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Old 21st April 2015, 23:02   #16
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Default Re: Scam alert: Cops overstating penalty. Verify traffic fines before actually paying them

Congrats akshladha, good lesson learnt and told. You need to publish this on social media and print media, so it's not just fellow bhpians but the whole world can take useful cues :-)
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Old 22nd April 2015, 02:33   #17
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Default Re: Scam alert: Cops overstating penalty. Verify traffic fines before actually paying them

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Originally Posted by S2!!! View Post
Lesson learnt...no mobile phone while driving.
That's it !

I am not defending the corrupt law implementation system, however my personal experience says that you are completely on their mercy if you have been caught doing anything that you are not supposed to do .

I am also curious to know what does law say about using those integrated Bluetooth systems for phone calls?

Is it just illegal to get involved in any kind of telephonic communication while driving or only the person holding the phone in hand has to be found guilty?

IMO, both could equally distract the driver and cause same amount of disaster.
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Old 22nd April 2015, 06:48   #18
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Thumbs up Re: Scam alert: Cops overstating penalty. Verify traffic fines before actually paying them

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Originally Posted by akshladha View Post
Victory at last! Though it wasn’t easy, but I paid my fine at the nearby Traffic Police Station and got my D/L .

I do propose to write to the JC, DCP & ACP and all the possible authorities. It might be time consuming, but cannot let these law breakers who are meant to protect the law misuse the ignorance of common man.
I've learnt the hard way too! All I wanted was to pay the fine online so I could be sure it was not ending up somewhere else. Wasted an entire day.

If you still have the stamina to pursue the matter, please go to the media and make sure you get the cops terminated, but make sure you will not be victimized in future.
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Old 22nd April 2015, 14:13   #19
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Default Re: Scam alert: Cops overstating penalty. Verify traffic fines before actually paying them

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Originally Posted by akshladha View Post
It did take me an entire hour, but better than going to court, waste a day and then another day to collect the D/L from the local RTO.
Was this at the Borivali National Park chowki ?

I have been on both sides of this post - I have held my ground and got through in the past as well as have been cornered and had to pay through my nose.

In recent months I have noticed traffic cops have been given a free hand (I am guessing by their superiors) to start asking for hefty bribes (unlike 50-100 before) or get the license impounded and give a court threat. Even if the traffic cop takes your license and tells you to pay fine and collect it from the chowki, the cop at the chowki window will try to fleece you by "laminated" past magistrate judgments on fines related to your offense.

Case 1: Asked to pull over while driving on the road for a suspected window tint. Cop scratches his pen tip on my side window glass to see if its tinted. On not finding one he says my car "looks" tinted from front and back and hence asks me to submit license and pay fine at chowki. I obviously lose my cool and get extremely stern to ask if fines are laid out on "percieved" offenses or actual offenses, to which he backs down and gives my license back and asks me to leave.
Verdict: WIN (but could have been a bribe for someone who was not ready to put up a fight)

Case 2: A green signal going on & off in Borivali led me to jump the same as I thought its possibly not working. Got chased and stopped by two constables on a bike who just took my license and handed me a form. I had to travel for work so I asked my family member to go and collect DL from the chowki with an authority letter. The cop at the window says that the motorcyle cop has charged me with dangerous driving and not breaking signal so "he cannot give" license back and I had to go to court in front of magistrate. He shows a few past judgments and fines from his file. Then subtly asks to settle at half the average fine amount (Rs.1350). Since I am traveling out of town for a while and want an instant out, I ask my family to pay it and get the D/L
Verdict: LOSS (but this has also made me less prone to jumping signals / breaking rules in general - which is a good sing)

Overall I think our reaction should be a mixture of being on the back foot and front foot depending on the situation. If you have broken a rule, then do walk with the system by being patient and jumping through hoops - or pay a bribe. If you haven't done anything wrong, then stand your ground (but without offending the cop).

A standard advise is offcourse to stay polite and humble as all said and done these are cops and have mighty egos and a corrupt system at their behest.
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Old 22nd April 2015, 14:45   #20
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Default Re: Scam alert: Cops overstating penalty. Verify traffic fines before actually paying them

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Originally Posted by Hrishi_111 View Post
I am also curious to know what does law say about using those integrated Bluetooth systems for phone calls?

Is it just illegal to get involved in any kind of telephonic communication while driving or only the person holding the phone in hand has to be found guilty?

IMO, both could equally distract the driver and cause same amount of disaster.
Any kind of telephonic device communication while driving is illegal, as far as I remember, even the hands free one.
It is just that no one enforces this.
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Old 23rd April 2015, 15:27   #21
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Default Re: Scam alert: Cops overstating penalty. Verify traffic fines before actually paying them

Hi Aksh,
Nasty experience ! Most of the traffic cops are crooks. I am yet to come across someone who is gentle polite and sticks to the rules in many of the cities I have been. The only exception is Chandigarh where they explain you the rule you have broken and then book you for that offence. The next day you go to the police lines, pay the fine and get the DL.

The whole point of traffic police in India is "extortion". Pardon my hyperbole but that is what it is. Harassing Truck, commercial vehicle, car, two wheeler is their norm. Their only motive while on duty is to make money and they give two hoots to upholding rules and law.

