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Old 19th August 2010, 14:47   #16
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Most of the times its the money. My colleague was drawing 8 lacs p.a when he changed. He got around 10+ lacs p.a. The funny thing was that the lady who was recruited to replace him came at a salary of 14 lacs p.a.

Thats the crux of problem. If salary is lower than what market offers then all the above mentioned points combined with the lower salary result in employee going. In India the salary simply does not increase with the responsibilty handled by the person.
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Old 19th August 2010, 14:56   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ghodlur View Post
  1. The job or workplace was not as expected.
  2. The mismatch between job and person
  3. Too few growth and advancement opportunities.
  4. Feeling devalued and unrecognized
+10

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Originally Posted by sudhi_des View Post
Some of my friends who are very good in their work complain about bad HR policies and politics in their company. They get a hike of says 10% and others get more than 20%(without any reason).

You will get a good rating in you appraisal but at the time of hike there will be a very thin margin between you and the average performer.


Don't know why you get just a little hike when you work extremely well
Further, this becomes more frustrating when you see other nincompoops getting more than what you deserved.

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Originally Posted by amtak View Post
0-2 years - Money
2-4 years - Position
4-6 years - Job satisfaction
6-8 years - Same old routine
8-10 years - What have I achieved in life?
10-12 years - Money
12-24 years - History repeats itself

Correct me if I am wrong.
A very good perspective, well said.

I would like to add one more:- Time consuming, non value adding, foolish and archaic activities which lead you to nowhere and of course you will always find morons standing in queues to take a pie of credit, but when the firing comes you are left alone ("Maine to bola tha na, Kya re itna nahin samajh paaye?")

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Old 19th August 2010, 15:00   #18
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"Its about money honey!". Position also matter in senior levels. A "Vice President" do sound much better than a "Program Manager" even though in practice both do the same job.

Bad boss is the primary reason why I changed 3 of my last 5 jobs. Rest 2 were for location change and issues with nature of job. Our HR department is struggling to cope with the high levels of attrition these days. Recruitment is even more tough due to "unfavorable" market conditions. Like somebody said earlier, we lose a person with 10 lacs salary for a 20% hike, struggle for 3 months to find a replacement and then finally manage to find one with 18 lacs salary as replacement. Total cost of this replacement is much higher than 6 lacs when you include the lost opportunities, training/acclimatization cost, customer/internal networking etc..
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Old 19th August 2010, 16:51   #19
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Originally Posted by DCEite View Post
Is it only me or anyone else who experienced more politics in a Services/ Outsourced product dev. company, compared to a Product company ?
agree completely with you DCEite. its way more than a product company.
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Old 19th August 2010, 17:10   #20
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Saw the thread title and suddenly retention bonus came to my mind. Surprised that no one mentioned it explicitly so far.

Seriously, HR should offer retention bonus to key employees. Sticking around for 1 year means this much moolah and so on. Or is that a wicked thought?

Quote:
Originally Posted by DCEite View Post
Is it only me or anyone else who experienced more politics in a Services/ Outsourced product dev. company, compared to a Product company ?
Interesting observation. Those who started/stayed with product companies for long duration may find the other side difficult? Is that the case?
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Old 19th August 2010, 17:24   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sbraj View Post
Interesting observation. Those who started/stayed with product companies for long duration may find the other side difficult? Is that the case?
I started out with a service company, and quit ONLY thanks to my boss and his inhumane ways or running the team. Yes, inhumane is the word.

Moved to a product based company and will complete 5 years here next june. Must say, i dont see much reason to leave.

My wife who's with the same service company i quit thinks of quitting every single day, owing to lack of recognition for efforts put in, while morons manage to suckle their way up. However, preparing for an interview is the sole reason holding her back.
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Old 19th August 2010, 17:35   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gandhi View Post
These are the points for which I will NOT leave a company:
  1. Management that under commits and over delivers
  2. Open work culture where everyone's opinion is counted
  3. Managers take care of management related things ONLY and technical things are handled by technical people
  4. A performance measurement system where people are rewarded accordingly (i.e. you get extraordinary rewards if you perform extraordinary and vice versa)
  5. A 360 degree feedback system till director level
  6. Complete flexibility to balance my work and personal life
  7. Of course industry par salary
P.S: All these things are considered IFF the work is satisfactory to me.
Isn't that every man and woman's wishlist for the ideal employer? Are you working in one such company now? If so do you have openings?
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Old 19th August 2010, 18:22   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sbraj View Post
Saw the thread title and suddenly retention bonus came to my mind. Surprised that no one mentioned it explicitly so far.

Seriously, HR should offer retention bonus to key employees. Sticking around for 1 year means this much moolah and so on. Or is that a wicked thought?
The retention bonus has to be significantly high amount to retain top performers. No one would stay back for a lakh or two over a year if that can be easily covered by a job switch to other company.

