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Old 17th November 2013, 21:02   #61
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Default Re: Cattle - The real menace on Indian highways

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Originally Posted by BlackPearl View Post
What if somebody does not believe in god and still comes back safely from a highway drive
BlackPearl, Thanks a lot for the appreciation.

I see things in a different angle - if somebody does not comes back safely from a highway drive, he will believe in God.

Anyway I don't wish to divert from the core topic, in this thread....
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Old 18th November 2013, 17:44   #62
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Default Re: Cattle - The real menace on Indian highways

When we talk of stray dogs on the road, even I do the same thing (inside the city also) i.e. run them over. To me the dog is stray anyway and if I tried some stunts to try and protect it, I will end up the loser in a big way. However, also being a biker, I know this cannot be done when on 2-wheels so it is best to try and avoid it which frankly is easier on a bike.

Coming to the issue of cattle, I think the initial post is very well written because the sheer size and mass of the animal means there is no "safe" way to run it over and not have any damage of any sort. Trying to avoid it of course has its own dangers.

The end conclusion I think is that if all drivers on the road follow some basic driving sense and speed is under control and also the NHAI puts up railings along the NH roads we can avoid such issues to a large extent
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Old 18th November 2013, 19:17   #63
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Default Re: Cattle - The real menace on Indian highways

Happened to me last year when driving on the Mumbai-Pune Expressway one evening. It must be around 7 - 8 pm on the stretch after the fourth tunnel (I think its the Madap tunnel) when coming from Mumbai side. I had just crossed the tunnel at a speed of 80 - 90 kmph, when suddenly the headlight picked up a brown cow/bull coming from the left lane towards the right most lane. I was on the middle lane and almost got a heart attack when seeing the animal. And it was crossing the lanes pretty fast. Instinct made me steer the vehicle to the left lane missing the animal by just a few inches. Lucky for me that there was no vehicle behind me either to the left or right. I was literally dazed for a few minutes after I crossed the vehicle and had to pull over to gather my wits.

In my opinion and experience couple of things we should keep in mind ...

1. When avoiding a large animal like cow/buffalo/donkey turn your vehicle (if possible) towards the animals backside. These animals do not have reverse gear :-) and they cannot circle back easily. So, they will keep going forward irrespective of the situation. Honking and expecting the animal to stop does not help either. Even if you hit the animal at the rear, chances are that your vehicle / and you will suffer minimum damage than when hitting the head/front area.

2. Do the exact opposite for smaller animals like dogs/cats/rabbits. These animals have better reflexes and they can turn back quickly and infact they will do that when they see approaching vehicles. Honking could also help a bit. But I have seen dogs getting disoriented when someone honks at it.

3. It is between 6 - 8 pm when there is a chance of cattle appearing on the roads. I guess the cattle which come on to the road are ones which would have got lost from the herd and trying to get back to its home. All animals have a good sense of direction but they cannot follow a definite path, so they end up getting onto expressways.

We should understand that a responsible farmer will never leave his cattle on the roads as it is their "rozi-roti". And most farmers revere them and do not like it to come to any harm.

BTW, all the above is true for cars and not bikes or slower vehicles.

Last edited by sukhoi30 : 18th November 2013 at 19:18. Reason: added sentence.
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Old 18th November 2013, 22:43   #64
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Default Re: Cattle - The real menace on Indian highways

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Originally Posted by anand.shankar82 View Post
When we talk of stray dogs on the road, even I do the same thing (inside the city also) i.e. run them over. To me the dog is stray anyway and if I tried some stunts to try and protect it, I will end up the loser in a big way.
Why do you need to run over the poor creature in city limits and speed? Its not some new version of road rash video game that you earn points for doing so. One can easily brake in city limits and save the dog unless you are too self centered to care at all. Everything is not about money and your beloved ride!
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Old 18th November 2013, 23:05   #65
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Default Re: Cattle - The real menace on Indian highways