The rules are very unclear, not communicated purposefully and the whole process is biased in favor of these crooks. One reason they do is their supreme confidence that "they can get away with it" as said famously in the Hollywood movie L.A Confidential. If somehow they are under fear that they cannot get away with it, things will change.

Congratulations for your tremendous courage to fight against these crooks and then finally have a happy ending.
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Old 26th April 2015, 10:06   #22
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Did not find a suitable thread to post this topic, hence posting it here.

Quote:
A police constable has blown the lid off the deep-rooted culture of corruption in Mumbai police's traffic department in an explosive letter to Chief Minister Devendra Fadnavis. The letter details a well-oiled machinery, which, instead of focusing on managing the city's traffic, collects bribes and distributes it to a chain of officers extending right to the top of the department's hierarchy.
Source
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Old 26th April 2015, 11:01   #23
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Default Re: Scam alert: Cops overstating penalty. Verify traffic fines before actually paying them

Good job. Congratulations on doing the unthinkable. You paid a fine legally and got your license back. Wow... This is something..
Sadly this is the situation in India. It should have been a simple fine to be paid online/over the phone and be done with.. Such little issues are clogging our system, no wonder the officers are too busy to take care of bigger things.
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Old 15th May 2015, 16:10   #24
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Default Re: Scam alert: Cops overstating penalty. Verify traffic fines before actually paying them

This has happened several times with me as well. The charges have varied from having tinted windows (I don't) to using mobile phones (I don't do that either: sometimes I just rest my head on my right arm which in turn rests on the door and it looks like I'm holding a phone - I drive an Automatic).

In every case I have gotten away without having to pay a fine, because I have a printout of the following page with me in the car, and readily pull it out when challenged:

Suggest you do the same.
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Old 29th May 2015, 07:56   #25
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Default Re: Scam alert: Cops overstating penalty. Verify traffic fines before actually paying them!

A lesser-known aspect about the way the law treats these driving offences is the process of compounding.

The Motor Vehicles Act, 1988 prescribes a whole bunch of offences as well as penalties. For example Section 184 - Dangerous Driving. For first time offenders the punishment can be upto six months simple imprisonment or a fine of upto Rs 1000 or both.

But the general perception is that the driver has a right to get off with a fine, usually Rs 300-500.

So why is there a difference?

The answer lies in Section 200 of the act which provides for compounding of certain offences. In short it is a mechanism to save everyone (police, offender, court) from the exertion of a trial if the offender knows he is guilty and is willing to plead guilty to the traffic police immediately -- a form of plea bargaining. In such cases the offender is required to sign a compounding slip (where he admits his guilt) but gets away with a lesser fine and no jail sentence. The compounding fine usually differs from state to state as it is prescribed by the state government (some are more lenient than others).

Here is a specimen compounding slip that the WB Traffic Police have been kind enough to put up for public information.

Pros. Quick, easy, not a burden on the wallet, no time consuming process, no seizure of documents

Cons. Maybe too easy and too less a burden on the wallet for effective deterrence, cannot be appealed against, decision to compound or not must be decided on the spot

Contrast this with a court trial which might take a few months, involve plenty of time, 10-20x costs on overheads, lawyers, etc. , impounding of vehicle, and in the end perhaps result in a conviction carrying a jail term!

Coming back to my example about dangerous driving, the compounding fine for dangerous driving in West Bengal is Rs 400 (against potentially Rs 1000 + six months in jail). Item 29 of this link

What are the implications of this whole system?

-- There can exist two different fines / penalties for the same offence. (one for compounding, the other for 'regular' trial).

-- The lesser penalty is always the compounding penalty which requires a declaration of guilt on the spot.

-- Failure to compound in time can foreclose that option. Thereafter the cops can give you a hard time by forcing you to attend court or extract a bigger bribe perhaps (for not forcing you to).

Please remember that very often the small 'fines' we often associate with traffic offences are compounding fines only and not the full extent of punishment.

Last edited by Kumar R : 29th May 2015 at 08:13.
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Old 29th May 2015, 10:29   #26
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Default Re: Scam alert: Cops overstating penalty. Verify traffic fines before actually paying them!

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Originally Posted by sdp1975 View Post
Did not find a suitable thread to post this topic, hence posting it here.



Source
Everyone in India knows about this. Police stands for corruption. Courts stand for corruption.

That means right from a school kid to the Supreme court judges and the President of India and of course the harbinger of अछे दिन आएंगे - new Prime Minister. I find it amazing that people in power say that common man should complain when he comes across such incidents of corruption only then they can take action.

Strange, have these people in power never experienced or observed corruption ever on their own to take action?

Last edited by alpha1 : 29th May 2015 at 10:33.
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Old 30th May 2015, 08:44   #27
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Default Re: Scam alert: Cops overstating penalty. Verify traffic fines before actually paying them!

Yesterday,in a local daily, it was announced that citation fines of Rs.100/- will be increased for the second offence to Rs150/- and for the third to Rs.300/-. There is no mention of reverting back to Rs.100/- after say some period of nil offence. That means after three citations we will have to pay Rs.300/- forever!!
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