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Old 6th November 2011, 00:35   #1
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Unhappy Ford Figo : Serious brake problem!

I met with an accident today, driving in my 5 month old figo, diesel.
My car did 10k last weekend, so I had it back from free service on Monday. Before giving it to free service, I had requested the service personnel to look into the brake condition. I told them that my figo doesn't seem to come to quick stop when I drive in speeds > 80kmph.

So, I was driving on a flyover in Hyderabad, today, which has an up turn and then a down. Everybody picks up speed when vehicles start getting down on the fly over. I was about 60kmph, there was no vehicle ahead of me, and I pressed the brake to slow down my car a bit - and I made no special effort as you can guess, it was just a customary half press on the brake (a muscle memory act), and before I know, the car came to an immediate halt and to zero. I had no clue to what was happening - My friend next to me was like, what the heck - why are you stopping. I had no clue. I have driven 10k kms so far right in the city and the way the car stopped, like I pulled the handbrake or something - from 60 to 0 - and before I could figure out what was wrong, it was too late for the lady on a scooty right behind my car.
She crashed hard and I could see her in my rear view mirror - she slammed hard into my rear windshield and it shattered to bits.

She suffered some minor injuries on her knee caps and a minor arm injury, so I took her to the nearest hospital. Technically, it wasn't my fault, but I just couldn't believe that I would go cause trouble to someone - so I took her to the hospital and told her that I would get her bike fixed, coz she was more worried about the bike. Oh, I have to add how pathetic and shameless our Hyderabad traffic police are. I mean, I am sure vultures would wait a little longer for a carcass than traffic police looking to make money out of these incidents. Instead of helping out people in accident shock, this guy stands there, not clear the traffic jam on the flyover and tells me that he has radioed the crime guys and I can't take her to hospital. Thanks to a gentleman on the accident scene, who yelled at the traffic constable and threatened to call the police commissioner, I was let go.

I am so sad today at the state of things in my country - I worry seriously about my future now. Nothing on this earth is going to change these pathetic lousy good for nothing traffic police in Hyderabad. Anyway, I bought medicines for the girl, got her scooty towed - I was later told that to fix the damage, it would cost me about 10k INR. So, here are some questions for you guys:

1) Have you had this sort of weird brake problems with Figo? I cannot believe that I would do something stupid as pressing the brake instead of the accelerator - Figo is my second car and I did about 50k on my last one and I have been driving for over 6 years.
2) Before the free second service, I noticed this creaky sound in my brakes - (I see that some threads have already mentioned this) - when I complained about my brakes, I thought they would fix it. When my Figo came back, the creaky noise still existed. It seemed like they did nothing to fix it - atleast, I couldn't tell if they did anything about it coz the supervisor who completed the job didn't mention it. Even if they did something about it, I have a feeling that they screwed up something. Do you think I should go get this brake checked out at a mechanic before I go back to Ford and yell at them?
3) I was told that to further investigate this issue, I should get a OBD scan, which records all activity. Do you think such a scan would reveal if it was my mistake or a car error?
4) I am still in shock about the whole thing. I am happy that the girl is ok. Though I feel morally bad about the accident, technically, the girl banged into the car rear - for not taking enough distance, she is at fault too. I am not sure if I should ask her if she could spare some money to get the bike fixed, coz 10k is a lot of money for me at this point (I am not doing well economically plus I have paid 1k for the girl's hospital charges and I'll have to pay out of pocket for my car post insurance claim approval). I have registered an insurance claim - should I claim third party damage too? Am I going to need an FIR for this? If I claim for third party, will it badly effect my premium next year? There is a part of me, that is telling me that, if I don't get her bike fixed up, which I said I would, I wouldn't be doing the right thing, but logically and practically, I see that I don't have to be this nice.

Please let me know your suggestions.

Please
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Old 6th November 2011, 09:29   #2
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Default Re: Figo brake problem! Figo owners, please help. Should I sue Ford?

Really sad to hear about the accident. Bad things happen :( . Dont worry, this too shall tide over.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fedexp View Post
1) Have you had this sort of weird brake problems with Figo? I cannot believe that I would do something stupid as pressing the brake instead of the accelerator - Figo is my second car and I did about 50k on my last one and I have been driving for over 6 years.

