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Old 5th August 2009, 19:09   #46
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The problem is we are ill equipped in our brains to do necessary things before doing something good like this.
Alternate arrangements should now be made and ban all movement inside forests.

I also see a lot of animals (elephants that too) getting killed in North Karnataka near Dandeli. I dont know why its not taken up. The NGOs and like do not raise their voices for this region.
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Old 6th August 2009, 09:37   #47
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Originally Posted by shankar.balan View Post
The other way to handle this is to completely ban all public transport and heavy lorry, tourist van, tourist bus type traffic on this stretch and only allow private cars, vans and LMV's through while at the same time implementing the construction of proper, banked speed breakers at intervals of every half km on the entire stretch of road. Plus - there should be a fine of 25000/- PLUS 7 years rigorous imprisonment without the option of bail, for every idiot who litters the jungle with food packets, bottles and whatnot. For every idiot tourist van which stops in the sanctuary for its inmates to leap around, drink, dance and picnic, there should be a fine of Rs 50,000/- per offender and 10 years of rigorous imprisonment.

I fail to understand the logic behind this,

1. Completely cutting off all public transport will put the general public to immense difficulty. During the weekends irrespective of the fact that 8 buses ply this road in the night, it is very difficult to get a seat. During long weekends these tickets are sold for almost triple the cost in the black market.
This would also be a move against the common public. A minimum of 750 people travel by public transport during the weekend from Bangalore to the Nilgiris.

2. Private cars, LMVs offer more damage in all aspects that the public transport,
a. If you travel by public transport there is lesser chance to get off in the middle of the forest. Private car travelers can do so.
b. You cannot smoke in a public transport and throw the butt into the forest. Private car travelers can do so.
c You cannot get off the bus to pee, wander or picnic in the forest. Private car travelers can do so.
d. Normally buses don't stop to sight see or watch wild animals, private car travelers can do so.
e. The speed of the buses are normally within 60 kms and the KSRTC buses even have speed limiters fitted.

3. Speed breakers as suggested by KANS for every 1/2 km is one of the worst suggestions. This goes to prove that if there is a large number of people with a common idea anything is possible against public interest.
This will consume more fuel and more damage to the eco system. Why cant you think on these lines.
Speed guns and heavy penalty should be imposed and this is a more practical solution.

As shankar.balan suggest heavy penalty needs to be imposed for every act. This is the only solution.
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Old 6th August 2009, 10:26   #48
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4. It is sensible for the environment to use public transport than traveling by private.

I have seen on these roads that the public transport vehicles and some lorries maintain high discipline rather than private cars. They drive on low beam and at least try to respect some basic rules unlike the unruly tourist who wants to picnic at every possible corner.
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Old 6th August 2009, 11:58   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beejay View Post
2. Private cars, LMVs offer more damage in all aspects that the public transport,
a. If you travel by public transport there is lesser chance to get off in the middle of the forest. Private car travelers can do so.
b. You cannot smoke in a public transport and throw the butt into the forest. Private car travelers can do so.
c You cannot get off the bus to pee, wander or picnic in the forest. Private car travelers can do so.
d. Normally buses don't stop to sight see or watch wild animals, private car travelers can do so.
e. The speed of the buses are normally within 60 kms and the KSRTC buses even have speed limiters fitted.

Speed guns and heavy penalty should be imposed and this is a more practical solution.
Quote:
Originally Posted by beejay View Post
4. It is sensible for the environment to use public transport than traveling by private.

I have seen on these roads that the public transport vehicles and some lorries maintain high discipline rather than private cars. They drive on low beam and at least try to respect some basic rules unlike the unruly tourist who wants to picnic at every possible corner.
Maybe you are sensible enough to use public transport. But what about others who drive their own vehicles? The points you make comparing private vehicles to public transport are very much valid . Also, putting speed breakers every 1/2 a km is not at all practical, but then installing speed guns & laying heavy fines is a distant dream. The government will never invest in such infrastructure where there are no votes.

Also please note that KSRTC is not the only one plying buses on that route. There are a hell lot of private buses travelling towards Kerala. I have seen these many private buses driving like maniacs.

Just 2-3 days back a chital was hit by a vehicle. A case was filed against the vehicle owner and the person is out on bail. (today's Times of India, Bangalore)

The main aim of banning traffic inside the National Park is to reduce the number of roadkills by speeding vehicles and to facilitate free movement of animals within the forest. But, since we Indians have scant regard for rules & limits, it has become necessary to implement a total ban on movement of vehicles at night.

The damage has already been done and this ban will only help in a small way in moving the wildlife towards normalcy. But, it is better than doing nothing, isn't it??

