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Old 19th June 2017, 16:31   #9436
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The most absurd thing that caught my attention from yesterday's match was, how selfish Jadeja was when he was sprinting towards his crease? As an experienced cricketer he should have known that Pandya was the last hope and he should have sacrificed his wicket for the sake of the team. I always had the impression that Jadeja was a 'team' player compared to some of the other Indian cricketers (i don't want to name any of them here), but all that changed yesterday for me!
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Old 19th June 2017, 18:31   #9437
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Originally Posted by Sawyer View Post
That said, India looked flat yesterday. And were completely dismantled by a team that wanted the win a lot more. India thought that they are entitled to the win.
Due credit to Pakistan for the way they played. They knew pressure was on India as they were favourites & this helped Pakistan play more freely!

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Some Indian ODI careers need to be closed down now with a view to WC 2019. Yuvraj, Dhoni, Ashwin are names that come to mind.
Still think they are decent enough for the time being but yes 2 years down the line that may not be the case. Selectors need to decide soon. Manish Pandey, Pant, Dinesh Kartik, Kuldeep Yadav are knocking at the door hard!

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Kohli has probably learnt his lesson on thinking flexibly and on his choking in all finals.
Infact, Kohli in tournament finals has a very poor record,just like the great Tendulkar!

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Originally Posted by antz.bin View Post
They were clearly rattled by the presence of Fakhar Zaman on the crease, but I don't know, was he really as dangerous as he was made out to be?
These new left handers really fancy themselves against the Indian bowling attack. Just take a look at that SA keeper's record against India.

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Either they were over confident or were under prepared for what was coming atleast when they batted.
We were never really tested in all the earlier games. 80% of the runs were scored by the top 3!
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Old 19th June 2017, 19:23   #9438
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Kohli blew it up at the toss. Pakistan are weak chasers, they even struggled to chase 230 odd against Sri Lanka. If we had batted first and put up even 250, we would have been in the game. Instead, we allowed them to completely bat us out of the game.

Scoreboard pressure always works in big games. Ganguly had made the same blunder in the 2003 world cup final but sadly we don't seem to have learnt anything from that.
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Old 19th June 2017, 20:09   #9439
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I used to be a hardcore cricket fan (not just 'Indian team' fan). I don't follow the game as much nowadays except through newspaper reports the next day.
Just wanted to share my 2 cents.
No team wins all their games. You win some and lose some. Its all part of the sport. As a fan of the game, what I want to see (particularly in big games) is a CONTEST between 2 teams - both teams in with a chance about 15 overs before the end of the match. And it ceases to be fun when one team throws in the towel too early or does not show the fight till the end. And that's what hurt me most about the Indian performance yesterday. One thing I admire about the Aussies or even the Kiwis - they never give up until the end. Wish this Indian team cultivates this trait - our present coach knows a thing or two about it .
Its not the loss that hurts but the manner in which we lost - without putting up a fight till the end.
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Old 20th June 2017, 12:45   #9440
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Right from the beginning both Bumra and Bhuvi were targeting middle and leg of Fakhar, so far as I remember one of the few balls that Bumra bowled in the regulation 4th stump line outside off, he got an edge, and cant be termed as bad luck, because bowling a no ball nowadays in limited over cricket is not acceptable (atleast at this level).

As many have pointed out Ashwin too was looking to block the so called strong off side play of Fakhar. I mean he is not Saeed Anwar or Sourav Ganguly or Brian Lara that we can't bowl him outside the off. The better strategy would have been good length out side the off stump (consistently) and then pack the off side field. Let him take his chances. He might hit a few boundaries but would also give you opportunities.

You win the toss elect to bowl first and then you start off defensive right from the word go instead of looking for wickets. If Kohli was so much worried about the flatness of pitch that it was just impossible to bowl orthodox line, then he should have opted to bat first.

Also the thinking that we will chase whatever they set is very odd. Pakistan's strength lies in their bowling (probably the best bowling side in the tournament). So they would even have been confident of doing well to defend a modest score of 250. They would have backed themselves. On the contrary if we would have posted something like say 275, even that target can create pressure on rather good batting line ups.

Everything said and done, I think the intent to win which I saw in Pakistan's team in the final was completely missing somehow in our case.

Kohli is a great cricketer, but still has some distance to go as far as captaincy is concerned. I am sure he is a quick learner and will adapt accordingly in future. Having said that, its never easy to lead teams like India and Pakistan. Few months back all were criticising Dhoni for non performance, now we will do the same for Kohli. But overall I still would like to believe that Ganguly and Dhoni were the two best captains India has ever had.

Last edited by Prafful_Rathod : 20th June 2017 at 12:48.
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Old 20th June 2017, 13:12   #9441
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Originally Posted by Prafful_Rathod View Post
... then he should have opted to bat first..
At least IMO, he should have opted to bat 1st as soon as he won the toss. Oh well...

