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Old 1st February 2012, 10:56   #886
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Default Re: Pune : Roads, traffic conditions, route queries and other assorted rants.

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Originally Posted by Swanand Inamdar View Post
Anyone read about the tiff between the Army guys and police guys in Alka chowk?

Apparently, 2 CME guys were on a bike on Lakdi Bridge. The cops seemed to have pulled them over, and then began a show of strength between the cops and the army.
Yup, this was utter non-sense act from the army guys. First of all, the 2 bikers were not supposed to ride on the Lakdi bridge. And instead of accepting their mistake and paying the fine or whatever, they started arm wrestling with the cops. They did not stop there. They called their colleagues and in no time, 4-5 truck full of army guys came to spot and started bashing the police like they were our enemies on the other side of the border. They slapped some cops, snatched and crashed cameras of media persons, broke into the police office and destroyed the glass top of a table and etc... I do not find a difference between the army guys and the local 'dada's in this particular scenario. Even those local dadas call their gang and bash up people like this.

Where is the army discipline in all this? Ideally, those 2 bikers should have accepted the mistake and calmly handled the case. Secondly, if they ever had to call someone, they should have called some senior army officer who would have talked to the police authoritatively and would have settled the case in a saner way.

All said and done, this is probably one side of the story. I am not sure what triggered the physical fight between the army guys and cops. We need to know those 2 bikers statement, hoping that they tell the truth and only the truth.
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Old 1st February 2012, 10:57   #887
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Default Re: Pune : Roads, traffic conditions, route queries and other assorted rants.

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Originally Posted by Swanand Inamdar View Post
Apparently, 2 CME guys were on a bike on Lakdi Bridge. The cops seemed to have pulled them over, and then began a show of strength between the cops and the army.
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Originally Posted by AutoIndian View Post
Apparently when the cops pulled them over & demanded the fine, they called up their friends/ colleagues & a mob of 40 gathered at the site & the ruckus between the army & the cops started. Had the 2 guys paid the fine for traffic violation & carried over, such a scene could have been avoided.
While such behaviour is condemnable, I have one question to ask.

Where were these cops when all the goons canvassing for various parties with flags/ banners etc were using Lakdi pul on their two wheelers?
The rule should be applicable to everybody including political goons. If they cannot or choose not to apply it, then I prefer that army guys flout the rule too
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Old 1st February 2012, 11:24   #888
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Default Re: Pune : Roads, traffic conditions, route queries and other assorted rants.

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Originally Posted by sajo View Post
^^ My memory and observations is really foggy, but I think the signs banning two wheelers are not very prominently displayed , either at Alka side or Deccan side.
I agree with you completely. The signs are very easy to miss. Almost everyone that I know of i.e. friends, relatives who are new in Pune have paid a fine on the lakdi pul. Even I had to pay the fine once when I was back after a long period overseas. People don't imagine such a stupid rule would exist on a fairly wide looking bridge, so irrespective of whether you know Marathi, you end up paying fine if you don't already know the rule.
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Old 1st February 2012, 11:34   #889
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Default Re: Pune : Roads, traffic conditions, route queries and other assorted rants.

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Originally Posted by sajo View Post
^^ My memory and observations is really foggy, but I think the signs banning two wheelers are not very prominently displayed , either at Alka side or Deccan side.
I dont know the current scenario, but a few years ago, a Tamil friend of mine was fined because he couldnt read the sign saying so at the start of Lakdi Pul , because it was in Marathi.
It should be prominently displayed everywhere , along with graphical representation and in English.
Gotta fully agree with you. The cops covertly stand at the other ends of the bridge to catch offenders than to stand at the start and request people not to enter the bridge. In my honest observation regarding this bridge, no person would deliberately dare to cross it if he knows its not permitted since the chances of getting caught are more. In most cases its a genuine mistake due to poor directions and guidelines on the use of the bridge.

