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Old 27th December 2015, 20:06   #19501
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Originally Posted by hserus View Post
The guy behind me had seen the signal start to go green and so hasn't slowed down all that much - which explains his slamming into me at 25-30 kmph instead of a much faster speed. Meanwhile the Palio took his right turn and drove merrily off.
This is one of my driving mantras: "just because the guy in front has started, does not mean he will not stop again." Obviously, you understand this whole thing too, but the Innova driver was just going by what he thought other people should do. The Palio driver was inconsiderate, and an idiot. The Innova driver was utterly wrong. You did everything right, and got a damaged bumper as a reward: life is not fair.

Sorry to hear about this: without those idiot attachments on the Innova it might have just been a dent that would have come out easily.
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Old 27th December 2015, 20:34   #19502
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Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom View Post
Braking, no problem.

Driving too close to car in front, big problem.
So what would you determine as a safe distance?
I find that leaving a small gap in between means lots of suicide bikers with Rossi's skills are going to cut in without sparing a thought, which will eventually slow you down. I try going as close as possible depending on the car's braking power. Sorry for the noob question, I'm a beginner.

Last edited by Turbohead : 27th December 2015 at 20:57. Reason: Typed breaking instead of braking. Autocorrect just had fun.
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Old 27th December 2015, 20:39   #19503
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Originally Posted by Turbohead View Post
I try going as close as possible depending on the car's braking power. Sorry for the noob question, I'm a beginner.
I would say that please let this bikers win their races and let them cut in front or come in between, they have a habit of finding minuscule gaps.
If you do not keep a gap and the car in front of you brakes hard, you have more chance of rear ending him. Even if the car in front of you and your car have good brakes, the guy behind you may still rear end your car with sudden braking.

Last edited by Gannu_1 : 28th December 2015 at 12:13. Reason: Editing quoted post. OP has corrected the typo.
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Old 27th December 2015, 20:42   #19504
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Originally Posted by Turbohead View Post
So what would you determine as a safe distance?
I find that leaving a small gap in between means lots of suicide bikers with Rossi's skills are going to cut in without sparing a thought, which will eventually slow you down. I try going as close as possible depending on the car's braking power. Sorry for the noob question, I'm a beginner.
The rule of thumb is being able to see the number plate of the car in front of you. That rule was not quite made for two wheelers and even office cabs that will happily nose in front of you if you do that. However not competing with them will save your blood pressure for sure - and prevents you to some extent from getting your car scratched.

Last edited by Gannu_1 : 28th December 2015 at 12:13. Reason: Editing quoted post. OP has corrected the typo.
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Old 27th December 2015, 20:51   #19505
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Originally Posted by Turbohead View Post
So what would you determine as a safe distance?
Search for the 3-second rule. Helps maintain a safe distance. That's the theory part. Practically, maintain a distance in which you are certain of stopping safely, including avoiding getting rear-ended.

Quote:
I try going as close as possible depending on the car's braking power.
You must account for the trailing/tailgating vehicle's braking distance also.

Last edited by Gannu_1 : 28th December 2015 at 12:14. Reason: Editing quoted post. OP has corrected the typo.
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Old 27th December 2015, 21:11   #19506
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Originally Posted by hserus View Post
Remember, it managed to start the bus and it into gear on its very first attempt. So already a better driver than most of the first time drivers that turn up with brand new driving licenses in India.

I am not sure just how it was able to put the bus into any sort of gear by the way. Don't buses have a clutch that needs to be depressed before, presumably, the monkey jumped onto or grabbed the gearshift in order to engage second gear and set the vehicle into motion?

I refuse to believe that the monkey could keep the clutch depressed and pull on the gear lever. The monkey playing with the ignition key could start the bus, but then pulling on or jumping onto the gear lever would still not put the vehicle into gear unless the clutch was depressed first.

Or unless the vehicle was actually parked with first or second gear engaged. I see at least some valet parking drivers etc leave a car in gear rather than neutral when parking it on absolutely flat ground, even claiming it is a best practice (yes I understand about parking it on a slope but there you'd generally twist the wheel so that the vehicle would go into the curb if it decided to start rolling on its own). The bus driver might have done just that, so that twisting the ignition key was enough to start the bus moving.


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Originally Posted by Pferdestarke View Post
That's incorrect. One can slot in a gear successfully without pressing the clutch but that would certainly stall the engine unless ample gas is pumped to it to keep up the revs.







This one sounds undoable. In case the vehicle is parked with gear slotted in and cranked up, the vehicle would flit a bit and stalls the engine.



All these hypotheses are far-fetched and are viable only when we suppose that the monkey has managed to press the gas pedal too.


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Originally Posted by sjcherian View Post
So many monkeys get to drive in the roads without knowing what they are doing.
So what if a real monkey managed to move a bus a bit.

I think the bus may already have its engine running. The monkey pressed the accelerator only. (Just like on the driving test that most human monkeys on the road take). Vehicle will move in whichever direction the front wheels are pointing.


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Originally Posted by Bigzero View Post
If the bus was parked in first gear with no handbrakes on, isnt it possible that the starter motor could have just about managed to jump the bus forward a bit? If the engine iis warm, isnt it possible that a brief jerk of that sort could have started the engine?

I have a solution to all the confusion. THE BUS WAS AUTOMATIC TRANSMISSON!!! Now can we move on. I can't believe people spend numerous pages discussing how a monkey drove a bus! I mean, it even sounds so weird. And no one really saw what really happened actually. And still! I can't really tell anyone what to discuss, but just stop a sec and reflect on the pages spent on this guys. I thought life is too short for stuff like this. But obviously I'm wrong. Play on!
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Old 28th December 2015, 14:06   #19507
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Default re: Pics: Accidents in India

This is my car now. Happened last night at 1 am on a narrow road. A dog suddenly darted in from the left. Swerved right to avoid it and then had to immediately turn left to avoid hitting a light pole head-on. Managed that, but the back right of the car hit the pole, the car turned 180 clockwise and came to rest after hitting a second pole on the front passenger door. My wife and me were both wearing seat belts and my son was sleeping in the back. No injuries to us in the front, but my son got a couple of scratches from the shattered back windshield glass and a bump on the forehead - probably from hitting the door when the car spun.

The car was doing 60 kmph.
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Old 28th December 2015, 14:35   #19508
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Default re: Pics: Accidents in India

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Originally Posted by samaspire View Post
This is my car now. Happened last night at 1 am on a narrow road. A dog suddenly darted in from the left. Swerved right to avoid it and then had to immediately turn left to avoid hitting a light pole head-on. Managed that, but the back right of the car hit the pole, the car turned 180 clockwise and came to rest after hitting a second pole on the front passenger door. My wife and me were both wearing seat belts and my son was sleeping in the back. No injuries to us in the front, but my son got a couple of scratches from the shattered back windshield glass and a bump on the forehead - probably from hitting the door when the car spun.
My condolences to you for having to see your brand new car go through such a damaging accident, glad that you and your family are safe though just goes to show that wearing seatbelts really does save lives or atleast serious injury hope you checked if your son has got any concussion because that is very important. I was in a crash once when the car I was driving aquaplaned at high speeds and there was simply nothing I could do to prevent the slide or regain control. The girl seated next to me wasn't belted up and while I was still able to drive the car to the workshop and everyone was fine, her optic nerve had got crushed and swollen and required several days of treatment to get rid of the blurry vision she complained of. Luckily we had her checked right after the crash even though she initially claimed she was fine, since the windshield was cracked and I suspected it was her head that must have struck it.

Seems like you did some very drastic swerving though. I'd recommend that you stay calm during such situations, I understand that it is a tough ask for most people but perhaps some meditation and a few track days would help and next time remember that as long as no one is behind you, it is always recommended that you brake (dont bother steering if you don't have abs unless you have the time, space and skill for such a maneuver) or simply hit the dog for your own safety (tough call to make I am sure but it is what it is).

Is it merely body panel and suspension damage or is there more to it, any info on whether it can be fixed and how much it will cost?

