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Old 2nd December 2015, 14:55   #16
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Default Re: Automotive Zeitgeist...or how older driving practices have changed today

Another driving practice that has evolved contrary to the rules (especially on the Delhi-Gurgaon-Jaipur Highway) is that slowest vehicle drive in the right lane . Another set of slow vehicles following rules, drive on the left 2 lanes. The normal vehicles are left with no option but to zig-zag to even maintain a speed of 70 kmph.

Is there a way these people can be fined for driving below the speed limit in a high speed lane ?
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Old 2nd December 2015, 15:01   #17
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Default Re: Automotive Zeitgeist...or how older driving practices have changed today

In Mumbai, auto wallahs are known to show feet signal as well!
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Old 2nd December 2015, 15:30   #18
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Default Re: Automotive Zeitgeist...or how older driving practices have changed today

I got my first drivers license in 1990. This was for a bike. At that time, I had a Kinetic Honda which had then become a rage and Honda was trying to usurp Bajaj in two-wheeler making.
I guess, Kinetic Honda was the only scooter at that time which came with turn indicators. Also, this was the first auto-gear scooter of that time.
So, I go the RTO for my first license. All formalities done and it was time to do a test drive.
There were many in line doing the test drive, and our constable conducting the test was sitting under the shade watching the drives. Everybody had to drive through couple of humps and then drive through the figure 8.
My turn came, I drive through the hump, through the figure 8 effortlessly on my automatic Kinetic.
The constable tells me : You are not ready for the license!!
I say : But, Why Sir?
Constable : You didn't give slow down signal by hand when going over the hump. Also, when doing the turns in the figure 8, you did not give the indication with your hand.
I said : But Sir, there are brake lights to indicate when I am slowing down, and for turning, I did blink the indicators.
Constable : Those things are not the proper way, you must use hands to signal always, no matter what lights you have. Your vehicle is also gear-less, so you will only get a non-gear vehicle license.

No matter how much I tried to make sense, he did not budge. Finally, had to go over the entire process again and take different vehicle to get my license.

Nowadays, I still see rickshaws, kaali-peeli taxis, trucks etc. still using hand signals for lane changing, turning etc. Trucks are notorious for not using turn indicators. Most of the time, their turn indicators do not work. Even if they work, they use it to indicate : "I am sticking on this lane, you go around" or "you can overtake from the side I am indicating" or "stop blowing horn".
I have seen many trucks having some rope or stuff hanging out of their OVRM which I have mistaken for a hand signal.
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Old 2nd December 2015, 15:31   #19
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Default Re: Automotive Zeitgeist...or how older driving practices have changed today

The biggest change is advent of Mobile Phones.

It makes a rather sane driver behave like a drunkard behind the wheel!
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Old 2nd December 2015, 16:14   #20
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Default Re: Automotive Zeitgeist...or how older driving practices have changed today

Quote:
Originally Posted by tharian View Post
In a country were 'I want to be first, I am the best' mentality prevails on top of 90% of the road users mind, there is no way any of the older driving practices will exist..
Exactly my point! We are an impatient race of humans. These "rules" are terribly deep-rooted into us. When I had come to the UK for a short visit, was driving on my Indian license. It took me at least 3 days to understand that I can drive, but I am not a driver. I was not safe for other people. While in India, I thought, I could easily be one of the best drivers on the road.

Day 1. We know we flash the headlights, like in emergency or "I am the Alpha, I will go first" rule. I was on a narrow road with a car parked ahead on the left hand side, making the road even narrower. I thought, for a change, let me be courteous and give way to the oncoming traffic. Two cars passed, then the third one. I waited, I had time. I could see the fourth one coming, it slowed down and flashed. I was like, okay mate, I have time, you pass. He flashed again. I waited. After a 2-3 seconds, I gave up and moved on. All the way I was thinking, what a stupid person, he flashed and still waited. I had no doubt he was stupid.

