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Old 9th November 2005, 20:30   #181
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The guy has been shut up
Beaten up in virtual space
We are now virtually technically prosthelyzing what to do

Logically it is time to end this thread
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Old 9th November 2005, 23:41   #182
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Smile thank you

Thanks for your views, guys. But in my opinion, disabling text selection seems to be the only 'quick & effective' solution to stop unauthorized reproduction of our content. True, there are ways to get around it, but assuming that the plagiarizer is a dumb wit who wants to earn a quick buck, the solution might just hold up. If not completely, it will at least reduce the number of reviews being plagiarized.

Even if we do manage to develop a custom solution to address our unique needs, it will be prone to hacks, bugs, cracks, cheats etc. There is nothing like a 'secure' or 'bug free' software. Every peice of code can be 'cheated' and it's purpose defeated.

Just for the records, mouthshut.com is using the very same logic I posted, to prevent unauthorized reproduction of their reviews.

And finally, the easiest way to rip content off a 'secure' web site is to view the source. It opens up the HTML code with the page content in Notepad.

@dceite: Using ASP won't help. It only pushes content along with HTML code from the backend to the browser. View > Source will still work.
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Old 10th November 2005, 00:23   #183
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yes moutshut has implemented this but it is useless.

1)was able to get all text from pulsu&*$ review on mouthshut within 30 secs after using Samurai's method.copying webpage .

2)secondly there is no quoting on mouthshut like we have here.

3)Cheats like pulsu%^*& are smart enough to get around these roadblocks.

a solid foolproof solution is not viable at all.
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Old 10th November 2005, 15:35   #184
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Pulsarian get yourself a girl go rent a (p) movie and try coming close to enacting what they do well that way it'll atleast make you feel like a man of some sort !
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Old 12th November 2005, 19:09   #185
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Quote:
Originally Posted by merve_extreme
a solid foolproof solution is not viable at all.
I totally agree with Merve here. HTTP protocol is text based. So... All we can do is make things difficult for such copy cat jerks.

Saving a web page from File menu can be tackled by opening the thread in a new browser window where all the toolbars would be disabled.

There are other tricks that could make copying contents of a webpage difficult but not impossible.

I'll try to come up with the best possible solution if time permits me. Anybody interested PM me. Because discussing this solution here would defeat the whole purpose.
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Old 12th November 2005, 23:50   #186
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rock 'n' rollz
I totally agree with Merve here. HTTP protocol is text based. So...
Well, all Internet protocols are text based, not sure where you are going with this. Besides, the http protocol is not relevant here. You should be talking about manipulating html, javascript, etc.
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Old 13th November 2005, 02:29   #187
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Default Here's my two bits on this fracas...

I have been following this whole thing a while. While this obnoxious kid may have been stamped out for now where is the guarantee that he won't change his pseudoname and start it all over again? Or for that matter someone else like him won't?

A solution is definitely required. At the same time conversion to image is riddled with problems as so many members pointed out. But solutions do exist.

Without getting into much technicalities let me draw a point-by-point case...

What are the possible ways to pick up text from the site? Here are the ways

a> Someone simply selects the content, copies it and pastes it elsewhere.

b> Uses the menubar to save the pages locally and then does the cut-paste job.

c> Since merve_extreme even thought of OCR (I personally feel thats a bit too much of an overkill for a two-pence drifter), one can do a print-screen, paste it and save it as image. Thereafter runs a software to convert that back into text.

So if we block all these ways would you ppl say that will solve our problems? If so, there is a solution available. Here is what can be done.

Using client-end scripting (Javascript)
a> stop the selection and copying of text from the pages.
b> stop the usage of mouse right-click.
c> stop all keys except the characters, numerals and special characters. This will stop the usage of extended keyboard features that bring-up the context menus.
d> to stop the saving of pages locally
i] either introduce frames. Even a dummy frame will do. A framed page is more difficult to save.
ii] better still, open the site (say, after the opening TBHP page without content) in a new window sans any menubar. That takes away all the menu options of the browser!
e> finally, to counter the unlikely image capturing issue (eg: through print-screen) a client code can ensure that anything that is grabbed will never be available to be copied back.

Best part is that once implemented it won't require ppl to sit and do time consuming conversions et al.

Oops! did i sound like a geek gone berserk?!! welll... actually this problem tickled my other love... to design a solution to a pesky problem. I do that as a professional, uc

Last edited by Zappo : 13th November 2005 at 02:44.
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Old 13th November 2005, 02:35   #188
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DueLLeR
Thanks for your views, guys. But in my opinion, disabling text selection seems to be the only 'quick & effective' solution to stop unauthorized reproduction of our content. True, there are ways to get around it, but assuming that the plagiarizer is a dumb wit who wants to earn a quick buck, the solution might just hold up. If not completely, it will at least reduce the number of reviews being plagiarized.

Even if we do manage to develop a custom solution to address our unique needs, it will be prone to hacks, bugs, cracks, cheats etc. There is nothing like a 'secure' or 'bug free' software. Every peice of code can be 'cheated' and it's purpose defeated.

Just for the records, mouthshut.com is using the very same logic I posted, to prevent unauthorized reproduction of their reviews.

And finally, the easiest way to rip content off a 'secure' web site is to view the source. It opens up the HTML code with the page content in Notepad.

@dceite: Using ASP won't help. It only pushes content along with HTML code from the backend to the browser. View > Source will still work.
@DueLLer, Source-code viewing can be stopped using muliple ways buddy.

