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Old 26th May 2014, 13:34   #1
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Default Using RTI to get Highways repaired?

Mods, please move this to an appropriate thread.. if one exists.

I’m a regular on the Bangalore – Mysore – Siddapur (Coorg) route. After buying some property there (Coorg), my drives have only increased. The worst stretch on this route is the last stretch (Periyapatanam to Maldari Forest). This is the shortest route.

It’s been years since they done any surface treatment or repair on this particular stretch. The route from Maldari to Siddapur is reasonably OK.. with some minor patches in between. But the roads before that - are literally the pits!

I would like to use RTI to ask some uncomfortable questions to the PWD of that area. Before I go ahead, I wanted to check with the folks here if anyone has tried this route (RTI) to get roads repaired. Who do I address it to? Any details that would help is much appreciated.
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Old 26th May 2014, 16:32   #2
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Default re: Using RTI to get Highways repaired?

Quote:
Originally Posted by triedeverything View Post
I would like to use RTI to ask some uncomfortable questions to the PWD of that area. Before I go ahead, I wanted to check with the folks here if anyone has tried this route (RTI) to get roads repaired. Who do I address it to? Any details that would help is much appreciated.
Using an RTI might/might not get the roads repaired. I say this because "why" questions are out of the purview of the act, and the authority may refuse to answer such questions. [Legal confirmation of this required]

However, your questions might get them put the act together and do the needful. What you can actually go is get details regarding when the road last done, what money was spend on it, how much do they spend on maintenace etc, and pass on that information to the media to get the issue highlighted.
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Old 26th May 2014, 17:12   #3
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Default re: Using RTI to get Highways repaired?

On a related note can anyone enlighten me on how NHAI or PWD makes sure private toll operators maintain roads. Many times I find the toll roads are not in good shape considering the amount we pay. Is there anyway we can highlight it to someone for necessary action?
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Old 26th May 2014, 17:53   #4
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Default re: Using RTI to get Highways repaired?

Quote:
Originally Posted by binaiks View Post
Using an RTI might/might not get the roads repaired. I say this because "why" questions are out of the purview of the act, and the authority may refuse to answer such questions. [Legal confirmation of this required]

However, your questions might get them put the act together and do the needful. What you can actually go is get details regarding when the road last done, what money was spend on it, how much do they spend on maintenace etc, and pass on that information to the media to get the issue highlighted.
I disagree. Karnataka PWD can't refuse to answer questions under RTI if they have been formed correctly.

Your RTI shouldn't ask WHY the roads are bad. Since it's an opinion question, you won't get an answer.

The CORRECT question to ask would be as below;

1. How many times has the road been repaved in the past 5-10 years?

2. Who was the contractor & who were the PWD Engineers who approved the designs, tenders, execution & certified the bills?

3. Who designed the crust of the road? (i.e. the layers of the road).

4. What was the CBR of the road & who certified the CBR (California Bearing Ratio)?

5. Was the design as per IRC Standards? (Indian Road Congress)

6. Any Warranty/ Defect Liability Period condition was part of the tender?

7. What was the Design life of the road segment & has the road aged beyond the design life?

Send it across to the local PWD/KSHIP Chief Engineer with a copy to the local Executive Engineer.

I can guarantee that your questions will cause some commotion for these so-called 'Engineers'. All these 'Engineers' have been doing is to collect their percentage from the contractors for the shoddy work done. (Typical % is about 3-5% for each CE, EE, AEE, AE, Section officer etc. In fact, these 'fees' adds up to 20% of the project cost)
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Old 27th May 2014, 08:21   #5
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Default re: Using RTI to get Highways repaired?

Binaiks is right. 'Why' questions aren't entertained. I got these questions from the RTI India forum.
I understand that asking questions wont get the road fixed. But the risk of publicity of that information might.

So here's the format.

To:
The SPIO
PWD/Corporation/ NHAI

(I'm not really sure of the specific address to send it to. Periyapatna Taluk comes under Mysore district.... so I'm going to try there first)


From:
XXX
XXXX, XXXX.
XXXX, XXXX
Tel: XXXXX Dated: XXXXXX

Dear Sir,

RE: Application for Information under RTI Act 2005

I, XXXX , a citizen of India, request you to kindly provide me the following information under the Right to Information Act, 2005:
  • Please inform me the Name, Designation , Address, Office Telephone number of the Officer of the XXX Municipal Corporation/Council/PWD, who is responsible for the maintenance of Roads located in the area called XXXXXX in the locality XXXXXXX of XXX town/city.
  • How often and with what frequency is the above mentioned officer supposed to carry out in-situ inspection of the roads and check their condition ?
  • a) When was the last date and time when the officer carried out a inspection of the roads located in XXXXX area ?
b) Please provide me with a certified copy of the inspection report made by the officer after the inspection carried out by him during the last visit to XXXXXX area.
c) Please provide me with a certified copy of the Action Taken Report based on the inspection report made by the officer after inspecting the roads in XXXXX area.
  • Please give a list of all the works related to improvement of roads and streets carried out in this area during the period from………….to……………
5. How many times have repairs (both minor and major) been carried out on each road and street in this area?

