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Old 15th September 2014, 13:36   #121
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Default Re: August 2014 Proposal: Stiffer fines, Penalty points for Traffic Offenders

The draft bill to replace the MV Act 1989 has been released by the MoRTH, apparently. I couldn't find the PDF, but spotted this summary on The Hindu's website:

http://www.thehindu.com/multimedia/a...f_2106544a.pdf

It has also received some fair bit of press coverage. The targets over the next five years are to save 2 lakh lives (I guess this means to reduce the number of road accident deaths by that amount) and 4% improvement in GDP (by way of supply chain efficiency).
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Old 15th September 2014, 14:11   #122
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Default Re: August 2014 Proposal: Stiffer fines, Penalty points for Traffic Offenders

Can we as a community do something about educating pedestrians to walk on the pavement and follow safety rules? At least in the cities and towns.
Traffic cops have said ' how can we tell people to walk on the pavement, can we hold their hands and take them there if they walk on the road?' What kind of apathy is this?
I have gotten into arguments with people who were walking on the road while I was driving, and they are completely unapologetic despite the footpath, a mere 3 feet away being COMPLETELY empty. On the contrary they argue saying' can't you wait a second while we walk out of the way'

I was really wondering if we could perhaps have a drive, or motor awareness rally for team bhp members in every city, where we could maybe hand out pamphlets, or just stickers with 'Pedestrians walk on pavements' or something catchy, so that people do that?
I think it would significantly cut down on accidents and damage to cars.

Just a thought, hoping to hear other people's opinions?
Ang.
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Old 15th September 2014, 14:48   #123
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Default Re: August 2014 Proposal: Stiffer fines, Penalty points for Traffic Offenders

This Govt thinks super high fines will bring discipline, like extra tough jail terms will stop rapes, like hanging a few murderers will stop murders, like banning cow slaughter will promote vegetarianism, like more draconian laws would stop terrorism.

This from an pseudo moralistic group of politicians who dont have a clue of what they are doing.
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Old 15th September 2014, 14:54   #124
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Default Re: August 2014 Proposal: Stiffer fines, Penalty points for Traffic Offenders

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Originally Posted by gsurya View Post
This Govt thinks super high fines will bring discipline, like extra tough jail terms will stop rapes, like hanging a few murderers will stop murders, like banning cow slaughter will promote vegetarianism, like more draconian laws would stop terrorism.

This from an pseudo moralistic group of politicians who dont have a clue of what they are doing.
I don't see why it (super-high fines) wouldn't be at the very least, a cog in the wheel - apparently such a regime has worked well elsewhere in the world.

I would also like to know what alternatives you suggest to bring in discipline.
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Old 15th September 2014, 15:05   #125
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Default Re: August 2014 Proposal: Stiffer fines, Penalty points for Traffic Offenders

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Originally Posted by binand View Post
I don't see why it (super-high fines) wouldn't be at the very least, a cog in the wheel - apparently such a regime has worked well elsewhere in the world.

I would also like to know what alternatives you suggest to bring in discipline.
Actually, NOWHERE in the world has a regime of high fines only worked. Its implementing the system properly that is the key. Need to reform traffic policing first. What I would do:
  • Keep fines moderate in line with middle class income levels
  • Allow policemen to fine & collect on the spot for common offences
  • Many people pay fines simply to avoid losing time going to the traffic post or court
  • Have vigilance squads to check on traffic police to catch the corrupt
  • First build a full nationally connected system of smartcard based license & integrated database to track every individual & their up to date address - this itself is missing now
  • Implement camera based traffic offence recording system like piloted in Bangalore at few places
  • Improve & tighten system of giving licenses & driving school permits - this itself is the biggest problem, almost any idiot can start driving without going through proper learning

Once the above is implemented well, slowly increase the fines, put in escalation levels etc. Then you can improve compliance.
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Old 15th September 2014, 15:33   #126
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Default Re: August 2014 Proposal: Stiffer fines, Penalty points for Traffic Offenders