Did you get your brakes checked after the accident?
2) Before the free second service, I noticed this creaky sound in my brakes - (I see that some threads have already mentioned this) - when I complained about my brakes, I thought they would fix it. When my Figo came back, the creaky noise still existed. It seemed like they did nothing to fix it - atleast, I couldn't tell if they did anything about it coz the supervisor who completed the job didn't mention it. Even if they did something about it, I have a feeling that they screwed up something. Do you think I should go get this brake checked out at a mechanic before I go back to Ford and yell at them?
Same as above
3) I was told that to further investigate this issue, I should get a OBD scan, which records all activity. Do you think such a scan would reveal if it was my mistake or a car error?
I believe that the car does store some driving logs. Good to get that checked
4) I am still in shock about the whole thing. I am happy that the girl is ok. Though I feel morally bad about the accident, technically, the girl banged into the car rear - for not taking enough distance, she is at fault too. I am not sure if I should ask her if she could spare some money to get the bike fixed, coz 10k is a lot of money for me at this point (I am not doing well economically plus I have paid 1k for the girl's hospital charges and I'll have to pay out of pocket for my car post insurance claim approval). I have registered an insurance claim - should I claim third party damage too? Am I going to need an FIR for this? If I claim for third party, will it badly effect my premium next year? There is a part of me, that is telling me that, if I don't get her bike fixed up, which I said I would, I wouldn't be doing the right thing, but logically and practically, I see that I don't have to be this nice.


Hope the insurance gurus can help here. However, 3rd party damage claims should be made by her instead of you doing it. In case of any claims, you will loose the NCB. However, I wonder if the rear windshield will have a 100% cover? (guess its 50% for glass).
Technically, its her fault. However, you are aware what caused it and I think you feel morally obliged to fix it. Then go ahead and do it.

Please let me know your suggestions.

Please
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Old 6th November 2011, 09:53   #3
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Default Re: Figo brake problem! Figo owners, please help. Should I sue Ford?

Quote:
Originally Posted by fedexp View Post
1) Have you had this sort of weird brake problems with Figo?
I'm not a Figo owner, but have travelled many kilometeres in the Figo, and many of my close friends own the Figo. None have encountered this weird issue.

Quote:
2) Before the free second service, I noticed this creaky sound in my brakes
This can be due to dust in the drums or discs. Or worn out pads, which is highly improbable for a 5 month old car.
Quote:
Do you think such a scan would reveal if it was my mistake or a car error?
From an OBD scan on the Figo, all you can get is the error codes, if there are any. Its not a black box.

Quote:
I am not sure if I should ask her if she could spare some money
Well, in case of rear ending, whatever be it, I think the girl is at fault. And not you.

--------------------------------------


Now coming to the incident, if the brakes have locked up, there should be visible signs for that. The brake rotor should have scratches. Also, check if the pads are of good quality, and not worn off. If you find nothing, then yes, it could be you slamming the brakes, as I cant see any other explanation.
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Old 6th November 2011, 10:11   #4
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Default Re: Figo brake problem! Figo owners, please help. Should I sue Ford?

Sounds to me that the brakes might not be set to factory clearance / adjustment and might be too close tolerance.- i might be wrong but if a normal brake feels like a handbrake then might be just that. or a link in your drum brake seized( very unlikely but can happen only if fitted incorrectly). this is strange but hope all goes well to you and the girl as well.

I would suggest going to a track / long unused road to test your brakes at various speeds / pressure ut make sure you get at least ford and FNG to double check your brakes as it is dangerous. it would be best if the service tech does it as well and wear your seat belts. god speed
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Old 6th November 2011, 10:19   #5
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Default Re: Figo brake problem! Figo owners, please help. Should I sue Ford?

Quote:
Originally Posted by aqualeo2040 View Post
Really sad to hear about the accident. Bad things happen :( . Dont worry, this too shall tide over.
Thank you for your words of consolation.

For me its more of a question of morals now. When an industrialist's Verna hit my car from rear a few months ago, it cost me close to 6k and lot of time. He played nicely during the accident scene and later he was like 'please go to the police' - so I was basically conned. I don't want to do the same thing here. I know how bad one would feel about it, coz I have gone through it myself. However, I am not really sure if I am being extra nice if I am spending so much money for the bike repair.
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Old 6th November 2011, 10:26   #6
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Default Re: Figo brake problem! Figo owners, please help. Should I sue Ford?

1) First time I am hearing this brake issue with Figo. And you have mentioned that you were about to slow down the car, so its not you stepping suddenly over brake instead of accelerator. And normally people do the other way round ( its a different story though ). From what you have mentioned, you were consciously trying to slow down.

2) Rear ending. I have faced this even at speeds of 40 in my city. Bikers would rear end even at speeds of 40. Lets reduce the speed now, I have been banged in the rear in Waggie by bikers even when the traffic flow is less than 10 kmph i.e. first gear crawls! The traffic is crawling and still they cant brake.

Its not your fault and this is for sure, but in our nation things work differently. If somebody rear ends you, its you who is at fault because you braked.

