted by entities are when they treat citizens of enemy/rogue nations and that does not raise any hue or cry in the host nation as well as the nation of the offending entity and by any media in general.

this is not the first time the a US-based airline has behaved as if rules do not apply to it. To treat a civilian head of state of a democratic nation and that too the largest one smacks of a racist legacy being continued till today. They wouldn't dare do it with any two-bit euro or Chinese head-of-state.
Sir ji, I am also an advisor to the UN and am aware of protocols, but that does not mean I like them. El Al, the Israeli airline, subjects all to in-plane security checking besides the in-ground security. If people can hijack planes and fly them into skyscrapers, the country is entitled to institute tough security safeguards. I also object to being frisked 15 times when I go to Vaishno Devi temple, but how do we ensure our safety in these times?
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Old 22nd July 2009, 11:00   #42
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All this hullabaloo reminds me of a Zen story. Zen priests are not supposed to think about women. Two of them came across a beautiful one wanting to cross a river. One of them helped her on to his shoulder, and took her across, and then they went their different ways. After 2 hours, the other one burst out - how could you do what you did back there, don't you know our rules? His friend replied, yes, but I have put her down 2 hours ago. You still seem to be carrying her with you.
Mr Kalam is the one that put down the lady a long time ago, and the rest of us...???!!
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Old 22nd July 2009, 11:05   #43
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All this hullabaloo reminds me of a Zen story.
Mr Kalam is the one that put down the lady a long time ago, and the rest of us...???!!
Rest of us don't make any hullabaloo and others take advantage to do whatever they like.

Its shame.
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Old 22nd July 2009, 11:06   #44
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Raveendra..I had the rare chance to meet Dr.Kalam last year when he came down to Hyderabad for the EMRI board meeting.I will tell you interesting facts that i saw with my own eyes about him,which will change your whole opinion of Dr.Kalam.Will do this today evening when we meet for Dinner.
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Old 22nd July 2009, 11:10   #45
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Sir ji, I am also an advisor to the UN and am aware of protocols, but that does not mean I like them.
hvkumarji, then the situation becomes more serious. It's not an error by omission but an error by commission.

you are aware of protocols yet deem that giving an Indian citizen/dignitary the same protocols is not required of a western airline. how do you think US would have behaved/reacted if an Indian airlines imposed it's own set of 'rules' security or otherwise in an American airport ? And supposing that Indian airline had asked a former US-president to strip waist-down after security check but before embarking, because they noticed something bulging out of his pants. Let's say like a check in the aerobridge by the airline staff supposedly on pretext of security.
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