For each repair work, the list should contain :


a. the length of the street or the road repaired and identify the starting and the ending point by house
numbers or other methods (like a small hand drawn sketch)
b. exact location of spots where the work was carried out
c. the name of the work
d. work order no.
e. length of repair
f. average width of repair
g. method of repair
h. what was the composition of repair
i. actual date of start
j. actual date of completion
k. amount paid or payable
l. status of work
m. name of the contractor
n. mode of improvement of that road or street

6. If the work was done departmentally, please also provide the following information:
a. Copy of relevant portion of stock register
b. Copy of relevant portion of labour register

7. If the work was done through a contractor, please also provide the following information:
a. Copy of measurement book (both abstract entries & record entries)
b. Copy of sketch
c. Copy of details of estimates
d. Names of the Assistant Engineer and the Executive Engineer who inspected each of these works and
passed payments.
e. Which portions of these works were inspected by them?
f. If there was any guarantee clause in the contract, copy of that portion of the contract which mentions this guarantee clause and the conditions in which this clause can be invoked.
g. Has the guarantee clause been invoked till now? If no, why in spite of the fact that the roads are in such bad condition.

8. After you have prepared the above information, I would like to inspect your measurement books and work order registers related to these works to ensure that you have given complete information.
Please let me know a date and time and the venue where I can come for inspection. (No kidding!)


9. The roads are totally broken these days. Please give specific reasons for the bad condition of each of these roads separately.

Name of the Road Starting and Ending point Reason for poor condition

10. If any of the roads is broken due to water stagnation on the road, please intimate whether it is due to wrong design , wrong execution, poor quality material or due to clogged drains or any other reason ?

11. If it is due to wrong design, wrong execution, poor quality materials, how was the payment passed?

12. What action will be taken against the engineer who inspected the road and let it pass like this?

13. If it is due to clogged drain, please provide the following information from the concerned department
which dealt with it:
a. When were these drains cleaned during the stated period?
b. Give copy of the measurement book of the cleaning carried out?
c. Provide the names of the officials who inspected and passed the payments.
d. This means that these officials did not do their job properly. Their inaction has caused so much loss to the exchequer and so much inconvenience to the public. They are also guilty of criminal misconduct under section 13(1)(d) of the Prevention of corruption Act. By when will action be taken against them and what action will you take?

14. The fact that these roads have broken shows that very bad material has been used in the roads.
a. What enquiries will be made to ascertain the quality of the roads?
b. How will you fix responsibilities?
c. By when the enquiries will be completed?

15. The payments seem to have been done fraudulently and the inspection carried out by the engineers was faulty. What enquiries will be instituted against the engineers who passed the payments and did faulty inspection?

16. I want to take sample of material of each of these roads under section 2(j)(iii) of the Right to Information Act, 2005. The sample should be collected from the place of my choice. It should be collected in my presence and should be sealed and certified. Please intimate me the date, time and venue where I should come to collect the samples.

17. I would also like to take digital pictures of the roads mentioned above, when I am inspecting the roads along with your staff and engineers. Kindly inform your Engineers and Staff accordingly.

18. How many written or verbal complaints has the XXX Municipal Council/Corporation received regarding the poor conditions of Roads in the XXXX Area ?
Please give me the following information about each of the complaints:
- Date of complaint
- Daily progress of the complaint received
- Action taken on the complaint received
- Date of reply given to the complainant and a gist of the reply

19.By what date can the citizens living in XXXXXX area expect the roads to be restored to their original conditions and be made fit for normal driving ?
  • If the roads are not restored to their original conditions by the date indicated in Item 19 above, what action will be taken AND what penalties will be levied by Council/Corporation against the officers/ contractors/ agencies which do not restore the road on time ?
I am enclosing herewith a B/C or D/D number…..issued by…….bank, dated……….for Rs………towards application Fees for this RTI Application.

I am willing to pay any further charges as decided by the PIO and communicated to me with a reasoned written order, giving detailed calculations for arriving at the additional charges so requested by the PIO.

Thanking You,
(XXXXXXXXX)


It will take them a few days to read this... and then a few more days to recover.
(Now you know why RTI activists are ''eliminated''!)

What I'm still looking for is an appropriate address. I know that even if such a request is sent to the wrong office, the information officer there is responsible to send it to the real 'culprit'.

Last edited by triedeverything : 27th May 2014 at 08:22.
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Old 27th May 2014, 13:36   #6
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Default Re: Using RTI to get Highways repaired?

Quote:
Originally Posted by triedeverything View Post
Binaiks is right. 'Why' questions aren't entertained. I got these questions from the RTI India forum. I understand that asking questions wont get the road fixed. But the risk of publicity of that information might.



Ahahahah!!! triedeverything is literally spoon feeding you this!

THIS is how RTIs are sent. A few letters like this from OP & others in the area & I can guarantee that the corrupt EEs & AEEs there, who in cahoots with the contractors have executed the poor work will have fire lit under their chairs.

OP, it's your DUTY now to send out this letter.

