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Old 12th September 2013, 15:54   #31
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Default Re: Freaked out by 90 degree skid this morning!

This may come across as stupid, but can ABS be retrofitted on a car?
I ask because I've never heard of anyone doing it? Also, the Swift and its lack of braking is legendary enough, so wont harp on that. But if indeed available, then seems like a valuable expense.

Vikram, that was so lucky of you! Vashi bridge is normally chocobloc and any other time may have been disastrous.
Do get the tyres changed asap. Weather to change all 4 or 2 is a decision you might have to take, though wisely.
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Old 12th September 2013, 16:13   #32
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Default Re: Freaked out by 90 degree skid this morning!

Hi guys, managed to get some pics of the rear tyres as suggested by some members. Uploading here. Pls let me know if you agree that these indeed warrant replacement. Not the best quality via my Nokia Lumia but I think we will be able to get some idea.

I am very strongly inclined to change all 4. Just want to go with something grippy and although my Acelere's have done me no harm so far, just want to rely on Yoko/Mich/Conti...

Pls let me know what u think of the condition of the tyres
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Old 12th September 2013, 16:22   #33
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Default Re: Freaked out by 90 degree skid this morning!

Quote:
Originally Posted by vikram31 View Post
today when I was on the Vashi bridge (dry road. Perfect tyre pressure, no uneven tread), a two wheeler swerved lanes and I had to slam on the brakes hard. To my horror, my car screeched and turned exactly 90 degrees and came to a halt. The engine was still running and I could smell burnt rubber. I was driving straight and there was no turn whatsover. My steering was perfectly straight as well.
Dear vikram31,

You are very lucky indeed. Thank your stars that you survived.

Now, I used to be a frequent traveller via this bridge during my pune trips few years back. Recently I used this bridge as well just a week back, BUT I wasn't paying attention to the road surface.

My question: Is that bridge still paved with the slippery tarmac which was the fad with all the contractors few years back?
I remember myself being very careful as soon as I entered this bit of tarmac. This slippery tarmac is very deadly in following situations:
1. Wet. Just drive very carefully when this type of tarmac is wet.
2. Road surface is dry but your tyres for whatsoever reason are still wet (maybe you went over a puddle or entered from an area where rains were on). Deadly combo.

Now, coming to your car, actually the best saviour from such a situation is ESP only. This keeps your car in a straight line in such situations. I have had first hand experience with this. I swerved on the expressway in rains at speeds above three digits, I had rotated the steering exactly like how the journo's do in the elk test trying to avoid a truck. The car just changed lanes as if the road was dry (only the speed reduced to under 80 w/o me even touching the brake pedal). It had ESP. Now compare that to my figo which actaully fishtailed when I was taking a 90 degree turn at 20-30 kmph in the rains. See the difference? The car's chassis and suspension play a big role, but ESP is a life saver in such situation described by you, even when you keep the steering straight.
That is why all the new cars with me have ESP. ABS, EBD are of little help, not much.

If you are not going to be changing your car, then at the moment just change the rear tyres. That is all you can do at the moment. The accelere's are actually decent tyres. However, if you want a grippier rubber, then go for michelin's (XM2's or PLC's or PS3 ST's). They are the best. Just be aware that you have to be a little more careful when driving through rough roads which are plenty in vashi IIRC. Avoid Yoko's and Conti's. Not as good as michelins.

Thanks,
Simple_Car

EDIT: just saw your pics. If the first and last one's are of the rear tyres, then you need a change. If the rest of the pics are also of the rear tyres, then I think there is uneven wear (can't confirm w/o personal inspection). Changing all 4 is always the best.

Last edited by Simple_car : 12th September 2013 at 16:26.
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Old 12th September 2013, 16:23   #34
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Default Re: Freaked out by 90 degree skid this morning!

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Originally Posted by Swanand Inamdar View Post
This may come across as stupid, but can ABS be retrofitted on a car?

