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Old 29th August 2013, 23:54   #76
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Default Re: Overspeeding Fine of Rs. 1.24 Lakhs in Kerala

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Originally Posted by speedsatya View Post
The BMTC airport shuttles through driven very rash max out at close to 90 kph. I haven't seen any of these buses do more than 8X kph
Any idea if these buses actually have electronically restricted top speeds, or just have the speed warning alarms (like the annoying ones in Meru cabs)?

I'll take a look at the speedometer the next time I ride to the airport on one of these shuttles.

Last edited by Chetan_Rao : 29th August 2013 at 23:56.
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Old 30th August 2013, 00:11   #77
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Originally Posted by Chetan_Rao View Post

Any idea if these buses actually have electronically restricted top speeds, or just have the speed warning alarms (like the annoying ones in Meru cabs)?

I'll take a look at the speedometer the next time I ride to the airport on one of these shuttles.
I think they are electronically restricted. I always keep my phone GPS on to check , though haven't been on these airport shuttles since 2010 :P
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Old 30th August 2013, 09:45   #78
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Default Re: Overspeeding Fine of Rs. 1.24 Lakhs in Kerala

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I read a comment- speed is seldom a reason for accidents. Far from the truth. In fact, faaaaaaar away.
Exactly what I thought as well when I was going through this thread now. In fact I would take a polar opposite view to the original statement - speed is almost always the reason for accidents - i.e. wrong speed in wrong hands in wrong situations. It is a different debate altogether whether the situations should exist or should be better etc. But as long as there is one - be it smaller roads, pot holes, uninformed or indisciplined public, villagers, animals, rogue road users etc. - if we are faster than we should be there will almost always be an accident.
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Old 30th August 2013, 10:31   #79
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Default Re: Overspeeding Fine of Rs. 1.24 Lakhs in Kerala

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Originally Posted by YaeJay View Post
See what happens when NFS MW BE goes viral? Toll Booth challenge.

A Volvo BR * will smoke most of the cars out here, if in the right hands. I think the steering is extremely precise.

It takes an idiot to crash one of those. As we know, ZMR cant do that. VOLVO can with a full load of travellers!

Overspeeding to me is a little different... Because I do believe doing 50kms/hr in a tvs50 is more dangerous than doing 150 on a VOLVO. yes I meant the BUS.

But, lets all respect the law of the land.
Err, what was this? I guess sarcasm.
ZMR compared to a Volvo? Are you kidding yourself? My query was:

"Who does 150 in a Volvo full of people at night?"
Also, I simply calculated the fine per checkpoint, that is, per camera installed on the way. (I read there were 42 cams)

Hence, any logical reasoning to this should have been a discussion on the driver's rash driving mentality at any time of the day, but you chose bringing up NFS MW here. Guess, you're happy now. But it didn't serve the thread one bit!
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Old 30th August 2013, 10:46   #80
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Default Re: Overspeeding Fine of Rs. 1.24 Lakhs in Kerala

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Originally Posted by Urban_Nomad View Post
We cry ourselves hoarse that traffic rules and broken by many every single day and how unsafe this country has become
...
Oh and you are correct - dangers in the day time are very different from the ones at night. At night (especially around "odd hours"); they increase 10 fold.
The truth is that speed doesn't cause all accidents, I have given two examples about bus accidents I was in, experience suggests that an element of unpredictability and recklessness over speed as a cause.

The dangers at night multiply 10 fold- probably true for Delhi and other major cities, in most parts of Kerala the roads are deserted at night. I know because I have done a lot of driving post 10pm and the only risk is with careless pedestrians and trucks with contraband, to which the police turn a blind eye. The KSRTC bus drivers get a for their driving, it's better than most private cars and taxis.
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Old 30th August 2013, 11:30   #81
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Default Re: Overspeeding Fine of Rs. 1.24 Lakhs in Kerala

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Originally Posted by avira_tk View Post
... in most parts of Kerala the roads are deserted at night. I know because I have done a lot of driving post 10pm and the only risk is with careless pedestrians and trucks with contraband, to which the police turn a blind eye.
I agree to that. Careless pedestrians = careless folks + drunks.

Quote:
The KSRTC bus drivers get a for their driving, it's better than most private cars and taxis.
Indeed they are! Far better than private buses and cabs.
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Old 30th August 2013, 11:33   #82
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Default Re: Overspeeding Fine of Rs. 1.24 Lakhs in Kerala

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Originally Posted by Zed View Post
A valid argument indeed. Yes - speed limits are enforced in many western nations in spite of even modern infrastructure, equipment and driver training. My understanding is that the basis for this is occupant safety - i.e a bus crashing at 120 kmph may not protect occupants to the same degree as a modern pascar. I maybe wrong though. In which case there has to be a valid reason for the speed limit. Emissions ? Braking distance ?
I am not sure of the exact reasons, there should be many; high speed stability, braking distance, susceptible to roll-over, passenger comfort, delays/road blocks in case of an accident etc. maybe a few reasons. And what is commendable is the way they follow the rules so diligently to ensure passenger safety and comfort. Itís not just about reaching from point A to B.

----------
Here is a short video (8 seconds) of a bus losing control and flying over the median to the opposite direction. Just putting it here to demonstrate how a slight lapse of concentration or an evasive action can create havoc. This happened here (in Singapore) last month, there were only two passengers in the bus; one person died, and the other passenger (and the driver) got severely injured.
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Old 30th August 2013, 12:19   #83
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Default Re: Overspeeding Fine of Rs. 1.24 Lakhs in Kerala

In Gods own country... Four wheeler drivers(including private vehicles, 90% of them) are out to kill everybody in sight... Two wheeler riders are on suicide missions the moment they mount their rides... The joke is, not to get hit even by a walking person, he will be walking at 40kmph. Even after driving through the crazy traffic in Bangalore day in & day out...scares the living daylights out when have to drive in GOC, happens once in 3 months. In GOC vehicles overtake with their horns and lights rather than traffic and common sense.
As a first step to improve the situation, I would suggest banning/removing sound horns and highbeams from all vehicles sold in GOC, even better if can be done in the whole country.
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Old 30th August 2013, 14:05   #84
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Default Re: Overspeeding Fine of Rs. 1.24 Lakhs in Kerala

I would think in any accident involving a moving vehicle, the speed plays a vital role. Something very basic and therefore easily overlooked. Take a simple example of an SUV which crushed a child under its wheels. A stationeryvehicle would have averted this tragedy. Take a simpler example of a bus falling into the river. If the bus had followed the speed limits or had been driving at half the speed, it could have been stopped.

Do we still need proof that speed does kill?
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Old 30th August 2013, 20:14   #85
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Default Re: Overspeeding Fine of Rs. 1.24 Lakhs in Kerala

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Originally Posted by honeybee View Post
I read a comment- speed is seldom a reason for accidents. Far from the truth. In fact, faaaaaaar away.

In most cases you will find if the driver had obeyed the speed limits and had not been accelerating mindlessly, accidents could have been avoided.

Speed - mindless and fuelled only by the car's engine's revving capacity and the senseless urgency of the driver, without any regard to any other parameters is one of the biggest causes.

Look everywhere around you: my car can easily do x kmph! But what about me? What about my surroundings? What about the road condition? What about the climate, the time of day? Nobody wants to think. They want to reach there physically before their mind reaches there.
That was my comment. But the point i wanted to make was that [using your points] speed mindful and not fueled by engine revving and sensible urgency with regards to other parameters would work yes? Utopian i know but just a point. Not thinking of kmph, thinking of surroundings, road conditions, climate and time of day and people who actually think many steps down the road, then would speeding be a pain?

Forget it. Too much gyan and not very conducive to the discussion at hand which is of a scary full load [?] bus travelling at high speeds. Anyone work out an approximate stopping distance if braked at that speed?

Someone i know lost his parents and two young kids in an accident recently while he was on a holiday with his wife. A bus from a side road joined the highway at full speed and rammed into their car! Problem with speed is that it makes most of us lose control of whatever common sense we have and that is when chaos ensures.

I shall cease my ranting. Kindly excuse.
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Old 30th August 2013, 21:28   #86
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Default Re: Overspeeding Fine of Rs. 1.24 Lakhs in Kerala

I've done a few calculations for the stopping distance.No idea how accurate they are.

Gross vehicle weight-19000 kg's
Initial velocity -150 Km/h(41.66 m/s)
Mu -Coefficient of friction between the road and tyres-.4(wet)

Equating the kinetic energy and the work done on braking we get the equation

Considering the values .7 for a wet road

d(stopping distance)=v^2/2*mu*g

d=221.146 m

Total stopping distance=Driver reaction time+stopping distance
=1.00*41.66+221.146
=262.806 m

This is just a theoretical value.I think there are other better ways to calculate.The baseline driver reaction time is 1.5.However I think our bus drivers deserve a 1.

IMHO 150 Km/h+ speeds on our highways,especially on full loaded buses is a very bad idea and definitely warrants a heavy fine But maybe the cops should also look into those very rash private bus drivers,the trucks with just 1 headlight and many more!
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Old 30th August 2013, 21:35   #87
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Default Re: Overspeeding Fine of Rs. 1.24 Lakhs in Kerala

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Originally Posted by avira_tk View Post
The truth is that speed doesn't cause all accidents, I have given two examples about bus accidents I was in, experience suggests that an element of unpredictability and recklessness over speed as a cause.

The dangers ......
As a team-bhp member, let me tell you that advocating dangerous driving in team-bhp is not welcome. Do not try to justify dangerous driving by saying "Reaching on time for class, marriage, flight..!!". Kerala roads are apt only for a maximum speed of 80 Kmph. Anything more than that is suicide. . Go check youtube for videos where private buses in Kerala do circuses at high speeds. Kerala police is doing a good job keeping an eye, catching these guys and collecting fine from these rash drivers. I saw someone saying it is socialism or something. Real funny . KSRTC buses dont do 150 Kmph, they do more like 80 Kmph max. And KSRTC drivers are not like the "arrogant monsters/ paid goons" working in Private buses.
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Old 30th August 2013, 22:23   #88
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Default Re: Overspeeding Fine of Rs. 1.24 Lakhs in Kerala

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Originally Posted by AstonMartin View Post
As a team-bhp member, let me tell you that advocating dangerous driving in team-bhp is not welcome. Do not try to justify dangerous driving by saying "Reaching on time for class, marriage, flight..!!". Kerala roads are apt only for a maximum speed of 80 Kmph. Anything more than that is suicide. . Go check youtube for videos where private buses in Kerala do circuses at high speeds. Kerala police is doing a good job keeping an eye, catching these guys and collecting fine from these rash drivers. I saw someone saying it is socialism or something. Real funny . KSRTC buses dont do 150 Kmph, they do more like 80 Kmph max. And KSRTC drivers are not like the "arrogant monsters/ paid goons" working in Private buses.
I am also a member here, I hope you figured that.
Please read all my posts to understand my views, the speed limit in Kerala is 50kmph all round not 80, the speed limit is 70kmph on highways where the incident took place, get your facts straight. The only reference I made to KSRTC(Kerala) drivers was a compliment to their driving, I don't know where you got this arrogant monsters description. Team BHP doesn't promote street racing for sure, that is not being discussed here, go through a few ownership posts you will find speeds close to 150kmph being discussed.

The Kerala cops don't collect fines for "rash driving", do you have any evidence that they do? In your book I suppose overspeeding is the only form of rash driving. The only thing that they have done is send notices to people who have been caught on a speed camera, the fines aren't going to improve the place, Onam bonus around the corner, the treasury is empty and this is the path of minimum resistance - highways are referred to as zamindari convenience in local lingo thats is a socialist hangover not socialism per se. If opposition to expressways qualifies as concern for people then maybe you have no understanding of Kerala psyche - again completely
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Old 30th August 2013, 23:23   #89
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Default Re: Overspeeding Fine of Rs. 1.24 Lakhs in Kerala

avira_tk, can you please highlight the onam part of your comments? Maybe some data to indicate fine collection suddenly goes up in the few days before Onam and other similar festivals?

And in most books, overspeeding would be a major example of rash driving, yes.

If the speed limit is 50kmph, you should be driving at 50kmph tops, not at 100kmph. Responsible behavior starts by following the rules, not by saying you can break certain rules this way and bend some others that way because you know better than the babus who frame those rules.
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Old 31st August 2013, 10:17   #90
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Default Re: Overspeeding Fine of Rs. 1.24 Lakhs in Kerala

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Originally Posted by avira_tk View Post
Onam bonus around the corner, the treasury is empty and this is the path of minimum resistance - highways are referred to as zamindari convenience in local lingo thats is a socialist hangover not socialism per se. If opposition to expressways qualifies as concern for people then maybe you have no understanding of Kerala psyche - again completely
Onam or not, Socialism or not, fining an overspeeding bus is right. There are no two ways about it.

Getting late for any occasion does not warrant putting the life of all the passengers in the bus + other drivers and their families at risk.

Does the damage done to a car hit by a bus travelling at 150 kmph decrease due to onam being around the corner?

The cops in this country are often corrupt to the hilt. But does that mean they can never ever do good? The speed is a killer. Wherever the bus was, Kerala or at the Bermuda triangle (Yes I know that is a water body. Its meant to be a hyperbole) , he made a big mistake.

On another note most of the school buses in Pune seem to have the speed governors installed. Its not an apples to apples comparison per se, but a good move nonetheless. And going by the speeds they do, the governors actually seem to be working.
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