Day 2. I was at a zebra crossing, which was not signaled. Now, as an Indian, I knew I would be risking my life if I step on to the zebra crossing, relying on the drivers on the road. So, I waited. With two cars on my left and 2 on the right waiting for me. Again, after 2-3 seconds, the one on the right flashed. I thought, ok mate, you go, you are in the car. Then he flashed again, and signaled me to cross at the same time (smiling - Please note). IMMEDIATE ENLIGHTENMENT. I was stupid.

Came back to India. Thought I will follow all the proper RULES. Now I properly take the roundabouts letting the ones on the right pass first. Letting the pedestrians cross first. Nutshell, I am more patient. But now, other people think I am stupid. At times, I get such looks, I feel I am actually stupid. Apt emoji. No pun.
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Old 2nd December 2015, 16:59   #21
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Default Re: Automotive Zeitgeist...or how older driving practices have changed today

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ironhood View Post

Came back to India. Thought I will follow all the proper RULES. Now I properly take the roundabouts letting the ones on the right pass first. Letting the pedestrians cross first. Nutshell, I am more patient. But now, other people think I am stupid. At times, I get such looks, I feel I am actually stupid. Apt emoji. No pun.
We have this joke in our office. There is a zebra crossing inside our campus while on the way out. During the rush hours there are some bikes and cars which stop and give way to the pedestrians first, some dont, some even honk and we christen the ones who stop as "onsite wapas"[Onsite return].

Last edited by saion666 : 2nd December 2015 at 17:00.
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Old 2nd December 2015, 17:00   #22
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Default Re: Automotive Zeitgeist...or how older driving practices have changed today

Right of way at roundabouts

At roundabouts, vehicles already negotiating the round about should be given way. Refer to http://delhigovt.nic.in/newdelhi/dep...ort/tr1a.asp#8

However, seldom is this followed. Having entered a roundabout, I have had to slow down/give way to speeding cars/bikes entering the roundabout! It seems that the mentality here is "if my car is bigger, then I have the right-of-way"
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Old 2nd December 2015, 17:14   #23
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Default Re: Automotive Zeitgeist...or how older driving practices have changed today

I am not sure if such a thing already exists, but can TeamBHP create an online document having guidelines of how to drive/ride properly? Simple stuff like 'stick to your lane while turning right'.

Better if it's in a format that can be shared on most social networks.
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Old 2nd December 2015, 17:19   #24
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Default Re: Automotive Zeitgeist...or how older driving practices have changed today

Superb article and a great find of the old manuals with hand signs.

The right indicator to pass has been one of the most dangerous things on high ways and I have always wondered who was the great person who invented this! It is very confusing and irritating , when people start doing this frequently, you are so stressed to understand and you lose the driving enthusiasm!

Hopefully RTO's get in some rules and teach people the right way.

There is lot to learn for drivers in India and I'm not sure how this can be educated to everyone, there should be some strict scrutiny before issuing a driving license - else I don't see a reason how people are going to learn to follow the rules.
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Old 2nd December 2015, 17:29   #25
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Default Re: Automotive Zeitgeist...or how older driving practices have changed today

Excellent thread SS-Traveller and nice articles. After going through them I have realised that I have evolved very little over the ages as far as adopting new driving style is concerned. There is one point mentioned that people found it easier to hold the steering at 10-2 position for non-power steering equipped vehicles. However, I used to drive an old amby during my initial years of driving and still used the 9-3 position. I still continue to use the 9-3 position except when driving go-karts.
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Old 2nd December 2015, 20:37   #26
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Default Re: Automotive Zeitgeist...or how older driving practices have changed today

Interesting to know all the various incidents happening around us. I'd like to share one from my side. Early mornings, or when there is no oncoming traffic, I patiently used to wait for my signal to turn green, while cars, buses etc zoom ahead. This is all fine in a car, but now that I frequently use a two wheeler, unless there are other people waiting at the signal I'm scared to stop. So I've improvised and now a days, if the signal is red, i take a left turn (usually its green at least in Vashi area) or try to use roads without signals if possible. Stopping at red signals is now a perilous affair. Either hit oncoming vehicles, or get hit by those who dont want to stop!
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Old 3rd December 2015, 10:00   #27
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Default Re: Automotive Zeitgeist...or how older driving practices have changed today

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheTeacher View Post
Samurai, spot on, +trillion! You describe the frustration I face every single day after having driven in the US for 22 years. Brinksmanship every step of the way, that is how driving is done here.