Vikram, that was so lucky of you! Vashi bridge is normally chocobloc and any other time may have been disastrous.
Do get the tyres changed asap. Weather to change all 4 or 2 is a decision you might have to take, though wisely.
Hi Swanand agree on the lucky streak..as i found out ABS CANNOT be retrofitted. Sadly I will have to settle with grippy tyres.
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Old 12th September 2013, 16:27   #35
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Default Re: Freaked out by 90 degree skid this morning!

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Agree with the part about braking. But when it comes to new tyres, its always better to put them on the rear axle
Thanks Rehan. That was informative and got me thinking.

I may be wrong, but in front wheel drive cars since braking and the drive is majorly dependent on the front wheels it demands a good pair due to the stress involved. For situations in the thread or video, its the rear which becomes crucial.

Bottom line, all four needs to be in a good condition, specially in Front Wheel Drive cars. Why take the risk with your life and luck ?
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Old 12th September 2013, 16:29   #36
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Default Re: Freaked out by 90 degree skid this morning!

Please get your brakes checked. It is possible that the wheel cylinder in one of the wheels is leaking - this causes the vehicle to swerve sharply during heavy braking due to uneven braking forces.
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Old 12th September 2013, 16:32   #37
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Default Re: Freaked out by 90 degree skid this morning!

Vikram, from the photos you posted, the tyres seem to be on the near end of their life. Please change them asap!
Check out the various threads on tyres to choose the best possible ones, but please change these one's
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Old 12th September 2013, 16:42   #38
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Default Re: Freaked out by 90 degree skid this morning!

Quote:
Originally Posted by vikram31 View Post
(dry road. Perfect tyre pressure, no uneven tread), a two wheeler swerved lanes and I had to slam on the brakes hard. To my horror, my car screeched and turned exactly 90 degrees and came to a halt.
While I have no more to say on changing tyres based on age/wear, I am not sure that tread depth is the culprit here, if the road was truly dry.
ABS/EBD would probably have kept things on an even keel.
So even if you change the tyres, this may need more investigation. And/or lower speeds till you change cars.
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Old 12th September 2013, 16:47   #39
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Default Re: Freaked out by 90 degree skid this morning!

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Originally Posted by Sawyer View Post
I am not sure that tread depth is the culprit here, if the road was truly dry.
ABS/EBD would probably have kept things on an even keel.
So even if you change the tyres, this may need more investigation. And/or lower speeds till you change cars.
+1 like I said a couple of posts ago. The issue seems to be leaking wheel cylinders on one side. Check for brake fluid leaks.
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Old 12th September 2013, 16:53   #40
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Default Re: Freaked out by 90 degree skid this morning!

Also - which is the cheapest car that has ESP? If ABS/EBD wouldn't have helped that is something to note, and of some concern.
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Old 12th September 2013, 16:58   #41
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Default Re: Freaked out by 90 degree skid this morning!

Thanks Simple_Car..Agreed on all your points. Though i am super confident about the wetness on the road and the tyres, the only thing remotely possible is that my car os washed every morning..and whether that much water could be sufficient to do something like this...Will always be careful on vashi bridge. Cheers
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Old 12th September 2013, 18:09   #42
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Default Re: Freaked out by 90 degree skid this morning!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sawyer View Post
Also - which is the cheapest car that has ESP? If ABS/EBD wouldn't have helped that is something to note, and of some concern.
That would be the VW Polo GT TSi or the ford fiesta A/T variants. Don't know the OTR prices, so whichever is the cheapest..

Thanks,
Simple_car
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Old 12th September 2013, 18:31   #43
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Default Re: Freaked out by 90 degree skid this morning!

Tyres matter a lot and so does ABS.

Recently, took Baleno for outstation trip as Innova was being taken out by dad and chauffeur. The trip was filled with horrible roads due to 1) A very heavy monsoon till date and 2) Road widening activities ( which lead to water getting accumulated on existing road and hence damaging it ).

On 20 Aug I drove Innova over that road and on 1st drove with Baleno. As soon as road cleared up towards my destination, naturally I drove hard forgettting that my Baleno is loaded with Apollo Amazer tyres and lacks ABS.