Reminds me of an (apocryphal?) anecdote about W.G.Grace

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..the good Doctor always knew what to do once he had won the toss and that was to bat. The exception being when he thought conditions favoured the bowling. Then he would think about it, and still bat.
Cheers,
Vikram
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Old 20th June 2017, 20:18   #9442
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Latest and expected (a sad one in my opinion) development in Indian cricket.
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Anil Kumble*has stepped down as coach of the*Indian cricket teamafter he decided not to accompany the Indian team to the West Indies for a limited-overs series starting June 23, citing commitment to an ICC meeting. Kumble is a part of ICC's cricket committee and has reportedly sent his resignation to*BCCICEO.
Source:http://m.timesofindia.com/sports/cri...w/59237922.cms
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Old 20th June 2017, 21:25   #9443
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The last head to have rolled - if at all needed to do so - has been the first to go.

Kohli needs to be kept on a tight leash. But it is not going to happen till we lose overseas, so this time I have conflicting interests in the results.
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Old 20th June 2017, 21:30   #9444
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Originally Posted by comfortablynumb View Post
At least IMO, he should have opted to bat 1st as soon as he won the toss. Oh well...
Maybe he chose to bat because Kumble told him to bowl first. Conspiracy theories
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Old 20th June 2017, 22:01   #9445
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I think we should look at a low profile coach, someone like Tom Moody or even Lalchand Rajput or even go back to Ravi Shastri if he's interested.
I was quite surprised that Kumble was picked as coach back then which i believe was more so because of him being a big name in Indian cricket as also his presentation which he made to the committee. We should completely avoid Sehwag as coach as he has no coaching experience and he's better of in the commentary box.
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Old 20th June 2017, 23:18   #9446
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Media reports say that Ravi Shastri is ready to take up the job provided its offered to him, he won't apply. For that to happen, one of the committee members Saurav Gangluy will have to swallow his ego because there was (is) a lot of bad blood after Shastri was rejected in favour of Kumble and dada went public with the reasons (which I personally think were right) - Shastri making his presentation remotely while on vacation !

Also, Kumble has fought within administration before - resigned and walked out of KCA where his group had a sweeping majority. This is his second fight / failure. Now that I think of it, even in his playing days, Kumble's attitude towards his fielding teammates was never really positive. Used to get visibly flustered quite often, even when the fielder was not at fault. So it may not be Kohli's fault only. In fact, I've read that even others in the team had issues with Kumble.

I think there will be no head coach for the WI tour. And fresh applications will be sought now that it is sure that we need a new coach. Maybe Dravid will be convinced to graduate to the senior team. But Sehwag, no way !
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Old 20th June 2017, 23:33   #9447
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Nobody with half a spine is going to last as coach of the cricket team. That would mean keeping the prima donnas in check and when has that ever worked out?

It only ever ends ONE way, labeled 'problematic/egoistic/your choice of epithet here' and kicked out, unless you have the good grace to resign first.
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Old 21st June 2017, 02:14   #9448
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Prima donnas running the game played by prima donnas, scratching each other's backs. Supreme court and administrators on the sidelines, merely spineless observers.

India could be a lot better at cricket than it is today - that is the message in all this.

Hockey seems to be better managed and coached these days.
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Old 21st June 2017, 09:50   #9449
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On the CT Final:
I think everyone mentioned here and I believe the same, we had the wrong strategy going into the final. Specially when it wasn't working, we kept using the same. Bowling first was okay but that attitude of only stopping runs wasn't.
And with a score of almost 340, you needed your top 3 to fire, and as expected they did not in a pressure game. India keeps losing these important knockout games.
It was sad to see the way Dhawan & Kohli gave away their wicket. Rohit got an absolute peach. All said and done, the better team won, easily in the end.

On Kumble quitting as coach:
This is absolutely absurd that the captain now decides who he can work with. We are now either looking for a lame duck or someone like Shastri who seems to be a massive Kohli supporter. I cannot believe that the likes of Sachin, Laxman & Saurav could not force this decision and had to essentially bow down to Kohli.

The thought that I get is that we are becoming a team who will play when everything goes in our favour. And yeah, I hope we don't play BD one more time in the knockouts, it tends to make our team believe they are unbeatable. If you look at it this way, if SA had not imploded in batting first from a position of strength, we might even not be in the semis. Instead, we got to play BD in semis and consequently in finals.
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Old 21st June 2017, 10:52   #9450
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On the CT Final:
... And yeah, I hope we don't play BD one more time in the knockouts, it tends to make our team believe they are unbeatable.
....
Instead, we got to play BD in semis and consequently in finals.
Point well made. Irony, we did not learn from out past mistakes. India sailing through to the finals comparatively easy.
A similar situation in 2003 WC. India played Kenya in Super six stage and Swmi-FInals and beat them quite easily. Ganguly had scored 3 centuries in the tournament before finals. 2 against Kenya and one against Namibia. These factors eventually led SG and the team believe that they could chase against AUS in the finals, even after winning the toss. Everyone knows what happened there, once AUS were put into bat.

On Kumble's ouster: Yes, Kumble is bit of a hard nut to crack and not a person who can be taken lightly on a cricket field. Having said that, one needs to keep "King Kohli" in the check. Right now, there seems to be no one to control the boy, within BCCI.
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