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Old 26th December 2015, 13:08   #301
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Default re: Delhi: Odd & Even numbered cars to drive on alternate days*Edit: website launched for feedback*

So, I cannot drive my car if I am going out with my family(of 5) in my Swift(which is designed to carry 5 thereby utilising the vehicle 100%) on an even day.

Wow! Just Wow!
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Old 26th December 2015, 15:23   #302
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One exempted category is vehicles carrying persons with medical emergency. Now who will finalise if a particular case is medical emergency or not? Poor traffic cop? Well, they have to have proper guidelines for these cases.
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Old 26th December 2015, 18:53   #303
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Default re: Delhi: Odd & Even numbered cars to drive on alternate days*Edit: website launched for feedback*

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Originally Posted by ajitstreet View Post
One exempted category is vehicles carrying persons with medical emergency. Now who will finalise if a particular case is medical emergency or not? Poor traffic cop? Well, they have to have proper guidelines for these cases.
How can there be a guideline for the above?

I see that the last few posts, people are just playing the role of armchair critic, criticizing anything and everything. The fact is that the air in Delhi right now is bad, very bad. And it is silently making your life shorter with each passing day. So we can all keep blaming the government and lack of infrastructure and keep knocking of overall life years from our lives, OR we can bear a bit ( or in some cases more) of inconvenience and try to take acute and long term steps to do something about it.

Honestly I feel that for starters the rules or proposals that have been put forward for this trial period are good enough. One can never please all. If at all, I would have rather preferred them to include two wheelers too in that list.

And finally, it is a project being run on a TRIAL basis. So there will be changes and modifications and fine tuning of the whole thing once they receive proper feedback. I would rather praise the government to have taken a bold step. Blaming them for not providing enough buses and Metro routes is just stupid since they have just come to power and these things would not change so fast.

If nothing else, then this trial project will atleast force a lot of people to try carpooling, either via apps like UBER or by tagging along colleagues and friends. Who knows if they might start finding it less cumbersome and more economical and easy than they had thought.

So buckle up and lets try to work together to improve the air quality. It is going to help all of us breathe!

Last edited by drmohitg : 26th December 2015 at 18:55.
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Old 26th December 2015, 19:46   #304
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Default re: Delhi: Odd & Even numbered cars to drive on alternate days*Edit: website launched for feedback*

I was watching news last evening and got to know that stickers of odd and even numbers are being sold all over Delhi. Sellers are also willing to design stickers in same font which is used to design other figures which are already there on the plate. Reversible plates are also being sold. Delhi government would face some real difficulties while checking them on road.

However people should realize that this is being done for the sake of their future generations. People should unite and boycott these ill activities and malpractice to ensure better future and life in Delhi.
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Old 26th December 2015, 20:59   #305
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Originally Posted by drmohitg View Post
I see that the last few posts, people are just playing the role of armchair critic, criticizing anything and everything.
Well, I stay in NCR and my hospital is 25 km from my home. Metro is good 20 km from my place. I visit hospital (with my better half and baby) almost every week. And from my place neither Uber nor any other apps provide services. So the impact of the rules are real for me, even if it is initially for 15 days only. Perhaps if need arises, I shall be in a queue to explain the traffic cops about my medical urgency.

Air pollution in Delhi has reached unbelievable level and it needs urgent and well planned action--and not half-baked, haphazard action.

A better course of action to deal with air pollution would have been to expand the Metro quickly, start more DTC buses, create better public transport infrastructure, increases taxes on buying more than one vehicle, implement the PUC norms strictly, tax vehicles in proportion to their pollution they create, hike the parking rate and the list goes on.

But these decisions are hard decisions and our politicians, like the voters, love playing to the gallery.
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Old 26th December 2015, 22:13   #306
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Default re: Delhi: Odd & Even numbered cars to drive on alternate days*Edit: website launched for feedback*

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Originally Posted by ajitstreet View Post

A better course of action to deal with air pollution would have been to expand the Metro quickly, start more DTC buses, create better public transport infrastructure, increases taxes on buying more than one vehicle, implement the PUC norms strictly, tax vehicles in proportion to their pollution they create, hike the parking rate and the list goes on.
Add provding 24/7 power to this list. Why govt cant simply do that? There'd be hundreds of thousands of generators belching smoke in air in the city. Entire markets run on electricity from gensets. So do cell towers, so many power backups and what nots. Here in Bangalore its not unusual for us to be on power backup for 8 hours on days and at least 3-4hours everyday is quite the norm. Govt can mandate going totally solar in all its establishments and incentivize private concerns as well to adopt solar power. These are the "hard" decisions that can show visible changes very fast. But then, all hardships are to be borne by aam people, they are not for the govt.
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Old 27th December 2015, 00:05   #307
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Default re: Delhi: Odd & Even numbered cars to drive on alternate days*Edit: website launched for feedback*

I had been to an IGL pump in the afternoon. They say that there is no information on the so called "STICKERS" which they are supposed to provide to the vehicles plying on CNG.
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Old 27th December 2015, 02:46   #308
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Default re: Delhi: Odd & Even numbered cars to drive on alternate days*Edit: website launched for feedback*

