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Old 26th June 2014, 13:03   #16
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Default Re: Right of way - safe driving

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Originally Posted by sudev View Post
...my search for 'Right of way' yielded no results so I thought of starting this thread.
Obvious answers?
Thank you for starting a thread on a topic that most drivers are completely unaware of in this country. It is shocking how traffic rules are never followed by most professional and commercial drivers, and how most folks are completely unaware about the standard rules of 'right of way'.
Quote:
Originally Posted by paragsachania View Post
Taking a U-Turn:
Always ensure to know the location of making a U-Turn. Never slow down abruptly in a manner that the traffic tailing you will be in trouble. The tailing traffic always has the right of way if you intend to make that U-Turn. Keep regular watch on Mirror, give the following traffic a hint about your U-Turn by gradually decreasing your pace, Turn on Indicators for 3-4 seconds and turn it off and again after 3-5 seconds turn it on again – This gives them a hint that you are going to either turn right or make a U-Turn and they get enough chance to change their lanes accordingly
More Importantly: Soon after taking that U-Turn, move left after assessing the mirror and allow that faster moving traffic to pass till you accelerate.
Also, stop your car at an angle at that U-Turn in such a way that its not protruding on either of the lanes (tailing and oncoming).
Vehicles making an U-turn are literally at the bottom of the food chain when it comes to right of way. A driver performing the manoeuvre has to yield to all other traffic - oncoming traffic which is approaching him, as well as a vehicle making a right turn from a side road on to the carriageway that he is turning into.

When indicating a turn (U-turn or otherwise) don't turn on and off the indicator - it confuses the following car, who cannot decide whether you really want to turn or are just checking if your indicator stalk functions okay! Instead, turn on the indicator to give the following vehicle about 3-4 seconds to realize the fact that you are turning - this, coupled witht the fact that your brake light would be on as you gently slow down, gives him enough warning to slow down, and if required, change lane and continue while overtaking you from your left. This is one of the few instances when overtaking from the left is legally allowed.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bravo6 View Post
4. Traffic moving from faster lane to slower lane for an up coming exit
  • Not sure on this one, but if they signal, better to let them pass and overtake from the right
If the vehicle in the adjacent lane on either side is ahead of you by at least half a car length (i.e. you can see his rear indicator) and is indicating a lane change into your lane, you must slow down & yield to him. This does not mean that you downshift and pull into the next lane and start to overtake him immediately.

Edit: Here's an example of how the law enforcement agencies themselves are unaware of rules & regulations: https://www.facebook.com/permalink.p...17817371573308

Quote:
TRAFFIC ADVISORY
As cyclist
Dos
Cycle must be fitted with the standard gadgets – bell, brakes, and rearview mirror, both
front & back mudguard painted white, reflective tapes affixed at the front & back
Cycle on the extreme left side of the road or use service road, if available
Avoid busy roads
Keep a safe distance from fast motorized vehicles
Give proper indications before stopping or turning
A cyclist need not carry rear view mirrors because it is easy for him to turn and check.

Reflective / white mudguards make no sense - it is the cyclist who needs to wear high-visibility jackets in the day and the cycle must be fitted with working front and rear lights at night - no mention of that. There used to be a time in Kolkata and Delhi when cops deflated cycle tyres if found not to be using lights - but nowadays, it's only the mad enthusiast cyclist who uses lights, not the general cyclist who cycles to work and home.

The cyclist must yield to pedestrians, but a car must yield to a cyclist.

A cyclist is entitled to his wobble, and cars must leave a 1-meter space while overtaking a cyclist.

So who's going to teach the Delhi Traffic Police all this?

Last edited by SS-Traveller : 26th June 2014 at 13:13.
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Old 26th June 2014, 13:33   #17
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Default Re: Right of way - safe driving

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Originally Posted by SS-Traveller View Post
When indicating a turn (U-turn or otherwise) don't turn on and off the indicator
- it confuses the following car, who cannot decide whether you really want to turn or are just checking if your indicator stalk functions okay!
This is exactly the reason I said pause and then indicate again. Have seen many cases where the Indicators remain on for a very long time as the driver may have forgotten to turn it off and others think he's never going to take that turn.

By pausing for 3-4 seconds and turning it on again and also gradually decreasing your pace it surely hints the tailing traffic that you are about to make that turn as per indication.

