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Old 23rd July 2013, 09:24   #4681
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Default Re: Rants on Bangalore's traffic situation

First thing this morning near the Agara Flyover when I was parked waiting for the traffic light to turn green. Suddenly there was a huge confluence of cars, all jostling to create space to squeeze into, in anticipation of the green light.
The moment the light turned green, a blue GJ Regd Honda Jazz driven by a Tie-wearing exec type just shot past me almost grazing my near side fender and overtook. Another KA51 Regd Hyundai Verna with a Chauffeur driving did the same.

I caught up with them both at the next traffic signal near the main Jakkasandra left turn, rolled down my window and told them off very politely.
The Blue Jazz owner accepted all that I said most politely and then turned left and almost immediately, was unto his old antics again, squeezing in and out of traffic at speed! Ridiculous!

I did not deign to talk to the Verna chauffeur of course, choosing to direct my remarks to the owner /exec type sitting in the back of the car. However that man, despite his obvious education etc just stared blankly back at me!

It is really sad that mid to senior level company executives themselves behave in this manner on the public roads. What chance is there for good manners, decent behaviour and road sense?
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Old 23rd July 2013, 09:59   #4682
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Default Re: Rants on Bangalore's traffic situation

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It is really sad that mid to senior level company executives themselves behave in this manner on the public roads. What chance is there for good manners, decent behaviour and road sense?
Education (in terms of the degrees), money and status do not instill commonsense and manners. It might however cultivate arrogance.
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Old 23rd July 2013, 11:17   #4683
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Default Re: Rants on Bangalore's traffic situation

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It is really sad that mid to senior level company executives themselves behave in this manner on the public roads. What chance is there for good manners, decent behaviour and road sense?
I don't think that most of these big car owners are from any decent company. It could be an overnight filthy rich turned businessman.
There are primarily 3 categories of road users I have seen -

1- People who became filthy rich overnight - People in my area who used to beg for food, are now billionaires, thanks to the pathetic IT boom (Sorry, even I got a job because of the IT boom only). These people have no respect to any individual. They just earn money from rents and buy luxury cars and expensive dresses. Brain is absolutely zero there.

2- Fresh IT Population (yes, that includes me too). These people get rich suddenly. Suddenly they buy vehicles and struggle to learn driving / riding. Yes that includes me too. But I can safely say that I drive safe.

3- Cabbies/Auto/Public Transport drivers - These are a different breed altogether. The less said is better.
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Old 23rd July 2013, 13:53   #4684
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Originally Posted by ashwin.terminat View Post
I don't know how BTP interpreted it, but I just felt that some Orange light durations are too short. It's really scary to come to a halt all of a sudden and you don't know if the guy at the back even intends to stop!
I think there is a fundamental flaw in your argument. Amber is not a "go through" aspect. The only time you are legally allowed to go through the signal is when it is green. Amber is a transitional aspect only to allow drivers who have already crossed the stop line to reach the other side safely. No driver is allowed to cross the stop line once amber aspect is in force.

Secondly, if you see a traffic light at a distance, you are expected to be prepared to stop there. That is, you should reduce speed as you approach the lights, irrespective of its aspect.
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Old 23rd July 2013, 14:03   #4685
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Default Re: Rants on Bangalore's traffic situation

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I think there is a fundamental flaw in your argument. Amber is not a "go through" aspect. The only time you are legally allowed to go through the signal is when it is green. Amber is a transitional aspect only to allow drivers who have already crossed the stop line to reach the other side safely. No driver is allowed to cross the stop line once amber aspect is in force.

Secondly, if you see a traffic light at a distance, you are expected to be prepared to stop there. That is, you should reduce speed as you approach the lights, irrespective of its aspect.
Amber light duration is based on the speed on a particular road and you can continue before it turns red. Its not to make you stop if you have not passed the stop line. It would be dangerous to do that on high speed roads.

Now this is how it is world over.
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Old 23rd July 2013, 15:26   #4686
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Amber light duration is based on the speed on a particular road and you can continue before it turns red. Its not to make you stop if you have not passed the stop line. It would be dangerous to do that on high speed roads.

Now this is how it is world over.
World over, where they follow rules like - "No blocking of intersection. Else you will be fined". Which means they might have to stop even on a green (on seeing the other end of the intersection there is no place and traffic is standstill. Might prove fatal in India.

I feel in most of our traffic chocking due to Blocking intersections. In a 4 way intersection, (or 4X ways in many places in bangalore) mostly i see 3 way or 4 way locking of vehicles. and no one moves in the whole intersection. A second later, Tetris play starts and the gaps are filled. Surely one of them has this amber story. (I am not arguing here against rule or definition. Just my thought on how a bit more sensible driving could help).
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Old 23rd July 2013, 18:20   #4687
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Originally Posted by srishiva View Post
Amber light duration is based on the speed on a particular road and you can continue before it turns red. Its not to make you stop if you have not passed the stop line. It would be dangerous to do that on high speed roads.

Now this is how it is world over.
I don't know about "world over", I can only talk about the countries where I have driven. For example, in the UK:

https://www.gov.uk/using-the-road-15...ons-170-to-183 (see rule 175)

It is abundantly clear that you cannot enter an intersection when the aspect is amber. It is a "go" signal only for those who have crossed the stop line already.