Well do you think only today the Delhi Pollution has gone worse, before this it was great? Government should have thought about it before hand rather than pressing the PANIC button.
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Old 28th December 2015, 13:19   #309
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I was contemplating booking an XUV 500 for a short spin to murthal on the 4th of January from zoom car. Just wanted to know if self drive rentals are exempted or should I specifically ask them for an even numbered car?
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Old 28th December 2015, 14:11   #310
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Default re: Delhi: Odd & Even numbered cars to drive on alternate days*Edit: website launched for feedback*

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Originally Posted by bking View Post
I was contemplating booking an XUV 500 for a short spin to murthal on the 4th of January from zoom car. Just wanted to know if self drive rentals are exempted or should I specifically ask them for an even numbered car?
Better safe than sorry. While you might be aware of the fine print but not all cops would be and if there's an option of getting an even-numbered car then please do so.

EDIT: My Plan A is to get to office by 8AM and use the evening time to hit the office gym and then leave office by 8PM. Plan B is to stay at my sister's in-laws who reside extremely close to my office in Cyber city for the 5 days when I'd not be allowed to take my car to Delhi.

Last edited by fine69 : 28th December 2015 at 14:20.
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Old 28th December 2015, 18:14   #311
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Default re: Delhi: Odd & Even numbered cars to drive on alternate days*Edit: website launched for feedback*

OMG, I just saw in news (Times of India - fight happening internally between police and AAP) that VOLUNTEERS who are NOT part of Police force are also being pulled up for implementing the law. So that means any goon/thug/robber, dressed himself as "I am Volunteer" can stop a car and loot the car and escape !!!

This is the most unfortunate situation people have to face in the world !! When RTO was stopping cars in Bangalore for "out of Karnataka" road tax raid, they used some EXTERNAL PEOPLE/SUPPORTERS and Waseem Memon (the person behind "DRIVE WITHOUT BORDERS") highlighted it to press/higher officials and they were immediately pulled out. But here government itself is giving approval for the same?

Is this entire stupidity being spearheaded by AAP ? If so, I have totally lost the respect I had for them. !!!

And someone in Delhi, pl escalate this and force government not to use external "Volunteers".

Last edited by petrol_power : 28th December 2015 at 18:18.
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Old 29th December 2015, 09:03   #312
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To sum up the odd-even formula is being criticised for following reasons:

1. Too many exemptions may not practically help mitigate pollution woes.
2. Such experiments have failed in other countries as people have tried to find a work around like buying a cheaper ( and more polluting) second car.
3. Fake registration and number plates scam.
4. Implementation problems due to shortage of staff and many exemptions.
5. No incentive for buying a cleaner vehicle.
6. Lack of adequate public transport will add to chaos.
7. Little coordination with neighbouring state govts (though the odd-even rule will be applicable to vehicles entering Delhi from other States).
8. Haphazard, half-baked and short-term measures.
9. We hardly have any reliable data about factors contributing to pollution in Delhi/NCR.
10. Violates "polluter pays" principle as the restriction is blanket.
11. Auto/taxi wala may charge exorbitant fare during the period.

The other side is:

1. High pollution level demands such drastic measures.
2. The 15 day experiment should be given a chance to succeed.
3. Will certainly help reducing pollution and congestion as the number of vehicles on road will reduce.
4. Will help people go for car pooling/public transport.
5. The policy will at least start the debate on rising level of pollution and the ways to deal with it.
6. The rant against the policy is mainly from the privileged middle class ( not aam janta!) which don't want the slightest discomfort to their lifestyle.

Last edited by ajitstreet : 29th December 2015 at 09:12.
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Old 29th December 2015, 12:18   #313
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Default re: Delhi: Odd & Even numbered cars to drive on alternate days*Edit: website launched for feedback*

Quote:
Originally Posted by ajitstreet View Post
The rant against the policy is mainly from the privileged middle class ( not aam janta!) which don't want the slightest discomfort to their lifestyle.
Very valid point!
The data on number of vehicles per capita of 2011 says India has 18 motor vehicles per 1000 people. So, the people who cringe about this rule are the privileged 1.8% of the entire population in this country, and this number also includes commercial vehicles, not just cars.
(I agree there is an explosion of vehicle growth from 2011 to 2015, but still less than 5% of the population would own cars).
Here on Team-BHP nearly 100% would own cars, but that is just us. Will this law cause discomfort to some of us? Yes! But we should probably change our timings or plans to suit the need. There is an exclusion supported in case of any emergencies. All other urgencies (such as no direct bus to office) can be handled with a little better planning, extra time and some patience over a little discomfort.
Thanks for bringing this point up, mate!
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Old 29th December 2015, 12:24   #314
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Default re: Delhi: Odd & Even numbered cars to drive on alternate days*Edit: website launched for feedback*

This will fail in the long run for obvious reasons - but there would be positive results in the shorter run.