Quote:
This goes to prove that if there is a large number of people with a common idea anything is possible against public interest.
If this was the case, Indian wildlife would be thriving. Your statement definitely does not hold good in case of wildlife or other environmental issues.


PS: If I am not wrong, the earlier order allowed govt buses & vehicles of emergency services to travel through the park. I think the same status remains
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Old 6th August 2009, 12:42   #50
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Originally Posted by addyhemmige View Post
Maybe you are sensible enough to use public transport. But what about others who drive their own vehicles? The points you make comparing private vehicles to public transport are very much valid . Also, putting speed breakers every 1/2 a km is not at all practical, but then installing speed guns & laying heavy fines is a distant dream. The government will never invest in such infrastructure where there are no votes.

Also please note that KSRTC is not the only one plying buses on that route. There are a hell lot of private buses travelling towards Kerala. I have seen these many private buses driving like maniacs.


Just 2-3 days back a chital was hit by a vehicle. A case was filed against the vehicle owner and the person is out on bail. (today's Times of India, Bangalore)

The main aim of banning traffic inside the National Park is to reduce the number of roadkills by speeding vehicles and to facilitate free movement of animals within the forest. But, since we Indians have scant regard for rules & limits, it has become necessary to implement a total ban on movement of vehicles at night.

The damage has already been done and this ban will only help in a small way in moving the wildlife towards normalcy. But, it is better than doing nothing, isn't it??

If this was the case, Indian wildlife would be thriving. Your statement definitely does not hold good in case of wildlife or other environmental issues.


PS: If I am not wrong, the earlier order allowed govt buses & vehicles of emergency services to travel through the park. I think the same status remains
I am sensible enough to use my private vehicle and I use the same on these ghats. My point was to validate the fact that there should be no bias for public and private vehicles. Rules need to apply to all in same context, if it is implemented. Why does the common man have to suffer.

The private buses divert from Gundalpet, from Ooty there are hardly any private buses, none to be exact. Only 4 maxi cabs ply these routes. I have never seen any doing more than 80 primary reason being it would fall apart if they tried to.

I wish to drive home the point that, you need to be aware that I am for anything and everything that will help maintain the sanctity of the sanctuary, however it is absurd that at times even activist with genuine intentions fail to see the interest of the common public.

The Government will not loose out on the vote bank for imposing penalties on violators, rather it would be seen as a welcome sign by many.

The chital was hit by a car.

Last edited by beejay : 6th August 2009 at 12:59.
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Old 6th August 2009, 13:10   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beejay View Post
I am sensible enough to use my private vehicle and I use the same on these ghats. My point was to validate the fact that there should be no bias for public and private vehicles. Rules need to apply to all in same context, if it is implemented. Why does the common man have to suffer.
That is what I was trying to tell here. There should not be a bias for public or private vehicles. That is why a total ban should be welcomed.

Quote:
The private buses divert from Gundalpet, from Ooty there are hardly any private buses, none to be exact. Only 4 maxi cabs ply these routes. I have never seen any doing more than 80 primary reason being it would fall apart if they tried to.
These private buses divert at Gundlupet and enter the National park at Maddur and go via Muthanga Wildlife Sanctuary (Kerala). Traffic is very high on this route. I understand that the Mudumalai route has very little traffic compared to the Muthanga. But, you can't block one route and open the other. The reason is that these private vehicles will take the Mudumalai route to go to Kerala via Gudalur if it is blocked. Hence the ban on both the routes would be better.

Quote:
I wish to drive home the point that, you need to be aware that I am for anything and everything that will help maintain the sanctity of the sanctuary, however it is absurd that at times even activist with genuine intentions fail to see the interest of the common public.
Come on beejay, I am not at all doubting your intentions here. There are and will be pros and cons to anything and everything. We just have to discuss that.
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Old 6th August 2009, 14:50   #52
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they can create a law saying Heavy Penalty of Rs 50000/- fine PLUS imprisonment etc - however, what really matters is the Enforcement of the Law.
In India where one can get away by paying a few bucks to the poor forest guard, this will never happen.
Also, in our country, life is regarded as cheap - Human lives themselves are not given the same respect accorded anywhere else in the developed world - I suppose this is a fallout of population explosion.
Therefore, while we may preach ahimsa and all that, it will take atleast another 2 generations of time coupled with proper education for our people to have regard for animals, wildlife or domestic pets or whatever.

Right now, we are all too busy seeking financial nirvana and seeking the easiest means to achieve the same.

Sad, but true.

least we can do i guess is that the educated ones amongst us can atleast not litter the place, smoke, eat, drink, park the car for photography etc when passing through the jungle. Each little drop of effort contributes to the ocean in some measure atleast.