Reminds me of an incident from Bombay when I went across a footover bridge at a railway station only to be caught on the otherside for ticketless travel. I asked the TC to accompany me to the place where such a signboard had been put up. He gladly walked along with me and showed me a round rusted board lying on the floor with pan stains all over it that had no readable warning. I held my ground and walked away without paying any fine.
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Old 1st February 2012, 11:57   #890
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Default Re: Pune : Roads, traffic conditions, route queries and other assorted rants.

I need to clarify that if somebody had to flout a rule, I would prefer army guys flouting the rule instead of these hoodlums canvassing on bikes.

Ajay; if a goon bashed up the cops, what action would have been taken against him? He would have been let off due to some political influence/ interference. While I dont think the traffic cops are 'milk bathed' either (doodh ke dhoole ), the problem lies in the empowerment of these cops. Everyone thinks they are above the letter of the law, both in rule and spirit. Be it a paid hoodlum or an army trainee guy. The thing that separates us civilians from such people is that we pay and move on while they take it as an accostment, a stain on their ego.

Kiran, I agree with you about the unfortunate focus given by our cops to collect fines rather than ensure preventive action. Our fines are so low that they are not even a deterrent to anybody anymore. Maybe they have monthly targets too.

All said and done, this is not the first time that army guys have clashed with civilian cops. And we all have heard enough number of true stories to prevent us from expecting this will be the last time this has happened.

Last edited by selfdrive : 1st February 2012 at 11:59.
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Old 1st February 2012, 12:08   #891
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Default Re: Pune : Roads, traffic conditions, route queries and other assorted rants.

Last time there was a major clash if this scale was a few years ago, where NDA guys and cops sparred at Khadakwasla.
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Old 1st February 2012, 12:30   #892
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Default Re: Pune : Roads, traffic conditions, route queries and other assorted rants.

Coming to moralfibres point: I agree to it, police allow to break the rule and they catch bikers on other side of the bridge.

But then there are sign boards - which i agree cannot be properly seen, but are clearly visible and can be read if attention is paid while driving.

Police cannot stand in every corner of roads, one-ways etc to stop people violating rules. if we violate we should pay the fine.

I have visited the police station near the bridge many times and asked them to correct the signal pattern and durations. they party did it, but still not perfect.

Last edited by noopster : 1st February 2012 at 15:59. Reason: Please stay on-topic.
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Old 1st February 2012, 13:23   #893
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Default Re: Pune : Roads, traffic conditions, route queries and other assorted rants.

Yesterday I was having some pineapple Juice at Pimpri at a known Juice Outlet when I saw 12-13 kids ; not more than 8 years old, on a bright Red Open Jeep (fully modded with heavy radials and all) driven by a middle aged man, canvassing for votes for a local candidate with a Handheld Megaphone...
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Old 1st February 2012, 17:00   #894
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Default Re: Pune : Roads, traffic conditions, route queries and other assorted rants.

Army fans here may probably argue with me, but I feel Army works very differently in Pune. I have been to Rajasthan near border, and seen how superb the roads are, and how the civilian life is part of military life there. Here in Pune, I have noticed following observations in my 3 years stay:

1. Speedbrakers. The road from Ghorpadi to Camp houses an unbelievable number of speedbrakers, many built up very recently. And always in pairs - one before a gate, one after, so that both sides slow down twice. I remember reading that speedbrakers within 100 meters of each other are not legal and Thane's speedbrakers were indeed removed few years back due to this. But to hoot with the law, as proven by the Lakdi bridge incidence.

2. Road blocking. The road between Mundhwa railway crossing and Koregaon Park was operating 1 year ago. One fine day, big gates popped up on both sides of the road, and it was closed to civilians. So it added atleast 3-4 kms of round trip through Mundhwa village for those coming from BT Kawde side to Koregaon Park/Kalyani Nagar.

3. Road signs. Once you are in military camp area, suddenly all your MG roads and Central areas disappear. All signs point to O/Ep/248, Esq.Dno.Ml. or some cryptic locations only those guys will be able to understand.

