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Old 29th December 2008, 14:36   #46
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Originally Posted by aaggoswami View Post
How in the dark they can come to know that a person is not surrendering or has slowed down ?
So are the NSG trained to see in darkness and then shoot, and in Mumbai it was by chance they caught one person alive,right ? This would be update for me.
Seriously, i can't believe you are even asking this question! It was dark, not pitch dark and zero visibility. you can still see a silhouette in the dark and can realize if the suspect has slowed down or speeded up... Also, as vikram said, you put your hands up when you surrender. Even the action of the mobile phone... if he is putting his hand in his pocket to take out or put the mobile back, the very act can be construed as reaching for a gun.

NSG commandos are not trained to see in the dark (they are not owls). They react better in poor visibility than other personnel. And i don't understand why they are being brought into discussion here. It was the regular armed patrol of the military police that did the firing.

About the fact that the mumbai terrorist being captured alive. READ THE FACTS first on how it happened. He pretended to surrender and then shot a policeman at point blank range. 5 bullets. Constable ombale after being shot, held on the the barrel of the gun and fell on kasab and then the other cops rushed and neutralized the terrorist. So i don't think anyone will take such a chance in the future.
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Old 29th December 2008, 14:38   #47
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I fully support the army's actions. Actually, this (The shooting) should have been done by the police. May seem harsh, but that is the reality in the law and order enforcement world.

The police does have the powers to cause grievous injury AND even death in course of apprehending suspect persons of certain (not all) offences. Especially when the person is asked to surrender and refuses to do so.
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Old 29th December 2008, 14:40   #48
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Its just another chase and a case horribly gone wrong.

Anyone getting into army campus is simply termed a intruder, this was his right fate.

That chap had already lost his sense, and its his fate which he met that day.

Based on the present scenario around,The Army guys have done the right thing,

We can only feel sorry for that young chap, may his soul REST IN PEACE.

Last edited by PAVAN KADAM : 29th December 2008 at 14:45.
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Old 29th December 2008, 14:55   #49
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The times we live in now is what is to be blamed. Its futile to fix the blame. It was a very unfortunate incident and a young guy lost his life. RIP.
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Old 29th December 2008, 15:10   #50
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IMHO I think its high time we all members of Team Bhp try and educate all the youngsters about street drag racing. If we can convince them to be safe and not do it especially between 11pm to 3-4am on our city roads, it will be great.

Speed is great, but you should know that with speed too comes other problems. Lets try and get a MNC like CAstrol or any other automotive company to organise official drag races each year with all the safety requirements and police permissions met.

Invite parents too a drag race, to show them how it is correctly done and not on the city roads at unearthly hours. Encourage their kids to stop when asked by the police. Also parents must make sure that their kids are not out drag racing in the night. Safety is the most important issue. Drag Racing on city roads is banned and the cops have every right to stop you.

I can imagine how the guy's parent must be feeling! Wish they never had bought a bike for him!
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Old 29th December 2008, 15:10   #51
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The Army guard was patient with him for nearly an hour.
What should we expect ? Wait till dawn ??!!
Atlleast we will have a safe new years eve
this year with these drag racers out of public roads.

Someone earlier talked about giving drag racers
a controlled environment. Trust me, most of them
are out on the public roads for showing off and
not to test their machines with others.
A controlled environment would reduce
usage of public roads for drag racing by
not much.
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Old 29th December 2008, 15:11   #52
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Lack of awareness?

How many of us knew that the army has full rights to shoot us to death if we trespass? I certainly didnt know that they will kill. The poor chap had no idea that he will be shot down to death if he didn't surrender.

I think they could have probably shot his leg instead of killing him outright.

I feel sorry for his family.
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Old 29th December 2008, 15:13   #53
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Gopz - According to reports they fired 3 warning shots in the air. Is that not enough?
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Old 29th December 2008, 15:19   #54
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We are beginning to sound like one of the TV news channels who in hindsight analyze everything to what XYZ should have done on a cricket field to how a Commando should have entered through the rear door, than through the window of XYZ wing of Taj. Come on, life isn't so easy. We aren't playing video games, are we?

It's not that the guard took some pleasure in shooting a road racer. The guard would care two hoots as to what the boy did on the roads. His problem was that there was an intruder in Army territory and I'm sure all Army areas are on high alert these days.

Sad that the boy had to pay with his life, but the fact is that people who live dangerously can't hope to be lucky all their life. I couldn't believe the TOI, Bangalore report today which said boys take to street racing because they don't have race tracks in Bangalore!

There is a lesson in this for each one of us. Just be a passive spectator on the road side and watch the traffic. You realize what kind of risks people take just to get from point A to point B, without thinking of the consequences. Is it worth losing one's life and leaving behind a family in a miserable state?

Last edited by CBlazer : 29th December 2008 at 15:25.
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Old 29th December 2008, 15:26   #55
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sitting in a chair and critisizing the soldier for shooting him is unfair - just like the arm-chair cricket critics who spout advice after a loss.

i fully support the action of the security guard.

if the guy was really a terrorist/suicide bomber and was not shot at, i am sure the media and certain members here would go to town critisizing the security men for not doing their job.

i also wish the cops would use the gun against the street racers, atleast to shoot at and disable the vehicles.
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Old 29th December 2008, 15:32   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prithvi View Post
IMHO I think its high time we all members of Team Bhp try and educate all the youngsters about street drag racing. If we can convince them to be safe and not do it especially between 11pm to 3-4am on our city roads, it will be great.

Speed is great, but you should know that with speed too comes other problems. Lets try and get a MNC like CAstrol or any other automotive company to organise official drag races each year with all the safety requirements and police permissions met.

Invite parents too a drag race, to show them how it is correctly done and not on the city roads at unearthly hours. Encourage their kids to stop when asked by the police. Also parents must make sure that their kids are not out drag racing in the night. Safety is the most important issue. Drag Racing on city roads is banned and the cops have every right to stop you.

I can imagine how the guy's parent must be feeling! Wish they never had bought a bike for him!
Yes you are right. Some positive attitude. Otherwise also, as individual, if we can keep on convincing kids and their parents about evils on roads, there would be some benefit.
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Old 29th December 2008, 15:37   #57
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Security agencies get blasted if they dont act and also again get blasted if they do.
No one has permission to trespass into private property right?

Well may the boys soul RIP. Please lets close this discussion. Its the times we are living in that such actions happened. Some security measures are taken for people to feel protected and people also should adhere to these measures.
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Old 29th December 2008, 15:38   #58
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I strongly feel its the responsibility of each and every parent to educate their kids not to take chances at least with law-enforcers. I feel in this case the boy took to his heels due to the fear of getting caught and being able to answer his parents or something similar.

If not he would have dared to stop and face the consequence (a mere fine would have got him out).
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Old 29th December 2008, 15:47   #59
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Easy to sit back and write about various options and all that.

At these high risk times, imagine being the army personal and there is a guy who refuses to surrender and keeps talking over a phone and it is 1am. Will you wait for him to come down to you at his leisure and hand over his visiting card or what?

As I said, to write anything about anything is the easiest thing to do.

And whats the guys age - 20 years. Does he not have the slightest sense of what to do and what not? Pushing your luck with a military person on night patrol on his grounds was not the smartest thing.

Feel sorry for his family for the loss they have to bear for his stupidity!!!
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Old 29th December 2008, 16:26   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tejas@perioimpl View Post

NSG commandos are not trained to see in the dark (they are not owls). They react better in poor visibility than other personnel. And i don't understand why they are being brought into discussion here. It was the regular armed patrol of the military police that did the firing.
I agree with that on top of that they are not even given the required equipment.

If our Marcos and NSG are not given proper nightvision units, where will normal military police get it from?

As far as I know, the local police have no jurisdiction in a military area, that could be why the dude jumped over a wall into the military camp [or infiltrated it as far as the military is concerned].
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