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Why do you need to run over the poor creature in city limits and speed? Its not some new version of road rash video game that you earn points for doing so. One can easily brake in city limits and save the dog unless you are too self centered to care at all. Everything is not about money and your beloved ride!
I do realize that you say this as a lover of all animals (especially dogs) and I have to say that I too used to try and avoid dogs earlier when I myself used to have an alsatian. However, the 2 times I have tried this, once by bike and once in a car, both times I have ended up with not only damages to the vehicle but to myself. On the bike, I crashed of course and had to have 6 stitches on my elbow. In the car, I crashed her (a Ford Ikon back then) into the divider and the glass from the driver side window went through my forearm as a result. Both of these were late at night so speeds within the city as you can imagine at those times are quite high (unless I am the only one going fast at 2am in the night)

So, just wanted to request you that before you call me self-centered consider the above facts. It may be that but if so then do correct me
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Old 18th November 2013, 23:24   #66
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Default Re: Cattle - The real menace on Indian highways

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Both of these were late at night so speeds within the city as you can imagine at those times are quite high (unless I am the only one going fast at 2am in the night)

So, just wanted to request you that before you call me self-centered consider the above facts. It may be that but if so then do correct me
It is so easy to everytime blame things on the strays. You got hurt both times because you were speeding at 2AM and not because of the stray. It could have been a pedestrian too or another vehicle. You will run over that too? Isn't it better and more humane to rather stay in control of your vehicle and surroundings rather then taking the easy way out and running over a dog?

Sorry I don't buy this logic of self preservation. Highway speeds of 80 kmph I can understand your choice. But not in city limits at city speeds. If you overspeed then its you who is at fault!
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Old 19th November 2013, 00:20   #67
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Default Re: Cattle - The real menace on Indian highways

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Originally Posted by drmohitg View Post
Sorry I don't buy this logic of self preservation. Highway speeds of 80 kmph I can understand your choice. But not in city limits at city speeds. If you overspeed then its you who is at fault!
I totally agree. When you are driving at 80-100 kmph speed on a highway, it is not easy to maneuver your car easily or wise to attempt any stunts there.

I am not judging here, just wondering why you would be driving at such high speeds in the city limit where it is not possible to control your car, whatever the time of the day it may be?
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Old 19th November 2013, 09:54   #68
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Default Re: Cattle - The real menace on Indian highways

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It could have been a pedestrian too or another vehicle. You will run over that too?
I do not think we are talking about pedestrians or vehicles here right? The topic which was discussed is about animals on the road. Also, I do not think anyone would say/think/dream of running over a pedestrian if they are on the road as we are now comparing a human life to the life of a stray animal, do you?

Anyway I think it is better to say at the end that we have different points of view on stray dogs on the road and leave it at that and of course thanks for sharing your point of view as well
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Old 19th November 2013, 14:07   #69
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Default Re: Cattle - The real menace on Indian highways

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Originally Posted by anand.shankar82 View Post
I do not think we are talking about pedestrians or vehicles here right? The topic which was discussed is about animals on the road. Also, I do not think anyone would say/think/dream of running over a pedestrian if they are on the road as we are now comparing a human life to the life of a stray animal, do you?

Anyway I think it is better to say at the end that we have different points of view on stray dogs on the road and leave it at that and of course thanks for sharing your point of view as well
I was expecting that line of arguement. The thing is not that human life is more important. The line of thought should be that a dog's life is no less. I am not judging you or anything. But please I sincerely request you to control the speed of your car and avoid running over anything. You run over the dog because it came in front of you suddenly and you didn't have time to react. So you took the easy way out. But what if it was a cow? Then you will end up injuring yourself and your car too right? So isn't it better to stay on speeds where you are confident of your car and suroundings?