Quote:
Originally Posted by gsurya View Post
Actually, NOWHERE in the world has a regime of high fines only worked. Its implementing the system properly that is the key. Need to reform traffic policing first. What I would do:
  • Keep fines moderate in line with middle class income levels
  • Allow policemen to fine & collect on the spot for common offences
  • Many people pay fines simply to avoid losing time going to the traffic post or court
  • Have vigilance squads to check on traffic police to catch the corrupt
  • First build a full nationally connected system of smartcard based license & integrated database to track every individual & their up to date address - this itself is missing now
  • Implement camera based traffic offence recording system like piloted in Bangalore at few places
  • Improve & tighten system of giving licenses & driving school permits - this itself is the biggest problem, almost any idiot can start driving without going through proper learning
Once the above is implemented well, slowly increase the fines, put in escalation levels etc. Then you can improve compliance.
Agree to each and every point mentioned above, but would also like to add that along with these, make the fines heavy so that people actually feel the pinch and would hesitate to break law. A combination of these two would work wonders on our congested roads. How long would this take, guess even god wouldn't have the answer yet.
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Old 15th September 2014, 15:40   #127
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Default Re: August 2014 Proposal: Stiffer fines, Penalty points for Traffic Offenders

Quote:
Originally Posted by gsurya View Post
Actually, NOWHERE in the world has a regime of high fines only worked. Its implementing the system properly that is the key. Need to reform traffic policing first. What I would do:
  • First build a full nationally connected system of smartcard based license & integrated database to track every individual & their up to date address - this itself is missing now
  • Implement camera based traffic offence recording system like piloted in Bangalore at few places
  • Improve & tighten system of giving licenses & driving school permits - this itself is the biggest problem, almost any idiot can start driving without going through proper learning
I did say it is a cog in the wheel, not the only thing to do. Anyway, these things that you mention are reportedly present in the new draft Road Transport and Safety Bill - especially the list items I have retained above.

It seems to me the government and you are thinking about the problem similarly.
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Old 15th September 2014, 20:27   #128
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Default Re: August 2014 Proposal: Stiffer fines, Penalty points for Traffic Offenders

What do our legal experts have to say about this provision in the new RTS Bill?
Quote:
Chapter III:
Every motor vehicle, including goods vehicles, passenger vehicles, trailers, semi-trailers and mobile machinery, non-motorised transport shall be so constructed, maintained and designed so as to be at all times under the effective control of the person driving the vehicle.
...
A person is guilty of an offence if that person:
(1) contravenes or fails to comply with any construction, maintenance, equipment
including safety equipment, design or use requirement under this Act;
Would this give teeth to the Bill once it becomes an Act, to penalize manufacturers for things like brake and steering failure?
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Old 16th September 2014, 21:09   #129
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Default Re: August 2014 Proposal: Stiffer fines, Penalty points for Traffic Offenders

Have just sent these suggestions to the designated email id of the Ministry of Road Transport and Highways: ( rtsbill2014-morth@nic.in )


Sir,

It is quite encouraging that your Ministry has taken up the job of drafting, finalising and later introducing the new Road Transport and Safety Bill, 2014 in the Parliament for enactment.

I would like to point out a few suggestions for incorporation in the Bill.

(1) Recalls by Manufacturers: The clause for Recalls by automobile manufacturers entails that a minimum 100 complaints against a manufacturing defects shall make it mandatory for the manufacturer to recall and later rectify the problem or replace the spares / car and so on.

Some cars do not sell even 100 units a month in India. A case in point is the Chevrolet Captiva SUV from GM costing more than Rs 20 lakhs. It is notorious for engine fires and recalls were undertaken in the U.S. and China but not in India. In India, a few fire incidents have been reported due to an inherent manufacturing defect. This link with about 25,000 views will illustrate the matter.

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/techni...tiva-fire.html (My Horror Story: Chevrolet Captiva on Fire!)

Hence such cases should be investigated by ARAI or other competent designated government agencies under direct monitoring by your Ministry so that the manufacturer can be booked.

(2) Damages for manufacturing defects : This needs to be attuned in line with the US consumer laws, wherein unlimited damages can be claimed by customers for manufacturing defects, that affect the well-being of the customer. The US courts award damages to the tune of several millions of dollars that act as a deterrent for manufacturers, who are very careful about the quality of automobiles being sold there. The damages need to be contested and awarded by a competent court to the customer or his or her dependents who has/ have suffered for such omission deficiency by the manufacturer.