Quote:
Originally Posted by beejay View Post
I fail to understand the logic behind this,

1. Completely cutting off all public transport will put the general public to immense difficulty. During the weekends irrespective of the fact that 8 buses ply this road in the night, it is very difficult to get a seat. During long weekends these tickets are sold for almost triple the cost in the black market.
This would also be a move against the common public. A minimum of 750 people travel by public transport during the weekend from Bangalore to the Nilgiris.

2. Private cars, LMVs offer more damage in all aspects that the public transport,
a. If you travel by public transport there is lesser chance to get off in the middle of the forest. Private car travelers can do so.
b. You cannot smoke in a public transport and throw the butt into the forest. Private car travelers can do so.
c You cannot get off the bus to pee, wander or picnic in the forest. Private car travelers can do so.
d. Normally buses don't stop to sight see or watch wild animals, private car travelers can do so.
e. The speed of the buses are normally within 60 kms and the KSRTC buses even have speed limiters fitted.

3. Speed breakers as suggested by KANS for every 1/2 km is one of the worst suggestions. This goes to prove that if there is a large number of people with a common idea anything is possible against public interest.
This will consume more fuel and more damage to the eco system. Why cant you think on these lines.
Speed guns and heavy penalty should be imposed and this is a more practical solution.

As shankar.balan suggest heavy penalty needs to be imposed for every act. This is the only solution.
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Old 6th August 2009, 15:15   #53
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I am really happy that this move to stop vehicular movements.
One thing we have to live with is to crib crib and crib to get any work done by the government. Now we can start cribbing about the condition of the alternate route and in a year or two it should be better. Till then I guess we citizens have to bear the brunt of bad alternative routes. A compromise made for a better cause.
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Old 12th August 2009, 14:00   #54
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Has anyone travelled between Gundulpet - Sulthan bathery route in the last one week. Is the night blockage in place?.
I am travelling to Calicut tommorow, will be doing the best to get across this stretch by 8 p.m. Please post the updates. Just in case i dont, i will not like to be stranded in a no mans land..Moolehole...LOL

Last edited by Sportsmind : 12th August 2009 at 14:03.
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Old 12th August 2009, 15:31   #55
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Originally Posted by Sportsmind View Post
Has anyone travelled between Gundulpet - Sulthan bathery route in the last one week. Is the night blockage in place?.
I am travelling to Calicut tommorow, will be doing the best to get across this stretch by 8 p.m. Please post the updates. Just in case i dont, i will not like to be stranded in a no mans land..Moolehole...LOL
Gate shuts by 6pm , try to be there before 6pm , they are quite strict with some monitoring going on, My cousin passed on this message , he takes this route quite often.
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Old 12th August 2009, 15:54   #56
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Gate shuts by 6pm , try to be there before 6pm , they are quite strict with some monitoring going on, My cousin passed on this message , he takes this route quite often.
Thanks for the update. 6pm is too early right. I thought it was 9 pm to 6 a.m. Now i will have to replan and also go a virtual 120kmps to make it there before 6p.m.
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Old 13th August 2009, 08:54   #57
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Thanks for the update. 6pm is too early right. I thought it was 9 pm to 6 a.m. Now i will have to replan and also go a virtual 120kmps to make it there before 6p.m.
"Too early" is the term for us humans
Oncer it is sunset time, the frequency with which you would see the animals near the highway is high and thats the logic behind this.
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Old 14th August 2009, 12:04   #58
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"Too early" is the term for us humans
Oncer it is sunset time, the frequency with which you would see the animals near the highway is high and thats the logic behind this.
Did my trip to Calicut yesterday. The banner at the forest check post mentioned 9pm to 6am. I managed to cross the check post around 7 pm.
You are right,plenty of elephants and deers on the stretch after the sun downer. Guess they have got the message of the closure too. One lone tusker did hold my drive for alomst 5 minutes, as he was having his supper in the middle of the road.
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Old 15th August 2009, 21:18   #59
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Even though I do support the move. But feel its just an eyewash, Forest department still continue to conduct the Jungle Safaris right into the habitat of wild animals.
I am not sure why they aren't banned too? Won't that affect the wildlife too?
The reason for the safari's are this
The public get educated about wildlife / nature
The money generated goes back into conservation

That is supposed to be the moot points but we all know what happens in a safari.
People asking for a refund if they dont see any elephants / tigers...
People shouting and hooting and what not during the safaris...
(Above 2 points we observed during the safari rules awareness drive in Nagarhole by KANS)
The money generated is not even enough to pay the paltry salaries...

But the truth is the safari money generated is necessary to supplement the budget allocation
Best regards
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Old 15th August 2009, 22:30   #60
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Heard on one one of the commercial (ie., non-AIR) channels in Kannur that the ban is result of some litigation in the Karnataka High Court, and the Govt. of Kerala is going to file a review petition against this ban.
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