I agree though when you say that every piece of software, no matter who writes it, can be cheated. However we can make it so difficult that the returns do not give enough incentives to go to such lengths even if the guy on the other side is a whiz. As a matter of fact more often than not these plagiarists (we are not actually bothered with hackers and crackers here, are we?) are a mere forms of con artists. They are just out there to have their time in the sun. Such people would just go elsewhere for easy pickings rather than device a solution to such problems, for if they could I suspect they would have done something more productive than scraping the bottoms of the pans for leftovers.

Last edited by Zappo : 13th November 2005 at 02:42.
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Old 13th November 2005, 09:38   #189
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zappo
Oops! did i sound like a geek gone berserk?!! welll... actually this problem tickled my other love... to design a solution to a pesky problem. I do that as a professional, uc
Nope you sounded like a Geek who is extremely practical. Sounds good, and like you said the point of the exercise is to make copying UNVIABLE and not IMPOSSIBLE because the latter is, well, impossible


The object of any preventative exercise to curb fraud of any sort is to make the effort of copying unviable in terms of either money/time/other resource so that the action becomes unsustainable for the perpetrator. You've hit the nail on the head!
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Old 13th November 2005, 15:35   #190
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zappo
I have been following this whole thing a while. While this obnoxious kid may have been stamped out for now where is the guarantee that he won't change his pseudoname and start it all over again? Or for that matter someone else like him won't?

A solution is definitely required. At the same time conversion to image is riddled with problems as so many members pointed out. But solutions do exist.

Without getting into much technicalities let me draw a point-by-point case...

What are the possible ways to pick up text from the site? Here are the ways

a> Someone simply selects the content, copies it and pastes it elsewhere.

b> Uses the menubar to save the pages locally and then does the cut-paste job.

c> Since merve_extreme even thought of OCR (I personally feel thats a bit too much of an overkill for a two-pence drifter), one can do a print-screen, paste it and save it as image. Thereafter runs a software to convert that back into text.

So if we block all these ways would you ppl say that will solve our problems? If so, there is a solution available. Here is what can be done.

Using client-end scripting (Javascript)
a> stop the selection and copying of text from the pages.
b> stop the usage of mouse right-click.
c> stop all keys except the characters, numerals and special characters. This will stop the usage of extended keyboard features that bring-up the context menus.
d> to stop the saving of pages locally
i] either introduce frames. Even a dummy frame will do. A framed page is more difficult to save.
ii] better still, open the site (say, after the opening TBHP page without content) in a new window sans any menubar. That takes away all the menu options of the browser!
e> finally, to counter the unlikely image capturing issue (eg: through print-screen) a client code can ensure that anything that is grabbed will never be available to be copied back.

Best part is that once implemented it won't require ppl to sit and do time consuming conversions et al.

Oops! did i sound like a geek gone berserk?!! welll... actually this problem tickled my other love... to design a solution to a pesky problem. I do that as a professional, uc

zappo,
taking away the menu-bar, disabling right mouse operations etc. will almost probably serve the intended purpose. But will it not also rob the genuine members here of ease of operation and on the whole be counter-productive to the rest of us ?

also can you explain how you can ensure that pages will not be stored in history ? also will that work across all browsers ??

because if the web-pages figure in the history of the browser, then even the browser-based restrictions you are suggesting such as disabling of right mouse click or the menus will be pointless as the file can just be opened in notepad to get at the text contents.

Also even though it may be difficult to save frame-based pages, it definitely not impossible. would just take a little while more to get at the contents through notepad. and remember, people like pulsarian have no shortage of time.
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Old 13th November 2005, 19:35   #191
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@zappo.your solution sounds good but then,one can easily get the text by quoting the post.so we will have to stop quote which is not possible on this forum.there are few other loopholes but i will tell u about them thru PM.

secondly,this forum is automated and the required code to dissable menus etc will have to be implemented in the forum source code which may not be possible.one will have to check it with vbulletin and i am not sure they will imlement it.
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Old 14th November 2005, 09:42   #192
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Hi-funda copy protection techniques will excite only the nave techie, while punishing the genuine user at the expense of site traffic. A motivated plagiarist will never be deterred... even if it has to mean re-typing makhkhi-se-makhkhi!

T-BHP fora are not commercial in nature that we should be bothered about loss of revenue because of plagiarism. In fact, we have a decent system of recording date/ time which will tell who wrote first. Let plagiarists be what they are worth. Let's focus on content... T-BHP is already the forum of choice for people who matter in India!
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Old 14th November 2005, 09:51   #193
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Quote:
Originally Posted by msprabhakar
Hi-funda copy protection techniques will excite only the nave techie, while punishing the genuine user at the expense of site traffic. A motivated plagiarist will never be deterred... even if it has to mean re-typing makhkhi-se-makhkhi!
Oh, thanks for saying this. I am of the same sentiment, only I didn't express it looking at the enthu of the younger techies.
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Old 14th November 2005, 21:46   #194
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Merve we are in total sync again. May be because we are those naive techies.
Zappo although your solution is on the right lines like merve said it wont be easy to implement because of vbulletin stuff...

It looks like we all agree that we can't do anything to fix plagiarists like pulsarian. On this note I suggest is thread ko lock kiya jaaye.
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Old 15th November 2005, 00:51   #195
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exactly Rock 'n' rollz we cannot do anything.if someone has to copy he will copy it even if he has to type the review all over again,how can we just stop anyone from writing(typing) down what he is seeing on his monitor.

T-bhp is not commercial in any way,nor were we trying to protect revenue loss,we were just trying to find a way around for members who feel deeply hurt when someone blantly copies their hardwork and takes the merit for himself.Nothing more to say.
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