Another parallel activity is to lightly press on the B pedal to illuminate the brake lights. Just slowing down may also give a wrong hint that you have just got a call on your phone!
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Old 26th June 2014, 13:49   #18
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Default Re: Right of way - safe driving

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Originally Posted by GTO View Post
Also, link to a video showing how our fellow road users have absolutely no sense of 'right of way' (more on this thread (Video: Why you should be cautious at road junctions)).
Scary stuff that; so many accidents at one spot. That place definitely needs an underpass for traffic wanting to get to the other side.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SS-Traveller View Post
If the vehicle in the adjacent lane on either side is ahead of you by at least half a car length (i.e. you can see his rear indicator) and is indicating a lane change into your lane, you must slow down & yield to him. This does not mean that you downshift and pull into the next lane and start to overtake him immediately.
Hehe I did not mean to say one ought to downshift and zoom off .
I assumed the other vehicle would be slowing down for the upcoming exit, while you'd still be maintaing highway cruising speed; so let him move to the left and slow down, and you can move to the right lane and "pass him" from his right. (assuming there was enough space in between to do so/without braking too hard)

OT: Cycles were required by law to have lights, and this was strictly enforced a few decades ago. Not sure if it still applies or is being enforced. Perhaps, stopping motor vehicles is more lucrative than stopping people on cycles.
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Old 26th June 2014, 14:02   #19
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Default Re: Right of way - safe driving

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Originally Posted by paragsachania View Post
This is exactly the reason I said pause and then indicate again. Have seen many cases where the Indicators remain on for a very long time...
Start indicating 3-4 seconds before you actually slow down. Don't pause the indicating.
Quote:
Originally Posted by paragsachania View Post
...lightly press on the B pedal to illuminate the brake lights.
Exactly - touch the pedal to turn on the brake lights, but not actually activate the hydraulics.

Last edited by SS-Traveller : 26th June 2014 at 14:03.
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Old 26th June 2014, 23:42   #20
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Default Re: About 'Right of Way' & Safe Driving

How many folks behind the wheel know what a 'yield' symbol looks like or what it is supposed to stand for? Can you count how many follow the 4 point rule before lane change or even turn on the indicators before lane change? For that, do all drivers - including the some of educated lot, know what lane discipline is or stay put at a red signal even in the middle of the night? I started my driving / training in the Middle East and no wonder the trainer's first question was whether I had been driving in India before. When I answered in the negative, his quick response was that I shall get my license soon - as I would get a chance to learn how to drive the proper way.

On the flip side, habits die hard - even now, for even a slight lane change on a lonely highway the indicators come on, take a proper long turn so as not to affect the opposite traffic, wait for the traffic to ease before you join the flow - but in all, been a victim of admonishment and endless honking - for not being a Roman in Rome.

The key to driving safe is not just to ensure that you remain unharmed, but also that you dont intimidate or endanger other fellow roadsters, irrespective of their vehicle bulk. Back to your topic, here are some that you can add :

1. Yield - when you have traffic trickling from main lane to service lane, when you join the main lane from service lane.

2. Cautious when changing lanes - remember the 4 point rule. Its hard to follow in Indian conditions, but lets make the effort.

3. Stick to lane speeds and give way when you spot an errant driver.

4. Pedestrian crossings, let them cross the road - but ensure that you have yours hazards on.

5. Especially on the curves, leave enough space (on the sides and rear) away from long vehicles. Let us be courteous, they indeed have a bad turning radius and chances are high that we are caught in their blind spot.

6. If you spot a signal turn amber from a long distance, don's sprint and come to a gentle stop.

7. If you see the a junction in a gridlock even when your signal has turned green, wait. Don't add to chaos and obstruct the others right of way. Its the classic 'Yellow Box' that not many know here.

8. Give way for uphill traffic / facing the gorge.

9. Do not enter the roundabouts unless your exit is clear, else you are contributing to the situation.

10. You may be in a hurry to change lane or take a turn, but look if you are driving into someone else's path - you are stealing their right of way.

The list can go on. While some may sound impractical to follow in India, the change can happen if the proper driving etiquette are taught as a part of the driving school agenda.
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Old 27th June 2014, 10:09   #21
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Default Re: About 'Right of Way' & Safe Driving

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Originally Posted by Electric View Post
...proper driving etiquette are taught as a part of the driving school agenda.
I wonder if someone can list out city-wise, driving schools that teach proper driving etiquette in this country.
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Old 27th June 2014, 10:23   #22
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Default Re: About 'Right of Way' & Safe Driving

Traffic Etiquette work like herd immunity. Unless a large percentage of people follow them, following them can be useless or dangerous. This is more so in India, because people who put road signs use less intelligence than the buffalo sitting under them.

