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Old 29th October 2009, 17:40   #31
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Speeding does not kill rather irresponsible speed can.

Of course response time is more during high speed. Its not always that we can predict what can go wrong or will a nut come riding out of the cut road. Having being behind the wheel for sometime now we can predict and understand when we need to lift our leg off the accelerator. However again, its hard to predict in our driving conditions.

Speed is good. Good brakes and Good luck is even better.
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Old 29th October 2009, 19:10   #32
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Originally Posted by beejay View Post
Speeding does not kill rather irresponsible speed can.

Of course response time is more during high speed. Its not always that we can predict what can go wrong or will a nut come riding out of the cut road. Having being behind the wheel for sometime now we can predict and understand when we need to lift our leg off the accelerator. However again, its hard to predict in our driving conditions.

Speed is good. Good brakes and Good luck is even better.
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Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
So what basically everybody is saying is the speeding is rarely the cause. Its merely increases your chances of dying. The cause can be other thinks like rash driving, not obeying signals, drunk driving etc.,
I think you guys got it just right. Contrary to what the police and the insurance authorities try to preach, speeding alone is not the biggest cause of road accidents. In fact it's actually not even in the top 5 causes. However, every time you're caught speeding and get a ticket, your insurance premiums go up exponentially. A seatbelt offence, for example, has a smaller fine attached to it than going 10 kph over the limit. But IMO it should be treated far more seriously since it is your first line of defense in an accident, and your airbags and active head restraints also depend on it.

Another example of an inconsistency I've noticed. For my Subaru Impreza which is one of the safest compact cars you can buy on the road here, the insurance premiums are the highest in its class. And that is because statistically more Impreza drivers in my age group are likely to cause a road accident than let's say Civic, Corolla or Mazda 3 drivers according to my insurance company. Go figure!!

Last edited by sujaylahiri : 29th October 2009 at 19:13.
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Old 29th October 2009, 19:20   #33
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Originally Posted by sujaylahiri View Post
Another example of an inconsistency I've noticed. For my Subaru Impreza which is one of the safest compact cars you can buy on the road here, the insurance premiums are the highest in its class. And that is because statistically more Impreza drivers in my age group are likely to cause a road accident than let's say Civic, Corolla or Mazda 3 drivers according to my insurance company. Go figure!!
Risk Compensation by everyone else ?
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Old 29th October 2009, 20:13   #34
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Risk Compensation by everyone else ?
You do bring up an interesting point, but I forgot to mention this in my previous post. A 5.7L V8 350 hp Hemi Charger costs me $30 a month less to insure and a 4.6L 300 hp V8 Mustang GT costs $10 a month less (both RWD) compared to my AWD 170 hp Impreza with all the electronic nannies you can think of.

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Old 29th October 2009, 20:35   #35
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Another study I came across which was conducted by Jeremy Jackson and Dr. Roger Blackman of Simon Fraser University in British Columbia, Canada.


The abstract of their thesis is:

Previous experimental tests of risk homeostasis theory (RHT) have failed to manipulate both motivational and nonmotivational variables in an ecologically valid within-subject design. In this study, 24 Ss operated an interactive driving simulator under varying levels of a within-subject motivational factor (monetary accident cost), a within-subject nonmotivational factor (speed limit), and a between-subjects nonmotivational factor (speeding fine). Consistent with RHT, increased speed limit and reduced speeding fine significantly increased driving speed but had no effect on accident frequency. Moreover, increased accident cost caused large and significant reductions in accident frequency but no change in speed choice. Results suggest that in contrast to motivationally based accident countermeasures, regulation of specific risky behaviors such as speed choice may have little influence on accident rates.

Source: Jackson and Blackman (1994) A driving-simulator test of Wilde's risk homeostasis theory
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Old 30th October 2009, 10:25   #36
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One thing which just crossed my mind. The the mid 70's at the time of the first oil shock, most countries reduced speed limits to 55mp or so. Stats showed that there was a major reduction in road accidents. Everybody was going gaga about it.

Then the German data came out (Germany had no speed limits on the Autobahns- barring, I think, Stuttgart to Karlsruhe, and did not impose any limits, i.e. status quo). The accident reduction was the same.

Moral: It was the reduction in trafic and not reduction in speeds.
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Old 30th October 2009, 10:33   #37
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Sujay - Thanks. Lovely article (second one). True 100% - By God ki kasam.

I fully agree with you. I drive the same way.

My minor scrapes have all been at <20 kph when i've been distracted, or assumed the cabbie/moron will not attempt to scrape through. Assume the worst, assign negative intelligence and high speeds are safe enough IMO!


