Go Back   Team-BHP > Buckle Up > Street Experiences


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 12th September 2013, 07:27   #1
BHPian
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 128
Thanked: 116 Times
Default Freaked out by 90 degree skid this morning!

Hi fellow Team-BHPians,

As an avid follower, I am writing on this forum to seek advice on what has been a scary morning for me.

The Car:
SX4 VDi (March 2011)
Driven: Approx 55k kms
Tyres:
Front: 5k driven Apollo Aceleres
Rear: Original OEM Apollo Aceleres (Driven 55k ks)

During my ownership I have constantly rotated tyres every 10k kms until earlier this year when my car was just shy of 50k and one of my front tyres got a cut on the road. I replaced this with a new tyre (Same make) and added the spare tyre (Literally unused) to replace my front wheel setup.

The Problem: One of the joys of my job is that it begins at 7 am and ends at 5. So even in a city like Mumbai, my drive from Vashi to Lower Parel is a joy in the early morning hours. Until now my car has been an absolute powerhorse and a joy in terms of ride quality, balance and stability. However, today when I was on the Vashi bridge (dry road. Perfect tyre pressure, no uneven tread), a two wheeler swerved lanes and I had to slam on the brakes hard. To my horror, my car screeched and turned exactly 90 degrees and came to a halt. The engine was still running and I could smell burnt rubber. I was driving straight and there was no turn whatsover. My steering was perfectly straight as well.

Luckily I was fully buckled in and had my hands hard on the steering. Exceptionally lucky was that the bridge was empty at that time. My approximate speed at the time could be in the 80-90 kmph area at that time.

I am freaked out by this and shudder to think what could have happened if my family was with me or if there was traffic on that road.

Looking for advice on what could have gone wrong. Should I replace the rear tyres? I am happy to replace the entire set as nothing is more valuable than life.

If so, please advise tyres with decent balance and grip (aka skid resistant) whilst also maintaining good fuel economy.

Looking forward to your advice!

Thanks
vikram31 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th September 2013, 09:57   #2
Senior - BHPian
 
pjbiju's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Karamattom, Aluva, Kotagiri, Yercaud, Hospet, Indore, Nashik, Pune (now)
Posts: 1,167
Thanked: 433 Times
Default Re: Freaked out by 90 degree skid this morning

IMO, the worn out tyres at the rear had a much lower braking efficiency compared to the newer front tyres. And the difference in the braking between the front and rear must have caused the drift. Also while moving forward, when you hit the brakes, the major part of the car's weight will get transmitted to the front and this will make the rear even lighter and the tyres will have even lesser grip on the road. It is always advisable to have all the four tyres with similar tread depth & tread pattern (for a similar contact area). And I feel if you are only changing two tyres, the newer ones should go as the rear tyres which will offer better grip and reduce the chances of drifting sideways. I guess, vehicles equipped with ABS will compensate for this and you will not drift. But your braking distance will be longer. It will also be helpful to know and understand the cause of the drift better, if you can measure the tread depth of the front tyres and that of the rear tyres and share it here. What was your approximate speed at the time of braking hard?

I think you simply need to replace the rear tyres only, if the front ones are good (and they should be since they have only been used for 5k)

Quote:
Originally Posted by vikram31 View Post
...

If so, please advise tyres with decent balance and grip (aka skid resistant) whilst also maintaining good fuel economy.
...
I think MRF (Z.L.O tyres), Michelin, Yokohama have all good grippy tyres (with lesser life since they are supposedly made of softer compound that offers better grip). There are tyre experts here who can guide you on this. I personally use MRF Z.L.O tyres on my Swift. They replaced the original JK tyres. I find them quite grippy. However I never have had to apply sudden brakes so far during the past 7+ years of driving the Swift. So I am not sure how they will behave under sudden braking. Anyway drifting can be the end result of a combination of tyre condition, road surface condition (sand, water, gravel etc.), weight distribution in the car, tyre pressure etc. We should take care of the tyres, tyre pressure and weight distribution in the car.

Last edited by pjbiju : 12th September 2013 at 10:17.
pjbiju is offline   (3) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 12th September 2013, 10:01   #3
BHPian
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 128
Thanked: 116 Times
Default Re: Freaked out by 90 degree skid this morning

Thanks pjbiju, I am confused whether I should change all 4 or just 2. Plus I dont want Acelere's any more so considering the Yokohama S Drives or Michelin Primacy LC. Could 2 of these go with my Acelere's in the front or should I take a small hit and go for a brand new set of shoes ?
vikram31 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th September 2013, 10:07   #4
BHPian
 
Altocumulus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: BLR / KOL
Posts: 551
Thanked: 466 Times
Default

Yes, you were lucky.

Change the tyres. The tread depth are there for a reason. Since you mentioned that your regular drive involves speed, its imperative you get the rear ones changed.

