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Old 9th June 2009, 12:46   #31
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Awaiting comments on the following:

1) Seen those clamp lock put on wheels? The traffic cops put them on cars towed away. They lock the wheel. Look very sturdy. Don't think one can mess with them. Are they available in market? How much do they cost? Just by the looks, I think them to be the best security device.

2)Dzire and Scorpio come with iCats system. How effective is it? I read a post by GTO saying cars with iCATS - Maruti and Scorpio continue to be stolen. This is scary. I would like to know how do the theives crack the iCATS. Does anyone know?
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Old 9th June 2009, 12:57   #32
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2 Scorpios got stolen in my locality in the last 10 days, and the Bolero was lucky.

The cops - they are hand in glove with the gangs - and don't be surprised if those clamp locks come with some sort of master key, which the cops will be happy to share.

Difficult to decide who is the biggest gangster - the cops or the car-burglars?
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Old 9th June 2009, 13:50   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sparkguy View Post
Removing the master fuse resets the ECU to state 0 or neutral mode. We need to get it re set from workshop. I learned it hard way. Hidden switch also cuts off the supply from battery resulting in state 0 of ECU
the DI turbo doesn't have an ECU. Or does it ?
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Old 9th June 2009, 16:15   #34
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Thanks HVK. This answers the issue on clamp. Still leaves me wondering that the iCats system that comes in Maruti and Scorpio can be beaten or not?
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Old 9th June 2009, 16:52   #35
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I think the Autocop/icats etc derive power from a direct wire to the battery, without the fuses involved. If this is the case, then this lead wire could be cut to neutralize the system. I guess it all depends on the wiring design how accessible the power wire is made. I am all for mechanical protection though, considering the electrical systems can malfunction/be bypassed pretty easily by knowledgeable persons. Give me a big steering lock, a gear shift lock and any mechanical device that prevents the ingress to the cab, and I'll be happy. Of course, for cars with ECU's, the immobilizer coupled with these mechanical devices should deter any theft attempt.

For the Bolero and other old school vehicles, security is a myth, and praying to God regularly remains the first course of action.
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Old 9th June 2009, 23:50   #36
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Originally Posted by sriku View Post
For the Bolero and other old school vehicles, security is a myth, and praying to God regularly remains the first course of action.
Which one? "Jeep Devta's son Bolero Bhagwan " or "DI Turbo son of Bolero Bhagwan"

All jeepsters, please remember "Jeep Devta" ki Jai!
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Old 10th June 2009, 14:49   #37
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Default Update.

VLX CRDe computer cut key/lock set:
I have spoken to many people at the workshop/showroom/plant and have been informed that I cannot mate the computer cut key and lock set from the VLX Crde to my SLX. Apparently there are design differences in the doors that are required for the mounting of these things, and these differences cannot be overcome. I am not entirely convinced, but there's precious little that I can do on my own.

Security system:
The showroom staff responsible for fitting an autocop like system have been unavailable for the last couple of days, citing illness, and I'm now going to meet the person tomorrow morning. Apparently installing the autocop system is a 5 hour job, unless there are some alterations needed.

Steering lock:
Apparently the guys from Nippon who install the security system will provide me with the steering and pedal lock too. Waiting for this as well.

"Jeep Devta":
I am not overly religious, and this incident hasn't made me change my mind. I believe in being honest, and am a strong believer in the "do unto others only what you'd want them to do unto you" philosophy. But, if there is a Jeep Devta, I'll happily break a few coconuts at his feet to get his blessings


Thanks as always for the responses,
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Old 11th June 2009, 15:41   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sriku View Post

Steering lock:
Apparently the guys from Nippon who install the security system will provide me with the steering and pedal lock too. Waiting for this as well.
What is a pedal lock? I know the steering lock gets hooked to a pedal and steering. Is this also called pedal lock?
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Old 11th June 2009, 15:45   #39
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Just a pointer for when you choose the auto lock system.

