Go Back   Team-BHP > Buckle Up > Street Experiences


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 30th October 2014, 01:17   #61
BHPian
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 70
Thanked: 31 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lobogris View Post
Could you please explain the issues with doing these two actions?
Is it wrong/ harmful to press the clutch if one is slowing down gently like when approaching a round about you are at 70 kmph and know that you would need to slow down to around 20-30 depending on the traffic you encounter? If you are in the 5th gear, you would need to use your clutch as you start slowing down.

On point 1, don't you need to use the clutch if you slow down to go over speed breakers?
Usually engaging the clutch at higher speeds increases breaking effort since the vehicle speeds up a little as wheels are in free motion. So it is better not to engage clutch until you feel the vehicle is jerking since it is in the wrong gear. You'll get better at doing this with practice and without jerking the vehicle. I usually use the brakes when in higher gear and use the clutch just at the right moment to change to the appropriate gear required for the upcoming speed. Speed bump at 50 in 4th, or 65 in 5th, break until about 20, engage clutch, shift to second and continue on.

Unless you are going over Rumblers, you'll invariably have to almost slow down to less than 20kmph at a speed bump, so you'll need to engage clutch anyway. I usually drive over Rumblers at normal speed since I feel very annoyed going over them at crawling speeds. This is my personal preference of course.
sswaroop is offline   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 30th October 2014, 12:03   #62
Senior - BHPian
 
m_upreti's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Mumbai/Medellin
Posts: 1,564
Thanked: 298 Times
Default Re: 10-2 steering position? Nope, it's 9-3 for Airbag-equipped cars

I drive a non airbag equipped Scorpio (2007) and normally use a single hand (at 3 'O Clock) position but the arm starts aching in small drives also, I have tried adjusting the steering (up / down) and the seats (back / forth) but no avail.

On high speeds and really bad patches of the road where there is a chance of being thrown about I use the 9 - 3 position with a tighter grip.
m_upreti is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th October 2014, 14:05   #63
BHPian
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Howrah, WB
Posts: 147
Thanked: 77 Times
Default Re: 10-2 steering position? Nope, it's 9-3 for Airbag-equipped cars

Strange how most people seem to prefer 9-3 position as most comfortable ! Having started with the 10-2, I catch myself often in the 11-1 position during long drives when I need not use the shifter frequently -- so that must be comfortable for me. Of course, I drive non-power steering with no airbag, a rarity these days ! But at any speed over sixty, I do not feel comfortable without both hands on the wheel, as nobody knows when you have to suddenly swerve because of a dog or cow or man that makes a sudden appearance on the horizon !

One question I have of 'Sutripta' and 'SS-T', do power steerings have the self-centering feature ?
SnakemanJohny is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th October 2014, 16:30   #64
BHPian
 
nishsingh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Hyderabad
Posts: 185
Thanked: 433 Times
Default Re: 10-2 steering position? Nope, it's 9-3 for Airbag-equipped cars

Just wondering if different steering holding positions might be preferred depending on the vehicle.

Looking at the posts in this discussion, SUVs, with a higher up and upright seating positions might be better for either 7-4 or 9-3 (depending on their preference), while drivers of low seated cars might feel more comfortable with either of 10-2 or 9-3?

Last edited by nishsingh : 30th October 2014 at 16:42.
nishsingh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th October 2014, 16:32   #65
BHPian
 
nishsingh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Hyderabad
Posts: 185
Thanked: 433 Times
Default Re: 10-2 steering position? Nope, it's 9-3 for Airbag-equipped cars

[quote=nishsingh;3568145]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lobogris View Post
Could you please explain the issues with doing these two actions?
Sswaroop above has already mentioned what I felt too.

I don't think riding the clutch is ever a good idea. The driving schools seem to be wrongly forcing the over-usage of the clutch on learners. I guess they are more bothered about is the car not stalling while being driven by the learners, than teaching them about the finer points of clutch (if they themselves know it, that is).

Speaking of which, I believe they too teach the 10-2 steering position over the 9-3 position.
nishsingh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th October 2014, 16:49   #66
Distinguished - BHPian
 
SS-Traveller's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 6,565
Thanked: 10,480 Times
Default Re: 10-2 steering position? Nope, it's 9-3 for Airbag-equipped cars

Quote:
Originally Posted by SnakemanJohny View Post
...do power steerings have the self-centering feature ?
Yes, pretty much all vehicles, irrespective of steering bing power-assisted or not, will have this feature. Dependent on the geometry of the suspension, where the wheels want to point straight ahead on their own if aligned properly.
SS-Traveller is offline   (2) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 30th October 2014, 18:19   #67
BHPian
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 302
Thanked: 263 Times
Default Re: 10-2 steering position? Nope, it's 9-3 for Airbag-equipped cars

Discovery TV has an article that stating as follows:

Finding: BUSTED
Explanation: In June 2009, The New York Times reported on a car accident in which one driver nearly got his right thumb ripped off by the force of the airbag detonation. His hand was in the wrong place at the wrong time, firmly planted on the horn when the airbag burst through.