Wishing you all the best with your insurance and car and many safer miles ahead.

Cheers!

Last edited by IshaanIan : 28th December 2015 at 14:52.
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Old 28th December 2015, 14:44   #19509
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Damn. That looks quite nasty.

Guess it's a car without ABS.
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Old 28th December 2015, 15:10   #19510
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Originally Posted by ghodlur View Post
It does not need to be brainy to predict which direction this case will move. Inspite of all evidences which the cops must have gathered, I would not be too surprised to know that the woman might walk out on a bail even though the charges applied are for non bailable offence. Remember the Nooria Haveliwala case where the lady again drunk mowed down a couple of cops and in spite of all the attention the case grabbed on the media, the lady is out on bail.
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When the heat dies down, she will get released on bail, and in a couple of months will start her drunken journeys once again....
Quoting a couple of posts relevant to the discussion on the Mumbai Audi case where a drunk lawyer drove on the wrong side of a freeway and collided with a taxi-killing two. Just read that apart from being out on bail, she has got her license and car back and has been allowed to repair the car also.

Pretty shocking that she got her license back so easily. Guess it is just a matter of time before the case also goes in the dustbin.

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After the accident, Gadkar spent over 50 days in police custody and was finally granted bail on 5th August, against a surety of Rs 30,000. In December, following her appeal to the Deputy Commissioner of Regional Transport Office opposing the deferral of her license, the court ordered a re-investigation by the RTO officer. The court stated that principals of natural justice were not followed ahead of her license suspension, further, Gadkar’s license was returned to her after she submitted the required approval from the RTO. The court has also allowed her to take her car back, but on a condition that Gadkar could get the Audi repaired but cannot change its colour.

She was drunk, she drove on the wrongside of a freeway, she rammed her SUV into a cab, killed two innocent lives, tried to bribe the witnesses and more, but now she is out, her driving permit is returned to her along with the car
Source: Motoroids

Quote:
Originally Posted by samaspire View Post
This is my car now. Happened last night at 1 am on a narrow road. A dog suddenly darted in from the left. Swerved right to avoid it and then had to immediately turn left to avoid hitting a light pole head-on. Managed that, but the back right of the car hit the pole, the car turned 180 clockwise and came to rest after hitting a second pole on the front passenger door. My wife and me were both wearing seat belts and my son was sleeping in the back. No injuries to us in the front, but my son got a couple of scratches from the shattered back windshield glass and a bump on the forehead - probably from hitting the door when the car spun.
Oh that was pretty unfortunate. Glad to know you and your family are fine. Car looks to have suffered significant damage. Bad thing to happen to a new car. :(

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Originally Posted by kiku007 View Post
Damn. That looks quite nasty.

Guess it's a car without ABS.
From sam's other posts and thread, I guess it is a variant that does not have ABS. But in this case from the description, does not looked like samaspire panic braked, he was able to swerve and avoid the dog but had to swerve again to avoid the post. I think this is the kind of situation that the ESP (Electronic Stability Program) helps prevent. Here due to the swerve, the rear went out of control. If it is a car equipped with ESC, it would kick in and may prevent this from happening.

Edit: A video on ESC from the Polo GT TSI Review. I assume this would have been the maneuver samaspire was forced to do. In a way lucky that it happened on a deserted narrow road. Could have been catastrophic on a busy highway

Last edited by Rajeevraj : 28th December 2015 at 15:23.
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Old 28th December 2015, 15:15   #19511
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Originally Posted by samaspire View Post
This is my car now.
Sorry to see your brand new car in such a condition! At the same time, I'm glad your family is safe. Please have your kid belted too and if it's a toddler please get an appropriate baby seat and belt him up. You were lucky nothing serious happened to him.

Also, an uncle of mine always said not to brake/swerve for an animal. He said that would cause more damage than just hitting the animal. Although it sounds morally wrong, his words definitely make sense.

On another note, that's a LOT of damage for a light pole to cause!