There are two kinds of auto locks systems.
Some which will lock your car after a certain number of seconds.
Some which will lock your car on attaining a certain speed.

I am talking about the car doors locking on their own after you are seated inside.

The latter is highly recommended as it reduces the possibility of locking the car with the
keys inside.
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Old 15th June 2009, 12:01   #40
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Post More scary news.

Just this Saturday, a Pajero was stolen in broad daylight from very close to my house. I heard that the owner unlocked the vehicle and was about to drive off, when a knife wielding man overpowered the owner and drove off in the Pajero in broad daylight. On Sunday, a local top cop gave a lecture at our clubhouse where he highlighted their initiatives against chain snatching and other nuisances like bikers riding rashly, and miscreants roaming around the complex. When my Dad mentioned the near theft and spate of vehicle robberies, the cop simply asked us to install all preventive and tracking devices and park within the building premises, while not committing to any action against the gang of thieves, who have been rampant these past months. Looks like we're going to have to fend for ourselves.

Some measures that I have begun to implement:
A) Preventive:
1. The gear lock. Cost 1800/-
2. The autocop alarm system. Cost around 5500/-
3. The remote release fuel lid scavenged from the Scorpio. Apparently the new scorpios have a primary and secondary remote release cable for the fuel lid. The primary accessible to the driver, the secondary, a failsafe accessible to the passenger behind the driver. This secondary can be mated to my Bolero. Cost: Unknown, custom install will be necessary
4. Chor switch. Car will crank but FIP will not be activated until this switch is engaged. The location of this switch will be discreet and camouflaged somewhere in the car. Cost: Under 500/-
5. Steering lock. Cost: Under 500/-

Total Preventive measures cost: About 9500/-

B) Tracker:
A system sold by Autotrack allows the vehicle to be tracked via a combination of GPS/GPRS/GSM and allows for immobilization, vehicle panic button, trip logs upto 6 months prior, fencing for 10 user defined locations etc. This system has been installed in a VLX Scorpio and an Indica owned by my workshop manager who are trying out the features and will review its feasibility for my vehicle. The immobilizer will work on non-ECU cars like the DI Bolero as well, and has sufficient battery backup and some anti-disarm features as well. Installation cost about 17-18K INR, and some monthly rental for the SIM upto 250 INR per month starting 6 months after installation.

So I'm estimating a bill of about 28,000 INR for all these measures. It may seem to be a lot of money (definitely does for me), but am able to justify the expense. I believe some peace of mind and proper sleep at night can never bee too expensive. Looking forward to comments by Bhp-ians.

Cheers,
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Old 15th June 2009, 20:28   #41
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1. I am a strong proponent of "get a security device before you take delivery" rule. I am glad you followed it. (Rest of you would be car owners - please note.)

2. When they install the remote / central locking system, make sure that all doors, hood (bonnet) and rear door are included. I discovered only recently that the rear hatch of my wagonR has not been wired to the security system on my car.

3. Remember that all security gadgets only delay a thief. No car is absolutely safe.

4. I do not know how the ECM in a modern diesel works, but the old school diesels I know can be always push started. (there is a thread on jeep security system somewhere here). No need for batteries, or ignition key.

AFAICT, most vehicles come with same key for all locks on it. Can anybody please name a vehicle with a different system currently in market?

And thanks for a detailed post on the modus operandi. It is very useful for most of vehicle owners to take preventive action.
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Old 30th June 2009, 15:52   #42
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Dear Sriku - please do all of these things I am writing below. At least you will sleep well at night.