Last edited by mobike008 : 27th May 2014 at 15:20. Reason: Please dont quote a long post for a short reply
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Old 27th May 2014, 13:45   #7
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Default Re: Using RTI to get Highways repaired?

Before filing an RTI application , please check the limit on the number of words.

State governments do have the authority to frame limits on the word count - I know that Karnataka does have a limit. Your query might just be rejected on such grounds as it does look somewhat lengthy to me.

Split the RTI query into more than one if necessary.
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Old 28th May 2014, 21:02   #8
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Default Re: Using RTI to get Highways repaired?

I've noticed that auto rickshaw drivers have started an illegal share-a-auto stand near major railway stations. These autos often drive in the wrong direction (no entry) and often double/triple park causing traffic snarls. Is it possible to file a RTI application with the local police station to get some answers on who allowed that auto stand and other such questions around the legality of this?
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Old 29th May 2014, 03:16   #9
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Default Re: Using RTI to get Highways repaired?

Quote:
Originally Posted by triedeverything View Post
Mods, please move this to an appropriate thread.. if one exists.

Im a regular on the Bangalore Mysore Siddapur (Coorg) route. After buying some property there (Coorg), my drives have only increased. The worst stretch on this route is the last stretch (Periyapatanam to Maldari Forest). This is the shortest route.

Its been years since they done any surface treatment or repair on this particular stretch. The route from Maldari to Siddapur is reasonably OK.. with some minor patches in between. But the roads before that - are literally the pits!

I would like to use RTI to ask some uncomfortable questions to the PWD of that area. Before I go ahead, I wanted to check with the folks here if anyone has tried this route (RTI) to get roads repaired. Who do I address it to? Any details that would help is much appreciated.
Buddy way to go. Hats off and please let me know how this goes.

FYI: Periyapatna comes under Mysore district and this road is mainly used by folks from Coorg. There is a lot of politics between the two MLAs of the route your travelling on. Votebank politics at play here.

Maddy
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Old 29th May 2014, 08:27   #10
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Default Re: Using RTI to get Highways repaired?

Quote:
Originally Posted by maddy42 View Post
There is a lot of politics between the two MLAs of the route your travelling on. Votebank politics at play here.

Maddy
Sure.. will update this thread on the result.

About 17 kms in Coorg, about 13 is well done. Real pleasure to drive, especially in the night. The total distance of this stretch is 28 kms. That leaves 15 kms of 'where-is-the-road' experience. A few years back, the road in Periyapatna was actually better. Like the Bangalore Mysore highway, every time there was an accident, a speed bump sprung up. Now we look forward for those speed bumps, because it's like sighting land at sea! The villagers could care less... the slower traffic is on this road, the safer their livestock are.
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Old 29th May 2014, 15:15   #11
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Default Re: Using RTI to get Highways repaired?

Good discussion on using RTI to understand the poor maintenance of roads. I am eager to know the response and to analyse the reasons based on the response you receive. Do keep us posted
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Old 29th May 2014, 17:31   #12
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Default Re: Using RTI to get Highways repaired?

Quote:
Originally Posted by HKap View Post
I've noticed that auto rickshaw drivers have started an illegal share-a-auto stand near major railway stations. These autos often drive in the wrong direction (no entry) and often double/triple park causing traffic snarls. Is it possible to file a RTI application with the local police station to get some answers on who allowed that auto stand and other such questions around the legality of this?
You need to file a compliant in your individual capacity or place a observation note with local traffic police. RTI may not help.
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Old 30th May 2014, 17:54   #13
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Default Re: Using RTI to get Highways repaired?

Will the process be similar if I need to file RTI to know why the road works have totally stopped on NH4 between Pune and Satara?

Since I see for the past 1 year not a brick has been moved. How to find under which department is this work being carried out?
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Old 30th May 2014, 18:07   #14
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Default Re: Using RTI to get Highways repaired?

I am in a similar position, but for a different reason.

Our apartment has made payment to the tune of approximately for around Rs.8L for cauvery water connection. This was done almost one year back and we havent received the connection yet. Repeated visits to the local BWSSB (Water and sewerage board) have turned futile as the engineers are ALWAYS busy. I am thinking of filing an RTI to ask when would the water be provisioned and the reason for such a long delay. The said apartment is on the outer ring road near marathalli, who do I submit the RTI to? and what are the questions that can be asked.
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Old 3rd June 2014, 11:19   #15
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Default Re: Using RTI to get Highways repaired?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dodge_Viper View Post
Will the process be similar if I need to file RTI to know why the road works have totally stopped on NH4 between Pune and Satara?

Since I see for the past 1 year not a brick has been moved. How to find under which department is this work being carried out?
If it is a national highway, you'll probably need to file it with NHAI. Don't worry about the department. It is their headache to get the request to the right person. Check row number 60 on this page - http://www.nhai.org/piu.asp. Remember to address it correctly along with the required payment (money order). Google RTI India forum to get more information from experts on RTI.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dass View Post
I am in a similar position, but for a different reason.
Register and post here - http://www.rtiindia.org/. If you haven't found what you looking for, post your question there again. Someone will help you with the draft... or point you in the right direction.

Last edited by triedeverything : 3rd June 2014 at 11:21.
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