I also understand this is exactly the case in Canada and US (and Australia). Still, not "world over", true.
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Old 23rd July 2013, 20:50   #4688
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Default Re: Rants on Bangalore's traffic situation

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Originally Posted by binand View Post
I think there is a fundamental flaw in your argument. Amber is not a "go through" aspect. The only time you are legally allowed to go through the signal is when it is green. Amber is a transitional aspect only to allow drivers who have already crossed the stop line to reach the other side safely. No driver is allowed to cross the stop line once amber aspect is in force.

Secondly, if you see a traffic light at a distance, you are expected to be prepared to stop there. That is, you should reduce speed as you approach the lights, irrespective of its aspect.
The Chandigarh Traffic Police says this about amber:

Quote:
If your have entered the intersection and the light turns to amber, move on very carefully. If you see the amber light before entering the crossing, stop the vehicle behind the stop line or cross walk.
So it looks like you are indeed right. But then, what is the purpose of the red light? If both are intended to get you to stop before the Stop Line, what's the difference?

I am at fault here. Not dragging this on, but I believe we need to lay out rules depending on ground reality rather than what the rulebook says? Neither do out folks stop for a Red light, leave alone an amber and moreover, neither do they adhere to speed limits. Our present rules are laid out believing that people do follow these rules, but since the cops don't seem to be able to enforce rules to get people to follow rules and slow down at an intersection no matter what light the signal is on, don't you think it is imperative that cops safeguard the ones who do follow rules?
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Old 23rd July 2013, 21:02   #4689
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Default Re: Rants on Bangalore's traffic situation

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Originally Posted by ashwin.terminat View Post

I am at fault here. Not dragging this on, but I believe we need to lay out rules depending on ground reality rather than what the rulebook says
The rulebook does take into account ground realities. See below.

Quote:
Originally Posted by binand View Post
I don't know about "world over", I can only talk about the countries where I have driven. For example, in the UK:

https://www.gov.uk/using-the-road-15...ons-170-to-183 (see rule 175)

It is abundantly clear that you cannot enter an intersection when the aspect is amber. It is a "go" signal only for those who have crossed the stop line already.
It is not as clearcut as you put it. Read the rule fully:

You MUST stop behind the white ‘Stop’ line across your side of the road unless the light is green. If the amber light appears you may go on only if you have already crossed the stop line or are so close to it that to stop might cause a collision.

If the light turns amber as you approach the intersection and you can not stop in time, then you can cross the intersection. If you step on the brakes that causes a collision, then guess what! You are at fault!!
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Old 23rd July 2013, 21:05   #4690
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Default Re: Rants on Bangalore's traffic situation

Those who use Varthur road can rejoice a little (KarthikK and guyfrmblr, apart from me). The enormous potholes that grew over the last two weeks, have been filled with medium size gravel mixed with cement and water.

They could add a little salt on the road's wounds too.

And today at 5 PM, there was an Interceptor opposite Shani temple at Gunjur, as the road till Gunjur from Dommasandra is quite straight, and has less traffic. All these days, cops used to stop heavy vehicles there, so that they cannot enter the city during peak hours. But today, all lorries could enter the city freely!
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Old 23rd July 2013, 21:46   #4691
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If the light turns amber as you approach the intersection and you can not stop in time, then you can cross the intersection. If you step on the brakes that causes a collision, then guess what! You are at fault!!
That is correct. Hence this comment in my original post: "if you see a traffic light at a distance, you are expected to be prepared to stop there. That is, you should reduce speed as you approach the lights, irrespective of its aspect."

If you do not do that and end up in a situation like you describe, it is your argument ("I couldn't stop in time" is for you to prove with valid supporting arguments/evidence, not the cops) versus the camera's evidence - where eventually the camera wins. You will most likely end up paying a hefty fine and three points (out of 12) to losing your license.

Last edited by binand : 23rd July 2013 at 21:50.
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Old 23rd July 2013, 22:46   #4692
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That is correct. Hence this comment in my original post: "if you see a traffic light at a distance, you are expected to be prepared to stop there. That is, you should reduce speed as you approach the lights, irrespective of its aspect."
Are you sure about this? That one should slow down even if the light is green and you are within the speed limit? Even the link you posted does not mention anything of that sort. Among other things, it is also required by law to not hinder the flow of traffic.

It is a good idea to be extra cautious when approaching an intersection in general. But to slow down to anticipate a yellow is a bit too much, specially in areas where the lights change based on traffic density.

This one is just for fun:
Name:  slow down.jpg
Views: 457
Size:  30.8 KB

EDIT:
Well, turns out that slowing down when approaching a traffic intersection is a recommended "defensive driving" technique! At least as per page 90 of

http://www.state.nj.us/mvc/pdf/Manuals/drivermanual.pdf

Last edited by amitoj : 23rd July 2013 at 23:13.
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Old 23rd July 2013, 23:32   #4693
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Default Re: Rants on Bangalore's traffic situation

Saw this 'educated' looking dude with his family who'd parked his Innova in the middle of the road (double parked next to the designated parking spots on the left) on Commercial Street.
Traffic had a tough time since they had to negotiate his car to go ahead and this was just couple of buildings before the police station. But, guess what the family was doing inside the car ?
They were eating fast food from a McD or some such
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Old 24th July 2013, 00:52   #4694
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So now nobody would think a bangalorean exaggerates when he talks about the roads or lack of it.

15 days after fresh tar was laid. Nandidurga road

Also notice the burgeoning pot hole on the left i had mentioned about in my previous post on this thread.
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Old 24th July 2013, 08:15   #4695
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15 days after fresh tar was laid. Nandidurga road
15? Hah! The patch of road in front of Concorde Motors, Hosur Road near Dairy Circle tool just 3 days! Out of which it rained for only two days!
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