1 ----- As it is a very well known fact that thieves remove the lock barrel from its location on the door / fuel cap, please REMOVE LOCK BARRELS FROM ALL LOCATIONS OUTSIDE YOUR VEHICLE. Also remove the small link rods which attach to these barrels (these are inside the door). Block the holes which will remain in the doors with rubber plugs. You can use the front suspension bump stop of the Mahindra Champion 3 wheeler for the same. Any M&M dealer will sell them to you. They cost Rs.14 per piece. LESSON TO THIEVES - "THERE IS NO LOCK BARREL TO STEAL - HOW WILL YOU MAKE THE KEY?" There have been people who have just removed the inner rods so barrels do not work even after the thieves have made the key but even then the thieves will spoil your door paint / body trying to pry out something which will finally not work. So it is best to install the rubber plug, the guy will see it, curse you and move on to the next vehicle. Then equip your vehicle with the ORIGINAL EQUIPMENT remote security system. Please DO NOT use any nonsense which is sold in accessory shops (most of it is nonsense anyways). It does not work. You will have to carry both remotes with you at all times to prevent the possibility of the battery of one of them running out on you as you come out of a party at night.

PLUS

2 ----- Use a "danda" on the steering wheel. This device is available in Europe but is not very popular in our country. There are places in England where if you give an undertaking to use such a device, your insurance premium is halved. Good quality devices cost around 100 euros but it is a wise investment. Alternatively, you can go totally local, buy a stout chain from CST Road in Kurla and use a Godrej Nav Taal lock to loop it over the steering wheel. These are effective visual deterrents. Please remember that a gear lever lock is not a very effective idea in vehicles which have the gear lever designed in two pieces. The thieves are not idiots. They will come with correct size spanners. Common sense, isn't it?

PLUS

3 ----- there are SIM CARD controlled systems by which you arm and disarm your vehicle using your mobile. The advantage is that even if someone threatens you and drives off, you can run some distance away and arm your vehicle using the mobile. The engine will switch off and can only be started after the disarm command is flashed. However, don't just install this. First think differently. These things finally prevent current from reaching critical areas on the engine. A smart electrician can still bypass these things so fabricate and fit brackets on the connectors which will prevent anybody from having a quick access to these locations. Also, the relays which control these functions must be removed from their normal locations and reassembled with suitable brackets in a location known only to you.

On an average, it takes 24 days to equip a vehicle with such systems. Need I say more?

ALSO, PLEASE PM ME. I WILL HELP YOU IN TOTALITY.

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar
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Old 30th June 2009, 15:58   #43
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On an average, it takes 24 days to equip a vehicle with such systems. Need I say more?
Is it 24 hours or days as 24 days is too much time ?
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Old 30th June 2009, 16:43   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM View Post
1 ----- As it is a very well known fact that thieves remove the lock barrel from its location on the door / fuel cap, please REMOVE LOCK BARRELS FROM ALL LOCATIONS OUTSIDE YOUR VEHICLE. Also remove the small link rods which attach to these barrels (these are inside the door). Block the holes which will remain in the doors with rubber plugs. You can use the front suspension bump stop of the Mahindra Champion 3 wheeler for the same. Any M&M dealer will sell them to you. They cost Rs.14 per piece. LESSON TO THIEVES - "THERE IS NO LOCK BARREL TO STEAL - HOW WILL YOU MAKE THE KEY?"
Behram Sir, I will PM you on this point, a lot of this information is greek and latin to a newbie like me.

2 ----- Use a "danda" on the steering wheel.
Sir, is this the steering lock thingy that hooks under the clutch pedal and the wheel? If it is, I've got this and use it wherever I park. It gives me some peace of mind, and you are right, the more visible the deterrent, the greater its impact.
Apart from this, I'd like to also share some more updates. I have replaced the ignition lock, and changed the door locks. Also got a steering lock "danda". As regards the autocop, the great Global Gallarie showroom accessories chap Mushir, did such a shoddy job installing the autocop system that the whole unit under the steering wheel dropped with wiring and all on my feet while driving Moby back home the very next day, rendering it useless. So in 24 hrs, I had to get back to the showroom and get the Nippon guys to come themselves and replace the entire wiring and kit. Needless to say, I was pretty agitated and let it be known in no uncertain terms that I was displeased with Mushir's carelessness. He, in turn, gave me attitude when I demanded a car wash and car cover as compensation, something the showroom should have offered of their own accord. At this, I lost it and unleashed my inner Sunny Deol. I vociferously demanded the wash and cover, making a huge scene at the showroom, scaring the potential customers present, and possibly causing the loss of two logan bookings for those guys. Finally, a senior sales guy intervened and heard me out, he agreed to my demands and apologised. I'm 6 feet tall and wide, close to 120 kilos and when unshaven, look pretty thug-like, so I'm pretty sure I scared some people badly. Am the last person to get violent or abrasive, in fact I'm as mellow as they get, but sometimes the situation demands it. Later in the day when I picked up the car and did an inspection, Mushir was nowhere to be found, I'd have tried to patch things with him had I met him, but don't terribly regret missing the chance to have done so.

Now that that's out of the way, I'd like you guys to consider this. The first free service for my Bolero is scheduled at 5000 kms. This is my first car, but I've been around cars (petrol) for a long time, and usually the first service with the all important engine oil change happens around 1000 kms. I've done 1400 kms, and all seems to be well, but I don't want to risk anything and need to know if the schedule 5K Kms oil change is acceptable or not. I guess this one's for Behram Sir, MileCruncher, HVK and the rest of the Mahindra gang. Ride-wise, Moby has performed very nicely in Mumbai, weathering the bumper to bumper traffic and heavy rains with aplomb. I'm getting 730 kms to a close-to-full tank of diesel (50ltrs, capacity of tank=60ltrs), and am on my second full tank. Gear shifting gets better day by day, noticeably, and downshifts from second to first in city traffic have smoothed out from before, when it was a little harder. I've only just gotten used to the low revving engine, and am figuring out that a shift from third to fourth only goes well at slightly more than 2k rpm, while fourth to fifth needs atleast 2100 rpm(~80kmph). I like the midrange action that the DI gives, loads of torque in third and fourth, and a comfortable coasting in fifth for the open highways. The ride, however gets bouncier as the load decreases, but only for the midrow passengers, so I can't be bothered. Loads of body roll gives me and my brother the opportunity to grab onto the wheel and the front dash handle and practice leaning and counter leaning, being the bike-nuts that we are. Driver ergonomics are good if you're a big guy, and have arms grafted from a gorilla. Check. Front seats need more padding for thigh support, which will be my next target along with whatever Behram Sir advices. The Nippon music system is surprisingly good, with SD card and USB input, and a nice looking HU. It may not be the best, but is good enough for my needs. Sound quality is fair, and I can register the bass and treble enough to keep me sane. No ipod recognition though, but I've got a 2 GB SD card loaded with my Rahman/MJ/Aerosmith to keep me company. A lot more will go into another thread with pics when I get around to it. Till then, thank you for listening and for the help.

Cheers,
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Old 30th June 2009, 19:09   #45
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Originally Posted by sriku View Post

Now that that's out of the way, I'd like you guys to consider this. The first free service for my Bolero is scheduled at 5000 kms. This is my first car, but I've been around cars (petrol) for a long time, and usually the first service with the all important engine oil change happens around 1000 kms. I've done 1400 kms, and all seems to be well, but I don't want to risk anything and need to know if the schedule 5K Kms oil change is acceptable or not. I guess this one's for Behram Sir, MileCruncher, HVK and the rest of the Mahindra gang. Ride-wise, Moby has performed very nicely in Mumbai, weathering the bumper to bumper traffic and heavy rains with aplomb. I'm getting 730 kms to a close-to-full tank of diesel (50ltrs, capacity of tank=60ltrs), and am on my second full tank.
Mine only gives about 500 Kms. 100% AC and I drive a bit fast. When will I also get good mileage

Mine's done about 4100 Kms and I need to get the 1st service done. Since Mahindra is giving 3 years warranty, they must have set the first service at 5k definitely knowing something.
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