Secondly, its not always the grip, tyres driven that long may fail anytime and burst. You never know. We may keep our cars spic and span however hardly anyone of us bothers to look at the tyres unless there is a puncture or visible cracks. Else we change them based on the 50k kms or time. That is a long time actually.

As far as your incident goes, it maybe possible that there was oil on the road, because of which the car skidded. Otherwise since your front have a lot of grip compared to your rear, the rears skidded and the sheer momentum turned the car.

Bottomline get the tyres changed to Michelins or something like that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pjbiju View Post
And I feel if you are only changing two tyres, the newer ones should go as the rear tyres which will offer better grip and reduce the chances of drifting sideways.
For effective braking its always the front tyres which contributes the most. The rear ones are to reduce the momentum and help the front brakes. That's the reason why most cars have discs in the front and drums in the rear. Similar for bikes. Else it would have been the other way around.

Last edited by Eddy : 12th September 2013 at 18:29. Reason: Please use the edit / multiquote option instead of posting back to back posts within 30 mins on the same thread. Thanks.
Altocumulus is offline   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 12th September 2013, 10:19   #5
BHPian
 
brraj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: bangalore
Posts: 788
Thanked: 341 Times
Default Re: Freaked out by 90 degree skid this morning

Go for 10mm wider size than your stock tyres.

Hankook Ventus V12 evo.
Michelin tyres.

For peace of mind change your car which has ABS+EBD or even better if it had ESP.

I have told n number of times to my relatives, friends to go for safety features like ABS,EBD,ESP and which has Airbags. One and only answer i get in return is "I am not a racer like you".
brraj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th September 2013, 10:19   #6
BHPian
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 128
Thanked: 116 Times
Default Re: Freaked out by 90 degree skid this morning

Quote:
Originally Posted by pjbiju View Post
IMO, the worn out tyres at the rear had a much lower braking efficiency compared to the newer front tyres. And the difference in the braking between the front and rear must have caused the drift..
Hi, to answer your last 2 questions..i braked around 80-90 kmph..and the diff in tread is..,.Front tread depth around 0.8 cm. Rear tread depth around 0.2 cm. So I should consider the rear tyre replacement only?

Mod Note: Please quote ONLY the relevant bits of a post. Quoting a full, long post inconveniences our mobile readers.

Last edited by Rudra Sen : 12th September 2013 at 13:18.
vikram31 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th September 2013, 10:20   #7
Team-BHP Support
 
bblost's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Hyderabad
Posts: 9,552
Thanked: 6,310 Times
Default Re: Freaked out by 90 degree skid this morning

Quote:
Originally Posted by pjbiju View Post
I guess, vehicles equipped with ABS will compensate for this and you will not drift.
If I understand them correctly.
EBD helps stabilize the front and rear bias during heavy braking.

ABS helps in the left and right bias.
bblost is offline   (3) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 12th September 2013, 10:21   #8
BHPian
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 128
Thanked: 116 Times
Default

Hey brraj. Not sure if I can replace my car yet but I have heard that MAruti offers ABS as an addon. Will check how much it costs and update you here

Quote:
Originally Posted by brraj View Post
Go for 10mm wider size than your stock tyres.

Hankook Ventus V12 evo.
Michelin tyres.

For peace of mind change your car which has ABS+EBD or even better if it had ESP.

I have told n number of times to my relatives, friends to go for safety features like ABS,EBD,ESP and which has Airbags. One and only answer i get in return is "I am not a racer like you".
Hi brraj, I am happy to loog at 10 mm increase if that improves comfort and stability. Any idea in %age terms how that impacts mileage ?

Last edited by Jaggu : 12th September 2013 at 10:58. Reason: Back to back posts.
vikram31 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th September 2013, 10:25   #9
SDP
Team-BHP Support
 
SDP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 3,660
Thanked: 7,508 Times
Default Re: Freaked out by 90 degree skid this morning

Vikram, don't want to alarm you, but the SX4 is a tall car with GC on the higher side. Its not really known as a stable, well-handling car. So if you ask me, don't take any chances on grip-levels. The rear-tyres should have been replaced may be 20kms back.

A personally know a guy whose SX4 toppled and flipped 3-4 times before landing upside down. He was not as lucky as you and there were multiple casualities in the accident. What surprised me was that he mentioned he has no clue what happened. He was at a decent speed, but no swerveing or braking was involved. The guy has huge amount of driving experience and the SX4 was already in its 4th year with him. Don't want to generalize based on one experience, but do consider these one-off cases and draw your own conclusions.

Last edited by SDP : 12th September 2013 at 10:26.
SDP is offline   (2) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 12th September 2013, 10:27   #10
BHPian
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 128
Thanked: 116 Times
Default Re: Freaked out by 90 degree skid this morning

Quote:
Originally Posted by SDP View Post
Vikram, don't want to alarm you, but the SX4 is a tall car with GC on the higher side.
=======
Don't want to generalize based on one experience, but do consider these one-off cases and draw your own conclusions.
Thanks SDP. not Alarmed but will definitely take the steps to get my car safer. ABS addon plus grippy tyres is a first step.
vikram31 is offline   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 12th September 2013, 10:27   #11
BHPian
 
rohan_iitr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 992
Thanked: 401 Times
Default Re: Freaked out by 90 degree skid this morning

New tyres should be installed in the rear.