(3) Traffic Laws: This 2014 Bill of ours surely seeks stringent fines for breaking traffic rules and can also mean cancellation of the driving licence. The existing laws are also stringent, but traffic users circumvent the laws and get off scot free. The developed countries have very strict penal provisions and drivers are scared of breaking traffic laws be it speed, rash driving,obstructing traffic, wrong lane driving, wrong parking and for not obeying traffic rules or for breaking any traffic rules.

We need provisions that will deter the wrong doers. The driving licence needs to be linked to the Aadhar Card (like the Social Security Number in the USA) so that the wrongdoer is detected if at all he or she tries to secure a second driving licence after the old one is cancelled.

Today's traffic is unfriendly for those who obey traffic rules and is a breeze for those who circumvent and break traffic and parking rules.

It is hoped that you will kindly look into my suggestions.

Yours faithfully,


Dr Anjan C.

Last edited by anjan_c2007 : 16th September 2014 at 21:11.
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Old 26th February 2015, 08:54   #130
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Default Re: August 2014 Proposal: Stiffer fines, Penalty points for Traffic Offenders

Tada tada... Good days are coming !!
SOURCE

First, some good news for the victims of road-condition related accidents !
I can immediately recall the case against the engineers involved in the bad planning of a flyover ramp, in Bangalore, which caused the death of a techie in an accident. READ HERE
Quote:
Road owning agencies and those involved in designing, implementation and maintenance would have to cough up Rs 1 lakh for any death in a crash due to the road condition. The penalty would be Rs 50,000 in case a road crash victim is disabled.
Second, this is apart from the stricter penalties and fines that would be imposed on traffic offenders.
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Old 26th February 2015, 14:13   #131
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Default Re: August 2014 Proposal: Stiffer fines, Penalty points for Traffic Offenders

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Originally Posted by Soumyajit9 View Post
Second, this is apart from the stricter penalties and fines that would be imposed on traffic offenders.
I don't like the idea of setting a 15L cap on third-party claims. I think it is quite a regressive move being implemented only to please the insurance companies. I hope this get shot down, either in the parliament (unlikely) or in the court.
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Old 26th February 2015, 14:26   #132
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Default Re: August 2014 Proposal: Stiffer fines, Penalty points for Traffic Offenders

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I don't like the idea of setting a 15L cap on third-party claims. I think it is quite a regressive move being implemented only to please the insurance companies. I hope this get shot down, either in the parliament (unlikely) or in the court.
Totally agree with this part. We have seen compensation run into crores even. So ofcourse this is a very small amount when compared to the death of someone who is earning well.
But I see this as a start. Let the bill come into enforcement. Further amendments can be done based on public outcry !!

Or if they have an option of revising the amount or removing this particular clause from the bill, they should do it. The bill should come into act at the earliest.
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Old 26th February 2015, 14:38   #133
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Default Re: August 2014 Proposal: Stiffer fines, Penalty points for Traffic Offenders

Rs. 500 / Rs. 1000 for Using Mobile while driving/no seat-belts/no helmet : is still pretty low IMO - by that I mean, it's still not as "strong" as the fine for jumping signals.

We are hearing about these "coming-soon" laws since last year, when are these actually going to be implemented.
Further, how much more time for this to be practically implemented all over India?

Driving sense really needs to come in.

It's high time.

Ace.

Last edited by driverace : 26th February 2015 at 14:39.
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Old 26th February 2015, 14:50   #134
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Default Re: August 2014 Proposal: Stiffer fines, Penalty points for Traffic Offenders

These bills won't be passed anytime soon. The government's priority is the Land , Insurance and the GST bills.

Capping the third party insurance is a mixed bag. TP payout without any upper limit has been causing losses to insurance companies. TP insurance has been rising significantly in the past few years , and capping it at 15lac will directly benefit the vehicle owners paying insurance, but at a cost to the accident victims.

Last edited by sdp1975 : 26th February 2015 at 14:51.
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Old 11th March 2015, 15:04   #135
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Default Re: August 2014 Proposal: Stiffer fines, Penalty points for Traffic Offenders

Mod note:

Please continue discussion in this thread: (Decoding the proposed Road Transport & Safety Bill, 2015)
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