However, this is a sensitive topic and way too many people will shout to make their point/prejudice heard - so I won't say anything more!
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Old 30th October 2009, 10:46   #38
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I am in the same situation as you, every single one of my scrapes have been at or close to standstill, and I regularly cross 150, but I will still advise everyone against driving fast, simply because I have seen far too many horrific accidents caused by speeding idiots who shouldn't have been allowed to drive a tricycle.
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Old 30th October 2009, 11:36   #39
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Can we rename the topic to Does Speeding Really Kill? - A Survey in Europe and America. Not valid for India.
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Old 30th October 2009, 13:33   #40
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In my take, speed and speeding are 2 different things. Speed is physics, Speeding is a policy. Every driver, in sane and sober state, has different response times for different speeds. So how do u make a state policy that can govern a million different response times as judicially correct?

For the sake of easy and convenient governance, a policy is brought in and made mandatory to be followed. Then there is common physics and implications of speed driving introduced into the policy for the sake of "Social Responsibility" (remember "speed thrills, but Kills" slogan?). This can include theories that wearing helmets is safer when riding (whether correct or incorrect can be debated another time). There is also the theory of reducing state's burden of medical and hospitalization due to accidents. Additionally, its common theory that driving in a consistent and optimum speed will result in greater fuel efficiency. This common theory of consistent and optimum speed is different for different vehicles.

So many theories, so many points of view. A blanket policy covers all. Purely convenience of governance for the roads.

The lack of these policy impositions effectively in India has resulted in so many speedbreakers on all roads. In effect, govt says, go kill urself if u want to go fast, else, just go slow. Period. Fuel efficiency and spares be damned.

Just going fast doesn't kill.

In the example of the Autobahns, are there illiterate and mindless villagers crossing the road like its their backyard? Or cows sun-basking on the fast lane? Or autorickshaws "speeding" at 20kmph? I don't think so. Its so easy to put a lower speed limit as the policy on the Autobahns, and going slow is dangerous rather than going fast.

Perhaps, we can make our roads safer by putting a lower speed limit and say roadcrossers/jaywalkers/autos/cows be damned, we gotta have budding schumachers on MG Roads! No jaywalker will ever dare a "speeding" BMTC, including Auto drivers. Cows could still be a problem though.

Prajwal
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Old 30th October 2009, 18:51   #41
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Originally Posted by prajwalkashyap View Post
are there illiterate and mindless villagers crossing the road like its their backyard? Or cows sun-basking on the fast lane? Or autorickshaws "speeding" at 20kmph? Prajwal
Dear Prajwal,

Please don't call villagers illiterate and mindless. The Indian villager is no more either illiterate or mindless. I know that most of the villagers I've met till date across India can identify alphabet and they have excellent awareness levels. So, it is extremely hard for me to call an Indian villager mindless even if she/he is illiterate, which is also getting rarer by the day.

I've personally noticed that it is not just villagers who cross roads without giving any attention to traffic signal or conditions but even city dwellers are equally prone to committing such errors.

Regards
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Old 30th October 2009, 19:07   #42
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Please don't call villagers illiterate and mindless. The Indian villager is no more either illiterate or mindless.
I think he was specifically refering to illiterate and mindless villagers and not literate and mindful villagers. BTW, I live in a village...
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Old 30th October 2009, 19:12   #43
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Dear Prajwal,

Please don't call villagers illiterate and mindless. The Indian villager is no more either illiterate or mindless. I know that most of the villagers I've met till date across India can identify alphabet and they have excellent awareness levels. So, it is extremely hard for me to call an Indian villager mindless even if she/he is illiterate, which is also getting rarer by the day.

I've personally noticed that it is not just villagers who cross roads without giving any attention to traffic signal or conditions but even city dwellers are equally prone to committing such errors.

Regards
It was mindless of me to have called them as "illiterate". Yes, you are right, city slickers are equally at fault, but somehow, u just find more of the villagers than city slickers on highways. In the city, there is no differentiation. All seem to be equally mindless.

Prajwal
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Old 30th October 2009, 19:34   #44
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Originally Posted by prajwalkashyap View Post
It was mindless of me to have called them as "illiterate". Yes, you are right, city slickers are equally at fault, but somehow, u just find more of the villagers than city slickers on highways. In the city, there is no differentiation. All seem to be equally mindless.

Prajwal
Forget only villagers, on our old highways, at times it seems as if the entire village is on the highway

True, city-slickers are equally at fault. I would not be wrong in saying that jaywalking without a thought for traffic seems to be ingrained in most Indians.
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Old 31st October 2009, 09:38   #45
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The thread reminds me of a quote,
" it takes almost 8460 bolts to make an automobile and a nut to scatter it all across the road."
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