Please go through this thread, it will clear your doubts.

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/tyre-a...ront-rear.html (Where to Install a New Pair of Tyres? Front or rear?)

Rohan
rohan_iitr is offline   (2) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 12th September 2013, 10:31   #12
Team-BHP Support
 
Samurai's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: B'lore-Manipal
Posts: 22,042
Thanked: 13,488 Times
Default Re: Freaked out by 90 degree skid this morning

Quote:
Originally Posted by vikram31 View Post
Hi, to answer your last 2 questions..i braked around 80-90 kmph..and the diff in tread is..,.Front tread depth around 0.8 cm. Rear tread depth around 0.2 cm. So I should consider the rear tyre replacement only ?
If you are a spirited driver, you should replace at 3mm tread depth. That is safe limit for wet roads, which we often have in this season.

Quote:
Originally Posted by http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech/techpage.jsp?techid=51
If rain and wet roads are a concern, you should consider replacing your tires when they reach approximately 4/32" of remaining tread depth.
Samurai is offline   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 12th September 2013, 10:33   #13
Senior - BHPian
 
pjbiju's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Karamattom, Aluva, Kotagiri, Yercaud, Hospet, Indore, Nashik, Pune (now)
Posts: 1,167
Thanked: 433 Times
Default Re: Freaked out by 90 degree skid this morning

Quote:
Originally Posted by Altocumulus View Post
For effective braking its always the front tyres which contributes the most. The rear ones are to reduce the momentum and help the front brakes. That's the reason why most cars have discs in the front and drums in the rear. Similar for bikes. Else it would have been the other way around.
That is true and that I believe is because, most of the weight gets transferred to the front and the front tyres have to have better braking power to take on the additional weight. But drifting happens because the rear tyres lose grip.
pjbiju is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th September 2013, 10:34   #14
BHPian
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 128
Thanked: 116 Times
Default Re: Freaked out by 90 degree skid this morning

Quote:
Originally Posted by Samurai View Post
If you are a spirited driver, you should replace at 3mm tread depth. That is safe limit for wet roads, which we often have in this season.
Noted Samurai, I guess thats a given now given the unanimous agreement that this is already overdue irrespective of the incident. Will get on it immediately.
vikram31 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th September 2013, 10:35   #15
Senior - BHPian
 
tharian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: SBC
Posts: 2,157
Thanked: 2,412 Times
Default Re: Freaked out by 90 degree skid this morning

Quote:
Originally Posted by vikram31 View Post
Hi fellow Team-BHPians,

As an avid follower, I am writing on this forum to seek advice on what has been a scary morning for me.


Looking forward to your advice!

Thanks
You were lucky in many ways. That there were no vehicles on either side of you or in front and most lucky that the tires did not grip enough when sliding side ways and topple.
Tires are the main reason , however there can be a other reasons.
I had the same incident occur to me couple of years back and I had a smile on my face as to how it ended.

I have a Figo which is known more for its stability and handling on turns and straights. I took this a to heart and used to take turns without slowing down as this was the place I could overtake everyone easily since they slowed down.
On one such occasion, I was coming down the ramp which is almost a 90 degree curve and is also sloping down. It is 3 lane wide and there was a old Verna in the middle lane and I was in the process of overtaking him on the right lane around 60-70kmh. In the middle of the lane, I thought the Verna might loose it since his speed was more than mine and I lifted off which was the mistake.
I was on the outer edge and my right side tires were on the fine sand accumulated at the edge of the road. I lifted off, the rear right lost traction and at the same time hit the expansion joint hump on the road and before I knew it, I was sliding sideways with tires screeching and white smoke all around. It felt so unreal since that was my first experience in a car drifting and felt good, except that I knew it was a big escape.
Just like you, I was lucky there were no vehicles around. Imagine if there was a truck on the side and you rammed into him, or a two wheeler.

Maybe, if your car was loaded with 4, it may not have drifted . My tires were new and run less than 10k then, so there are many factors.
But yes in your case, you do need to change your rear tires.
Drive Safe

Regards
tharian is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Grand Vitara gets custom made skid plates Samurai 4x4 Technical 107 11th October 2016 10:47
Basic Swift touring mods in Delhi (HID, skid plates, GPS mount) - what else? phamilyman Modifications & Accessories 36 7th November 2013 12:06
Cute air freshener hangy thingy EDIT - Anti skid mat thingy from Page # 19 Sam Kapasi Shifting gears 622 31st October 2007 18:09
How can we drive out safely from a skid? vnabhi Street Experiences 28 12th October 2007 10:37
Bike Skid on the way to Hogenakkal benbsb29 Street Experiences 6 30th January 2007 15:07


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 05:39.

Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks