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Old 28th November 2006, 16:25   #31
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Originally Posted by suman View Post
I don't know why we are going on about crumple zones.....MOST modern day cars in this segment have crumple zones. I think what we are pointing out is that the sheet metal used in the Honda City is probably not as tough as one would have expected - why is that so difficult to acknowledge? And if a 9 lacs plus car "self destructs" on hitting a bike, well I for one am glad I've not bought one!

Someone was talking about Lancers & Fiestas "bouncing back" after hitting objects & bikers dying & car occupants safe etc etc - is that what a crumple zones is supposed to do, protect the riders/occupants of the vehicle being hit? !!!!!!
Well my dear friend if honda uses thicker sheet metal then it would not have a crumple zone. Also you are not paying 9 lakhs for a battle tank. You are paying it for a car which is relatively quick, economical and safe for everybody (occupants and non occupants). And do you have any idea how much momentum a bike with 2 people onboard will have travelling at 50 - 60kmph (assuming the bike had time to slow down a little before impact)? The reason Honda and any other verhicle will use thin sheets is so that it crumples. And lastly yes a crumple zone is supposed to protect rider/occupants of the vehicle being hit.
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Old 28th November 2006, 16:48   #32
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Well my dear friend if honda uses thicker sheet metal then it would not have a crumple zone
Really? How do you arrive at that conclusion, what is the accepted threshold of the sheet metal (in terms of gauge) for it to conform to crumple zone standards? So all the other manufacturers are defrauding the public by having thicker sheet metal & no crumple zones?

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Originally Posted by vikram_d View Post
Also you are not paying 9 lakhs for a battle tank. You are paying it for a car which is relatively quick, economical and safe for everybody (occupants and non occupants).
The last bit is what I'm questioning after seeing the state of the car; remember the accident was not mid-ship so its pure conjecture on whether anything would have happened to the cabin or not had the impact been with a larger vehicle

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Originally Posted by vikram_d View Post
The reason Honda and any other verhicle will use thin sheets is so that it crumples.
You seem to have missed the point completely. I'm saying that ALL modern cars have crumple zones but I haven't seen too many of the others disintegrate (or "self destruct" lol!!) the way the Honda City does. So.......I'm questioning whether Honda uses the acceptable gauge of sheet metal or thinner stuff

Quote:
Originally Posted by vikram_d View Post
And lastly yes a crumple zone is supposed to protect rider/occupants of the vehicle being hit.
Again, point missed....example given was Fiesta or Lancer hitting a bike (not vice versa) & bike riders getting killed becaue of "tough" metal of the cars & (supposedly) no crumple zones. In your mind, who is the crumple zone supposed to protect (and please don't say "both")?? I would think the car manufacturer would have it protect the car occupants in the event of the impact, not the bikers?????

Last edited by suman : 28th November 2006 at 16:49.
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Old 28th November 2006, 16:51   #33
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Honda has one of the best pedestrian safety standards. Thats the reason you see them "crumble".
This wont affect the safety of the people inside the car, but the guy outside has more chance of survival. The only downside is cost of repairs after such a shunt will be much more for a Honda due to pedestrian safety, but then human life is more important!
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Old 28th November 2006, 18:18   #34
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1. There is no hard & fast rule which says that this is the crumple threshold. The threshold is decided on by the manufacturer who design the vehicle to crumple at impacts equal to or higher than a point upto which they think is acceptable. Maybe Honda has decicded to design their vehicles to crumple at lower speed impacts also.
2. No the other manufacturers are not defrauding the public. They only choose to design their vehicle in such a way that it crumples at a higher impact load. Fiestas and Lancers will crumple at a higher speed impact and maybe not as low as that of a Honda.
3. And as tsk1979 has put it Honda also has the best pedestrian safety standards. Hence the need for thinner sheets.

You can read more about it here.

Kelley Blue Book - Automotive Tools • Tips • Advice

Making Cars Safer for Pedestrians -- Road & Travel Magazine

Honda Worldwide | Safety

The third link is from a Honda website so it might be partial in your opinion.

Last edited by vikram_d : 28th November 2006 at 18:32. Reason: Added links
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Old 28th November 2006, 18:50   #35
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Let's see the fun, where insurer's detariff and premiums are valued based on cost of repair
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Old 28th November 2006, 19:09   #36
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http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/techni...liability.html (Shell Reliability)

Mr.Rudra had given me an explanation on thickness of gauge used in cars. (don't know how to attach his reply alone, hence attaching the thread)

Is there a solid car (like palio) which equally fare against HONDA in terms of safety? or you can achieve Honda level of safety by constructing the body with lesser gauge sheets. I felt that lesser gauge sheet are used to keep the weight off & achieve more FE

Last edited by Surprise : 28th November 2006 at 19:12.
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Old 29th November 2006, 10:56   #37
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Woah..small world....Just saw this thread, I saw your car almost immedeately after the accident happenned.....Based on the damage on your car, I thought you had hit the pole in the traffic island or another car........

Thats terrible damage to your car, just glad your friend and you are safe.....
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Old 29th November 2006, 11:24   #38
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Originally Posted by IndianDawg View Post
in the end i have came to know that i dont need LC for the insurance claim so.. now my car is @ the workshop of honda which is located at lal baug..!!

i'll be going der 2moro...and sort the things out with them...

-----

Edit: why my car is so damaged and pulsar isnt that damaged compared to honda city ...? i mean look at the damage...its like totally screwed man...and a pulsar at 100kmph didnt had a small dent...only the steering and yes there were many problems but when it comes to body part why my car is so damaged?
That guy got hospitalised- his bike survived without more than a scratch; your car took a hit and you got off unhurt. What more do you expect? These new cars take a lot of damage and protect the passengers. So be happy.
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Old 29th November 2006, 17:46   #39
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i had told honda to make a list of damage parts and tell me the estimation of loss of damage parts and all comes to like Rs.2 lakhs and says the engine (vtec) is absolutly fine..!! but also said the list may go ahead because they need to cut down few parts and check which they cant right now unless and until the insurance guy checks out the car ..!!

lets hope for the good..!!
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Old 4th December 2006, 23:35   #40
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if a motorcycle can fold up Honda so much imagine what another car, truck or bus would do? they will probably crumple City past the passenger compartment and all the way back up to the trunk. So much for Honda technology, thank you. and some guys blindly keep parroting Honda advantage. All cars have crumple zones but i have never seen any car being damaged so much a bike. i saw a speeding bike crash head on into a tiny M 800. the biker died and not much happened to M 800. I also saw an Ikon leave road at 140 kph and hit a tree. the tree was uprooted by ikon's impact, the ikon made 2 /3 rolls and when it stopped, the driver just stumbled out with just a bleeding nose. of course he was belted in but still. a H City in its place would have opened up like a soda can, i think.
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Old 5th December 2006, 06:26   #41
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Originally Posted by pgsagar View Post
I also saw an Ikon leave road at 140 kph and hit a tree. the tree was uprooted by ikon's impact, the ikon made 2 /3 rolls and when it stopped, the driver just stumbled out with just a bleeding nose. of course he was belted in but still. a H City in its place would have opened up like a soda can, i think.
How do you know the Ikon was doing 140 kph? Honda is known world wide for its safety standards. Yes the damage does seem like a lot on this City but considering the fact that the bike was travlling at speed with two people on it the combined mass and the momentum is huge. You should keep in mind that this is an offset crash which has a greater impact on the body shell as the force is distributed in a relatively small area of the car. Had these bikers hit some other car like a Mahindra jeep they would have had serious injuries or may have died.

The Pulsar has a broken T Stem. The handle bars have snapped clean from its mounting. This is one of the strongest part of the chassis.
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Old 9th December 2006, 23:45   #42
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Yusha! It's strange that Nh City suffered so much damage after being hit by a bike and you are offering so much explanation about weight and momentum of the bike. Boss this is not the first time a bike has crashed into a car. I wrote a bike crashed into a M800 and the bike rider died. May be Honda Citys are designed to protect erring bike riders. How thoughtful of Honda. Please do not forget to collect 4 lakh NH City repair costs from the biker. I'm sure he would gladly pay that because your grand NH City just saved his life. LOL!!!!
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Old 10th December 2006, 00:49   #43
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i saw a nhc zx acouple of days ago. it was standing at a red light and there was a traffic jam behind it, when i got closer what i saw was similar to the car in the first post.

the nhc was hit by a 800 from behind ,then the nhc banged into a scooter which was in front of it and guess what the nhc got ripped badly ,looked like the incredible hulk had taken his anger
out on it

the bonnet was almost touching the front windshield and the back was totally gone but the damage to the 800 was just a broken bumper and the scooter had a broken tail lamp.!!!

crumble shrumble whatever the damage to the nhc was just too much ,as a owner of a zx myself now i am extra carefull while driving coz one wrong move and ill have to declare bancruptcy
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Old 10th December 2006, 01:10   #44
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Its not that bad @faithless, have faith in your car.

Last edited by rahul_intlad : 10th December 2006 at 01:28.
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Old 10th December 2006, 10:14   #45
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**** that is really bad...
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