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Originally Posted by kiku007 View Post
Guess it's a car without ABS.
samaspire never mentions anything about braking or wheels locking. He clearly swerved to avoid the dog and lost control of the vehicle. What would ABS do in this scenario?
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Old 28th December 2015, 15:20   #19512
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Quote:
Originally Posted by samaspire View Post
This is my car now. Happened last night at 1 am on a narrow road. A dog suddenly darted in from the left. Swerved right to avoid it and then had to immediately turn left to avoid hitting a light pole head-on. Managed that, but the back right of the car hit the pole, the car turned 180 clockwise and came to rest after hitting a second pole on the front passenger door. My wife and me were both wearing seat belts and my son was sleeping in the back. No injuries to us in the front, but my son got a couple of scratches from the shattered back windshield glass and a bump on the forehead - probably from hitting the door when the car spun.

The car was doing 60 kmph.
As Ishaan mentions, the best thing to do would probably be to hit the dog, however wrong it might sound. But instincts do take over I guess so nothing much can be done about it. Luckily there was no other vehicle coming in the opposite direction.

Do you have zero depreciation insurance? Since it is a fairly new car, I am assuming that insurance would cover most of the cost, even if there is no zero depreciation coverage though. Keep us posted!!!
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Old 28th December 2015, 15:36   #19513
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Originally Posted by Rajeevraj View Post
From sam's other posts and thread, I guess it is a variant that does not have ABS. But in this case from the description, does not looked like samaspire panic braked, he was able to swerve and avoid the dog but had to swerve again to avoid the post. I think this is the kind of situation that the ESP (Electronic Stability Program) helps prevent. Here due to the swerve, the rear went out of control. If it is a car equipped with ESC, it would kick in and may prevent this from happening.
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Originally Posted by Added_flavor View Post
samaspire never mentions anything about braking or wheels locking. He clearly swerved to avoid the dog and lost control of the vehicle. What would ABS do in this scenario?
ESC would have definitely helped in keeping the car in control but electronic stability programs are still a very rare feature in the Indian car market. I guess what Kiku meant is that if the car atleast had ABS, samaspire could have easily braked and steered at the same time perhaps avoiding such drastic movement in the first place.

Last edited by IshaanIan : 28th December 2015 at 15:40.
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Old 28th December 2015, 16:39   #19514
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rajeevraj View Post
From sam's other posts and thread, I guess it is a variant that does not have ABS. But in this case from the description, does not looked like samaspire panic braked, he was able to swerve and avoid the dog but had to swerve again to avoid the post. I think this is the kind of situation that the ESP (Electronic Stability Program) helps prevent. Here due to the swerve, the rear went out of control. If it is a car equipped with ESC, it would kick in and may prevent this from happening.
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Originally Posted by Added_flavor View Post
samaspire never mentions anything about braking or wheels locking. He clearly swerved to avoid the dog and lost control of the vehicle. What would ABS do in this scenario?

This is how a car with ABS would have helped -->

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Originally Posted by IshaanIan View Post
I guess what Kiku meant is that if the car atleast had ABS, samaspire could have easily braked and steered at the same time perhaps avoiding such drastic movement in the first place.
1. See obstacle, stamp on the brakes, hold steering straight - ABS won't help always. The wheels won't lock, you'll travel in a straight line but you'll most likely hit the obstacle.

2. See obstacle, stamp on the brakes, steer away from the obstacle - ABS helps. You have control of steering while shedding speed.

Having cars with ABS as standard and informed drivers will help a long way in preventing many accidents in India. However we see manufacturers choosing Airbag as standard instead of ABS so that their cars clear any random crash test with a better score.

Last edited by kiku007 : 28th December 2015 at 16:43.
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Old 28th December 2015, 16:44   #19515
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Originally Posted by kiku007 View Post
This is how a car with ABS would have helped -->
Hypothetical scenario --> ABS would have given the confidence to the driver to brake.

Real world scenario --> Out of sheer instinct, the driver steered away from the obstacle and did not touch the brakes, ABS or no ABS.

My reasoning is on the real world scenario and hence the question. Cheers!
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