So in India the basic rules or Etiquette I follow are stuff like, look and merge into main road, give traffic on major road right of way etc.,

But following other things can get you killed.
I will give some example.
The national capital of New Delhi has many areas where two roads merge into each other(main roads).

Rules and common sense indicates then from the side you should merge with the traffic on the main road so that the traffic on the main road does not have to slow down.

But, if you do that, you will fly over the speedbreaker traffic police has put up and end up somewhere you did not intend to.

Case 2. AH1. A big massive highway. I have seen a couple of minor(very minor actually intersections) where there is a stop sign. Not towards the side road, but facing the highway traffic. You know what happens if you apply breaks on a 90kmph highway in the middle of nowhere.

You get rear ended.

So etiquette and rules make sense upto a certain level.

Just follow these rules
1. Do not make other traffic apply brakes for you(if they have right of way or if they are bigger)
2. Do not jump red lights, unless you see a truck doing 80kmph approaching fast. He is drunk and he will take you to kingdome come.
3. When crossing the road, always look left right, and up and down also. Something may fall from the sky, or someone may come from patalpuri
4. When turning left, traffic on your right has right of way

Following signs like Yield and Stop, remember whoever put those signs there and the buffalo sitting under it. They do not have a clue.

I mean what sort of intelligent entity decides "Hmmm this is a fast right turn over a flyover, so lets put a speed breaker in the middle of it, so that if a fast guy comes he loses control and jumps over the median, rather than before the curve starts?"
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Old 27th June 2014, 12:06   #23
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Default Re: About 'Right of Way' & Safe Driving

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Originally Posted by SS-Traveller View Post
I wonder if someone can list out city-wise
Yes, this could be a wishful thinking and a hard one to compile though. The oxymoron here is, we get to find what the gaps are only when we get our licenses and out of driving school, learn from mistakes and hard to relate to what was actually being taught in the driving schools. A thread where we can rank/ share the driving school experiences will indeed be a good one for someone who starts to learn.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
Unless a large percentage of people follow them, following them can be useless or dangerous.
Very true for an . Though one tries to be as law-abiding as much as possible, they are looked upon as minority. But I beg to differ on the later part of your sentence - it may be dangerous on some occasions, but calling it useless is callous in my opinion. Even if the practice begins as a minority, that is how the behavior begins its transition. We should rather not dismiss them completely and follow the herd. Just my thoughts.
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Old 27th June 2014, 12:48   #24
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Default Re: About 'Right of Way' & Safe Driving

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Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
So in India the basic rules or Etiquette I follow are stuff like, look and merge into main road, give traffic on major road right of way etc......
I mean what sort of intelligent entity decides "Hmmm this is a fast right turn over a flyover, so lets put a speed breaker in the middle of it, so that if a fast guy comes he loses control and jumps over the median, rather than before the curve starts?"
nicely put!

Lately I've observed that there is so much theory on this forum that anyone could be a great driver if they start following them. However, in India, not using common sense and going strictly by the book might not be good for your health.

Case in point -
(1)
On an intersection I see a green light but don't see a clear exit because of a traffic jam ahead. I decide to stop instead of tagging along because I know the light would turn red in another 3 seconds (thanks to the timer) and I'd be adding to the chaos when the other side's light turns green.

So I decide to stop but the guy behind me in a white scorpio is honking like crazy, I try to educate him using sign language, first from within the car and then immediately rolling down my window and trying to come up with polite signs on why I (& him) shouldn't move ahead.

He also reciprocates, only I know that his signs are pointing towards my family members and he's trying to communicate with them via me. The light turns red and another 10 seconds later he's standing besides the window of my car which I rolled up. Of course I roll it down a bit because I'm obliged to hear the latest expletives otherwise there is a fear of him smashing the glass, breaking a few of my bones while still making me hear those expletives. Meanwhile I'm trying to juggle between holding my ear saying sorry and doing a namaste saying sorry.

With 4 guys wearing white kurta-pyjama, in a white scorpio, I shouldn't have pulled off this stunt but since I did, this guy wants to have a closer look at what I'm wearing so I step out. This guy is about twice my height and weight. May be I'm wearing spectacles is why he doesn't slap the "rules" off my face or maybe he's impressed with the no. of sorries I've said in the last 30 seconds. Heck, it could have been some sort of record now that I think about it.

Nonetheless, I think he realizes "his" mistake (after a nervous explanation from my side by the end of which I only end up apologizing for stopping) which is why he helps me get back in car. But he's trying to be gentle and only uses one hand which pushes me back in my car with a couple hundred newtons of force. Its not his fault and probably the steroids he's on acting up. And being the gentleman that he is, he closes the car door behind me as well with twice the amount of force he used on me. I'm only glad that the component speaker in the car door didn't fall off.