My understanding of the rules of driving in India are:

1) Whoever gets there first has right of way
2) Might is right (supplants #1)
3) There are no other rules

I am still surviving in one piece despite all this.
You are absolutely right! I believe my commute to office is the single most dangerous thing I do every day. I am in Gurgaon and there is a chowk here [Rajeev Chowk], which reminds me of a Tom Cruise fighter pilot scene. The pilot is looking at all o'clocks for the plane tailing him in a traning session. I feel just the same when I cross this chowk: vehicles are everywhere, and if you don't sight the one that is going to ram you, you are going to get it. No cheers!

And I also feel that I am now unsuited to drive in a civilized country, because my driving habits have changed for the worse. I overtake from the left if I have to--but seriously you are just left with no option at times.
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Old 3rd December 2015, 11:31   #28
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Default Re: Automotive Zeitgeist...or how older driving practices have changed today

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Originally Posted by SS-Traveller View Post
Traffic Signs

Traffic signage has undergone a sea change over the years.
Nice Thread.

I have been driving cars for 10 years and before that, I had a MCWG Licence for 4 years.
Till now I have not understood the following set of Traffic Signs

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Where ever I have read, I have read that any 'blue and white sign' is a mandatory thing. Which means we have no options.

Now what should I make of the above signs?
The first one says Mandatory Straight or Left!!! When it is Mandatory, why is there an option?

What is the need for the first three of those signs when we can use the following in their place?
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And whenever I find the last one, I laugh.
I find it at the beginning of many flyover ramps in Bangalore.
Should I split my vehicle into two and one goes over the ramp and the other below the ramp?

Can someone please explain these signs to me and how they came into being?

I had posted this question on the Bangalore Traffic Police facebook page long ago; the then commissioner had even replied that they would explain it later. Till today I have not got an answer!

Last edited by hemanth.anand : 3rd December 2015 at 11:35.
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Old 3rd December 2015, 12:03   #29
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Default Re: Automotive Zeitgeist...or how older driving practices have changed today

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Originally Posted by hemanth.anand View Post
Can someone please explain these signs to me and how they came into being?
This signage system has it's roots in UK signs although you will find them in most Commonwealth countries.

Blue & red circles are both signs that order a motorist to do something, the difference being that red circles are used to specify what NOT to do.

So from your example,

the first blue one says, motorists can either go straight or turn left

the second one says motorists can either go straight or turn right

the third one says, motorists have to turn left or right (e.g. at a T-junction)

the last one reads, motorists can either take the left or the right lane to reach the same destination.

The red ones you have shared mean the following:

No right turn

No left turn

No U-turn

No vehicular traffic allowed in the direction (e.g. a one way)


Hope this helps. attaching the general signage rules from the current UK handbook:

Automotive Zeitgeist...or how older driving practices have changed today-uktrafficsigns.png
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Old 3rd December 2015, 12:33   #30
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Default Re: Automotive Zeitgeist...or how older driving practices have changed today

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Originally Posted by outofthebox View Post
the third one says, motorists have to turn left or right (e.g. at a T-junction)
Thanks for your reply, but I know that blue sign tells me what I'm mandated to do and the red ones tell what not to do. That was not my question.

Mandatory means 'no option', so these 4 signs in question are not at all mandatory signs in the first place IMO because they give us an option!

In your own example, imagine we have these signs at a T-Junction. Now why do you want to tell people to take any of the two ways at a T junction when that's all they can do!

For the straight or left board, A simple example I can think of is a 4-road junction where taking right is not allowed.
Instead we can use 'Right turn prohibited' sign which conveys the same message.

So theses 4 signs look redundant to me as they convey the same thing that can be conveyed by existing signs.

Hence I want to know where they can be used to instruct something which can not be conveyed by other signs?
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