What happed during trip :

1) At multiple places, I had to brake real hard due to sudden patch of broken road. There was desperate skidding and noise.

2) On corners, I have to admit that better tyres would have helped.

3) A dog came out from bushes when I was doing 90, I braked hard, skidded for more than 50 mtrs. before hitting dog, which managed to save himself and run away after a small hit. The car was OK and still runs fine.

Overall, even if I brake at 50 kmph, tyres lock up and car skids dangerously. Yes, in city driving conditions at 50 kmph. The noise also attracts very angry and aggressive stares ( comments, conversations also happen ).

Why the above details : TYRES matter a lot. Always ignored, they are point of contact to road, invest in tyres rather than music systems and other aesthetic accessories. ABS can save us, but nice set of tyres are very very basic necessity for any car. Considering excessive heat, etc. it makes sense to have tyres changed at 40K kms. or 4 years.

PS:Apollo Amazers are basically tyres for M800 which is how they came into existence. Made a huge mistake with those tyres. Avoid on any car.
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Old 12th September 2013, 19:36   #44
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Default Re: Freaked out by 90 degree skid this morning!

A similar experience only a few weeks before under wet conditions but luckily the car managed to behave as per steering inputs despite of skidding for a long length in my WagonR.

Driving in rains with darkness offers many close shaves but the one I encountered on a Sunday night (July 21st) was something that I will never forget.

NH4 Towards Bangalore looked empty on a Sunday evening owing to incessant rains over the past few days. Khedshivpur toll was unusually empty this time. We proceeded ahead after paying toll and began to gain speed and steadily maintained 80-90kmph.

We crossed a particular curve after Khedshivpur toll under very mild rains and then next thing I see right ahead of me 10 meters away is a huge object camouflaged under the combination of Darkness, darker rain soaked non painted median and roads. It was a cattle that had decided to cross the road which appears right in front of me out of nowhere.

The next set of actions under limited time:
  • Since I was very close to the cattle, I had no other option but to brake and assess options to escape from collision with it
  • I slam my brakes and the wheels lock up almost immediately and I could easily listen to the screech increasing with the momentum and wet roads still pushing the car ahead
  • I flash my lights to try find a quick gap (either on its left or right) and swerve right only to find the second cattle tailing the first one
  • Holding the steering tight with both hands, and reflexes doing its job by dropping from 5th to 3rd gear, swerving extreme right would make me jump on the median after crashing into it
  • So, I maneuver the steering in a zig-zag fashion (as illustrated) and pass right between these 2 cattle without even swiping the tail or the nose of the both these animals and stop ahead on the side of the road
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As I was thanking my lucky stars and my car for barely saving the men inside and the machine, a few youths start running towards me. A fellow with pink color all over his face almost tried to punch me yelling me how I didn’t see the cattle.

As I speak Marathi, first thing I tell him is to calm down and that the situation is not bad since all of us are saved. A few other in group were murmuring something while one fellow was peeping through my rear door.

Our of all these folks, one Gentleman wearing a cap was well mannered and he said “Kaai naahe, Tumhi chala Saheb” and I continued to drive.

I am still unable to believe I steered well in control just between the gap while the wheels were locked. I am very sure I was more than just lucky that night.

Visibility on this night due to road construction coupled with the combination of camouflaged cattle and darker wet roads plus very less traffic may have ticked the villagers to cross the road just when I approached out of a barely straight looking curve.

I was lucky that I was not tailed by anyone who may have either crashed onto my vehicle or the cattle.
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Old 12th September 2013, 19:56   #45
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Default Re: Freaked out by 90 degree skid this morning!

This may sound daft, but since you travel a long distance, usually alone, and Mumbai roads are full of paver block / concrete/ bitumen sections, I would recommend filling a gunny bag with around 25 kg of sand and keeping it in the boot. It will anchor the rear of your car, better. Ofcourse, change the tyres first, as others have recommended.
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