I don't find any weight in the criticism that there were better ways to curb pollution. Just because there are better ways doesn't make this one bad. Delhi's air quality is bad. B-A-D. Even stricter measures are required to be brought in to make this stupid city livable. Of course, better and more efficient ways are required to fight this effectively. But we need time until then. What better policies can be there? Do we just let it get worse until those come in?

Some news channels are opposing this with the argument that factories, etc. are contribute more to pollution than vehicles, and thus this policy is stupid. NO! Just because someone else is doing something wrong does not mean you have a defense! Of course, they need to be stopped as well - but that does not allow you to ruin life for everyone else. This is a different version of argument used by people when stopped by cops, "look even he is without helmet". NO. JUST NO. That's not how it works.

Personally I have disliked Aam Aadmi Party from the very beginning, and most of its policies have been stupid (not that it's a topic of discussion here); but this, I support. Saying this only so that others do not judge me to be an irrational political supporter.

Someone mentioned why the panic button was pushed by the government. Because High Court asked the govt. what is being done regarding this, and they just had to do whatever possible. Panic buttons are what are used in situations as extreme as these. It might be wrong, sure, but something needs to be done.

About fake number plates, well, I hope those using them get caught as soon as they do it. Obviously severe legal consequences must follow (and will, if they get caught - both, under IPC as well as MVA). But of course, none of these should come from private persons or volunteers. The State only should be allowed to infringe someone else's liberties. if a private person is allowed to penalize me, I sure am allowed to penalize him. What results? Anarchy. Oh well, let's not go there given the current government.

Again, of course, better and stricter norms against pollution need to be present. Inconvenience to public is no defense to this. Why should your comfort of sitting in an air conditioned car be given more importance than my necessity of breathing clean air?

Quote:
Originally Posted by hybridpetrol View Post
Very valid point!
The data on number of vehicles per capita of 2011 says India has 18 motor vehicles per 1000 people. So, the people who cringe about this rule are the privileged 1.8% of the entire population in this country, and this number also includes commercial vehicles, not just cars.
(I agree there is an explosion of vehicle growth from 2011 to 2015, but still less than 5% of the population would own cars).
You are taking all-India data and applying it for Delhi. The 'vehicles per capita' will obviously be way more than all India.

EDIT: And lack of implementation is no critique either. Just because it is not possible to completely enforce something does not mean nothing should be done. Just because all murderers are not caught doesn't mean no laws should apply to those who are caught. Implementation is different than policies. Do not mix the two when criticizing. A proper criticism of this policy would be to cite some statistics and reasons from Mexico and why it failed there. Everything else stated above is no reason to have a polluted city.

Last edited by N.A.GTC : 29th December 2015 at 12:53.
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Old 29th December 2015, 14:04   #315
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Default re: Delhi: Odd & Even numbered cars to drive on alternate days*Edit: website launched for feedback*

Quote:
Originally Posted by hybridpetrol View Post
Very valid point!
The data on number of vehicles per capita of 2011 says India has 18 motor vehicles per 1000 people. So, the people who cringe about this rule are the privileged 1.8% of the entire population in this country, and this number also includes commercial vehicles, not just cars.
(I agree there is an explosion of vehicle growth from 2011 to 2015, but still less than 5% of the population would own cars).
Here on Team-BHP nearly 100% would own cars, but that is just us. Will this law cause discomfort to some of us? Yes! But we should probably change our timings or plans to suit the need. There is an exclusion supported in case of any emergencies. All other urgencies (such as no direct bus to office) can be handled with a little better planning, extra time and some patience over a little discomfort.
Thanks for bringing this point up, mate!
I don't get this. So I am privileged class. 30% of my income is taxed. On that I pay 14.5% service tax on every transaction I make. The tax on the fuel I buy is 50%. On top of that, if I still manage to save and scrounge and buy a car then you tell me that I should be okay for using it only for half the time. Mind you, the Delhi government did tax me all of the road tax not just 50% of it.

What is this tripe on greater good? Where is the public transport to support this greater good? The government can't even provide enough public transport for those who want to use it, and now it wants to make more people use something that is hardly adequate?

What is the alternative to a car in India? Have you ever tried to find public transport in Gurgaon? What if you need to commute from Gurgaon to Connaught Place? How am I supposed to travel from my home in Gurgaon to a metro station or a bus stop?

Did I, the privileged class, ever say I will not spend more money to buy a BS-V compliant vehicle? The government dilly dallies in making pollution norms stricter. The RTAs provide fitness certificates as per their whims and fancies. But then I am the one causing pollution. When will the government own up and say they messed up? That from now on only BS-V vehicles will be sold. From now on, no one will be able to register a diesel car in Delhi? From now on, PUC will no longer be a sham?

This is the weasel way of doing things. They will try this. It will fail. They will blame everyone from Central Government to Delhi Police. And then they will say we can't do it because we are not getting the support.

Let us at least not say that it is okay since this affects only 1.8% of the population. Injustice is still injustice. It is like saying that only 2% of innocent people are behind bars. No it is not okay.
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