Even I am worried about my future in this country, but leave it for later discussions.

3) Cost of repairing scooty. Have you talked with your insurance company if at all they can help in any way, or may be the scooty owner might have insurance to pay for repairs as technically she is at fault. You need not worry about it either. Let insurance take care of this.

The biggest mistake IMO is that you promised to repair the scooty. This promise might make others believe that it was your fault and trying to prove that you are innocent is difficult.
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Old 6th November 2011, 10:40   #7
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Default Re: Figo brake problem! Figo owners, please help. Should I sue Ford?

This reminds me of an incident in which my cousin was rear-ended by a truck. His dad had bought a new Skoda Laura L&K and it was on temp. regn. He took it for a test drive and not used to automatic, he jammed the brake like one would a clutch. So the car travelling at 60 suddenly stops on a dime. The truck travelling behind just couldn't stop on time.
While I agree that rear-ending by 2-wheelers is a menace, thankfully not causing much other than a few scratches on the bumper, in your scenario, I think you're at fault. One does not stop in the middle of the road from 60kph without giving a signal, slowing down and pulling over to the side. Agreed it was a mechanical fault, so it is an accident and not willful hurt.
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Old 6th November 2011, 10:51   #8
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Default Re: Figo brake problem! Figo owners, please help. Should I sue Ford?

If the Scooty is new or 2-3 years old, she can claim insurance.

Please check with the TVS SC about the necessity of FIR.

Since you had promised to repair, i suggest you to personally initiate the insurance claim by taking the scooty to TVS SC. 10K is little too much to shell out from own pocket.
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Old 6th November 2011, 12:36   #9
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Default Re: Figo brake problem! Figo owners, please help. Should I sue Ford?

Quote:
Originally Posted by fedexp View Post
I was about 60kmph, there was no vehicle ahead of me, and I pressed the brake to slow down my car a bit - and I made no special effort as you can guess, it was just a customary half press on the brake (a muscle memory act), and before I know, the car came to an immediate halt and to zero. I had no clue to what was happening - My friend next to me was like, what the heck - why are you stopping. I had no clue. I have driven 10k kms so far right in the city and the way the car stopped, like I pulled the handbrake or something - from 60 to 0 - and before I could figure out what was wrong, it was too late for the lady on a scooty right behind my car.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dhanushs
Well, in case of rear ending, whatever be it, I think the girl is at fault. And not you.
technically yes, but in this case, it was clearly a brake malfunction and our man literally stopped with little prior warning. One doesn't practically maintain a full braking distance in India (unlike elsewhere). Do you always do that? Here in gurgaon on the expressway, even at 70-80 speeds, if you are cruising with enough gap between you and the vehicle in front (in peak hours), some moron will squeeze in. But technically, you're right.

So this argument would definitely not fly in his case. and should the girl get pissed and press charges, he'll get into serious trouble (cash wise). Just not worth even mentioning it!!
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Old 6th November 2011, 18:12   #10
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Default Re: Figo brake problem! Figo owners, please help. Should I sue Ford?

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Originally Posted by phamilyman View Post
technically yes, but in this case, it was clearly a brake malfunction and our man literally stopped with little prior warning. One doesn't practically maintain a full braking distance in India (unlike elsewhere). Do you always do that? Here in gurgaon on the expressway, even at 70-80 speeds, if you are cruising with enough gap between you and the vehicle in front (in peak hours), some moron will squeeze in. But technically, you're right.

So this argument would definitely not fly in his case. and should the girl get pissed and press charges, he'll get into serious trouble (cash wise). Just not worth even mentioning it!!
Ok. I found out that, the girl's scooty doesn't have an insurance - it expired a year ago. She also told me that she doesn't have the DL with her or a copy of it and she claims it was in the scooty and she would have lost it in accident!! Her brother called up in the morning and he doesn't want the police involved. What do I do now?
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Old 6th November 2011, 18:21   #11
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Default Re: Figo brake problem! Figo owners, please help. Should I sue Ford?

what ever be the reason, it is always the fault of the person who rear ended.

Regarding the brakes, I have a titanium and I never faced any issue and my braking was always precise.

By the way, was that the first instance you braked that day or the brakes acted up after being fine until then?


Quote:
Originally Posted by phamilyman View Post
So this argument would definitely not fly in his case. and should the girl get pissed and press charges, he'll get into serious trouble (cash wise). Just not worth even mentioning it!!
No way! She cannot press charges legally, even if the person were to die (I know of one such case). He might be troubled for sometime, but legally he is not liable.

Last edited by anilisanil : 6th November 2011 at 18:24.
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Old 6th November 2011, 20:35   #12
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Default Re: Figo brake problem! Figo owners, please help. Should I sue Ford?

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Originally Posted by fedexp View Post
Ok. I found out that, the girl's scooty doesn't have an insurance - it expired a year ago. She also told me that she doesn't have the DL with her or a copy of it and she claims it was in the scooty and she would have lost it in accident!! Her brother called up in the morning and he doesn't want the police involved. What do I do now?
lol.. they just passed the ball into your court buddy.

Do what your moral side allows, and nothing more.
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Old 6th November 2011, 20:48   #13
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Default Re: Figo brake problem! Figo owners, please help. Should I sue Ford?

Did you pass a water of puddle on the way ? Or was this one of your few first brake application's for the day ?

If either of the above, then yes sometimes the brake do grab during either of the above conditions. In my car, the first couple of brake applications are like hitting a wall. Instantly stops with just a minor pedal application.

Try this out, go to an empty stretch and try braking again and see what happens.
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Old 6th November 2011, 21:48   #14
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Default Re: Figo brake problem! Figo owners, please help. Should I sue Ford?

My inputs regarding the accident issue, have no clarity on the figo brake aspect so won't comment on it

Quote:
Originally Posted by fedexp View Post
1. She crashed hard and I could see her in my rear view mirror - she slammed hard into my rear windshield and it shattered to bits.

2. Technically, it wasn't my fault, but I just couldn't believe that I would go cause trouble to someone - so I took her to the hospital and told her that I would get her bike fixed, coz she was more worried about the bike.
3. Though I feel morally bad about the accident, technically, the girl banged into the car rear - for not taking enough distance, she is at fault too.
4. coz 10k is a lot of money for me at this point (I am not doing well economically plus I have paid 1k for the girl's hospital charges and I'll have to pay out of pocket for my car post insurance claim approval).
Go through the above 4 points - all your statements - that should clear your own thoughts. Clearly you are already at a greater loss (unless you have a zero dep insurance, that windshield & other damages is going to burn a hole in your pocket) than the girl & her scooty damages.

I think you need to take a back seat and let the girl's family accept her faults in this accident.

Quote:
I have registered an insurance claim - should I claim third party damage too? Am I going to need an FIR for this? If I claim for third party, will it badly effect my premium next year? There is a part of me, that is telling me that, if I don't get her bike fixed up, which I said I would, I wouldn't be doing the right thing, but logically and practically, I see that I don't have to be this nice.

Please let me know your suggestions.

Please
1. I think you have the idea of third party insurance wrong. Here you are the first party, and the girl - 2nd party. Third party means any other person/object who got hit/damaged, which is not in your case. Nothing to be done with regards to 3rd party insurance in this case.
2. You will have to claim insurance (Comprehensive/Zero Dep) for your own car damage, and yes that would hit your No claim bonus (NCB) discount for the premium next year. Anyway, I doubt if the damage would be lesser than the discount in your next year's premium, but do the calculations & decide.
3. You took her to an hospital, you paid her medical fees; you even towed her bike to the service center. IMO, that is more than enough.
4. Seriously, getting into an accident with a girl involved as the other party - will always mean that you are at fault. In a lot of cases, the situation turns ugly at the scene (for the guy). So be happy - what you did in that situation was quite correct. Going ahead, you can take a step back & let her family handle it on its own.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fedexp View Post
Ok. I found out that, the girl's scooty doesn't have an insurance - it expired a year ago. She also told me that she doesn't have the DL with her or a copy of it and she claims it was in the scooty and she would have lost it in accident!! Her brother called up in the morning and he doesn't want the police involved. What do I do now?
Awesome. That's three brownie points for you - legally she should not be driving without an valid insurance & a DL (irrespective of what she says, she doesn't have it, right?). No wonder her brother doesn't want the police involved.

My suggestion - make it clear that whatever you did so far was more than enough. If his brother gets nasty, make it clear to him that your car damage is going to be more than her scooty damage. Drop in a hint about the legal aspect of expired insurance & "lost" DL, and he should get the idea.

Also you know about your (suspected) figo brake problem, not they. Make your stand clear on that - don't ever mention about it in discussions with them. Most important of all, never get cocky - I would suggest you to be nice to them in all the discussions - that generally resolves most fights/negotiations.

And chill, sh$t happens.

Last edited by ninjatalli : 6th November 2011 at 21:50.
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Old 6th November 2011, 22:07   #15
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Default Re: Figo brake problem! Figo owners, please help. Should I sue Ford?

Is it possible that during the service the Ford people actually did brake bleeding or whatever and the brakes became more sensitive, and also you braked according to how you used to brake earlier, but this time owing to the brakes getting fixed the car stopped much faster? Seems far fetched I know.
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