Also I see this arguement a lot times that human life is more sacred. I am pretty sure that if tomorrow they start charging us under IPC section 302 for running over a dog then in no time would the Dog's life also become equally sacred!
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Old 19th November 2013, 19:42   #70
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Default Re: Cattle - The real menace on Indian highways

I totally concur with drmohitg, I too having encountered several cattle/dog intrusions in highways, think it is our responsibility to try the maximum to save the living thing's life/limb. Given the circumstance, if there are no vehicles behind the car or in the sides, there is no harm in slamming the brakes/changing lanes to save an animal from being hit. It's life is as precious to it and I think we have only equal rights with animals in the world.
No offence intended on anybody
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Old 19th November 2013, 19:55   #71
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Default Re: Cattle - The real menace on Indian highways

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Originally Posted by anand.shankar82 View Post
When we talk of stray dogs on the road, even I do the same thing (inside the city also) i.e. run them over. To me the dog is stray anyway and if I tried some stunts to try and protect it, I will end up the loser in a big way. However, also being a biker, I know this cannot be done when on 2-wheels so it is best to try and avoid it which frankly is easier on a bike.

Coming to the issue of cattle, I think the initial post is very well written because the sheer size and mass of the animal means there is no "safe" way to run it over and not have any damage of any sort. Trying to avoid it of course has its own dangers.

The end conclusion I think is that if all drivers on the road follow some basic driving sense and speed is under control and also the NHAI puts up railings along the NH roads we can avoid such issues to a large extent
Easier said than done,replace the poor creature with a human being,will you run him/her over?;no,because doing so will land you behind the bars,while after running over the dog,you can simply drive off leaving the creature behind to suffer.
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Old 19th November 2013, 22:18   #72
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Default Re: Cattle - The real menace on Indian highways

^^^ On the same topic of stray dogs inside city limits, I have a question - at speeds generally above 50 Kmph, head-on accident should cause air bags to be deployed, right? If the answer is affirmative, regardless of what that object (animals, stray dogs or humans) is, shouldn't we be careful? You may not value the life of stray dogs but then I am sure many will worry about that fat bill due to air bags deployment if nothing else!

I only want to suggest here that there are lot of instances where we do have choices and we must take one by considering minimum negative impact to everything that is around. For example, its thrilling to drive faster on empty road but at the same time the risk gets multifold if that happens inside the city regardless of time of the day! To make things worse, the illusion of being in control of the car can cause larger damage than one imagines.

I guess the point to take home here is, you can run over on anything only if there is no better choice! And if we are disciplined and alert drivers, we can avoid things getting ugly in first place itself.
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Old 19th November 2013, 22:55   #73
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Wink Re: Cattle - The real menace on Indian highways

Well..it wasnt cattle but he was a menace at first.

I was the one riding the bike.. was on a regular weekend trip to Lavasa..He did put me in a spot of bother (you can hear a small expletive ) but I would have never liked to run over this guy! Absolutely loved the way he runs around!

Cheers
Jayanth

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Old 21st November 2013, 16:06   #74
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Default Re: Cattle - The real menace on Indian highways

Animals are a part of natural habitat, we have to move around taking them into consideration. In India it is cattle, in middle east it is camels. No matter how good our highways are or how well fenced they seem to be, animals will find their way on the road. We have to understand them as traffic and negotiate our way, all thrills and speed should be enjoyed considering the traffic.Otherwise its reckless driving, ofcourse endangering ourselves and others.
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Old 22nd November 2013, 16:26   #75
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Default Re: Cattle - The real menace on Indian highways

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^^^ On the same topic of stray dogs inside city limits, I have a question - at speeds generally above 50 Kmph, head-on accident should cause air bags to be deployed, right? ....
The answer is in the negative. The rule with animals on roads is simple, run them over. People are far more valuable than animals and the consequences of swerving can be far worse that and this will be corroborated by anyone with significant driving experience.

I will mention two incidents in respect of the above:

1) The driver of a fully loaded vehicle tried to do the humane thing and avoid a pig on a highway, crashed through the divider and hit a car driven by a fellow BHPians father. Two of the occupants of that car died there, the third is fighting for his life. The BHPian's father suffered a broken ankle. The two cars were totalled.

2) While driving on the highway at around 80 kmph, a driver encountered a dog who suddenly decided to jump on the highway less than 7 feet away and chase a passing cyclist. The driver, being a cold and uncaring person, braked but did not sttempt to save the dog by swerving. The dog was killed and the car lost a foglamp. The cyclist, the driver and his passenger were unharmed.

Which of the two scenarios is preferable for you?
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