Once I have been to Rajasthan and saw how well the Army maintains the roads there, with proud motto on the lines of 'our target is fast mobilization of resources', here it is completely opposite of the way, where they put as many obstacles in ways of speedbrakers and 'no entries' to 'slower mobilization of resources'! I wish Pune's camp and other army areas become as friendly and good as their Rajasthan ones!
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Old 1st February 2012, 19:04   #895
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This is unacceptable un Officer Like Behaviour.

I am sure Comdt CME will order a Court of Inquiry and within 3 months a General Court Martial will dish out examplary punishment to the guilty Officers.

Indian Army will not be found wanting in taking quick action.

Rgds

Indian Navy Vetran

Quote:
Originally Posted by Swanand Inamdar View Post
Anyone read about the tiff between the Army guys and police guys in Alka chowk?

Apparently, 2 CME guys were on a bike on Lakdi Bridge. The cops seemed to have pulled them over, and then began a show of strength between the cops and the army.
Show of Strength ! How many tanks turned up?

Dont worry all the mighty strength vaalaas will be sent home !

Quote:
Originally Posted by ajay_satpute View Post
Yup, this was utter non-sense act from the army guys. First of all, the 2 bikers were not supposed to ride on the Lakdi bridge. And instead of accepting their mistake and paying the fine or whatever, they started arm wrestling with the cops. They did not stop there. They called their colleagues and in no time, 4-5 truck full of army guys came to spot and started bashing the police like they were our enemies on the other side of the border. They slapped some cops, snatched and crashed cameras of media persons, broke into the police office and destroyed the glass top of a table and etc... I do not find a difference between the army guys and the local 'dada's in this particular scenario. Even those local dadas call their gang and bash up people like this.

Where is the army discipline in all this? Ideally, those 2 bikers should have accepted the mistake and calmly handled the case. Secondly, if they ever had to call someone, they should have called some senior army officer who would have talked to the police authoritatively and would have settled the case in a saner way.

All said and done, this is probably one side of the story. I am not sure what triggered the physical fight between the army guys and cops. We need to know those 2 bikers statement, hoping that they tell the truth and only the truth.
My sources tell me Commandant CME is under tremendous pressure from Higher Ups to discipline the rouges Officers and a COI has been ordered.

Unconfirmed reports say some Officers are already in Quarter Guard. Something like House Arrest.

Note from the Team-BHP Support Team: Please use the "edit" button if posting within 30 minutes of the first post, instead of creating another back-to-back post.

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Last edited by noopster : 1st February 2012 at 20:53.
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Old 2nd February 2012, 00:10   #896
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Default Re: Pune : Roads, traffic conditions, route queries and other assorted rants.

Quote:
Originally Posted by selfdrive View Post
While such behavior is condemnable, I have one question to ask.

Where were these cops when all the goons canvassing for various parties with flags/ banners etc were using Lakdi pul on their two wheelers?
The rule should be applicable to everybody including political goons. If they cannot or choose not to apply it, then I prefer that army guys flout the rule too
Why only the army guys ? Why only political people ? Why not you and me ? Is it because we are the stupid common public paying taxes and following rules or is it because of the below -
Quote:
Originally Posted by selfdrive View Post
The thing that separates us civilians from such people is that we pay and move on while they take it as an accostment, a stain on their ego.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ani_meher View Post
1. Speedbrakers. The road from Ghorpadi to Camp houses an unbelievable number of speedbrakers, many built up very recently. And always in pairs - one before a gate, one after, so that both sides slow down twice. I remember reading that speedbrakers within 100 meters of each other are not legal and Thane's speedbrakers were indeed removed few years back due to this. But to hoot with the law, as proven by the Lakdi bridge incidence.

2. Road blocking. The road between Mundhwa railway crossing and Koregaon Park was operating 1 year ago. One fine day, big gates popped up on both sides of the road, and it was closed to civilians. So it added at least 3-4 kms of round trip through Mundhwa village for those coming from BT Kawde side to Koregaon Park/Kalyani Nagar.

3. Road signs. Once you are in military camp area, suddenly all your MG roads and Central areas disappear. All signs point to O/Ep/248, Esq.Dno.Ml. or some cryptic locations only those guys will be able to understand.
+1, you mentioned some valid points. No body knows why and what laws or who gave them the authority to harass civilians likes blocking roads suddenly.

I think you missed one point - they are doing favor by not collecting toll taxes on the roads through camp area etc. if you notice there are some sign boards clearly mentioning the taxes to be paid, depending on the vehicle size/shape which they do not collect always !

Quote:
Originally Posted by nanduchitnis View Post
This is unacceptable un Officer Like Behavior.

I am sure Comdt CME will order a Court of Inquiry and within 3 months a General Court Martial will dish out exemplary punishment to the guilty Officers.

Indian Army will not be found wanting in taking quick action.

Rgds

Indian Navy Vetran



Show of Strength ! How many tanks turned up?

Don’t worry all the mighty strength vaalaas will be sent home !


My sources tell me Commandant CME is under tremendous pressure from Higher Ups to discipline the rouges Officers and a COI has been ordered.

Unconfirmed reports say some Officers are already in Quarter Guard. Something likes House Arrest.
Good to read this. However, this is not the first case (forget Pune this has happened in many other cities and many times, if any proper action was taken before this would not have happened here) and won't be the last one.

There is always a first time though, please do share the actions taken and how many army personnel (if at all) is sent home finally (as per your post above), so that we the poor civilians get some relief from this power/ego/strength shows.

Quote:
Originally Posted by selfdrive View Post
All said and done, this is not the first time that army guys have clashed with civilian cops. And we all have heard enough number of true stories to prevent us from expecting this will be the last time this has happened.
+1, Sad but true.

----------------

*** Please note - am not a fan or hater of any class of people, these are just my views, you may or may not agree, I am ok with that, feel free to express your opinion

Last edited by AvonA7 : 2nd February 2012 at 00:17. Reason: edit ...
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Old 2nd February 2012, 06:10   #897
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AvonA7

I think you missed one point - they are doing favor by not collecting toll taxes on the roads through camp area etc. if you notice there are some sign boards clearly mentioning the taxes to be paid, depending on the vehicle size/shape which they do not collect always !
The said tax is the vehicle entry tax collected by PCB (Pune Cantonment Board) from Transport Vehicles & Taxis (yellow number plated) plying through Camp area of pune.
This tax is duly collected by contracted agencies appointed by the PCB.

You may notice such tax collection shacks on empress garden road, solapur road, golibar maidan road, bhairoba nala road, etc.
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Old 2nd February 2012, 07:37   #898
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Default Re: Pune : Roads, traffic conditions, route queries and other assorted rants.

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Originally Posted by AvonA7 View Post
Why only the army guys ? Why only political people ? Why not you and me ? Is it because we are the stupid common public paying taxes and following rules
Army guys because if it is not according to protocol, be assured something will happen later.
Stupid common public not ok because we are soft targets and will end up paying one way or the other. Is it not enough that we are paying so many taxes anyway (notably double taxation on both income and expenditure)? The common man mostly has enough common sense to be penny wise here.
Other people I mentioned earlier, no control by anyone, no further comments from me.
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Old 2nd February 2012, 10:56   #899
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Default Re: Pune : Roads, traffic conditions, route queries and other assorted rants.

I was under the impression that the canvassing has stopped. Proven wrong already. Everyone is rooting for himself and his uncle.

People travelling to Kothrud: Avoid the Chandani Chowk route till Bhusari Colony. Apparently, there's going to be a rally there. While coming to office, I did see party workers putting up a pandal and all.
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Old 2nd February 2012, 11:42   #900
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Default Re: Pune : Roads, traffic conditions, route queries and other assorted rants.

When is the underground road near the Sancheti hospital going to be completed??? I have lost track of time when it was started in the first place. The work is going on at snail pace. Though the bottleneck is not as severe as it used to be before, its kind of frustration to see the work being slowly done.
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