I make it home in one piece and hug my wife for a little longer than usual. I've done it before this day a couple of times and I do it a few times after this day. As far as I can remember she hasn't experienced these extra-long hugs in the last year or so which only means that I've achieved the wisdom of knowing when to use my head and when to follow the rulebook.

If anyone was able to read through the complete story and is interested in reading upon how the rule-book is linked to your health insurance let me know, I do have a couple more.

PS: Right of way in India, sure, tell me the complete joke.
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Old 27th June 2014, 12:54   #25
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Default Re: About 'Right of Way' & Safe Driving

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Originally Posted by SDP View Post
Good topic! "Right of way" is such a alien concept in our country that its alarming. I am pretty sure, most have not even heard about the phrase let alone understand or follow it.
Right of way is not an alien concept at all. Everybody has it, all the time!

It is giving right of way that is the alien concept

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Originally Posted by Secretariat View Post
  • To drivers displaying L Board (at least to driving school cars)
Probably not. Giving right of way to L drivers will just teach them to expect it for the rest of their lives. L drivers should be treated with caution, and kept at further distance. They may stop, start, turn, or do anything, even more unpredictably than other drivers. An instructor in UK told me that most L-car accidents involve being rear-ended, because the one thing the instructor just can't prevent is the sudden, senseless stop.
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Old 27th June 2014, 15:18   #26
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Another 'right of way' courtesy that is ignored all over is blocking multiple lanes. Be it on right turns in metros or railway crossings in rural settings.
I cannot understand what the lane jumpers and blockers achieve except slow down every one.
In Pune for last two days I observed traffic clogging at almost all places where there is a separate green signal for right turns. People do not have the courtesy to stick to their lane but start second or even third parallel lane. This results in blocking the straight through traffic which gets barely one lane to proceed even though they are facing green signal.

Most of the drivers do not think ahead. These two or three parallel lines then try to squeeze into one lane after the turn. Leading to further chaos.
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Old 27th June 2014, 22:28   #27
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Default Re: About 'Right of Way' & Safe Driving

"Right of way' is just a small part of the traffic rules. That includes stopping at stop lines or red lights, not parking in 'no parking' areas, and not crossing the speed limit.

Now, which of these do we not do as frequently as we muddle up other people's right of way? We don't jump red lights, or overspeed on certain roads - the reason is not that we love following the rules, but that some gents in uniform might lighten our wallets.

Violating right of way of others doesn't affect our wallets - until violations of right of way lead to violent write-offs along the way.

Until enforcement and penalties for violating right of way happen in this country, I don't imagine much change will happen.
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Old 28th June 2014, 22:37   #28
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Default Re: About 'Right of Way' & Safe Driving

Was browsing 'Team-BHP' page on Facebook where I stumbled on these images on traffic flow with a small set of DO's and DONT's.

Didn't want to create a new thread for this. Just posting the pictures from there.

About 'Right of Way' & Safe Driving-1.jpg

About 'Right of Way' & Safe Driving-2.jpg

About 'Right of Way' & Safe Driving-3.jpg

Name:  4.jpg
Views: 219
Size:  35.7 KB

About 'Right of Way' & Safe Driving-5.jpg

About 'Right of Way' & Safe Driving-6.jpg

About 'Right of Way' & Safe Driving-7.jpg

About 'Right of Way' & Safe Driving-8.jpg

About 'Right of Way' & Safe Driving-9.jpg


NOTE: The work is NOT mine and the owner is Mr. Gautham Naidu. After his consent I am posting the same. Thanks Buddy.

Drive Safe.

Anurag.

Last edited by a4anurag : 28th June 2014 at 22:41. Reason: Adding Note.
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Old 29th June 2014, 00:38   #29
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Default Re: About 'Right of Way' & Safe Driving

How about...

Everybody prints those out and posts them on their office notice board.

All good, and beautifully done. Thank you Mr Naidu
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Old 29th June 2014, 09:46   #30
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Default Re: About 'Right of Way' & Safe Driving

Whenever I drive on highways and even in city roads where lane is clearly marked I see many driver who neither drive on right lane nor in middle lane. He occupies both lane by half each. It is most disgusting thing I face and hope many of you must be facing. Not sure how to teach them the lane descipline.

In my experience the lane width in India is bigger than any other developed countries. Still in developed countries they maintain the lane discipline. God knows when our drivers will learn this and occupy their own lane.
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