However, other anecdotal evidence has also indicated that the safety devices aren't safe for thumbs, and some driver's ed courses warn new motorists against gripping steering wheels with their hands in the classic 10 o'clock and 2 o'clock positions for fear of losing their fifth digits in a wreck.

The MythBusters blew up the latter theory by creating a crash-test dummy with lifelike arms and hands (and, of course, thumbs) and subjecting it to a series of airbag explosions. No matter what position the dummy's thumbs were in on the steering wheel - curled around it or resting on top of the wheel - the airbag consistently struck the dummy's arms first. Consequently, the inflating bag forced the arms outward, bringing the hands off the steering wheel before it could make contact with the digits.

The MythBusters didn't test the thumb risk associated with laying on the horn like The New York Times' subject did, but their tests did bust the myth that an inflating airbag can blow off your thumbs while they're in the "10 and 2" positions on the steering wheel.

Guess your grip is safe.

http://www.discovery.com/tv-shows/my...thumbs-off.htm
Lobogris is offline   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 30th October 2014, 18:46   #68
Distinguished - BHPian
 
SS-Traveller's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 6,565
Thanked: 10,480 Times
Default Re: 10-2 steering position? Nope, it's 9-3 for Airbag-equipped cars

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lobogris View Post
...tests did bust the myth that an inflating airbag can blow off your thumbs while they're in the "10 and 2" positions on the steering wheel.
Injury to hands/arms/fingers is the least of our problems when driving on a day-to-day basis. Placement of hands at 9-3 is the optimized position for best car control for any driver.
SS-Traveller is offline   (2) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 31st October 2014, 17:38   #69
Senior - BHPian
 
joybhowmik's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 1,314
Thanked: 1,885 Times
Default Re: 10-2 steering position? Nope, it's 9-3 for Airbag-equipped cars

Quote:
Originally Posted by SS-Traveller View Post
Placement of hands at 9-3 is the optimized position for best car control for any driver.
SST,
I have a very simple rule. I place my hands where they feel most comfortable. For me, last 20 years - this has invariably been 9:30 - 2:30.

Never had any major accident. Have managed quite well to swerve out of the way of obstacles multiple times.

I think instead of being prescriptive, leave it to the driver in question- does he feel comfortable? The answer does not have to fit the one prescribed standard.

Variations are possible , nay welcome, and are another feedback to the car manufacturers and driving trainers, to provide more individualized offerings - whilst not compromising safety.
joybhowmik is offline   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 31st October 2014, 18:36   #70
Distinguished - BHPian
 
SS-Traveller's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 6,565
Thanked: 10,480 Times
Default Re: 10-2 steering position? Nope, it's 9-3 for Airbag-equipped cars

Quote:
Originally Posted by joybhowmik View Post
...I place my hands where they feel most comfortable. For me, last 20 years - this has invariably been 9:30 - 2:30.
If you will notice, I said...
Quote:
Originally Posted by SS-Traveller View Post
1. 10-2, 9-3 and 8-4 are all valid positions to hold the steering wheel. Each has its advantages and disadvantages...
The range of hand positions best suited to safe driving extends from 10-2 to 8-4, and you are free to choose.

However, comfort and safety need not necessarily be inter-related.

If by comfort you mean ergonomics, yes, each car model is slightly ergonomically different from another, and there is no one-size-fits-all formula, as you discovered some time ago with your own Innova (Issue: Driver's foot (Accelerator foot) over a long drive). So if 9:30-2:30 suits you, and still leaves 10" gap between your chest and the steering centre boss (and airbag), carry on with it.

The only message I want to convey in this thread, is not to drive for extended periods with only one hand on the steering wheel, as a matter of habit.
SS-Traveller is offline   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 31st October 2014, 21:19   #71
Senior - BHPian
 
joybhowmik's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 1,314
Thanked: 1,885 Times
Default Re: 10-2 steering position? Nope, it's 9-3 for Airbag-equipped cars

Quote:
Originally Posted by SS-Traveller View Post
If you will notice, I said...

The range of hand positions best suited to safe driving extends from 10-2 to 8-4, and you are free to choose.

However, comfort and safety need not necessarily be inter-related.

If by comfort you mean ergonomics, yes, each car model is slightly ergonomically different from another, and there is no one-size-fits-all formula, as you discovered some time ago with your own Innova (Issue: Driver's foot (Accelerator foot) over a long drive). So if 9:30-2:30 suits you, and still leaves 10" gap between your chest and the steering centre boss (and airbag), carry on with it.