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Originally Posted by cnaganathan View Post
Isn't that every man and woman's wishlist for the ideal employer? Are you working in one such company now? If so do you have openings?
One can't generalize such things at company level as the companies are getting bigger and bigger. Different groups in different companies will have different work cultures etc. In my group, yes above mentioned items are pretty much in place and hence we have very low attrition rate (is less than 10% good?).
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Old 19th August 2010, 18:31   #24
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I can talk about a few reasons for severe employee attrition in my organisation which happens to be one of the biggest IT companies in India.
  • This company treated its employees very badly during the recession time. Tens of Thousands were shown the door for no real good reason only to show double digit profits even during the peak of recession - So much for a company whose motto included "Act with Sensitivity". Now the market has picked up and its payback time by the employees!!!! An adept example of "You reap what you sow".
  • Below average salaries - Almost everyone who is jumping the boat is claiming 60-150% hike.
  • Inefficient senior management without any clear vision for the future
  • Clueless HR's who are still busy doling out childish schemes for employee retention which is only backfiring at them time and again.
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Old 19th August 2010, 19:06   #25
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Here is an amazing video on "How to motivate employees" by Dan Pink.

The art of motivating employees - Holy Kaw!

Am still trying to convince management that they should pay employees enough that they forget about money and just focus on work .
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Old 19th August 2010, 20:39   #26
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My two cents on this. Some reasons which would help the companies to retain the employees.

1. Good & positive environment in the project.
2. Good sports recreational facilities to be offered in the company.
3. Match the skill set of the employee with the role that is being performed by him/her.
4. Share short term and long term visions at project, account & company level with an employee.
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Old 19th August 2010, 20:53   #27
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Values. I see declining values amongst both the employees as well as the board! That reflects the current values the company professes, propagates!
I've been with a company for 10 long years. Initially, I stayed back because of immense opportunities to learn. Then I stayed back because I built some good relationships and groomed people. Then I stayed back because, of the work life balance. No point of time did I feel that I was grossly underpaid (compared to my peers), or there's so much of in-house politics that is stifling my other-wise what would have been a fast paced growth in the corporate world.
But since last 2 years, I have got the feeling, where's ethics and values? Do they simply adorn walls in the form of mission and vision statements alone? Are we willing to take shortcuts to meet targets?
Am I ending up a loner or worse an idiot in a world that says make hay while the sun shines?
With appreciation for values and ethics dwindling, I see that it's time to toddle off. May be 10 years is too much to spend in one company.
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Old 19th August 2010, 21:01   #28
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I'm really curious. I was paid X at my previous company. my best friend from another co was offered 1.8X and the next applicable role by my co. And I was offered the same and around 1.7x by his co.
Eventually, I would have ended up replacing him, and him replacing me, and both companies about .7~.8X poorer
both of us were willing to stick to our own cos for around 50% more OR a role change, and yet these companies forced us to play this hand, which ends up more expensive for them.

I cannot come up with a rational/logical explanation for this behavior. I asked this to my HR during my exit interview. He said that 'thats just the way things are'
(I'm a noob to this HR stuff, so pardon my naivety)
Why is it that most people get better evaluations elsewhere for the same job, than internally?
Or conversely, despite all this talk of retention,
Why are laterals are paid more than existing employees, even when they bring nothing new to the table?

Last edited by greenhorn : 19th August 2010 at 21:10.
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Old 19th August 2010, 21:22   #29
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I think the story is same everywhere, at least from the posts one gets that feeling.
Strange thing I have noticed in our company is that, nominal hike was given to very good employees and after they leave, HR has no problem in hiring a replacement giving him/her a 30-40% hike.

Is it the same everywhere? Reluctance in rewarding the people who have been with you for quite sometime, performs quite well but ends up in a zone wherein they are kinda forced to leave?

Or HR must be getting a cut from job consultants, who knows?

The primary reason for leaving the job
(1) Work not up to one's expectations.
(2) Bad manager
The above two can be in any order. It holds good either way.
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Old 19th August 2010, 21:48   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greenhorn View Post
I cannot come up with a rational/logical explanation for this behavior. I asked this to my HR during my exit interview. He said that 'thats just the way things are'
Whenever I change a company, it affects my resume. Hence, though theoretically, I can change as often as I wish, in practice I cannot. Beyond a level, it will not be acceptable to most companies. An unreliable candidate is not someone keenly welcomed. HR plays on this when it comes to existing employees.
Moreover, employee retention is partly owned by the reporting manager. HR will get impacted when people leave from multiple department in herds citing HR related reasons. Else the reporting manager gets questioned.
Quote:
Originally Posted by greenhorn View Post
Why are laterals are paid more than existing employees, even when they bring nothing new to the table?
To attract talent, most companies offer high initial pay which gets normalised over couple of years.

Just my thoughts, I could be completely wrong.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bkbkr1212 View Post
Or HR must be getting a cut from job consultants, who knows?
You bet.

Last edited by sbraj : 19th August 2010 at 21:50.
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