The only message I want to convey in this thread, is not to drive for extended periods with only one hand on the steering wheel, as a matter of habit.
My response was to your statement "9-3...is the optimized position for best car control for any driver."
Using the word "best" for "9-3" clearly over other "valid" positions - that too from someone with a great deal of credibility on this forum - implies the need for others to correct themselves - even when there's no correction required.
I am glad that your latest response has endorsed (equally?) all the widely accepted positions for holding the steering wheel.
I am also glad that you concede, that each car is different (seat height, outward visibility, position of steering , angle of wheel) , each individual is different (height, arm length, torso height ) not to mention any specific special needs (back pain etc), and therefore the combination of the two requires not one best position - but a range of valid positions to safely operate the car.

Last edited by joybhowmik : 31st October 2014 at 21:21.
joybhowmik is offline   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 1st November 2014, 00:49   #72
BHPian
 
Optimus7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Chennai
Posts: 111
Thanked: 12 Times
Default Re: 10-2 steering position? Nope, it's 9-3 for Airbag-equipped cars

After trying out various steering positions, I have settled to use the 9-3 or 8-4 positions. I find that these positions apart from being easy on your arms, also lets you provide smoother steering inputs. Whenever I used the 10-2 position, I felt that my steering inputs were a bit inconsistent, smooth at times, but sharp turns more often.
These might be due to various reasons, one, the arm is not comfortable at 10-2 position for longer duration and two, your hand comes down when you turn in as compared to going up in the 9-3 or 8-4 positions.

I have seen a lot of cab drivers leaning forward and holding the steering at 10-2 or 11-1 position and in most cases their steering inputs are sharp/sudden.
Optimus7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st November 2014, 05:38   #73
Distinguished - BHPian
 
SS-Traveller's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 6,565
Thanked: 10,480 Times
Default Re: 10-2 steering position? Nope, it's 9-3 for Airbag-equipped cars

Quote:
Originally Posted by joybhowmik View Post
My response was...
...your latest response has endorsed (equally?) all the widely accepted positions for holding the steering wheel.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SS-Traveller View Post
...and still leaves 10" gap between your chest and the steering centre boss (and airbag)...
Is this some kind of contest to prove yourself right? Please go right ahead and drive as you always did, irrespective of what I might say or not. Replace your steering wheel with a handlebar for all I care. Hold it at 10-4 or 8-1 or any other number combination if that suits you - I don't drive/ride in your car, so it doesn't matter to me. I am not endorsing whatever you think I might be endorsing - I am no brand manager for hand positions on steering wheels.

After all, your safety is your choice.
SS-Traveller is offline   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 1st November 2014, 05:59   #74
Senior - BHPian
 
joybhowmik's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 1,314
Thanked: 1,885 Times
Default Re: 10-2 steering position? Nope, it's 9-3 for Airbag-equipped cars

Quote:
Originally Posted by SS-Traveller View Post
Is this some kind of contest to prove yourself right? Please go right ahead and drive as you always did, irrespective of what I might say or not. Replace your steering wheel with a handlebar for all I care. Hold it at 10-4 or 8-1 or any other number combination if that suits you - I don't drive/ride in your car, so it doesn't matter to me. I am not endorsing whatever you think I might be endorsing - I am no brand manager for hand positions on steering wheels.

After all, your safety is your choice.
I did not say that this is a contest, nor did I mean it to be one.

OT:
At the heart of the issue - All I am saying is that words should be chosen carefully - especially when they contain guidance for people , and the post is from someone who enjoys a huge amount of credibility on the site.

If my observation has caused an offense, and hurt your sensibilities , I understand - the first reactions to feedback always are - we are all human. But, if you think about the core point I am making in this post in a rational moment, I hope you will embrace it.

Last edited by joybhowmik : 1st November 2014 at 06:00.
joybhowmik is offline   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 4th November 2014, 08:25   #75
BHPian
 
Wanderers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Delhi-NCR
Posts: 455
Thanked: 523 Times
Default Re: 10-2 steering position? Nope, it's 9-3 for Airbag-equipped cars

Hi

For me, the steering holding position goes hand-in-glove with seat height and distance I am driving.
During long drive, I choose lowest seat position, lowest steering tilt and 8-4 steering position, which may be not technically correct but I feel comfortably doing it as I am not looking for turning steering more than few millimeters.
This also safety guards me from over steering during high speed cruising.

Sometime the steering position is driven by type of steering. For example- In New Fortuner, you cannot doe 10-2 or 9-3 for long due to sweating and would need to change position to something below 9-3 as its the leather portion of steering.
Wanderers is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
So How Safe are the lpg\Cng equipped Cars ? Technocrat The Indian Car Scene 51 10th April 2013 11:01
Driving Position / Where to hold the steering wheel! Torque-ative Technical Stuff 69 17th July 2012 19:23
Steering position ballkey Technical Stuff 67 30th November 2009 13:41
Honda unveils world's first airbag-equipped motorbike cnu Superbikes & Imports 11 29th May 2009 15:40
Steering Position? BUSA Technical Stuff 8 6th March 2006 12:36


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 05:55.

Copyright 2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks